surf dtoid with 
Rising (10+)
People you follow
Aren't most casual games Mini-game collections?
That's the problem I think. No-one but casual gamers will play mini-game collections...unless they have something special that others don't.
That's the problem I think. No-one but casual gamers will play mini-game collections...unless they have something special that others don't.
As long as they keep Casuals and Hardcores separate, i'm fine with it.
When they try and adapt casual playing into serious games, whats when it becomes a problem.
When they try and adapt casual playing into serious games, whats when it becomes a problem.
Is it a game? Yes. Are they playing it? Yes. They are gaming, therefore gamers, regardless of the category. The more people buy consoles, the more developers can afford to take risks with certain games and come out with fantastic hits that everyone likes. That is what they want - what you want may not be the same but rest assured, there are a ton of games for those considering themselves 'hardcore' ...
I don't think they will risk it even then...they will just focus on "casual" games...since there will be a wider audience.
I don't think anyone wants to alienate the traditional (or hardcore) gaming crowd just to appease the new casual market. I doubt Epic is going to cancel "Gears of War 2" in order to devote more developer time to "Cooking with Marcus Fenix." They're just opening up to a new market, and trying to cater to that one *as well*. I don't see how this can do anything but benefit everyone.
CliffyB can't play Gears of War, is he a Casual gamers?
I am not the best at Gears online but I beat Gears on Insane by myself pretty much no problem.
I am not the best at Gears online but I beat Gears on Insane by myself pretty much no problem.
I don't like the terms 'hardcore' or 'casual'. You're either a gamer or you're not. The genre of games you play does not define you as a gamer. I play Animal Crossing and Viva Pinata and then I go play Gears of War and Rainbow Six: Vegas. I like all kinds of games, because I'm not a hardcore gamer or a casual gamer, I'm just a gamer, period.
I don't like the terms 'hardcore' or 'casual'. You're either a gamer or you're not. The genre of games you play does not define you as a gamer. I play Animal Crossing and Viva Pinata and then I go play Gears of War and Rainbow Six: Vegas. I like all kinds of games, because I'm not a hardcore gamer or a casual gamer, I'm just a gamer, period.
Don't you know? Casual games are gateway drugs. Right now your mother is just playing some Warioware, but pretty soon she'll be kicking your ass at Unreal Tournament and staying up all night playing RPGs. Its part of our geeky, 7-point plan (I will never agree with the bastards who call for a 9-point plan) to take over the world. All the world will be a 'Con! It is only a matter of time...
To me, this is a non-debate. The only way that videogamers are ever going to be taken seriously is to have a wide variety of people playing them. Gaming needs the numbers if it ever wants to be taken seriously and once it has the numbers, I'm certain we will see the raitings shift to match closer with movies. The disparity now is that videogaming is still a niche entertainment and seen by most as something children do. Once the general public gets in on gaming, this perception will change. Then you can have your movie tie in for hostel 9 and torture teenagres all the live long day.
With a new market of gamers, the game industry may be making a shift. I think the people who this worries the most are those whos first videogame experience started with the Playstation. As an old man of videogaming, I can remember being left out of an industry shift at least once as 90% of the 2d genres I loved are dead. While I dont think having new people play games will be that drastic, changes of the landscape are natural and prevent stagnation.
What I really love is the whole casual gamer concept among the core audience. They freak out when videogames are dismissed as childerns entertainment, but don't hesitate to use casual as an equally dismissive term.
I say if having more casual games around gives me more Raving Rabbids, I'm all for it. I like the game on its own merits (which I don't think I'm allowed to and still be a gamer). My girlfriend also loves the game and having games we can play together is a godsend. For those of you too busy pwning to get laid, I can understand why these games can fuck off. For those of us with spouses and the like, being able to share our hobby with the missus not only makes bringing more games into the house easier, it lets us have videogame time as together time. How cool is that?
My old lady is getting pretty good at trauma center too. Given the games ninja gaidenesque difficulty, I don't know that I would throw that one in the casual pile. I suppose the idea of casual games working as a gateway game never crossed anyones mind.
