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Why so few demos on PSN? Sony gives us an answer, and more! photo

Without exception, the one thing about the PS3 that has always stuck me as odd is the slim amount of game demos that can be found on PSN at any given time. While it's certainly more that what Nintendo has decided to give us, it is just about obliterated by what can be found on Xbox Live.

I've found myself pondering over the reasons for this more than once over the past few months, but I never was able to come up with anything to justify it -- even if Sony's PSN is still in its infancy, and free.While I'm still not sold on the reasoning, at least I now have answers -- as the result of a phone interview that Sony's director of product development, John Hight, had with MTV's multiplayer blog.

Ready for reason number one? Well, it would seem that they haven't been as profitable as expected:

We did a demo on Blast Factor and I’ve got 600,000 people playing that demo but I haven’t translated that into 600,000 people buying the game. … I think the demo kind of hurt it in a way and people got satiated.

 That's a fascinatingly simple way of looking at it, but isn't it logical to presume that Microsoft has the same problem on the Xbox 360? Of course not everyone is going to run out and buy the full game based on the demo. However, it unquestionably makes a difference. From a customer's standpoint, trailers can only go so far; it's actually playing part of the game that can help us decide if it's right for us.

Hit the jump, and you'll find more on this -- as well as some good news:

This of course, brings us to the second part of the reason that Sony has decided to limit the amount of demos on PSN: proliferation vs. polish:

“I thought we’re back in the same cool space as the early 90s, where kids can take their own savings, or, as [Everyday Shooter] creator Jon Mak did, work on this thing on his own, and find a place to publish it. And have it perceived maybe in the sense that it’s creative, fun and free and a new idea — but not something dangerous that’s going to crash your machine or leave you a really bad experience… It has a level of polish, but not so much polish that it feels like its commercial. The resulting PSN service hasn’t been overwhelmed with games."

“We’re very careful about the stuff we add to our catalog. Early on as a company we decided it’s not going to be about giant numbers and ‘Hey, come to PlayStation Network and you’ll have 5000 games, maybe three of which you actually want. Go ahead and find that needle in the haystack.’ It’s more about each one of these experiences is something special.”

Still not buying this argument? Neither am I. Nonetheless, I can appreciate that Sony cares about having polished games for us to enjoy online. The only problem with this, is that Microsoft has managed to do it -- and has given us many more to enjoy in the process. In the case of third-party, multiplatform games, I just can't think of any good excuse not to offer demos for both formats.

So what about this supposed good news that was promised earlier? Now this is something that certainly trumps what Xbox Live currently offers, and the topic itself has been a point of contention for Xbox 360 fans ever since the size restrictions were first imposed on developers:

“We’re not going to repeat ourselves. You won’t see sequels. We’re doing more content, so more experimental [games], but on balance you will see some somewhat bigger budget titles come in. The biggest thing I’ve got going now is about 2 Gig. That’s 2.5 times the size of Warhawk, and more in the ballpark of GT5 Prologue.” 

Now that sounds more like it, and a step in the right direction for Sony. With background downloading now an option for PS3 owners, there's no reason for the restrictions (hear that, MS?). Just call it a hunch, but something tells me that the mystery title in question is a third-person shooter by some company that calls themselves Zipper Interactive.

So where does this leave us? From the looks of things, I'd say somewhat for the better, and yet somewhere right smack dab in the middle of where we've been all along. We all know that Sony is going to get the message, and up the ante on the PSN side. We've seen inklings of this with ambitious home project, and now the download size increase. We've also seen PSN evolve since its inception, and it's just a matter of time before it more closely resembles (and perhaps surpasses) the Xbox Live experience.

Microsoft set the bar pretty high, and was able to persuade most of us that the cost of admission was worth it. Now we just need to convince Sony that more needs to be done on their end when it comes to giving us demos. They listened to us when we complained about price of the PS3 (we didn't buy them), and they made it cheaper. We've been buzzing about in-game XMB, and we pretty much know that's coming too. The PS3 is doing much better now, but it still has a long way to go in order to keep up with the other guys. Just keep that in mind, Sony. We'll be sure to do our part, and remind you along the way-- it's our job. How's that for a symbiotic relationship?


