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I call it the "parents doing their bloody jobs as parents" system.
YES
Not even your computers are safe
'''<=======================3-see what I mean
YES
Not even your computers are safe
'''<=======================3-see what I mean
Ah Jim, he's a major in the "People who know what the fuck they're talking about" system. Thus is why we all love him...
Who the fuck is Jim again?
<j/k homie... much love>
Who the fuck is Jim again?
<j/k homie... much love>
Nintendo will fix this easily: by fixing Miis so that you can't make them look like either penises, vaginers, nipples, goatse or pubic hair
why do the job your meant to do, when you can blame the problems caused by not doing the job on someone else.
Friend codes suck! How the fuck this system made it past QA and testing is beyond me, b/c it doesn't work on any level. Did anyone EVER say "I like this system?" Fuck no
On a different note, as far as parents doing their jobs? Has anyone ever thought that maybe the reason kids end up like they are is because they learned it from someone? I don't know, maybe their "parents"? A lot of adults these days are just as irresponsible as children, and that shit rubs off on kids. Just sayin...
Jim, the friend code system isn't there to protect children. It's there to get parents to think that it protects children so they'll but a DS and/or Wii for teh kiddies.
A common parent shopping for next gen console and video game store clerk encounter.
Parent- "But tell me clerk, do these consoles allow for my children to surf upon the World Wide Web?"
Clerk- "Why yes they do. And it allows for downloading of new games at a lower than retail cost, as well as interaction with other console owners via online multiplayer."
Parent- "What? Humans interacting with my boys on the internet, in the manner depicted in 'To Catch a Predetor'? Madness! Forget this electronic game buisness! I'm just going to get a learning game for my boys, something like Scrabble of Monopoly. Now those are real game, the games that I grew up on. They taught me the importance of spelling. and of capitailism. Furthermore, Dr Phil says that..."
(interupting)Clerk- "But, Nintendo has a friend code system on their consoles to keep your kids safe. It works by...
(interupting)Parent- "Al right already! Man, you video game clerks are so pushy! What, are you all paid on commision or something? Just give me the safest one. But it better not cost me more than $250!"
That's who friend codes are for. Parents like that.
A common parent shopping for next gen console and video game store clerk encounter.
Parent- "But tell me clerk, do these consoles allow for my children to surf upon the World Wide Web?"
Clerk- "Why yes they do. And it allows for downloading of new games at a lower than retail cost, as well as interaction with other console owners via online multiplayer."
Parent- "What? Humans interacting with my boys on the internet, in the manner depicted in 'To Catch a Predetor'? Madness! Forget this electronic game buisness! I'm just going to get a learning game for my boys, something like Scrabble of Monopoly. Now those are real game, the games that I grew up on. They taught me the importance of spelling. and of capitailism. Furthermore, Dr Phil says that..."
(interupting)Clerk- "But, Nintendo has a friend code system on their consoles to keep your kids safe. It works by...
(interupting)Parent- "Al right already! Man, you video game clerks are so pushy! What, are you all paid on commision or something? Just give me the safest one. But it better not cost me more than $250!"
That's who friend codes are for. Parents like that.
cont.
I have more or less seen the above interaction occur several times at Wal-Mart, Target, and Gamestop. These are parents who think the X-Box 360 is a X-Box shaped like a sphere, and is otherwise identical to the original X-Box, ignoring the clerks attempts to educate them otherwise. Parents who think the difference between the PS2 and the PS3 is the same as the difference between a $120 TV and a $600 TV. "The both play games, right?" say these parents "What's the difference then?"
I have more or less seen the above interaction occur several times at Wal-Mart, Target, and Gamestop. These are parents who think the X-Box 360 is a X-Box shaped like a sphere, and is otherwise identical to the original X-Box, ignoring the clerks attempts to educate them otherwise. Parents who think the difference between the PS2 and the PS3 is the same as the difference between a $120 TV and a $600 TV. "The both play games, right?" say these parents "What's the difference then?"
You know, Jim, I've been promoting your system for years, but for a different reason...
Let cookie monster eat his god damn cookies!
Let cookie monster eat his god damn cookies!
"Jim, the friend code system isn't there to protect children. It's there to get parents to think that it protects children so they'll but a DS and/or Wii for teh kiddies."