With a new market of gamers, the game industry may be making a shift. I think the people who this worries the most are those whos first videogame experience started with the Playstation. As an old man of videogaming, I can remember being left out of an industry shift at least once as 90% of the 2d genres I loved are dead. While I dont think having new people play games will be that drastic, changes of the landscape are natural and prevent stagnation.
What I really love is the whole casual gamer concept among the core audience. They freak out when videogames are dismissed as childerns entertainment, but don't hesitate to use casual as an equally dismissive term.
I say if having more casual games around gives me more Raving Rabbids, I'm all for it. I like the game on its own merits (which I don't think I'm allowed to and still be a gamer). My girlfriend also loves the game and having games we can play together is a godsend. For those of you too busy pwning to get laid, I can understand why these games can fuck off. For those of us with spouses and the like, being able to share our hobby with the missus not only makes bringing more games into the house easier, it lets us have videogame time as together time. How cool is that?
My old lady is getting pretty good at trauma center too. Given the games ninja gaidenesque difficulty, I don't know that I would throw that one in the casual pile. I suppose the idea of casual games working as a gateway game never crossed anyones mind.
Also take into account that the "new gamers" that are buying those Wiis aren't playing Beyond Good and Evil, or Indigo Prophecy, or Ico, they are playing Cooking Mama, Wii Sports, and maybe Mario when it comes out. As much as its "expanding the market", it is REINFORCING the idea that games are a children's toy, not opening people's eyes to the possibilities of what a game can do.
I still don't know how people can claim the Wii is innovative, it just slightly improved old peripheral ideas like light guns and dance pads and applied them to the same types of games we've already seen everywhere. The major qualm I have with companies devoting time and money to "casual" games is that the games are overly simply, repetitive, and unrewarding. They're fun for about 30 minutes and then it's the same shit forever. Regardless, I still think they're necessary and in many cases a good investment for companies since only making cult classics has never been a great source of income in any industry.
@ TheRob91:
If new people playing Cooking Mama, Wii Sports, et cetra are the parents and grandparents who never touched games before, how is that reinforcing the idea that video games are a children's toy?
If new people playing Cooking Mama, Wii Sports, et cetra are the parents and grandparents who never touched games before, how is that reinforcing the idea that video games are a children's toy?
It seems this has turned into a, "Why fewer core titles, Nintendo" discussion, so I'll just continue in the vein, well, -ish.
When I first heard of Wii Fit, my initial reaction was, "Oh, great, so now my last bastion of couch potato-ness is under attack". But I could stand to lose a few pounds...and knowing what I do of gaming life, so could most of us. Perhaps instead of playing SSBM or Ninja Gaiden or whatever for hours on end, I might actually get off the couch and do something. Horrors! Armageddon!
So as corny as it sounded initially, I must applaud Nintendo for Wii Fit - a videogame company that cares about your personal health? Anyone else think of one?
When I first heard of Wii Fit, my initial reaction was, "Oh, great, so now my last bastion of couch potato-ness is under attack". But I could stand to lose a few pounds...and knowing what I do of gaming life, so could most of us. Perhaps instead of playing SSBM or Ninja Gaiden or whatever for hours on end, I might actually get off the couch and do something. Horrors! Armageddon!
So as corny as it sounded initially, I must applaud Nintendo for Wii Fit - a videogame company that cares about your personal health? Anyone else think of one?
It seems this has turned into a, "Why fewer core titles, Nintendo" discussion, so I'll just continue in the vein, well, -ish.
When I first heard of Wii Fit, my initial reaction was, "Oh, great, so now my last bastion of couch potato-ness is under attack". But I could stand to lose a few pounds...and knowing what I do of gaming life, so could most of us. Perhaps instead of playing SSBM or Ninja Gaiden or whatever for hours on end, I might actually get off the couch and do something. Horrors! Armageddon!
So as corny as it sounded initially, I must applaud Nintendo for Wii Fit - a videogame company that cares about your personal health? Anyone else think of one?
When I first heard of Wii Fit, my initial reaction was, "Oh, great, so now my last bastion of couch potato-ness is under attack". But I could stand to lose a few pounds...and knowing what I do of gaming life, so could most of us. Perhaps instead of playing SSBM or Ninja Gaiden or whatever for hours on end, I might actually get off the couch and do something. Horrors! Armageddon!