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44 comments | showing # 1 to 44

Crumpet Lips's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/18/2008 23:55
Crumpet Lips
I must admit that I USED to judge games by their demo like they are saying; I refused to get or play Bioshock because I didn't like the demo at all.... dear god how I was wrong. I bought the game and I would have to say that I was terribly wrong in assuming it would be shit because of the demo. Never again will I judge based from a demo I have played of it.
BluFire's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/18/2008 23:58
BluFire
The PSN is kind of like the way a dolphin's blowhole feels on my dick.
pooper's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/18/2008 23:58
pooper
A lot of it's on Sony, they give the developers the choice of producing demos or not. Microsoft forces everyone to put out demos on their console.
amalgamut00's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 00:00
amalgamut00
Thank you Sony for once again doing the wrong thing
Magesx's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 00:09
Magesx
Why can't we just rent games like the olden days?
specter620's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 00:09
specter620
"I’ve got 600,000 people playing that demo but I haven’t translated that into 600,000 people buying the game"

And that has nothing to do with it sucking, just people being 'satiated' right?
GuitarAtomik's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 00:12
GuitarAtomik
All I hear is "They might realize how much the game sucks if we let them try it first!". Like Hells_666 I look at it the other way. There are plenty of demos (for both the Arcade and full game releases) I've downloaded for games I really had no intention of buying, and the demo changed my mind.

The second excuse wasn't even relevant to the question. So you have less content, but higher quality than the "competition" so you don't have to make demos for them? Besides that statement being wrong (quality wise), it doesn't even make sense.
Y0j1mb0's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 00:15
Y0j1mb0
I could care less about a demo. And let's be real here..most of us here on Dtoid are pretty well informed about games. What intrugues me more are the experimental games down the pike. Echochrome looks AMAZING, and having no size restrictions mean developers don't have their hands tied before they start a game.

Bring on the games..I've waited this long a few more months wont break me.
Emrah's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 00:20
Emrah
Blast factor didn't even run at 60fps, and it's a measly 2d'ish shoot em up game. I am glad I didn't have to buy it to see that. Of course 600000 will see it and of course only a small percentage will buy it, even if it was anything good. But it also sucked ballzors, which didn't help.
KamikazeTutor's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 00:20
KamikazeTutor
"We did a demo on Blast Factor and I’ve got 600,000 people playing that demo but I haven’t translated that into 600,000 people buying the game. … I think the demo kind of hurt it in a way and people got satiated."

So... will they be just releasing games from now on, and having people buy them and get pissed off for the lack of quality and not being able to try the game before?
moot button's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 00:22
moot button
how do you translate "someone you know probably owns the game, just ask them how it is" into this guys's jargon?
broonor's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 00:28
broonor
I think that just means there will be no more demos for PSN exclusive games. If a game is an hour or two long, but you get to play 30 mins in the demo (or 5 whatever), that's a lot of free. PJ:M lets us know that even with a demo (wish we had that in the US), you can still have a ton of replayability in the game and have it "short". Their demo (first level I suppose?) wouldn't have just satiated me; I'd have wanted to buy it with or without the first level. No real point here... Demos are just that, demos.
BluFire's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 00:29
BluFire
I betcha thousands of people played the demo for Space Giraffe, but I doubt that translated into hundreds of thousands of sales.
Topher Cantler's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 00:35
Topher Cantler
They don't have 600,000 people playing Blast Factor because Blast Factor is fucking lame, not because of the demo. :P
KamikazeTutor's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 00:37
KamikazeTutor
I would rephrase that, Topher, into:

"They are right. They don't have 600,000 people buying Blast Factor because Blast Factor is fucking lame, proven by the demo."

;)
Niero's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 00:48
Niero
Haha you guys already beat me to it. Blast Factor totally lacks a hook. Bad example fella!

Anyone with half a brain should look at Geometry Wars as a case study and see what happens when you publish a game that's worth a damn.
Dan CiTi's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 00:50
Dan CiTi
The PSN does feel a bit lacking at times, but the XBLA and VC does seem to have enough junk/cookie cutter shit at the moment.
vexed alex's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 01:21
vexed alex
@ Magesx

"Why can't we just rent games like the olden days?"

