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The XNA Community Review Challenge photo

A little while ago, I wrote a rather damning appraisal of the Xbox 360's Community Games channel, sharing my belief that nearly every game on offer was garbage. I know that there are a few actual worthy titles to be found, but sifting through the utter crap takes a lot of time and hard work.

The Community Games development community took my words to heart, and there has been some discussion about what to do. One developer, the creator of Biology Battle, decided to take action and has asked that I review the game on Destructoid.

As a matter of disclosure, Biology Battle developer Novaleaf Software has given me the required Microsoft Points to download the title (in lieu of being able to offer review copies) and the review will hit this week. After discussing with Nick Chester, we think this could become a rather interesting way of separating the wheat from the chaff on the Community Games channel, as well as give XNA developers some much-needed coverage.

In essence, we will be presenting reviews as an open challenge to Community Game developers. Hit the jump for the full details.

Here's how it will work.

If you want us to review your Community Game, merely contact me at jim @ destructoid.com and we can arrange a review the same way that Novaleaf has. What you will then get is a full-scale Destructoid review, written with as much depth as your game allows. We'll treat it as any other videogame, which means it will get the same respect and discussion, as well as the same brutal honesty. 

If you read this site, you'll know how tough (or at the very least, unpredictable) the reviews on Destructoid can be, so it will definitely take someone who truly believes in their game to come to us. Hopefully, this means that the best of the channel will pass through Dtoid's doors and, naturally, the Destructoid readers will benefit from getting to know which games are worth clawing through the crap to try out. 

At its best, the Community Games channel is a terrific place for indie developers to get some real attention. At its worst, it is a home for derivative, poorly made trash that obscures any glimmer of talent that might be hiding. Regardless of its potential for disaster, the Community Games channel does deserve coverage, and we think this is a really cool way to cover it. 

If any other XNA developers are willing to follow Novaleaf and have their game reviewed on the site, always be aware that our mantra of "brutally honest game reviews" remains. Microsoft Points will gather no special treatment, only a review. If you're going to give me Kitchen Sink Wars, you better take your 2/10 and love it. If your game is magnificent, however, it will get the glowing praise we feel it deserves. 

That's it. Stay tuned for the official Destructoid review of Biology Battle, coming this week, and hopefully we can look forward to many more Community Game reviews coming soon.


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45 comments | showing # 1 to 45

EternalDeathSlayer's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 09:52
EternalDeathSlayer
Sounds like a good idea, don't really see anyone else reviewing these shitty games.

Maybe you'll find some diamonds in the rough.
PhazonYoshi's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 13:25
PhazonYoshi
Great idea, give these guys some recognition.
garison's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 13:26
garison
Can't wait to read.

I hope some of these games don't totally suck.
mourning orange's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 13:27
mourning orange
Ohhh I hope something good comes from this little challenge.
XrayZwei's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 13:28
XrayZwei
If the first two posts are any indication, is there even reason to "review" the game? I mean come on; we know they're shitty well before they ever come out, right? Or will the scale be little piles of poo?
Char Aznable's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 13:29
Char Aznable
THIS SHIT IS BIASED!
Mr Gilder's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 13:39
Mr Gilder
This is a fantastic idea Jim. I will look forward to it.

Sub-question. If I give you the appropriate MS points out of my own pocket, will you review Dokee and the Musical Rain?
falinter's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 13:47
falinter
I went through and tried a few of those games and have since given up.

This would probably be the only way I would go back into that section of Live and try/buy a game.

Good on ya, Jim.
Tubatic's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 13:54
Tubatic
1) first 50 cent, now XNA?

Destructoid will throw down if challenged CONFIRMED!

2) This is a great idea. WiiWare, and cell phone games could benefit, in theory, from a similar challange.
Jim Sterling's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 13:59
Jim Sterling
"Do these shitty games warrant an even shittier review?"

The rest of the comments so far seem to prove you wrong.

Seriously, try and wait for a real reason to troll rather than jump the gun. You're trying too hard, babe.
Jesus H Christ's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 14:01
Jesus H Christ
So all it takes to get an official Destructoid review is a couple digital dollars. Interesting.

I keed. Don't get butt hurt, nerds.
smack0007's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 14:05
smack0007
As an Xna developer myself I've tried to play many of the games. Most are total crap and some are just trying to steal your damn money. Something really needs to be done about this otherwise this whole Community Games initiative will just become a big joke.

