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Easy way around it: Don't be a pussy and play hardcore mode, then there's no bought items!
Simples and much more fun.
Simples and much more fun.
I gave up on D3 awhile ago, I'm ticked off but Blizzard has changed (not for the best). Great points though.
First Starcraft II with online DRM and now this.
First Starcraft II with online DRM and now this.
As someone who intends to play the game, I don't really understand how "thousands of bots/gold farmers will sit around in their own games farming valuable items" hurts me in any way.
It probably means that if I get a really good item I won't be able to sell it for very much, since farmers will have flooded the market. But if the price is low, either I'll use the item for its intended purpose (killing demons) or whatever price I would get for it is a bonus.
So how exactly does this hurt players?
It probably means that if I get a really good item I won't be able to sell it for very much, since farmers will have flooded the market. But if the price is low, either I'll use the item for its intended purpose (killing demons) or whatever price I would get for it is a bonus.
So how exactly does this hurt players?
I still don't understand what will be ruined though, it doesn't even have PvP does it? So if you don't buy the auction house items, it has no bearing?
The constant internet connection required is my dealbreaker, not this at all.
The constant internet connection required is my dealbreaker, not this at all.
I look at it as prime opportunity to get people to have some positive cash flow for playing video games. Look at the economy right now. If I can sit down and play Diablo 3 for 8 hours a day for 5 days a week and rake in 100 dollars a week. That's pretty much having a 12.50/hr job. And it's not like people have great chances of getting employed right now. So, why not? Get paid to game... shoot, I can use the extra cash.
In addition, @Hasney is correct. If you don't want to mess with the auction house system, there will be hardcore mode. If you were in Beta, you would know about Hardcore mode. It's the place to be if you don't want to be around the kiddie gamers/gold farmers.
In addition, @Hasney is correct. If you don't want to mess with the auction house system, there will be hardcore mode. If you were in Beta, you would know about Hardcore mode. It's the place to be if you don't want to be around the kiddie gamers/gold farmers.
Hundreds of dollars, woot?? That never happened with Diablo2. As far as I can remember it was just a few bucks to 20 Dollars maybe.
I honestly don't see the problem with this auction house. It was already there in D2 times, only then it was on ebay. Now it's inhouse. Same difference. It does not really have impact on the game for oneself snd folks lacking ingame gold in dire need of better equipment can pump up their characters.
Also, boss runs won't be encouraged through several quest stages one has to absolve to get to them. MAybe Blizz will even have a system sorting out suspicious "power sellers".
I honestly don't see the problem with this auction house. It was already there in D2 times, only then it was on ebay. Now it's inhouse. Same difference. It does not really have impact on the game for oneself snd folks lacking ingame gold in dire need of better equipment can pump up their characters.
Also, boss runs won't be encouraged through several quest stages one has to absolve to get to them. MAybe Blizz will even have a system sorting out suspicious "power sellers".
The auction house is just an easier way to sell items in-game rather than relying on some sketchy third party website that could possibly rip you off and breach your account. That being said, the auction house cannot be used with Hardcore characters anyways so who really gives a shit?
Because of farmers farming all the good items, your average player will probably have a very hard time making money off this game. However, I don't really understand why everybody is shitting their pants over this. Diablo is not an MMO, so you can perfectly avoid ever having to deal with farmers, especially if you host your own game with a couple of friends.
I'd much rather Blizzard have this feature built into the game rather than seeing it all on eBay. If it's going to happen, it would be better for it to be in a safer, sanctioned venue instead of eBay and the like.
@Xaeius:
Might want to check your math $100/40 hr = $2.50 / hour, not $12.50/hour. In other words, much less than minimum wage.
Might want to check your math $100/40 hr = $2.50 / hour, not $12.50/hour. In other words, much less than minimum wage.
I would be more scared if illicit gold and items sellers didn't already destroy Diablo 2 multiplayer. Now, it's more like, "thank God they're formalizing it!"