That's pretty much what I was hinting at in the article -- it makes the problem of online predation more prevalent elsewhere ... but as long as it's off Nintendo's property, they don't give a shit.
That's pretty much what I was hinting at in the article -- it makes the problem of online predation more prevalent elsewhere ... but as long as it's off Nintendo's property, they don't give a shit.
it's too bad that this goes over the head of a majority of the world's population...
Nintendo is afraid that lawsuits will erupt over the online services created by game companies, and when and if that day comes, Nintendo will be the only seemingly omnipresent and litigation-free console maker.
nintendo will never lead into territory that risks massive lawsuits or negative public perception -especially among parents- intentionally... unless it changes it's target audience... but it seems that children and family friendly entertainment are more Nintendo's audience now than ever =(
Nintendo is afraid that lawsuits will erupt over the online services created by game companies, and when and if that day comes, Nintendo will be the only seemingly omnipresent and litigation-free console maker.
nintendo will never lead into territory that risks massive lawsuits or negative public perception -especially among parents- intentionally... unless it changes it's target audience... but it seems that children and family friendly entertainment are more Nintendo's audience now than ever =(
I love my wii, but the friend code makes me want to punt the damn thing across the room.
there really is a better way to do things.
there really is a better way to do things.
I wouldn't hate friend codes as much if the UI was a little more intuitive. HINT: NINTENDO FIX THE UI
For instnace, a big shiny button (I know they can make those) that says "Email my friend code to another Wii" would be infinitely improved. Instead, we all have to TRANSCRIBE our goddamn code from the television to a piece of paper and send it via carrier pigeon to a friend, so they can reverse engineer the code on their side.
Keep trying Nintendo! don't give up!
For instnace, a big shiny button (I know they can make those) that says "Email my friend code to another Wii" would be infinitely improved. Instead, we all have to TRANSCRIBE our goddamn code from the television to a piece of paper and send it via carrier pigeon to a friend, so they can reverse engineer the code on their side.
Keep trying Nintendo! don't give up!
Sure, friend codes suck but this image is hardly the means by which to bash them. It doesn't even look like a dick, at least not any I've seen. And judging by the number of points he has, he must have been striker of the day at about 4 in the morning, not a real dangerous time for the kiddies. My bet is some pathetic douche bag busted his hump getting striker of the day just past midnight, snapped a picture and then called friend codes a danger to kids.
Buried for being lame.
Buried for being lame.
yeah, looking more closely at the picture, based on the time left in the season, this was taken at about 4 in the morning. The douche must have played all night trying to get this picture.
I remember seeing a conversation in a store (EB or something) were a parent was oh-so convinced that his kids PS1 could play "this racing game" (gran turismio) that even after everyone in the whole store told him it was a DVD, he bought it anyways and then said his kid could play it on his DVD player.
Above and beyond the friend code issue, is the bigger issue of mainstream consumers assuming videogames are for kids, this happened to animation.
Tex Avery made animation for adults, so did all the early animation pioneers, later on, people like Hannah Barbara discovered you could churn out utter shit and kids will still watch it, and so the kiddie market was born. Even though animation lends itself to adult subject matter, the medium is now considered a kiddie market, and parents assume that ALL animation should be suitable for kids, which is why in America so many animations are cut and censored, and none are aimed at adults.
What's my point? Well, videogames are in danger of being thought of as a kiddie medium where a token gesture of child protection is considered over the convenience of the medium, just to appease the parents who think that anythig that isn't film should somehow be a child friendly industry. This warped view is encouraged and backed up by Sony and Nintendo when they go oit of their way to exclude software that parents may find offensive, or in Nintendo's case complicating and limiting an online feature just to keep the parents happy even though they have no more rights than any other consumer. Manhunt 2 is an obvious example, why are Sony and Nintendo policing the content of their hardware? Surely their hardware doesn't belong to any exclusive market, let alone kids. But they have already shown that they will buckle under the pressure of mainstream arrogance and basically allow the ignorance of parents to dictate how a creative medium is run.
Think I'm being hysterical? Animation went from being one of the most creative mediums in the world, America was at the forefront of groundbreaking animation from the depression era to around the late 60's. Look at it now, it's saturday morning product placement fodder for kids.
