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The P-Wing was a forerunner for the Super Guide photo

I'm using this bit of news more to point out that there is a new Iwata Asks up over at Nintendo's site, and if you haven't been reading the series you really should. As it's gone on it has become one of the more interesting articles on the web, and often has insights into modern and retro game design that don't get shared too often. That and Iwata often makes terrible, terrible jokes.

One of the more interesting aspects of the interviews is that they show how Nintendo's game design has progressed through a sort of natural evolution. An example of this is evidently the P-Wing, which, according to Volume two of the New Super Mario Bros. Wii Iwata Asks, was the forerunner for the Super Guide as it let you fly over en entire level.

Toshihiko Nakago, one of the designers on Super Mario Bros. 3, said, "I was also glad that we included this feature(the P-Wing). After all, there are those players who want to get through a level quickly. Moreover, the P-Wing item in Mario 3 is a forerunner of the Super Guide feature in New Super Mario Bros. Wii.

The full interview has 100 more interesting little revelations like this, and should probably be required reading for anyone interested in game design. The guys in these interviews are the people who made the gaming business what it is today.








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Matthew Razak is Destructoid's Associate editor and co-founder of film site Flixist. He began as community member "cowzilla" and was since sequestered to write brainy features material. He lives in Los Angeles with his beautiful wife. Likes Games! Movies! Hats! Meet the rest of the team



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24 comments | showing # 1 to 24
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BrandonUndead's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 10:11
BrandonUndead
Thanks for the link!
Toucan Rider's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 10:17
Toucan Rider
Ha, I was thinking that too. But a little more politely.
reg1892's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 10:25
reg1892
Isn't this more of an example of de-volution? Using the p-wing incorporated the player at least and wasn't the passive experience that the super guide provides. Bring back the p-wing!!

Make them difficult to earn and then bumping your difficulty-spike-level would be a reward and not a hollow watch-the-game-play-itself anti-climax.

BRING BACK THE P WING!!!
Monodi's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 10:42
Monodi
@reg1892

Personally, I find the P-Wing very useless.
Chris Carter's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 10:54
Chris Carter
You couldn't P-Wing every stage: that's that.
Everyday Legend's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 11:03
Everyday Legend
P-Wing was an item earned, rather than a feature given. There are certain parallels that can be drawn between the two, but the former is markedly different than the latter. "Inspired by" is putting the comparison very loosely, in my opinion.
manasteel88's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 11:11
manasteel88
I agree with everyone. The P-Wing is a reward. You had to earn the P-Wing and then you couldn't use it all the time. Plus it wasn't an automatic stage beater for every stage. Vertical stages were helped by the P-Wing, but it didn't let you skip everything. Even still, you had to play every level.
Everyday Legend's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 11:29
Everyday Legend
Even SMW's cape powerup would allow you to effectively skip stages, but the use of that ability took a finely honed sense of timing, therefore making the ability to breeze a stage involve a naturally-acquired skill rather than giving the player an "easy button." Nintendo sounds a little more delusional to me more and more, day after day. Seriously, they can find a justification for anything these days.

I guess that little rant is a roundabout way of saying, "expect more from your userbase, and they will rise to the challenge." It's a videogame, something designed to be played, not played for you.
Chris Carter's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 11:35
Chris Carter
What Everyday said.

The SMW cape was actually better than the P-Wing, because it was more useful underwater, and you could still effectively skip every non-underwater/vertical stage. But, tit-for-tat, it also required a ton more skill. Likewise, the P wing was also earned, and very sparing.

Nintendo seems out of touch with their older games more and more as time goes on.
XGC TheDude's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 12:07
XGC TheDude
I am excited about the super guide my kids will be able to see how to do the moves and then execute them next time they play. I have a feeling more people will use it than you think
Tony Ponce's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 12:28
Tony Ponce
I'm putting my foot down: People who complain about the Super Guide are morons. Period. There is no room for debate, at all. None. You are morons. Plain and simple.

