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(Smash Gameplay Balancing Part 2)


This has already been posted here: https://www.destructoid.com/--559347.phtml#post

This is for those that couldn't read the whole thing since it was 21 pages so I'm posting 4 parts 5 pages each so it's easier for them to read. The beginning will be in each part so it's not confusing if you weren't here for the 1st part. I don't understand how you could get confused here I was very detailed on every single change makes alot of sense to me at least. I would like feedback if theres something specific on each part.

This section is to fix the mechanics inside of the game but every game the mechanics have been getting better making the game look smoother and less glitchy but at the same time making mechanics that were fine unbalanced because the wrong solution was used or something was ignored and this section is to fix the remaining mechanics. This section is the most important because it is an absolute game changer this applies to all characters so it is required for the next section. This should be most noticeable in competitive 1 on 1 matches seeing how most these “techniques” are used there. Certain changes were used in combination to fix the same thing, you’ll see in the way I explained and led into another change. Hopefully I didn’t miss anything and you must really understand Smash itself to know what I’m talking about.

Unlike a game like Street Fighter where your options are very limited, strict and you don’t have much room at all to work with this game is the complete opposite, it has so much freedom which is why you can glitch almost everything in the game because there are literally no boundaries to prevent it. Because of all the freedom this game has no combos because almost nothing is guaranteed, the only thing that is would be a grab into a pummel or a throw into an aerial.

Most of these issues weren’t Sakurai’s fault because these competitive players don’t play the game right causing themselves arthritis while some are because some of his balance changes have been giving characters that couldn’t glitch ways to instead of removing it from the characters that could already which I thought would have been easier. This also indirectly fixes some characters so I don’t have to make the same fix to every single character that has it or if I forgot. These fixes should either fix a problem completely or at least lessen the problem. I put them in order from most major to minor so you can see the bigger problems first which are usually longer. Of all 3 of my sections this was the hardest even though I had the least to do I couldn’t test most of these out like I could with regular moves. This also fixes many bad moves into good moves. You should take a very hard look at my (Shield) change that could have been the most important but I needed to start with physics.

This game is all about physics and positioning since based on the power of an attack will knock them further but weight decreases their knockback. Based on your position you can boost the K.O power of attacks if you go off stage and hit them while closer to the blast zone which is why you want to stay in the middle or have your opponent hit you towards the other side of the stage. A game I would really recommend is Boom Blox the best physics game out there for the original Wii and its sequel Bash Party. First 4 are to clarify some of the mechanics I used for my characters between Statistics, Knockback and Held moves.

<(Ledge)> The ledge is the most dangerous spot to be in because you have such limited options and one read by the opponent could end your life since you’re forced to grab it because of helpless falling. This is basically being in the corner in Street Fighter. They can also steal your ledge and back aerial you. There are also moves made specifically for ledge guarding only like Ike’s (Eruption). Grabbing the ledge should be a last resort meaning you barely made it back not your only option which it is for now.

To fix when you first grab the ledge and someone steals it you should still have invincibility so they can’t just Back Aerial you again or steal your invincibility since if you grab it again before landing it’s gone because it was stolen only if you do so yourself should it be gone. While on the ledge if you climb up, roll or attack you should be able to adjust the speed of these actions by holding or tapping the button to each action to slow them down or speed them up. With this rolls and jumps can look like normal get ups and vice versa to avoid punishes easier.

Also get up attacks should have high shield push to give you room if they shield right next to the ledge and you should be able to jump away from the stage so you can use a Special Move to recover high or dive onto the stage. Certain characters have Special Moves to switch stage position like Greninja’s (Shadow Sneak) to kick them towards the ledge or teleporting Up Specials.

<(Falling Speed)>

Characters that have faster falling speed than others shouldn’t have the penalty of being combo food, Fast fallers can get trapped in moves that can combo more easily because they fall into them faster and are most susceptible to ground to ceiling or vice versa into spike K.Os. All characters should fall into combos equally I don’t know why fast fallers exist it should be based on weight there is no reason for Fox to fall so fast maybe it’s because of his metal legs? But Falco has them too and he’s a floaty contradictions here.

All characters should go up levitate at its peak and then fall downwards faster gradually. Just like a ball basically no matter it’s weight or shape they always stop at its peak before falling and the weight makes one fall faster gradually not immediately like in this game. This way they won’t fall into combos anymore and possibly help their recovery a little bit. If you want to fall at max speed immediately you should just fast fall don’t force it.