Tex Avery made animation for adults, so did all the early animation pioneers, later on, people like Hannah Barbara discovered you could churn out utter shit and kids will still watch it, and so the kiddie market was born. Even though animation lends itself to adult subject matter, the medium is now considered a kiddie market, and parents assume that ALL animation should be suitable for kids, which is why in America so many animations are cut and censored, and none are aimed at adults.
What's my point? Well, videogames are in danger of being thought of as a kiddie medium where a token gesture of child protection is considered over the convenience of the medium, just to appease the parents who think that anythig that isn't film should somehow be a child friendly industry. This warped view is encouraged and backed up by Sony and Nintendo when they go oit of their way to exclude software that parents may find offensive, or in Nintendo's case complicating and limiting an online feature just to keep the parents happy even though they have no more rights than any other consumer. Manhunt 2 is an obvious example, why are Sony and Nintendo policing the content of their hardware? Surely their hardware doesn't belong to any exclusive market, let alone kids. But they have already shown that they will buckle under the pressure of mainstream arrogance and basically allow the ignorance of parents to dictate how a creative medium is run.
Think I'm being hysterical? Animation went from being one of the most creative mediums in the world, America was at the forefront of groundbreaking animation from the depression era to around the late 60's. Look at it now, it's saturday morning product placement fodder for kids.
I think Nintento's biggest fear is their online initiative turning into what X-box live has become (with all the assholes and racsists), which would hurt it's reputation far more then microsoft or sony since it's viewed as a family friendly console.
I think they should institute an open and closed type of online system where the closed system would be where only friends could be contacted and played with (for the kids obviously) and an open system where you can join any game and have anyone join (pedophiles and all).
I think they should institute an open and closed type of online system where the closed system would be where only friends could be contacted and played with (for the kids obviously) and an open system where you can join any game and have anyone join (pedophiles and all).
Zardoz: Your argument could hold merit, but I think the opposite has happened to games, to be honest. It started as a kiddy medium, but as gamers have grown up, so too has the industry. The problem is not those changing it to a kiddy medium, but those resisting change FROM a kiddy medium.
Fuck you, fuck your shit site. This vomit inducing 'website' is on par with Kotaku as the most biased games site on the web. Your bias against nintendo is childish in the extreme and shows how juvenile and ridiculous this website is. Jim and the rest ignore most of the Wii news and shit on Nintendo at any opportunity, do you even know that in a matter of weeks the Wii will outsell the crap-tastic 360 and become the worlds No.1 next gen console? You only wish you had a site that is half as decent as IGN. This site is nothing more than a blog of PC, and Xbox fanboys who can't stand that Nintendo is defecating all over the competition. Fuck you, fuck Kotaku...Goodbye.
@pdarkness
Sounds like someone needs a big ol' bear hug to get him through today
Besides, you would have to be extremely biased towards nintendo to think friend codes are a great idea.
Sounds like someone needs a big ol' bear hug to get him through today
Besides, you would have to be extremely biased towards nintendo to think friend codes are a great idea.
???
Dude, I love my Wii, but it still has problems.
At least they aren't breaking down on all of the editors here like the 360 is.
chill out.
Dude, I love my Wii, but it still has problems.
At least they aren't breaking down on all of the editors here like the 360 is.
chill out.
I don't think friends codes are good, they're terrible. But on the occasion I visit this site, i'm greeted with posts upon posts slamming Nintendo and the Wii, i'm sick of it. Like I said, Kotaku has the same issue. I really enjoy the casual nature of both these sites, but as I am a Wii owner (suprise) there is nothing for me here. IGN and Gamespot seem to be the only multi-platform games site that doesn't have a vendetta against Nintendo.
P.S @whipple, thanks for the hug, lol.
P.S @whipple, thanks for the hug, lol.
@pdarkness,
Dude, Whoa, just fucking whoa.
D'toid has it's problems. Bias against Nintendo isn't one of them. (now that summa left)
But don't hold up IGN as something great. That site is a bit shit. It may actually be worse than friend codes.
Dude, Whoa, just fucking whoa.
D'toid has it's problems. Bias against Nintendo isn't one of them. (now that summa left)
But don't hold up IGN as something great. That site is a bit shit. It may actually be worse than friend codes.