The only games I've found to be any good so far are this game and Word Soup. Bloc would be good but the controls are completely frustrating.
SubOrbital's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 14:09
SubOrbital
This is a fantastic idea, Jim. I applaud it as a move that will highlight some otherwise anonymous games, and most importantly, support the indie industry. Way to go.
Mr Gilder's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 14:10
Mr Gilder
@Hobgoblin: Ease off. I think the main offense here is your use of the phrase "shittier review." It's alittle pompous and unfriendly against this site in general, and the fine people who write reviews for it. I get tad frustrated with the "maverick" attitude Jim takes toward things sometimes too, but this isn't the place to get rude or call him out on it. He's just trying to enact a interesting way to give indie developers a chance to prove their worth. Can you really blame a legit game journalist for wanting to do such a thing? I submit that you cannot.
AgentMOO's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 14:14
AgentMOO
I will probably submit my game to you - I'll be glad for every point out of 10 I get above a 1 (if any).
PhazonYoshi's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 14:19
PhazonYoshi
No, Troll is the label jim gives people who, and I quote, post controversial, inflammatory, irrelevant or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum or chat room, with the intention of provoking other users into an emotional response or to generally disrupt normal on-topic discussion.
Mr Gilder's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 14:21
Mr Gilder
@Hobgoblin: Any piece of art that is released for consumption on public forum has the right to a review. When done by any thorough, unbiased, and intelligent writer, the review process provides thoughtful consumers with the tools to decide whether or not "shit" is, in fact, "shit." This site provides a number of useful insights, including evaluation and description of mechanics, into simple flash games in its "indie nation" column. Likewise, I am sure reviews of Home arcade games would emerge if demand emerged (as it seems to have for these XNA games). Refusing to review something simply because it has a tendency to be shitty circumvents the purpose of reviews in the first place.
Jim Sterling's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 14:24
Jim Sterling
I want more flash and indie PC games reviewed. We do what we can. It's difficult to cover something so sprawling. The XNA challenge thing here is just part of what I want to do overall on a grand scheme.

Of course, you can feel free to be discouraging and apathetic if you want, we really appreciate that on Destructoid.
Qraze's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 14:40
Qraze
you don't base a full game review of a 15 second demo hobgoblin. and go and find a new home like joystiq, you have been anti-everything since you first surfaced here. i wish i could punch you right now. you don't even have a profile or any friends here so you may want to make some before you trash destructoid. how about this, write a fucking blog with your opinions and maybe, just maybe, people might agree with you if you present enough facts. go fucking kill yourself troll.
mourning orange's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 14:43
mourning orange
Hobgoblin,

If the game is shit,then Jim will tell us it's shit. He has to REVIEW THE FUCKING GAME to proclaim it shit.

How is that so fucking hard to understand?
Solgrim's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 14:58
Solgrim
You should review Weapon of Choice. I have been interested in that game but, with the shitty time limit on the trial game, I can't tell if I want to buy it. So far though, it looks badass.
johannhat's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 15:01
johannhat
I think this is very much a good thing. I've seen a couple of other places review XNA Community Games, but nothing more than mere tidbits, with the reviewer wanting nothing more to do with them by the trial's end (In most cases, with good reason.) I'm really, *really* hoping the state of XNA Releases will improve six months from now when submitters shape up and realize what is currently or the people who were not in a mad rush to make NXE launch to release their stuff. We shall see.

I'm actually playing a lot with XNA stuff right now. I'm not sure if it'll go anywhere. If it does, I will make *damn* sure it doesn't end up like our current results. But for now, that's a long off goal, if a goal at all.
Jim Sterling's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 15:17
Jim Sterling
I find it ironic that Hobgoblin says we don't need a review of something explaining stuff he already knows, then goes on to post the same point several times over.
CharleyTony's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 15:18
CharleyTony
I just tried the demo of Biology Battle...
Its not bad, for thw whole 4 minutes I played it, it looked like it had a couple of interesting ideas incorporated into the game, which is a standard twin stick shooter.
800 MS points? that might be too much, 400 would have been a better fit. And its a shame that almost no good twin stick shooters have online multiplayer. That was THE THING that was missing from Geometry Wars 2
Tubatic's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 15:25
Tubatic
@hobgoblin

Seems a bit ironic to me.