<(Fast Falling)>

While we’re on the subject if you fast fall or land from a high height you should have some extra cool down like in real life the higher you jump or the longer the fall the longer it takes for you to get back to a normal stance because of your momentum. This should also fix fast falling Aerials at ground level this fix is going to be more important than it sounds. Aerials should only be safe in the air so Ground Attacks are actually useful for the first time through every smash bros game. Also you should not be able to fast fall during an aerial do it before or after cool down.

<(Auto Cancel)>

Nothing in the game should have 0 consequences everything and every move should have some type of recovery time just like they have startup. Even Final Smashes have cool down unlike the moves below this. <(Aerial Attacks)>

This entire series of games has always been dominated by auto cancelling Aerial Attacks by using the ground which I like to call wave dashing with an attack. They also do as much or more damage as ground attacks or even smash attacks but are faster so ground attacks have been forever irrelevant and you can use them off of the stage closer to blast zones to basically make them even more powerful and spikes are basically 1 hit K.Os with the support of gravity. You can move while using this attack so you can combo by chasing the direction they were launched in. This just maybe the most broken part of Smash Bros but for this game in particular Shields maybe worse.

The only and most honest character in the game is Pac-Man doesn’t have over powered Aerials his front only does 5% and cannot K.O anytime soon and his Back Aerial does 11%, doesn’t come out instantly and didn’t have that much launching power until they made that update…

To fix Aerials should have a cap on their Knockback and do half the damage of ground attacks since they can combo and be used off stage. This should also apply to Special Moves as well when used in the air but only if they aren’t projectiles. This should help Little Mac significantly.

Here are some examples for moves that should use each level of Knockback below which should be based on the startup time of the attack so fast attacks are weak and slow ones are stronger. Some have an exception like Captain Falcon’s Front Aerial only the beginning has knockback if you miss the sweet spot it barely does anything. Again based on a normal 100% (Attack) character if you land during an aerial you should have increased cool down they are only safe in the air not at ground level so ground attacks are relevant. Ground Attacks should always have priority over Aerial Attacks they are attacking from the air you have leverage over them.

Weak: Moves that are fast like Mario’s Up Aerial and Pac-Man’s Front Aerial should use this knockback doing 1% to 5% damage.

Medium: Moves that are the standard speed like Mario’s Neutral Aerial and Pac-Man’s Up Aerial should use this knockback doing 5% to 10% damage.

Strong: Moves that are slow like Peach’s Front Aerial, have a sweet spot like Captain Falcon’s Front Aerial or are spikes like most Down Aerials should use this knockback doing 10% to 15% damage. Aerials cannot go any higher than Strong Knockback.

<(Air Momentum Reversal)>

When reversing the direction of a Special Move it should not reverse your momentum only turn you around instead of being able to zigzag through the air.

<(Individual Moves)>

I have to make a list of moves that I may have forgotten in the (Character Balancing) section which is next each of them should have the exact same fix I will usually use 2 examples for different versions of the same type of move. These are all very important no matter how small it seems it’s a bigger problem than it appears to be. I did and explained these changes the best way I could.

Passive Abilities: Stuff like Peach’s floating, Link’s Shield and Wario’s (Waft) should not be used unless it’s a Special Move that uses that particular ability itself it’s not fair to be able to block projectiles while walking float across the sky and charge a smash attack overtime like those moves. It basically gives them an extra move an unfair advantage very few have.

Combination Attacks: Usually a rapid jab or 3 hit combo from a Neutral Ground Attack. Increase the time frame to complete the jab combination so you can’t use it to cancel into a Smash Attack or if that particular character has something worse in their Special Move set. Also either if it is a normal or Special Move you should force finishers or have a slowing down animation to cancel it if you don’t perform the finisher.

Combo Weak Up Ground Attacks: Like Mario, Fox, Falco, Mii Sword Fighter, Bowser list goes on. These should not become Stale and should be able to DI away from these diagonally so you don’t easily go from 0% to 40% before being able to escape because its knockback weakens each time allowing it to trap you longer. This same fix goes to its Aerial version below.

Combo Weak Up Aerials: Like Mario, Meta Knight, Zero Suit Samus, Captain Falcon the list goes on there’s probably 20 characters that have this. When hit this should not become Stale and depending upon which direction they are hit in the angle should be bent in that direction so it’s easier to DI to escape them to get out of elevator combo’s into an Up Special finisher usually.