@Tien Le: Totally agreed, I made some cash as a kid playing Diablo 2. But you had to goto ebay/playerauctions to sell stuff
I completely disagree. Diablo 2 featured no soul bound items, and that didn't affect the gameplay whatsoever. The conclusion that items "worth a few dollars" won't be sold is preposterous. That's money, people don't abandon it. Also, this exact model is and had been around since the beginning of D2; ebay offers the same service!
Everything bought and sold came from people's efforts, and the market will reflect it. If you're worried about farmers, which are region locked anyway, their efforts would only level the prices due to competition.
I really have to disagree , and would like to use this as a shameless opportunity to pimp my blog with my thoughts.
Everything bought and sold came from people's efforts, and the market will reflect it. If you're worried about farmers, which are region locked anyway, their efforts would only level the prices due to competition.
I really have to disagree , and would like to use this as a shameless opportunity to pimp my blog with my thoughts.
Hardcore mode is something to be played in addition to regular mode. I wouldn't call that the solution here.
Don't get me wrong, I'm a huge roguelike fan... But I've never actually ascended in one.
Beating a game without dying once is incredibly hard. The majority of people would never be able to even finish Diablo 3 without respawns.
On topic however, I agree with the article. I remember a time when buying ingame stuff with real money was considered cheating. Now it's a perfectly acceptable practice. Oh so far have we gamers fallen.
Don't get me wrong, I'm a huge roguelike fan... But I've never actually ascended in one.
Beating a game without dying once is incredibly hard. The majority of people would never be able to even finish Diablo 3 without respawns.
On topic however, I agree with the article. I remember a time when buying ingame stuff with real money was considered cheating. Now it's a perfectly acceptable practice. Oh so far have we gamers fallen.
@Tristrix
I could never get any of my kids to watch that show. All they ever want to watch is Spongebob. :(
I could never get any of my kids to watch that show. All they ever want to watch is Spongebob. :(
When the market has no barriers of entry and everyone participates, the prices will be forced to the lowest available option. Anyone trying to encode this will be met with an inactive sale on the auction house. This is how capitalism works: competition from vendors fighting over people's business, namely by lowering prices.
Any resident D2 fan knows that eBay item selling was rampant, and scams were on both sides.
This just helps alleviate that inevitable burden.
This just helps alleviate that inevitable burden.
This is a silly article, full of silly economic doomsaying and bad logic. Why would more people able to sell ultra-rare items cause the price to increase? Correct: it wouldn't, since there would be more of those items. They'd get cheaper. "Normal" people would have more access to super rare items, not less. And in the same breath as you lament the increase in farming, you lament that low-level items will never be farmed. Now this is a bad thing? Those items would not be destroyed; they would naturally be found by those "normal" people who play the game, and who will probably happily buy and sell perfectly ordinary items for low prices. Everyone wins.
I'm not excited about Diablo 3 for completely different reasons, but I just don't understand what drives this panic about real-world currency auction houses. Is it jealousy? Fear of Big Business? Evil corporations?
I'm not excited about Diablo 3 for completely different reasons, but I just don't understand what drives this panic about real-world currency auction houses. Is it jealousy? Fear of Big Business? Evil corporations?
I just don't understand how someone burning a bunch of money in D3 to get better loot is going to affect my gameplay experience?
One thing that limits how much of an influence gold farmers can have on the economy of items is that the servers are region locked so you can only play on the server your country is connected to. Third world countries can farm all they want but they will only ever affect the economy of their region as opposed to everyone that plays
Once all the Chinese farmers or hackers get in there nothing on the real money AH will sell for more then a buck.Blizzard had to add some kind of monetization to the game to shut up Activision and id rather it be this then some kind of subscription tier shit.
Most of you are correct: the Real Money Auction House doesn't really affect you as a player, unless of course you A) Want to sell on the AH for cash, or B) Are playing Diablo 3 in some sort of competitive fashion. The problem is that adding a real money AH based on randomized loot drops and farming to any game makes it substantially skeezier. I don't play games for money, I play them because they're fun. If I wanted to play games for money, I'd go to a casino. And adding this "feature" does just that: turns this game into a goddamn casino.