Jim, I don't agree with you that games started as a kiddy medium, they started as a crude simplistic child like medium due to the technology restraints, they couldn't really feature complex subject matter or visually disturbing adult themes, because they simply weren't capable of presenting anything other than basic game worlds or themes. Gaming is 100% reliant on cutting edge technology, the 16-35 year old male group have always been the first to adopt any new high tech hardware, so gaming and young adults/adults has always been a perfect marriage.
Kids were part of the 80s arcade scene, whereas teenagers and adults were more into the home computer game scene (ZX Spectrum, C64, Atari, Amiga, Amstrad etc) I don't think there has ever been a time when games were kiddy though.
It's just ironic that perhaps the biggest creative risk takers - Nintendo - are prepared to put the paranoia and misunderstanding of parents, before the best interests of the interactive medium, I actually though Iwata was going to change all that, guess not.
All these issues fall under the umbrella of the "Misunderstanding of Interactive Entertainment", relatively speaking, games are a new, misunderstood medium and are thusly put into categories born from older more established mediums, "Games are fun, bright, loud, colourful, and they're obviously not films, so what are they then, what are they like? Oh yeah, they're just like Disney or Pixar, or something that's not film but colourful and loud and fun, and anything that's fun must be primarily for kids and families right? So let's regulate the entire medium for kids and parents". Until the interactive medium is universally understood like the medium of film is understood, then parents will assume that they have first rights just like they have with animation.
Again, Manhunt 2 is the perfect example, it is banned for not conforming to the idea of what a game should be, as categorised by the non gaming mainstream. The obvious problem is that people don't know what a game should be, yet infuriatingly this problem is magnified by the games industry itself when Sony and Nintendo police their own hardware and add friend codes for no other reason than appeasing a wrong assumption about their medium. Film has no such assumptions inflicted upon it because people understand that many films are made for many different tastes, which is why you don't get Panasonic or Toshiba policing their DVD players, games are yet to be understood at this level which is why we get ridiculous crap like friend codes.
Kids were part of the 80s arcade scene, whereas teenagers and adults were more into the home computer game scene (ZX Spectrum, C64, Atari, Amiga, Amstrad etc) I don't think there has ever been a time when games were kiddy though.
It's just ironic that perhaps the biggest creative risk takers - Nintendo - are prepared to put the paranoia and misunderstanding of parents, before the best interests of the interactive medium, I actually though Iwata was going to change all that, guess not.
All these issues fall under the umbrella of the "Misunderstanding of Interactive Entertainment", relatively speaking, games are a new, misunderstood medium and are thusly put into categories born from older more established mediums, "Games are fun, bright, loud, colourful, and they're obviously not films, so what are they then, what are they like? Oh yeah, they're just like Disney or Pixar, or something that's not film but colourful and loud and fun, and anything that's fun must be primarily for kids and families right? So let's regulate the entire medium for kids and parents". Until the interactive medium is universally understood like the medium of film is understood, then parents will assume that they have first rights just like they have with animation.
Again, Manhunt 2 is the perfect example, it is banned for not conforming to the idea of what a game should be, as categorised by the non gaming mainstream. The obvious problem is that people don't know what a game should be, yet infuriatingly this problem is magnified by the games industry itself when Sony and Nintendo police their own hardware and add friend codes for no other reason than appeasing a wrong assumption about their medium. Film has no such assumptions inflicted upon it because people understand that many films are made for many different tastes, which is why you don't get Panasonic or Toshiba policing their DVD players, games are yet to be understood at this level which is why we get ridiculous crap like friend codes.
pdarkness
I spend A LOT of time on the sites. I have mostly nintendo systems. the fanboy in me gets offended, but it's really not a big deal. Sure I'd get irritated when sites wouldn't even acknowledge the GCN last generation, but the Wii is too much of a force this time around to be a ignored as something not worth having.
If you spend a lot of time on this site, the Wii is really popular, especially with the Clogs, the 360 is loved, but derided for breaking down, and the PS3, well, let's say the PS3 is where the GCN was near the end of the last cycle.
I spend A LOT of time on the sites. I have mostly nintendo systems. the fanboy in me gets offended, but it's really not a big deal. Sure I'd get irritated when sites wouldn't even acknowledge the GCN last generation, but the Wii is too much of a force this time around to be a ignored as something not worth having.