"B-b-b-but-but-but..."

But nothing.
Artemus's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 12:38
Artemus
I agree with megaStryke. The Super Guide is for morons.
Isn't that what he said? ;)
Also, these Wii.com Miyamoto and Iwata Asks features are amazing reads.
NeoGreenLantern's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 12:42
NeoGreenLantern
Has anyone seen the superguide? It doesn't actually beat if for you. It just shows Luigi going through the level. You still have to go back and beat it with Mario for it to count.
KingSigy's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 12:43
KingSigy
I definitely could see the P-Wing as a super guide sort of thing. I essentially let you cheat an entire level. I usually never use them, but I remember doing so when I was 7.
Everyday Legend's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 13:13
Everyday Legend
It's not a level-clearer, and this has been noted. However, we all learned through the magic of trial-and-error, and some part of that ethos has to be credited for making every last one of us into the gamers we are today. It seems to me that they're robbing/denying that method its due chance to flourish, as when one of my personal running buddies found a better way, it was passed down like an actual skill, rather than just handed to you. At the risk of sounding like "when I was your age," the old way is still better.

@ MegaStryke
Really? That attitude? From you? Someone with a Power Blade avatar? Dude...you're just upset over something else and taking out your frustrations via your own kind out of blindness. We're "old-dog" gamers. We EARNED our right to bitch. :oD
Tony Ponce's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 13:32
Tony Ponce
Blind, my ass. That archaic "force a player to replay the same level over and over and over and over again" shit from the 8-bit days doesn't cut the mustard anymore. No one is going to drop 50 or 60 bones on a game that they can't play. Anyone who says "they shouldn't be playing those games" misses the point that these people WANT to play the game but can't because of stupid bullshit.

And it's Power Blazer, not Power Blade.
GoldenGamerXero's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 13:34
GoldenGamerXero
@Everyday Legend

They stopped trial and error gameplay because it wasn't fun. No I don't think everything should be handed out to you with no challenge but there's a large difference between difficult for the sake of being difficult and an actual challenge.

I only ever seem to get into Trial and Error mode when there's something unexpected that only occurs in a certain stage and I have no clue how to get past it. That isn't making me any better at the game or teaching me some hidden gaming skills it's just pissing me the hell off.

I like the idea of the super guide because it just tells how to do the stage. It knows you tried, it knows you failed and it knows that if you haven't gotten through the stage eight freaking times chances are you're not getting it on the ninth.

Is it honestly so bad that a game chooses to be fun instead of difficult?
Chris Carter's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 13:48
Chris Carter
I agree with Mega. The Super Guide is not a bad idea, and doesn't deserve a lot of the guff it received.

The P-Wing and World Cape are just better ones.
GoldenGamerXero's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 13:57
GoldenGamerXero
@Magnalon

Oh I'm not arguing that. In fact I think that the three are completely different.

The P-Wing was in fact completely useless in some levels and too useful in others.

The cape is bad ass but takes a lot of skill. CAPE FTW!

The Super Guide tries to to teach you the way through levels but requires no effort from the player.

It's really apples to oranges.
Krow's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 14:01
Krow
In this thread, everyone misses the point.
DaedHead8's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 14:30
DaedHead8
I agree with Krow.
Everyday Legend's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 15:08
Everyday Legend
@ megastryke
Pardon the error. One point for you, sir.

I'm just not a fan of things being handed to people on silver platters. If trial-and-error design won't sell, explain the success of Megaman 9.

I'm not saying it's an evil thing, just that there could have been a better way, i.e. Cape.

I'll let it rest now.
fetusmilk's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 19:39
fetusmilk
if mario is to hard for you and you need the super guide, your either an infant. or an octogenarian.

which is fine if you need it. which is why i dont understand why people are bitching. you DONT have to use it ya know.
Brian Szabelski's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/12/2009 22:34
Brian Szabelski
They really, really need to bring the P-Wing back. That shit was off the hook. And its cousin, the P-Balloon, too.
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