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The demo is a lie: Turning Point developers promise the game doesn't suck photo

Last week, a personally anticipated game had a demo appear on Xbox Live. The game was Turning Point: Fall of Liberty, and the demo, unfortunately, was a disappointment, going some way toward dampening my interest in the title.

Among the issues were awful sensitivity problems, a complete lack of AI and a look and feel that just screamed "PlayStation 2 launch title." Spark Unlimited is well aware that most people felt let down by the demo experience and has written a blog post assuring that the critical reaction was taken on board and that the issues have since been addressed:

Optimized targeting and movement: Optional control settings have been refined to alleviate sluggishness in the slowest setting and the 'on ice' feeling at the faster settings. Also, a user-defined soft lock has been added which means that controls can be set so once an enemy is hit with a bullet the crosshair will ‘stick’ to the target.

Refined AI behavior: The dynamic intelligence and pathfinding for enemies has also been enhanced. The 'hot point' based system should add to Turning Point’s replay experience.

Ammo levels and grappling optimized: Up until final submissions, the team has been listening to playtest feedback and doing everything possible to create a ‘civilian at war’ feeling. The end result is an experience more visceral than the demo, relying less on repeated ammo refills, and more on the grappling and the hand-to-hand combat.

Final Mip-mapping and texture levels: The art team has also been able to further optimize lighting, textures, and effects throughout the title. 

I really hope that Turning Point will eventually be a good game, because the actual premise is rock solid and the potential is there for an amazing experience. Sadly, if there wasn't any great amount of user interest before, the shoddy demo is going to have killed any amount of hype this may have received. It's going to take a lot to get gamers to invest faith in this one, but I really hope Spark pulls it off.








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Jim Sterling serves as reviews editor for Destructoid.com, head of the Podtoid podcast, and produces a number of news stories, original features, one-of-a-kind videos. With his passionate argumentative style, controversial opinions, harsh delivery, and dedication to brutal honesty Sterling is a name that you can't help but recognize. Likes PS2, iPod Touch, Silent Hill 2, Metal Gear Solid, Dynasty Warriors 3 Meet the rest of the team



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44 comments | showing # 1 to 44
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njsykora's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 11:13
njsykora
In other news, Lair developers say their game is good after negative reaction to the full game.
waxximis's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 11:14
waxximis
yah i really wanted this game to be good. but unless its delayed until late 2008 i doubt they can make it much better
TNTv's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 11:15
TNTv
Fix it. Bring out another demo. Then, maybe, I'll buy it.
Actually, I'm bored of FPS for now. Just make it a racing game or Phoenix Wright.
covah's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 11:16
covah
Oh no, that game still sucks. Those "fixes" won't change jack shit. If anything the game is subpar at best.
ZombiePlatypus's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 11:19
ZombiePlatypus
They did all that since last week? Damn, they must be pretty good, huh?
amalgamut00's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 11:24
amalgamut00
This was one of the first demos I played and deleted right away. I was so upset that I had to wait so long for it to download, it was shit.
ElfShotTheFood's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 11:26
ElfShotTheFood
"They did all that since last week? Damn, they must be pretty good, huh?"

The posting says that the demo code was finalized "several months" ago so it's entirely possible they've addressed a lot of the issues.
Cowzilla3's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 11:27
Cowzilla3
It's the Indiana Jones theory. Nazi's as bad guys make things better. Sure Indy two was great but no ones going to argue that 1 and 3 weren't better. You know why? Fucking Nazis, thats why.
skullivan's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 11:29
skullivan
I don't understand why developers knowingly release bad demos.

I'll probably still give the game a rent because I didn't think the demo was THAT bad but most people are just going to completely write the game off now. I'm aware that most demos are builds from like 6 months to a year ago and aren't indicative of the state of the game right now.

But that begs the question, why create a demo for a trade show, go back to work on the game for 6 months (the period where most polishing is done on a game) and then release that old demo which demonstrates none of that work, right before the game's release?

When a game is only a month away, the consumer is going to assume that it is pretty much the final product. In that case they should have just released the demo 6 months ago. Either make a new demo that shows the new work you've done or don't do a demo at all.
vexed alex's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 11:31
vexed alex
I completely agree, Jim. When I first saw the game I thought the idea was so cool. I was so excited when I saw the demo up on Live. When I popped it on it was utter disappointment. That game needs a lot of work. I don't understand why they'd put up a demo that's that horrible. Did anyone even play test it?

THEY CAN'T FUCK THIS UP! I want this game to be good.
amalgamut00's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 11:31
amalgamut00
I know one company that doesn't give a shit about people hating their games when the demos come out...

SEGA
hollywooda's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 11:38
hollywooda
i downloaded the demo, i started it up, i played it, my jaw hit the floor, i deleted it...... (still in shock).
Rucksack's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 11:38
Rucksack
Go Go Gadget QA TEAM!
Kyousuke Nanbu's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 11:59
Kyousuke Nanbu
A demo is never final representation of the finished product, this demo code was old hence all the crap we saw.

