I don't think Fallout 3 will be good based on Oblivion, which I hated. That being said, I do agree with the general philosophy of not doing whatever fans want. Listening is one thing, but taking orders is another. Most people do not know what they want.

And not that it has any bearing on this discussion, but I love tactical games and I love RPGs and I love dialogue-heavy games. With all that in mind, I tried to play the original Fallout about a year ago because it seemed so my type of thing. I played over ten hours into it and try as I might, I could not get into it. A few things felt really good (like using the submachine gun at point-blank range) but it had a horrible interface, control scheme, et cetera . . . you know, the gameplay? Honestly, it kind of turned me back to Japanese games for a while. For all their faults (linearity, simple rehashed stories), at least their games don't seem like a bunch of glitches and quicksaves stitched together. And they're prettier. Fallout was such an ugly game . . . it reminded me of Oregon Trail more than anything else.

Would it have killed them to use a grid-based map like Final Fantasy Tactics? Or am I the only person that can't stand Baldur's Gate-style interfaces and those ugly little sprites?

So maybe if Bethesda can take the dialogue and character of the Fallout series and change the gameplay, I will like it. But probably not, because Oblivion sucked.

why can't we just have a balance between fan input and original ideas coming from the bethesda team. you can't go extreme in either direction.

the turn from isometric to fps is the reality of the state of gaming. graphics have come a long way since the first fallout. as an fps, bethesda knows they will sell more copies. personally, i would not go near this game if it was isometric viewpoint. a well developed storyline and killer graphics and gameplay are much more immersive as an fps. imagine playing bioshock with an isometric view.

Oh, that is it. I'm a huge Fallout fan, and I am so ashamed of No Mutants Allowed existing to the point that they have. Every single member of their forums is the very definition of a fanbase so rabid, it will not tolerate even the slightest tooling around with their precious Pip-boys and action points. They want Fallout 3 to exist in a time/space that is somewhere around 1999. Personally, I hope Bethesda blatantly ignores every suggestion on NMA's boards, and even adds stuff just to piss them off. They make Ultima Online addicts look relevant.

Oh, and Oblivion's aight in my book. Just sayin.

@CaffeinePowered

Um, and when you played Fallout 3, did you notice that all those things you wanted were missing? The dialogue, moral choices, dark humor, all that? It's amazing what you can derive from a handful of screenshots and interviews.

The problem with people like you is you jump to conclusions the moment something doesn't sit well with you. Okay, so it's not an isometric point of view, and it will have a part turn-based and part action-based combat system. What the hell does that have to do with moral choices and quality writing? You're jumping to conclusions about a game nobody has even really seen in action. That's why I can't take you (or fans like you) seriously.

How about you wait a bit before crying about raping great RPGs until, oh, after you've played it? You can bitch all you like after that.

How can you say Oblivion sucked? (that is a rhetorical question) That just blows my mind. I mean...did you get out the sewer and TRY it? Or just quit once you realized you had to use FPS-style combat system? You couldn't suspend your critical super-ego long enough to try and immerse yourself in the game and employ a little imagination? (again, all rhetorical).

That's not the point of this article though, and as I read through the comments it appears that this thread is 90% anti-fanboy and chock full of people shouting the rabid fanboys down anyway. Didn't anybody read the developer diary where Bethesda said they were steadfastly trying to follow the original list of points that Interplay wrote up to guide the production of first Fallout?

@Disco

Ive never in any of my comments said 'It WILL suck', Ive said I hope it doesn't suck and based on their track record I'm not very hopeful.

It could be good, we haven't seen enough, but can state what I HOPE the game includes, even if there is no information going either way.

Theres always a chance it could be a worthy successor, but the general fear is 'oblivion with guns'.

I have to say that I'm looking forward to what Bethesda has done to the Franchise, Comparing it to Tactics and BoS, it would be an improvement. I'm not bothered with a Genre Change (going from RPG to First Person), as long as it "feels" like I'm in the same world. I'm kind of sick of hearing the fanboys whining that they're not getting the 2d Isometric boxed beta that was released 11 years ago. Fallout wasn't perfect, and neither was fallout 2 when it came to bugs. I bought fallout 2 when it came out and had to wait months for a patch to come out so I could play the thing. Vastly disappointed.

I could rant for days about certain groups (NMA, I'm looking in your general direction) that have that holier than thou attitude and think something is owed to them just because they have a favorite video game franchise. If they don't like the way things are going with it, then maybe THEY should've bought the brand and made Fallout 3.