Aside from that, two other issues stick out in my mind: 1, Blizzard has legitimized sweatshop farming. Was it going to happen anyway? Of course, but why make it easier on them? Crimes occur whether there are laws against them or not, but few people would make the argument that we should abolish laws and legitimize crime (in general).
2, when you play a game with real money involved, all your decisions become colored by the shadow of money. When you get a good drop, you will be tempted to sell it for cash instead of using it in game, trading it to a friend, or selling it for in-game currency. You've brought the real world into your fantasy world. For me, that defeats the point of gaming at all.
Aside from that, two other issues stick out in my mind: 1, Blizzard has legitimized sweatshop farming. Was it going to happen anyway? Of course, but why make it easier on them? Crimes occur whether there are laws against them or not, but few people would make the argument that we should abolish laws and legitimize crime (in general).
2, when you play a game with real money involved, all your decisions become colored by the shadow of money. When you get a good drop, you will be tempted to sell it for cash instead of using it in game, trading it to a friend, or selling it for in-game currency. You've brought the real world into your fantasy world. For me, that defeats the point of gaming at all.
I expect it'll just be a heavily regulated way of selling phat lewtz for real money where Blizzard gets a to be the guy profiting and not some shady 3rd world scam artist.
Everyone is instanced off so you will never see the gold farmers. The only difference it will make are lower prices in the auction house, which if you ever plan to buy items, is a good thing.
You seem to misunderstand how drop rates work. It isn't a case of; the gold farmer got this 1/1000 chance item so now no one else gets it for the next 1000 times. Everyone has that 1/1000 chance every time they play. It's possible (though unlikely) that you could get that item twice in a row. There's no reason that gold farmers being more likely to get it from farming excludes you from finding it while questing. So they can't drive up auction house prices, because the prevalence of normal players still far out numbers that of gold farmers.
Finally, gold farmers in third world countries will be seriously gimped by the fact that the auction house will be split into regions and currency. If third world gold farmers are limited to selling to third world players, it will not be a particularly profitable business and therefore a non issue.
You seem to misunderstand how drop rates work. It isn't a case of; the gold farmer got this 1/1000 chance item so now no one else gets it for the next 1000 times. Everyone has that 1/1000 chance every time they play. It's possible (though unlikely) that you could get that item twice in a row. There's no reason that gold farmers being more likely to get it from farming excludes you from finding it while questing. So they can't drive up auction house prices, because the prevalence of normal players still far out numbers that of gold farmers.
Finally, gold farmers in third world countries will be seriously gimped by the fact that the auction house will be split into regions and currency. If third world gold farmers are limited to selling to third world players, it will not be a particularly profitable business and therefore a non issue.
Also, I'm going to claim that soul binding was a lazy way at attending to solve a loot issue.. But in an MMO, where the objective is to dangle a carrot of an incentive to play longer to the players, they needed to artificially demand far more hours of investment. Diablo games are about immediate satisfaction from fun gameplay and rewarding loot. I'm incredibly grateful there isn't a soul bind system.
This article is Wrong-O. Clearly somebody didn't play Diablo 2 enough. Items worth hundreds? Maybe for that first windforce after launch, but give it a month and SoJ's will be tic tacs again.
And as for worrying over twink characters with too many pass-backs. It's all part of the game. It will work in your favor when you're questing so you probably won't have any complaints until you're getting pwned in PVP and well...getting pwned in PvP by a alt wearing epic gear = Welcome to Diablo!
The auction house (cash or otherwise) will give me something worthwhile do to with my epic loot that's meant for another character class besides trading it for duped items that disappear with the next patch D:
And as for worrying over twink characters with too many pass-backs. It's all part of the game. It will work in your favor when you're questing so you probably won't have any complaints until you're getting pwned in PVP and well...getting pwned in PvP by a alt wearing epic gear = Welcome to Diablo!