Multi-Hitting Moves: I’m tired of these attacks leaving a lingering attack out that you avoid all but the final hit and you take the full knockback since it doesn’t weaken like a single attack, it seems to happen all the time and they beat air and spot dodges. Moves like these should have less knockback based on how many hits connected so it weakens like single hit attacks that you don’t hit when they first come out. Also this should lock opponents in the attack so they don’t fall out anymore.

Ground Pounds: Like Bowser, Yoshi and Kirby’s Down Specials it doesn’t have to be a Special Move it can be like Bowser or Greninja’s Down Aerial as well. The Special Move usually has a head butt to combo into the ground pound which is bad because they are usually shield breakers and K.O moves. Head butts should not combo into the ground pound anymore and if you don’t hold the button on the ground you can cancel the ground pound so it’s more like an uppercut should make a good anti-aerial. For the ground pound based on distance traveled will increase its power. Standard should be Medium/Strong and startup always Spikes Strong to prevent ceiling K.Os and the launch angle should be more horizontal which gets more diagonal the more distance traveled to further prevent ceiling K.Os. You must activate it from high up to increase power if you want to break shields but that gives the opponent more time to react so it’s fair. It should also increase the size of the shockwave if you miss I guess you could include moves like a (Falcon Kick) and Sonic’s Down Aerial with this but spikes diagonally at the start.

Head Butts: They should all work like Pikachu’s (Skull Bash) but bounce off of shields the longer you charge them the faster and more shield knockback they have should be used to approach or push them away from the ledge or off if you have control of center stage. Also give them super armor to get through projectiles instead of somehow clashing with them and remove Luigi getting stuck in the stage Sakurai always picking on him.

Angled Up Specials: I don’t care what type of recovery move you have allow it to be angled diagonally at least a little going straight up isn’t good enough unless your directly under the ledge which makes you an easy target to spike.

Offensive Up Specials: All Up Specials should not be able to multi hit if activated in the air so you cannot carry foes upwards with you for ceiling K.Os this is very important to fix Zero Suit Samus and Bayonetta’s elevator combos. If activated on the ground they can and are more powerful.

Diving Up Specials: Moves like Ike’s (Aether) or Mii Swordfighter’s (Stone Scabbard) should only do the downwards version if you hold the button past its peak otherwise add a horizontal strike to launch them so you can move again without forcing the dive their horizontal recovery is really bad because of that.

Passively Charged Up Specials: Specials like R.O.B’s (Robo Burner) should take 10 seconds to fully charge 2 seconds equals 1 second of fuel recharges to fast right now. Also must be on the ground to charge them.

Item Special Moves: Once these disappear it must take 5 seconds before you can pull another one out to stop the spam of these for item characters. While holding that item you can use the same move to put it away so there is no delay and charge it further if you can like (Gyro) and (Bonus Fruit).

Automatically Charged Special Moves: Moves like a (Falcon Punch) should halve their knockback and damage if activated in the air since you can still move towards them before hitting them. I know they are hard to land but they have monster strength if you land one, these should be used more often now after the (Shield) change and this type of move are the ultimate shield stun punishers.

Stored Charged Moves: Moves that can be charged and stored like Samus’ (Charge Shot), Pac-Man’s (Bonus Fruit) and Donkey Kong’s (Giant Punch) can only be charged on the ground so you can’t use the air for momentum if you try to charge in the air it automatically releases. These types of moves are basically a Smash Attack in your pocket when fully charged and can be pulled out at any time since once it’s fully charged you have to fear them using it forcing a defensive play style. When fully charged only last 5 seconds after that it starts to weaken and after 10 seconds the entire charge is gone so use it sooner than later and no more having to fear them now that the charge weakens. Also if activated in the air and is not a projectile damage and knockback is halved.

Un-Storable Chargeable Special Moves: Moves that can be charged and have to be released like (Clown Cannon) and (Shield Breaker) can be charged in the air and released but allow these to be cancelled too to prevent Counterattacks and Reflectors.