If the fanboys want an experience as close the their beloved original Fallout as possible, they should just play the original. Leave Bethesda to make a fantastic game and be happy with the fact they they aren't buttfucking their franchise like some other developers might be inclined to do.

@DanMazkin: I bet bioshocked is one of those developers. I wouldn't say that I was disappointed with Oblivion, as I have bought and played through all of the expansions on 360 and on PC. The developers are right though, they'll make the games they want to make, and I'll continue getting the best gaming experience I'll ever have playing pre-21st Century games. I think I used to buy over 20 games per quarter back then, now i might buy one. I may or may not buy Fallout 3 based on nothing I've read here, and completely based on the fact that I want to know Fallout as the isometric tactical rpg marvel that it is and will always be. Fallout 3 will be a completely different game, sure, and I'm not really making a decision until one of my friends buys it and lets me play through most of it as per usual.

the game is FALLOUT 3.

it should be a fallout game. yes, some people didn't like fallout - who cares? making the third game in a series bethesda should be following a very specific formula, or else they are just using the name to sell a new game.

for those that never played fallout/ fallout 2 - play them before you comment here. they really are radically different to any other games, which is why the fallout community wants any changes to be as subtle as possible.

I'm with CaffeinePowered on this one.

I too would go in with low expectations if Oblivion is any indication of what is to come. Was Oblivion a bad game? No not really. But the game was broken in some ways, and a devoted community fixed it. It had a really dumbed down feeling when it came out.

One of the things I've always liked about RPGs and role-playing, is that you can create useless characters or very odd and strange ones. In Fallout, you could customize your character in a way that the game could be almost entirely unplayable. Depending on your intelligence, the dialogue changes in such a way that you can either come off as an extremely well articulated person that gets plenty of quests and information, or a person that can only make grunting noises that nobody understands, and you don't get any quests at all. What happens if you're character is extremely lucky or unlucky?

It's customization like this that truly made Fallout a fun experience every time. No matter how many times you played it, there's was practically always something you actually hadn't even seen or done. Most of the quests had several possible ways you could deal with them in. But when you set out those stat points, you sometimes excluded your characters from certain options.

The dynamic world and how the player is forced to make choices in Fallout still puts most of the games today to shame. Bioshock being all about moral choices? Well I liked that game and I totally loved SS2, but pfah! You could choose between good or evil and that was it.

I wish Bethesda good luck, but I hope they don't forget about the actual RPG elements this time around, and don't get too caught up in just getting the atmosphere right.

The Fallout series was great because the world was so open ended, you could do anything you wanted to and go anywhere you liked, it felt like a real adventure and all the little details of the game made it shine. After watching the trailer it seems like Bethesda are trying to take all the cool things about the Fallout universe, I.E. the art Deco 50's feel and just mash it into a rather linear FPS with Fallout theme's. It's too bad the boy's missed the point about why Fallout was such a brilliant game. Maybe Fallout 4 will return closer to its heritage.

I understand fans being fans and I'm sure Bethesda listen to their input, fans need to also be realistic though. Bethesda are creating a third Fallout game in a different market climate to the previous games.

They are also selling this game to a wider audience, whereas the previous games were PC only. With the competition for sales tougher than it ever was, I can understand changes being made. These days you fans shouldn't worry about this stuff so much. Use RE4 as an example that change can be positive, despite what fans might have wanted RE4 to be. Also updates and extra content can easily be added to Fallout 3 later on.

We can only judge it once we've played the game. To do so prematurely, because you disagree on certain aspects isn't good or fair on Bethesda. This applies to games across the board.

Well, the game has 12 endings, something I haven't had since Chrono Trigger, so I know I'll be buying it. I'm sure many ordinary gamers will too.

Right, I don't mean to shit on everyone's Bethesda cock sucking parade, but there's a distinct possibility this may be quite horrible regardless of the direction they want to throw their game-designer balls.

Will it be a success? Of course it will, it'll be marketed as Oblivion with guns, and people will eat that shit up while anyone who played Fallout will literally cry blood soaked tears while beating themselves unconscious with their own keyboards.

Seriously, why do you guys give a shit. You still have the OG games don't you? Is Sonic the Hedgehog not awesome because Shadow came out? Thought so.

I mean yeah, I get it. You want a "true" sequel to the game you played back then. Well, you played an antiquated game back then. It would be profit suicide to make that game again. Even the "good guy" developers HAVE to make money if they want to eat more than ramen noodles and make new games.