If you spend a lot of time on this site, the Wii is really popular, especially with the Clogs, the 360 is loved, but derided for breaking down, and the PS3, well, let's say the PS3 is where the GCN was near the end of the last cycle.
"parents doing their bloody jobs as parents" system
aka, PDTBJAPS
Well done, Sir Jim. Well done. (Everyone from England is a knight, right? Dragons, swords, the whole bit?)
Oh, pdarkness - you need to read more Dtoid. I'm a big Nintendo fan. Dtoid definitely takes jabs at Nintendo when deserved, but they also give the big N praise when rightfully so.
aka, PDTBJAPS
Well done, Sir Jim. Well done. (Everyone from England is a knight, right? Dragons, swords, the whole bit?)
Oh, pdarkness - you need to read more Dtoid. I'm a big Nintendo fan. Dtoid definitely takes jabs at Nintendo when deserved, but they also give the big N praise when rightfully so.
Part of what annoys me about the friend code issue is that it seems to be a case of nintendo catering to a demographic that wouldn't buy there product anyway. Can the neo-conservative afraid-that-the-technologies-are-stealing-my-childrens-souls-through-the-interwebs demographic really that lucrative for a console manufacturer? I do know parents who choose nintendo for there kid friendly image but from talking to then I know that has more to do with an abundance of good kid friendly software than ass backwards internet. Plus the friend codes really shoot them in the foot with the casuals who are drawn in by ease of use. Nothing says simple like random 16-digit numbers. And on that note why 16-digits? Social Security can pull it off with 9 but nintendo needs 16?
Zardoz- I'm suprised you didn't mention comics. They started as an adult friendly medium, then got killed by the self imposed "comics code", and are just now starting to crawl out of it and gain some artistic integrity again.
ESRB = Comics code. Self censorship, or any censorship for that matter, doesn't work when the goal is to make an entire form of media "safe for kids". It's a broken system and I hope it doesn't take the video game industry 40 years to figure it out, as it took comics.
ESRB = Comics code. Self censorship, or any censorship for that matter, doesn't work when the goal is to make an entire form of media "safe for kids". It's a broken system and I hope it doesn't take the video game industry 40 years to figure it out, as it took comics.
Lol. pdarkness is adding more evidence to my "Pride in Consoles" theory.
I own a Wii. It's my most played system. Friend codes are bullshit and Nintendo needs to get their heads out of their asses.
@Jim
Jesus, you are anti-Nintendo now, too!? You better hope nobody sees your negative posts about the XBox. Then you will be a man without a proverbial country!
I own a Wii. It's my most played system. Friend codes are bullshit and Nintendo needs to get their heads out of their asses.
@Jim
Jesus, you are anti-Nintendo now, too!? You better hope nobody sees your negative posts about the XBox. Then you will be a man without a proverbial country!
Jim, sadly, your new method will never catch on.
@pdarkness: like other have said, dtoid used to have a huge anti-Nintendo bias, but Summa is gone now. Now it's just a bunch of excellent writers who happen to point out flaws in Nintendo's plans when deserved. And it seemed most of Summa's anti-Nintendo rhetoric was to get a rise out of everyone, anyway.
@pdarkness: like other have said, dtoid used to have a huge anti-Nintendo bias, but Summa is gone now. Now it's just a bunch of excellent writers who happen to point out flaws in Nintendo's plans when deserved. And it seemed most of Summa's anti-Nintendo rhetoric was to get a rise out of everyone, anyway.
Yeah, if you think the current climate at Destructoid is one of bias against Nintendo, you should have seen it a few months ago (before the departure of a certain editor).
Anyhow, I do think that Jim has a point here (I'm a long-time Nintendo fan and Wii owner, by the way). I think anyone who has played PC or 360 games online can understand why parents (and thus, Nintendo) might be concerned about online gaming. Potential predation isn't even the only danger here; think about the kind of belligerent, tourette syndrome-afflicted d-bags you might encounter when playing Counterstrike or Halo, for example. These are not typically the kind of people you might want your young progeny to interact with.