The auction house (cash or otherwise) will give me something worthwhile do to with my epic loot that's meant for another character class besides trading it for duped items that disappear with the next patch D:
The AH are seperate per region, also D2 had the same thing with companys that weren't Blizzard selling stuff. There is no problem here at all. ALso, anyone who says SC2 drm is an idiot. SC2 you can still play offline. If you want to play online you need to be online. That isn't drm.
This article is Wrong-O. Clearly somebody didn't play Diablo 2 enough. Items worth hundreds? Maybe for that first windforce after launch, but give it a month and SoJ's will be tic tacs again.
And as for worrying over twink characters with too many pass-backs. It's all part of the game. It will work in your favor when you're questing so you probably won't have any complaints until you're getting pwned in PVP and well...getting pwned in PvP by a alt wearing epic gear = Welcome to Diablo!
The auction house (cash or otherwise) will give me something worthwhile do to with my epic loot that's meant for another character class besides trading it for duped items that disappear with the next patch D:
And as for worrying over twink characters with too many pass-backs. It's all part of the game. It will work in your favor when you're questing so you probably won't have any complaints until you're getting pwned in PVP and well...getting pwned in PvP by a alt wearing epic gear = Welcome to Diablo!
The auction house (cash or otherwise) will give me something worthwhile do to with my epic loot that's meant for another character class besides trading it for duped items that disappear with the next patch D:
This article is Wrong-O. Clearly somebody didn't play Diablo 2 enough. Items worth hundreds? Maybe for that first windforce after launch, but give it a month and SoJ's will be tic tacs again.
And as for worrying over twink characters with too many pass-backs. It's all part of the game. It will work in your favor when you're questing so you probably won't have any complaints until you're getting pwned in PVP and well...getting pwned in PvP by a alt wearing epic gear = Welcome to Diablo!
The auction house (cash or otherwise) will give me something worthwhile do to with my epic loot that's meant for another character class besides trading it for duped items that disappear with the next patch D:
And as for worrying over twink characters with too many pass-backs. It's all part of the game. It will work in your favor when you're questing so you probably won't have any complaints until you're getting pwned in PVP and well...getting pwned in PvP by a alt wearing epic gear = Welcome to Diablo!
The auction house (cash or otherwise) will give me something worthwhile do to with my epic loot that's meant for another character class besides trading it for duped items that disappear with the next patch D:
You're worrying for nothing, it will be perfectly fine. Besides it's Diablo we're talking about here. Everything is fully random, so no exploits of any kind are possible. And it's not like boss runs are anything new. And if you've played WoW, you know overpriced shit just sits on the shelf forever, or until the seller gets tired of wasting money. Blizzard is still one of the smartest developers out there. And if they can't figure it out, well then nobody can. I just love how people are still saying Blizzard is just in it for the money and not quality, yet they passed up on 2011 holiday sales. Dirka derp.
Maybe today isn't my day, but I could have sworn Stone of Jordans went for a couple of hundred on ebay at one point in time. Maybe I am thinking of bulk prices? I also want to remember accounts going for high prices as well?
And I am also guessing prices based on the economy of WoW, simply because I already know plenty of WoW players are waiting on D3. It will be interesting to see how everything plays out. I know I will still be playing D3 regardless, along with Old Republic!
And I am also guessing prices based on the economy of WoW, simply because I already know plenty of WoW players are waiting on D3. It will be interesting to see how everything plays out. I know I will still be playing D3 regardless, along with Old Republic!
"The auction house is optional. If you don't like it, don't use it."
Kind of end the discussion.
Honestly this text makes no sense. Where is the disaster? Why the problem with the gold farmers? Some people wanna make money playing games on internet, so what? You know the worst thing that can happen? Auction House fail and be taken off. Still will be skeletons to crush? Of course! Then where is the disaster?
Kind of end the discussion.