Point Sterling. You'd better step it up in the next round, 'goblin. Its the lighting round. Very series.
Mr Gilder's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 15:31
Mr Gilder
@Hobgoblin: Saying that a small demo is enough to judge the intrinsic value of a game in it entirety is like saying that a simple hands on preview is enough to write a full review of a title. This is ludicrous. Many games change and evolve as they are played. Difficulty ramping up as one progresses inherently changes the experience. Mechanics that make little sense in the first 5 minutes may eventually become a games key components.
I thought the demo of Weapon of Choice was awful, but I'd love a full review that explains some of the other facets of the game in different levels, with different characters, etc.
You seem to really like Weapon of Choice. Going by your evaluative methods, I'd simply start deriding the game as "Shit" now, and be done with it. Wouldn't you rather someone write up a strong defense of the title so that I give the hard working developers a second chance?
Attitudes like yours do the industry a disservice.
TheBigFeel's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 15:32
TheBigFeel
great idea! I just wanted to say it too.
Tubatic's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 15:47
Tubatic
@hob

Well, considering your repeated messages are incongruent with what one would expect from someone pushing a message of not needing to state or restate a known opinion or status . . . yep, I'd call it ironic.

You know, you really should write a c-blog about all this. I'd read it, for what that's worth.
Jim Sterling's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 15:54
Jim Sterling
It is quite ironic that Hobgoblin, in telling me I don't know what irony is, demonstrates that he does not know what irony is. Or dignity. Or intelligence.
AgentMOO's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 16:00
AgentMOO
@hobgoblin

The same rules still apply - a game is either fun or not. The reviews will address the game being "worth it". A $60 game has different criteria for amount of time and polish of experience than the $2.50 - $10 range. Within the smaller price point you have some games costing four times as much as other titles, so they will have to answer to why they demand that price in the review.
Necros's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 16:07
Necros
I think it would be ironic if we were all made out of iron.
exodus1925's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 16:47
exodus1925
Amen
Jim Sterling's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 17:05
Jim Sterling
Okay, so the general gist of this is that everybody likes the idea, except one guy who hates it nine times over.

I think we are looking at a successful review model.
the GAMEGOBLIN's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 17:32
the GAMEGOBLIN
I've got a legit question.

I want to start an XNA game (I'm in need of a programmer but that's besides the point)

What if you don't like that particular genre? Say, for instance, I created a Rouge-like game, you know, the whole nethack thing. It's a good Rouge-like, punishing difficulty, very complex, ect. If you didn't like Rouge-likes and give it a bad review isn't that kinda just cutting off the knees of a game that some people would have enjoyed? It's hard enough having a good community game float to the top in a barrel of shit and negative publicity would only make less sales.

But with that being said niche games would probably be sought out by people who liked it so it's not that big of a problem.

I kinda answered my own question there.

Maybe you should avoid the numerical score altogether, have a small recap detailing all the good parts.
the GAMEGOBLIN's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 17:35
the GAMEGOBLIN
Simply put, I wouldn't want my game to get a negative score because the reviewer didn't like RPGs, or Puzzle games, or punishing Platformers ect.
TorpedoTed's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 17:38
TorpedoTed
@ Jim

Dude you get cained quite alot on here does it ever get on your nerves?
I would find the most annoying thing about it all is that the people who cain you are like 12 years old and havent got a clue. Kinda reminds me of that great film Jay and Silent Bob where they hunt down all the kids on Poop Shoot and beat the shit out of them...how pleasent that would be :¬)
Jim Sterling's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 17:49
Jim Sterling
the GAMEGOBLIN:

There are only one or two genres I feel I can't play objectively. Roguelikes are possibly one of them. In that extreme case, I will of course get another of my review team to do it.
TrailerParkJesus's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 18:50
TrailerParkJesus
May I suggest Blow and Galax-e-mail. If I remember correctly, those were decent games where I didn't come away pissed off.
kawitchate's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 22:00
kawitchate
great idea, and Biology Battle is the only game i've found (out of maybe 20) on Community Games so far that DESERVES a review. here's to a good one!
the GAMEGOBLIN's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 23:26
the GAMEGOBLIN
Oh, and I forgot to hug you

Awesome idea!
NihonTiger90's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/17/2008 23:59
NihonTiger90
It's an interesting challenge, that's for sure. I trust Dtoid to be fair in their reviews, especially after the EC fiasco.
dgschrei's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/18/2008 06:31
dgschrei
Well we will see. I definately like the idea of getting reviews for the Community Games. That will probably save me a lot of Microsoft Monopoly Money.
And if Jim doesn't get to review any games that are worth playing, we at least will have a chance to rip on the devs for their shitty game and to tell them to "Go fuck themselves" and therefore driving them to become alcoholics. ^^
Dexter345's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/18/2008 17:36
Dexter345
This sounds like an excellent idea.
Arttemis's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/29/2008 12:39
Arttemis
Wow, this is an absolutely fantastic idea! The community games channel was already something I was dismissing because of its content's ambiguity.

I would have added my two thumbs up earlier if I had seen it then; really, great challenge!
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