But clearly, there are issues with Nintendo's actual implementation of protections against this sort of behavior (i.e. Friend Codes). In my opinion, Friend Codes are more obtrusive then they strictly need to be to serve their intended purpose. Inherent in Nintendo's online strategy thus far is a trade-off: less freedom and utility for greater protections against against potential abuse. Whether or not this is the correct approach is up for debate (I'd love to hear some D'toid parents weigh in on this issue), but seeing the image above, it is difficult not to feel like perhaps this trade-off is not worth it after all.
In the end, however, I find it highly unlikely that Nintendo will perform a complete reversal of their online strategy, as Jim seems to advocate towards the end of his post. The question then becomes: is there a way to achieve the balance Friend Codes are intended to create in a manner that is less burdensome on general users who see no real benefit from this balance?
Anyhow, I do think that Jim has a point here (I'm a long-time Nintendo fan and Wii owner, by the way). I think anyone who has played PC or 360 games online can understand why parents (and thus, Nintendo) might be concerned about online gaming. Potential predation isn't even the only danger here; think about the kind of belligerent, tourette syndrome-afflicted d-bags you might encounter when playing Counterstrike or Halo, for example. These are not typically the kind of people you might want your young progeny to interact with.
But clearly, there are issues with Nintendo's actual implementation of protections against this sort of behavior (i.e. Friend Codes). In my opinion, Friend Codes are more obtrusive then they strictly need to be to serve their intended purpose. Inherent in Nintendo's online strategy thus far is a trade-off: less freedom and utility for greater protections against against potential abuse. Whether or not this is the correct approach is up for debate (I'd love to hear some D'toid parents weigh in on this issue), but seeing the image above, it is difficult not to feel like perhaps this trade-off is not worth it after all.
In the end, however, I find it highly unlikely that Nintendo will perform a complete reversal of their online strategy, as Jim seems to advocate towards the end of his post. The question then becomes: is there a way to achieve the balance Friend Codes are intended to create in a manner that is less burdensome on general users who see no real benefit from this balance?
Either Nintendo Just assigns you one universal friend code, or creates a program that automatically updates your Wii with another friend's Wii whenever they purchase and setup a new WiFi compatible game, thus removing so much of the hassle involved with independent friend codes.
As a parent who has been trying to 'do his bloody job' all along, I've so far had very few problems teaching my child that douchebags who waste their lives trying to make obscene spectacles of themselves are never worth the attention they so desperately crave.
In other words, a hearty "Suk it, Fuckr" to anyone so dysfunctionally vengeful as to blame this behavior on the friend code system, instead of on the asshole who wasted hours of his life just to capture that ridiculous screenshot.
If my kid has to look at that screen, I am confident he'll get over it. If my kid is the one who makes that screen, and posts it on the internet as if it is evidence of something beyond his own fucked up value system, that's when I'll worry that I haven't been doing my bloody job.
In other words, a hearty "Suk it, Fuckr" to anyone so dysfunctionally vengeful as to blame this behavior on the friend code system, instead of on the asshole who wasted hours of his life just to capture that ridiculous screenshot.
If my kid has to look at that screen, I am confident he'll get over it. If my kid is the one who makes that screen, and posts it on the internet as if it is evidence of something beyond his own fucked up value system, that's when I'll worry that I haven't been doing my bloody job.
pdarkness, you're officially being way too oversensitive.
And yes, games were intended for kids, originally. Look at the advertising. 99 times out of 100, they show kids playing it. Regardless of who was actually playing them (and let's be honest, most people playing games back then were kids) games were a kiddy medium. (When I say kiddy, I include the early teenage years.)
And yes, games were intended for kids, originally. Look at the advertising. 99 times out of 100, they show kids playing it. Regardless of who was actually playing them (and let's be honest, most people playing games back then were kids) games were a kiddy medium. (When I say kiddy, I include the early teenage years.)
Sorry Jim Sterling, I guess you'll have to rape my butt on a different system. When I play Wii, my butthole is protected from predators like yourself.
But Nintendo is now trying to grow their market, so I think eventually there will be much stronger segmentation. As online gaming becomes more and more popular, Nintendo will need to cater to a more mature online gamer. There may eventually be two versions of some games -- one with friend codes, one with standard online. Parents will purchase kid-friendly version that will only allow friend codes play, others will purchase version that allows more conventional online play. Nintendo could make it very easy for a developer to build both types of games.
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