Honestly this text makes no sense. Where is the disaster? Why the problem with the gold farmers? Some people wanna make money playing games on internet, so what? You know the worst thing that can happen? Auction House fail and be taken off. Still will be skeletons to crush? Of course! Then where is the disaster?
I get the feeling that a lot of people are thinking in make some easy money playing Diablo 5 minutes per day. Now they comes with the "animals of the third world are coming to TAKE OUR JOBS". Guys, really, this again?!
@Derek
"And I am also guessing prices based on the economy of WoW, simply because I already know plenty of WoW players are waiting on D3. It will be interesting to see how everything plays out. I know I will still be playing D3 regardless, along with Old Republic!"
Why would you even try to compare the economy of WoW, that has an average of 2500 players per auction house, to an economy that's going to encompass an entire country?
"And I am also guessing prices based on the economy of WoW, simply because I already know plenty of WoW players are waiting on D3. It will be interesting to see how everything plays out. I know I will still be playing D3 regardless, along with Old Republic!"
Why would you even try to compare the economy of WoW, that has an average of 2500 players per auction house, to an economy that's going to encompass an entire country?
"I think what some developers fail to understand is that people are actually paid in third-world countries to sit behind a computer on their shift and farm in that same spot for hours and hours."
Im 100% sure every mmo developer is very much aware of this.
Im 100% sure every mmo developer is very much aware of this.
@Derek - Diablo prices were never WoW-levels of expensive. Everyone is going to find gear, and likely participate in selling it; this isn't the WoW style where you have to invest hundreds of hours of raising our farming to get loot. People will probably post gear on the AH for a hundred bucks, but out will definitely not sell when players get in the swing of things and drive the prices down. Also, SoJs were never that much!
I've appreciate your feedback on my thought last month: [url]http://www.destructoid.com/blogs/Arttemis/diablo-iii-what-the-auction-house-really-means--207781.phtml [url]
I've appreciate your feedback on my thought last month: [url]http://www.destructoid.com/blogs/Arttemis/diablo-iii-what-the-auction-house-really-means--207781.phtml [url]
Autocorrect fail.
I'd appreciate your feedback on my thought last month: http://www.destructoid.com/blogs/Arttemis/diablo-iii-what-the-auction-house-really-means--207781.phtml
I'd appreciate your feedback on my thought last month: http://www.destructoid.com/blogs/Arttemis/diablo-iii-what-the-auction-house-really-means--207781.phtml
Real money in fantasy worlds does not mix---the cash should be all in game cash..so you need to earn your keep in game...not in the real world.
Uh, economics says no. Higher supply at a given demand = lower prices, not higher prices. The Second Life comparison is also completely flaccid. Loot drops in Diablo are going to be perfect competition (because one epic is the same no matter who is selling it). The Second Life market is monopolistic competition to downright monopoly due to branding and rights and such. (I guess technically PC could exist, I haven't been there, but with practically limitless resources people would basically only be paying for convenience, but I digress.)
No, what the system means is less money for people who get it "legit" rather than "farm" it, if the farmers were to magically disappear (or fail to appear, as the case may be). It also means less money for the farmers, and less farmers until an equilibrium is reached. In fact, since farming was already a thing with Diablo 2, this ought to reduce the total amount of farmers by introducing more legit sellers by reducing the barriers to entry to become a seller.
It *could* be a problem if there were some sort of equipment cap (only 10 of this hat exist in the world), in which case it would mostly go to farmers who would then have a practical monopoly on the thing, but as far as I know, that's not how any item drop works in Diablo.
Honestly, farming is a problem in MMOs mostly because it uses up space on the server. People can't get to a drop area because it's clogged with farmers. This is not a problem with Diablo.
And just to be nit-picky, try 0.04-0.05 percent, not five percent. One in twenty-five for an epic drop? No way that's going to be worth a dollar.
