Isn't the entire world sick of shitty party games?

"Obligatory Natal will be wank comment"

The problem for gamers is the majority of people who buy games like that aren't gamers in the sense that WE are gamers. So they sell millions and our market gets flooded with them.

They need to show us something. If you're sick of it, give us something that isn't that in the motion control paradigm...

too much to ask I guess...

I don't get why some folks get so worked up over shitty party games. Don't play them. They're not making their way into your Uncharted or Gears of War, so who cares?

@Interlink: Shitty party games literally did drown the Wii, and as Dv8thwonder rightly points out they shitted up the PS1/2 as well. The problem with the Wii is the GIGANTIC mountain of shovelware actually pushed the good games off the shelves.

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of course natal is going to go through the same sort of motion titles that wii is. third parties still are refusing to make deep games that include motion control. if valve is just now starting to think about motion controls, they aren't going to be coming out with anything for a couple of years anyhow. their statement is true, but i highly doubt that it's anything other than a blanket statement.

@dethtoll

Oh don't get me wrong, I totally agree that the Wii is party game shovel-ware city. Though to play devil's advocate for a second, there are people that enjoy those kinds of casual games, and I think that's okay - we all have different tastes in movies and music, so why not games? If Aunt Jane wants to play Carnival Games 2, I say let her enjoy herself.

As a "hardcore gamer" (I hate that term), it doesn't bother me at all because there are so many other games out there that appeal to me. Until developers I really care about, like Team Ico, Rockstar, etc, stop or reduce making games that appeal to me in order to make Wii party games, I guess it doesn't affect me too much.

I love VALVe.

Oh hey Valve! Remember that game franchise that MADE you? I think it was called Half-Life. What the fuck are you doing with that?

Well why doesn't Valve put their money, where their mouth is? The Wii has been out for over 3 years now and different people from Valve have said numerous times that they would love to work on the Wii, but they still haven't. So why didn't they do something for the Wii, if they're so sick of shitty mini-games?

If they think they're going to do something brilliant on Natal, like make a wiggle-fest version of Left 4 Dead, than they're just delusional, because no hardcore gamer would buy it. Unless they're all hypocrites, because wiggling around like a retard on Natal is no different, than waggling your arm with a Wiimote!

I'm still waiting for someone to take advantage of the wii motion plus.

still where is Valve on the wii? I mean there it is one thing to be angry cause a game that you made didn't sell because of the amount of shovel ware pushed it out of the shelves, but Valve has not even tried to make a game for the wii.

"We have these technologies now that let us interact in different, really exciting ways. It's developers' jobs to do something with it. Impress me. Don't just make sh*tty games I wouldn't want to play if I had to use a joystick."

Them be fightin' words.

I don't understand, does he have nieces and nephews or a neighbor's son with whom he is forced to play party games with on a daily basis?

I hope they do something completely crazy and unexpected.

But its probably going to be more of the same.

Christ, why is it that every Valve thread either mentions HL2: Episode Three or wanting a new engine, or complaining how they don't make PS3 games? Christ people, are we that starved for complaints that we must regurgitate the same 3-4 arguments every time a Valve thread is made?

(Also, people wanting HL2: Episode Three: Be fucking patient, christ.)

I wonder if Garry's Mod can benefit from Natal.

I don't think Valve is in a position to criticize when they haven't made any efforts on the Wii.

Hey, there's an idea! Why don't you lead by example? Or, failing that, why not try to make something that works for the PS3?

(Meanwhile, I'll play mah PC TF2 and L4D...)

@dethtoll

"The problem with the Wii is the GIGANTIC mountain of shovelware actually pushed the good games off the shelves."

You mean games like Deadly Creatures or Mushroom Men? You think such quality titles would have sold well if they weren't "pushed off the shelves"?

Or maybe you mean the actual high-quality titles like MadWorld or Little King's Story that would have bombed regardless of platform? (BlazBlue or last gen's Okami would like to have a word with you...)

Or could you mean the quality AND mainstream games like GTAIV, Mass Effect, Final Fantasy XIII, and Modern Warfare 2?

Oh... You mean those didn't get released on the Wii?

The fact of the matter is, the third party situation only exists because developers make it exist, not because there's anything intrinsically wrong with the Wii or its having a plethora of cheap, casual titles just like the PS2 and PS1. The PS2 would have had the same problem had developers only released their best efforts on the GCN and Xbox. ("RE4 stays GCN-exclusive unless you can prove you have RE fans by buying Gun Survivor en masse, PS2. Oh, Gun Survivor DID sell well? Okay, here's Gun Survivor 2, while RE4 stays GCN exclusive.")

So, dethtoll, you're statement would be true if there were any high-tier third party titles to shove off shelves in the first place, but excluding the niche ones, there really aren't. Nintendo is the only one that really puts forth an effort, and that's why their games sell so well, not because of any inherent fanboyism.

Don't 'party' games and 'shovel-ware' exist on every platform from high definition hardware all the way down to legacy hardware? The ratio varies from console to console, but I don't think it's intrinsic to the hardware, it's the demographic which is driven by software developers, publishers, and marketing. (imo)