Is that a serious fucking question? If that's the case, why don't we ride horses to work like the olden days?
tgammet's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 01:21
tgammet
Except on very rare occasion I don't buy anything that I didn't get to play first. I wish more people did the same.
-PL-'s Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 01:56
-PL-
Stop feeding us crappy geometry wars ripoffs and we'll buy more stuff off of PSN SONY!
mistic's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 02:01
mistic
"Come find the needle in the haystack"

seriously, I want the haystack!!!!
kawitchate's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 02:07
kawitchate
i've never NOT bought a game after playing its demo.
i have, however, bought one after liking the demo.
Topher Cantler's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 02:14
Topher Cantler
What they need to do is bring Every Day Together to the US. Japanese PS3 owners are having a blast with that game, and I wish so hard I could play it without a translator.
Necros's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 02:20
Necros
By the same token, I know a few friends who are satisfied with the demo of Geometry Wars and frequently play it because they can't even last a full five minutes. By their logic, why should they pay for the later levels when they can't even get there? My pleas about paying for a game you like seem to fall on deaf ears.
Crunshii's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 02:23
Crunshii
70% of PSN Demo's are good. A better example of a not so good Demo that honestly is a amazing game was Heavenly Sword.

The NA Demo didn't show any of the climax scenes between the king and Nariko. I honestly thought it was a rip off from God of War, Till I bought the game and played it through the excellent dialog cinematic, the story, the japanimation and the crazy bosses. (and multi language)

So you shouldn't judge games 100% of the Demo, but it is good try them out.
Samit Sarkar's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 02:43
Samit Sarkar
More original content is great, but I’m still not buying this “quality over quantity” argument. Give me more demos so I can decide for myself what’s good and what isn’t. Sure, demos can turn people off to the full game (see: XBL demo of Turning Point: Fall of Liberty), but hey, that’s the developer’s fault. The best way for me to decide whether or not to buy a game is to actually play it. I was already eagerly anticipating MLB 08: The Show, but after playing the PSN demo on Thursday night, it has moved up to my must-buy list (depending on how it compares to MLB 2K8, of course).
Wedge's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 02:58
Wedge
While it is mostly just rhetoric, I do think there is a decent point about quality of content. I mean, how many throwaway titles has the VC seen put out? What about the 20 versions of backgammon on XBLA?

Even if everything on PSN didn't turn out top notch, most of what gets released there is original and at least an attempt at doing something good it seems.

Though that really has nothing to do with demos, and I'm confused where line in the discussion between demos and general content exists. I don't see any reason to not have demos for full games, but arcadey titles I can understand. I'm one of those people who doesn't care about a full verison of Geometry Wars. It's fun, but I've never understood what's so special about it, and the demo gives me all I need.
Justice's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 03:17
Justice
That is one lame reason!
vexed alex's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 03:28
vexed alex
Where did these "meh" feelings for Geometry Wars come from? You people. You people are crazy, I tell ya'.
CALkulon's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 03:56
CALkulon
Blast factor was ass, that's why nobody bought it. If you don't put up demos a hefty amount of people won't look twice at the game - they want to know what it plays like before they commit £5 to it.

All we want right now is Europe is parity with the US - we keep getting anally drilled by SCEE over the PSN, I can only remember one or two good updates on it. We see game demos up after the games release (which meant I ended up with a copy of the STILL crappy online PES2008) most of the time, not to mention 2/3 weeks after the US.