I'll still give it a shot.
chasegamez's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 12:13
chasegamez
this game sucks
nowherekid03's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 12:13
nowherekid03
If they want to save this then they need to get their shit together and release another demo
F Whipple's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 12:47
F Whipple
@amalgamut

Not just the demos...but the actual games as well
ME4Twaffle's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 12:47
ME4Twaffle
Wow... I'm genuinely surprised that they did that. I shouldn't be, because ALL game companies should care that much about customer complaints. I mean, my friend and I were talking about how the game had alot of great ideas, but with the shoddy controls, and sometimes shitty graphics, we just didn't think it would pan out. :\
Samit Sarkar's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 12:59
Samit Sarkar
I’m right there with ya, Jim. I haven’t played the game myself, since I only own a PS3, but I was saddened to hear that the 360 demo was pretty much universally panned. I’ve been looking forward to this game for a while...hopefully, the full thing is good. I agree; I think it’s a fantastic premise, and it’ll be a welcome respite from the Medal of Honor “one man takes down Nazi Germany” play style.
RWarrior1CO's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 13:09
RWarrior1CO
Playstation 2 launch title? There's no way in hell a PS2 could pull this game off. Not that I'm defending it, realy--wasn't really blown away by the game myself.

Oh, and anybody notice the part in the demo where the Nazis figured out how to melt steel with fire, and used it to make a building collapse?
amalgamut00's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 13:16
amalgamut00
@F Whipple

I can't remember the last good Sega game that was released. The games they release feel like demos and the demos...I have no idea what those are.
JReaper617's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 13:18
JReaper617
eh i haven't played it yet but i'll give it a shot wats the worst that could happen right?
Neonie's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 13:26
Neonie
has Turning Point hit a Turning Point?
MechaMonkey's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 13:26
MechaMonkey
Read as: "So we heard our game sucked. We're starting over and making it good this time. Sorry for the confusion."
FreePablo's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 13:37
FreePablo
They might as well have included Blast Processing with all the nonsense kin that press release. As if I was going to buy another WWII video game 3 years after they finally reached their peak?
ScottyG's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 13:44
ScottyG
Good to hear they're taking feedback to heart. The other issues aside, the movement and targeting made the demo unplayable for me. Shame too, as - like lots of other people - I'm looking forward to this game. For a WWII game it has a good premise.
Cheeburga's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 13:49
Cheeburga
They did this all within a week?
Roryzilla's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 14:00
Roryzilla
the flash codes for spark
pwned88's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 14:07
pwned88
The main things that totally killed this was it started, and the scene presented to me instantly reminded me of crimson skies <PC version> which was an amazing game, but was not graphically pleasing <albeit, awsome back in the day> and thats thr problem, the graphics were almost IDENTICAL to that of an 8 year old game. And the controls had a slow, laggy feel to them <mind u, my hands are accustomed to the knee-jerk '7' setting in halo games> And the crappy control combined with what had to b the worst collision detection system ever made it impossible to hit something. I'm a headshot guy, so I assume that when i aim at a guys face and pull the trigger, hes going to die. This was not the case in Turning point, after shooting the guy in the face 7 times with the rifle, i shot him once in the shoulder and he died instantly. I just can't play a game with those kind of mechanics. I was willing to look past the bitmap-looking textures if the game was fun to play, but it wasn't.
side note: did anybody notice the glitch when you walk into the room after putting out the fire? You shoot the guy on the ground from the door and he dies, then as you walk closer he instantly is standing up and goes through a death animation ending in the invisible bike position. killed myself, went back to the point, did the exact same thing.
pwned88's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 14:08
pwned88
sry for the wall, i should've just done a review on my c-blog =P
DrNutt's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 14:24
DrNutt
I think you vaginas are acting spoiled. It's a pretty cool premise for a game that brings something a little new to a stale genre. And I didn't think the graphics were bad, it seemed like they were going for kind of a 30s/40s comic book style, and I thought it worked well. Good Christ.
skullivan's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 14:59
skullivan
@Eques

What they were saying is that the complaints people had about the demo had already been fixed in newer builds before the demo was even released.

From what they said on their blog, I would say the demo that everyone played is at least 3 months old.
Drunken Haze's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 15:04
Drunken Haze
These all sound like little tweaks and to make that demo would take an act of god.
Psywolf's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 15:22
Psywolf
i just tried and actually posted on the demo

long story short seems like a bargin bin pick up to me when we hit the dry gaming spell
Brandon Undead's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 15:23
Brandon Undead
Jim, I got you this book.

It tells you how to interpret the demo.
PrinceofCannedPeaches's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 15:25
PrinceofCannedPeaches
So basically, it was a beta?
Eschatos's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 18:19
Eschatos
Yay for more WW2 games!
Churchhills Dog's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 20:07
Churchhills Dog
I really want to like the game. In many cases a separate team is set aside to do a demo and they may have been at the mercy of the publisher.

unfortunately, as the old saying goes, you only get one chance to make a first impression and that demo was it. I still may grab it depending on how the reviews pan out.
Farktoid's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 20:58
Farktoid
I want to like this game as well. The premise sounds like it could be fun, but the execution seemed horribly sub-par. Anyone try the High look rating? Impossible to control.

Unless someone forgot to turn off the Suck variable before compiling the code for the demo, the game's gonna be pretty bad. Remember guys:
int suck = 0;
int fun = 1;
Never forget those two lines in your code.
Fading Star's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 21:01
Fading Star
Please don't suck.
JonDarkwood's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/29/2008 23:43
JonDarkwood
The demo really broke my heart... I really wanted it to be good. I will be renting this and hoping for the best when it's released.
Danger Shark's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/30/2008 01:42
Danger Shark
The demo hurt it a bit for me. Who knows, a rental is all it's going to get for now.
StriderS's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/30/2008 10:37
StriderS
That's stupid. Why put out a suck demo anyway?
loki d20's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/30/2008 13:30
loki d20
Still going to be a game that I wait until it hits ~$20. I'm not at all influenced by the storyline. So far, none of the videos or the demo give me a reason to believe that this game will be worth $60.
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