Cancelling while charging: You should be able to cancel any chargeable move whether it is a Smash Attack or Special Move so you’re not forced to shoot a projectile or use an attack but cancelling has cool down too for even attempting it. This can prevent opponents from jumping in and getting easy counterattacks on Smash Attacks or reflect projectiles by canceling it altogether. Now that there’s recovery time for charging you can’t just charge in the opponents face anymore then shield or dodge. Even across the map isn’t safe cause you can’t shield immediately if they have projectiles too only when alone or they are off stage is it safe to charge now.

Penetrating Special Moves: Moves that penetrate through opponents should have boosted damage and knockback in a 1 on 1 match they have a disadvantage because there’s nobody else to hit.

Counterattacks: This is overpowered because it blocks an attack then immediately counters with an attack twice as strong as the one countered for no reason at all if you block an attack it usually unbalances you not put you in a better position to deal even more damage. The slower a move is the easier it is to counter and most of the time the slow ones are the most powerful so you can basically wait if they are charging a smash attack waiting for them to hit themselves. An Ultimate mention finally allowed them to reflect a countered projectile which was a very simple fix Counterattacks should have Strong at the very start to Medium knockback at the end of the window and deal about 10% damage. Also all counters window to counterattack should last 1 second not a decade like Shulk’s (Vision) and 1 second of cool down if you don’t counter an attack so they are vulnerable. You should remove all custom moves that increase or decrease the power of this type of move as well. Ones with extra movement like Lucario and Greninja’s which can attack groups should be decreased to Medium/Weak knockback.

Reflectors: These basically work just like Counterattacks but for projectiles so I’m going to fix it in kind of the same way. Projectile based characters cannot get around this at all because they don’t break easily I mean they’re never going to get hit by a 50% damage attack unless a miracle happens but these are useless against foes with no projectiles because they can’t be used offensively that well if at all. Reflectors that surround your character should have 50% health and act as a secondary shield before it breaks and is unusable for 15 seconds before it regenerates. Reflecting and blocking attacks decreases health and it regenerates 1% health every second while not in use if it hasn’t broken yet. Reflected projectiles should do the same amount of damage when reflected and you get pushed back like shields but if you reflect as soon as it hits like perfect shielding the projectile’s speed will be increased by 50% no increased damage. Startup knocks foes back Medium. You should remove all custom moves that increase or decrease the power of this type of move and these can be used as shields in the air like Pit’s (Guardian Orbitars).

Absorbers: All Special Moves that can absorb can only do so with energy projectiles most characters use physical projectiles making this obsolete. Allow it to absorb both physical and energy absorb the amount of damage don’t double the healing anymore, add super armor and when released you release a shockwave as a manual Counterattack since it does have super armor Medium.


- Black Mage for Smash! https://smashboards.com/threads/black-mage-for-smash.506369/#post-24080523

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About ABowlOfCerealone of us since 6:45 PM on 04.24.2019

Ohaider I'm a Smash Bros moveset creator I would take request but probably will be special move only won't be as detailed but if they have enough potential I will add some feedback. I'm about to shift over to another game once my last 2 characters drop though.

I'm not really a writer I just write about stuff I care about for the most part things that I felt I had to do. I am a Flightless Phoenix, just give me a shot and i'll be able to soar tired of being locked in a cage. My Roblox is "CosmicMotion" a Periastron collector which is what my logo is I play on Xbox, I also play Maplestory M as CerealKnight America inoysys server 195 Hero F2P and CerealNite America 2 on Guardian Tales F2P aswell.

Dunno what to write here really trying to be Anonymous but I eat Cereal for dinner sometimes and play and listen to rare video game music just give me a song I can usually counter it with a much better one. I collect rocks make smaller ones into necklaces I draw a bit do low key pottery and I played some real life sports when I was younger before a major injury to my left knee hit so no I'm not a nerd trust me I'm probably also one of the only people that hasn't seen Star Wars or Game of Thrones I'm 21 born 1999 October 27th favorite number is 37 my Jersey Number. I am finished on (Smash 4 Blueprints) unless I add more characters it is now in a collection so it's easier to pick what you want to see here: https://www.destructoid.com/--568161.phtml#post

Maybe impossible and I maybe a fool for trying but Shia LaBeouf has helped me move forward a lot with his "Just Do It" speech. He said Don't let your dreams be dreams, make your dreams come true. One of these days your going to work hard at it nothing is impossible. You should get to the point where anyone else would quit but your not going to stop there JUST DO IT. Which I have many times I don't care what people think of him that speech came from his heart.