Sony needs to sort their asses out over the PSN, but I can see them getting slack after the Blu-Ray announcements to be honest.
Petrie's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 04:41
Petrie
@ Necros

Wow, your friends really suck at Geometry Wars.
DrLilo's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 05:04
DrLilo
The thing with simple XBLA/PSN games is... I almost never buy them. I get the demos and really enjoy them, but that's enough for me. These games are usually very simple retro single-screen like titles... The full versions usually change the amount of available playing fields from 1 to say 5, but the core gameplay, the ten minutes of fun you expect from these games, is all there in the demo.
Cheeburga's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 05:12
Cheeburga
Good news!
I'm buying a PS3 as soon as it hits 100$
:]
ScottEFresh's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 07:56
ScottEFresh
It's free. Shut up.
big filth's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 08:19
big filth
haha. I love how some of the people with ps3's are saying

"we dont need no demo's!"

ok guys.
LarkOhiya's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 09:53
LarkOhiya
The PSN is kind of like the way a dolphin's blowhole feels on my dick.
The PSN is kind of like the way a dolphin's blowhole feels on my dick.
The PSN is kind of like the way a dolphin's blowhole feels on my dick.
The PSN is kind of like the way a dolphin's blowhole feels on my dick.
The PSN is kind of like the way a dolphin's blowhole feels on my dick.
I just can't stop thinking about that blowhole.
skullivan's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 11:17
skullivan
"We did a demo on Blast Factor and I’ve got 600,000 people playing that demo but I haven’t translated that into 600,000 people buying the game. … I think the demo kind of hurt it in a way and people got satiated."

That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. You're never going to come even close to a 100% conversion ratio. If something is free there's no reason for every single person who has access to it not to try it.

The problem is, there are people who will buy a game without trying it and those who won't. Either way, you've already got the first group, so it makes no sense to ignore the second. Even if the demo turns some people off to the game, there are going to be those who will go ahead and buy it who wouldn't have otherwise.

The only reason not to have a demo is if the game completely blows and you don't want anyone to play it.
joshandrox's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 12:21
joshandrox
Thats funny, I didn't buy blast factor because there was no demo! When the demo came out and I had a chance to play it I bought it that day!!
Leathersoup's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 14:16
Leathersoup
WTF?! They won't provide demos because people don't buy the game if they're able to try it first?
Does this sound like they want you to buy games even if they're not fun?
Sheesh.. I wish more people would follow Blizzard's business model. If a game isn't fun while they're developing then stop making it. It's not hard to mock up a simple version of the game without a fully developed engine. If that's not fun what makes them think that people outside of the company will think it's fun?
SlimPickens42's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 17:26
SlimPickens42
My question is, why does the interface of the Playstation Store suck? How hard would it be to make an interface that
1. isn't part of their lame web browser
2. is organized by game like Xbox Live. I hate to click through tons of crap just to find the newest add-on to a game
It doesn't seem like it would be that difficult. The Playstation store is one of my biggest gripes with the PS3 right next to having to install everything that I download (once I download something it should be installed, don't make me go through another step). Sony really needs to take a look at what both Microsoft and Nintendo are doing with their stores and emulate them.
jackdoe's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 17:36
jackdoe
Well, seeing as how most games are multiplatform, game demos are generally out of Sony's hands. Whether or not the game developer wants to make a demo would ultimately determine whether a demo will be made available. And you want to know the TRUE reason why there are so few demos on the PSN? It hasn't been out as long as Live. Hard concept to believe, I know, but just maybe, and I may be stretching here, a year of demos contributed to the difference? Too hard for you to fathom?
Fading Star's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/19/2008 18:28
Fading Star
More demos!
HarassmentPanda's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/20/2008 00:09
HarassmentPanda
Demos are a double-edged sword. But, if you create a quality game and output a quality demo that whets the player's appetite, they can do nothing but help sales.
Burnt Meatloaf's Avatar - Comment posted on 02/20/2008 05:49
Burnt Meatloaf
It's about time people started talking about this.

None of these excuses wash, because:

1) Most games don't have videos, let alone demos.

2) Most games don't have freakin' SCREENSHOTS, let alone videos.

3) Hell, they won't even tell you the download size or price before you get to the download screen. That wouldn't be such a big deal if the Store didn't have a GUI about as friendly as Steve Buscemi's teeth.

The bottom line is that Sony isn't telling people *anything* about the games, let along letting people try them. The whole PSN sucks. That's why I don't own anything. XBLA gives me demos, and that's why I own 7 games, plus the "XBLive Arcade Unplugged" collection.
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