No, what the system means is less money for people who get it "legit" rather than "farm" it, if the farmers were to magically disappear (or fail to appear, as the case may be). It also means less money for the farmers, and less farmers until an equilibrium is reached. In fact, since farming was already a thing with Diablo 2, this ought to reduce the total amount of farmers by introducing more legit sellers by reducing the barriers to entry to become a seller.
It *could* be a problem if there were some sort of equipment cap (only 10 of this hat exist in the world), in which case it would mostly go to farmers who would then have a practical monopoly on the thing, but as far as I know, that's not how any item drop works in Diablo.
Honestly, farming is a problem in MMOs mostly because it uses up space on the server. People can't get to a drop area because it's clogged with farmers. This is not a problem with Diablo.
And just to be nit-picky, try 0.04-0.05 percent, not five percent. One in twenty-five for an epic drop? No way that's going to be worth a dollar.
"My very first thought was "Great, now gold farmers are going to be able to sit in the same exact spot 24/7 and sell that epic item with a very low drop rate as soon as they get it.""
Diablo doesn't work that way.
"I think what some developers fail to understand is that people are actually paid in third-world countries to sit behind a computer on their shift and farm in that same spot for hours and hours."
Do you honestly believe Blizzard is one of those?
"The whole soul-bound issue is making this even worse. For the players that actually want to earn their in-game money like a normal person, this is great considering they can play Diablo III fairly and have a lot of different options to sell gear, but this is a disaster when you add in a real-life-currency Auction House. "
Why? You can't just say something and make it so.
"This is just going to increase the amount of farmers and bots used in the game because they will need to cover more territory."
Cutting out the middle-man for RMT will only have the _opposite_ effect. 3rd party gold farmers/item sellers make the majority of their money off of the arbitrage from the lack of a way for this commerce to happen. "Legalizing" this kind of thing crushes the black market. How many bathtub gin safehouses do you see these days?
"They will be destroyed or vendored. The only thing the farmers will be after are items people are willing to pay hundreds of dollars for and when you add in Auction House access from anywhere, the gold farmers will be able to spike up prices extremely high simply because they will be the only ones ever around to actually get the chance at that four or five percent rate."
Oh, you don't understand how instancing works. I'd look that up, as online Diablo has been instanced since it's existed. Also, SM which you brought up earlier was as well. No number of gold farmers can prevent anyone from having a "fair shot" at a drop.
"It is truly difficult to understand the thought process Blizzard has in mind for a real-life currency auction."
This is because you no nothing about how the games work, primarily, or anything about virtual economies, secondarily.
Diablo doesn't work that way.
"I think what some developers fail to understand is that people are actually paid in third-world countries to sit behind a computer on their shift and farm in that same spot for hours and hours."
Do you honestly believe Blizzard is one of those?
"The whole soul-bound issue is making this even worse. For the players that actually want to earn their in-game money like a normal person, this is great considering they can play Diablo III fairly and have a lot of different options to sell gear, but this is a disaster when you add in a real-life-currency Auction House. "
Why? You can't just say something and make it so.
"This is just going to increase the amount of farmers and bots used in the game because they will need to cover more territory."
Cutting out the middle-man for RMT will only have the _opposite_ effect. 3rd party gold farmers/item sellers make the majority of their money off of the arbitrage from the lack of a way for this commerce to happen. "Legalizing" this kind of thing crushes the black market. How many bathtub gin safehouses do you see these days?
"They will be destroyed or vendored. The only thing the farmers will be after are items people are willing to pay hundreds of dollars for and when you add in Auction House access from anywhere, the gold farmers will be able to spike up prices extremely high simply because they will be the only ones ever around to actually get the chance at that four or five percent rate."
Oh, you don't understand how instancing works. I'd look that up, as online Diablo has been instanced since it's existed. Also, SM which you brought up earlier was as well. No number of gold farmers can prevent anyone from having a "fair shot" at a drop.
"It is truly difficult to understand the thought process Blizzard has in mind for a real-life currency auction."
This is because you no nothing about how the games work, primarily, or anything about virtual economies, secondarily.
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