So as corny as it sounded initially, I must applaud Nintendo for Wii Fit - a videogame company that cares about your personal health? Anyone else think of one?
klll6
Check out what my kitten typed... she's evil.
Ugh. More bitching from gamers. Here's the thing: DON'T BUY CASUAL GAMES IF YOU DON'T WANT TO PLAY THEM. You have a choice and it doesn't require you to voice your opinion. Simply keep playing the games you like, which I assure you will continue being made, and be happy with that. If your mom/sister/grandparents/etc start playing games then good for them. Gaming will simply become a more common thing and that can't be bad.
Check out what my kitten typed... she's evil.
Ugh. More bitching from gamers. Here's the thing: DON'T BUY CASUAL GAMES IF YOU DON'T WANT TO PLAY THEM. You have a choice and it doesn't require you to voice your opinion. Simply keep playing the games you like, which I assure you will continue being made, and be happy with that. If your mom/sister/grandparents/etc start playing games then good for them. Gaming will simply become a more common thing and that can't be bad.
Wow, this story seems to almost be MORE of an attack ( and a generalisation) of the "hardcore" gaming populace as much of society sees it than an article in support of casual gaming.
I understand the argument that getting games into the hand of more people, be they 'casual' or not, should theoretically further legitmize our favorite passtime to the rest of the world. Alas, there is a ginormous (it's officially a word now, WHOO HOO!) problem in this logic...
The games that are infiltrating the traditionally non-gaming populace are basically ALL casual games. In effect, they are actually DISTANCING gaming from being seen as a form of art or at the very least, a venue from which intelligent, artistic, even mature, media can be achieved.
And yes, the more resources are pooled towards casual games, the more they are taken away from meaningful, thought-provoking games.
And no, I couldn't care less about the next GTA, or ultra-violent FPS. Manhunt 2 (free speech issues aside) can stay dead for all I care. As gaming strives to garner the support and finances needed to produce more artistic, intelligent IPs, I'm waiting patiently for the next Ico; the next Okami; the next Shadow of the Colossus.
Putting games in more hands can only take gaming so far. I feel we need LESS of a shift from gaming as a 'geek' activity to an 'anybody' activity, and MORE of a shift from gaming as a 'violent' refuge to an 'artistic' escape.
That was a horribly structured final sentence there, but I think it makes at least SOME sense.
I understand the argument that getting games into the hand of more people, be they 'casual' or not, should theoretically further legitmize our favorite passtime to the rest of the world. Alas, there is a ginormous (it's officially a word now, WHOO HOO!) problem in this logic...
The games that are infiltrating the traditionally non-gaming populace are basically ALL casual games. In effect, they are actually DISTANCING gaming from being seen as a form of art or at the very least, a venue from which intelligent, artistic, even mature, media can be achieved.
And yes, the more resources are pooled towards casual games, the more they are taken away from meaningful, thought-provoking games.
And no, I couldn't care less about the next GTA, or ultra-violent FPS. Manhunt 2 (free speech issues aside) can stay dead for all I care. As gaming strives to garner the support and finances needed to produce more artistic, intelligent IPs, I'm waiting patiently for the next Ico; the next Okami; the next Shadow of the Colossus.
Putting games in more hands can only take gaming so far. I feel we need LESS of a shift from gaming as a 'geek' activity to an 'anybody' activity, and MORE of a shift from gaming as a 'violent' refuge to an 'artistic' escape.
That was a horribly structured final sentence there, but I think it makes at least SOME sense.
you can't bastardize gaming in order to become popular.
that defeats the purpose of gaming in the first place... =)
if what you are saying is that gaming must be dumbed down in order to become mainstream, you might be right =)
but by the time you get there, you'll be just as dumb as other forms of entertainment, and will thus no longer be gaming... =)
that defeats the purpose of gaming in the first place... =)
if what you are saying is that gaming must be dumbed down in order to become mainstream, you might be right =)
but by the time you get there, you'll be just as dumb as other forms of entertainment, and will thus no longer be gaming... =)
There's a big difference between "dumbed down" and accessible. Just because a game can be picked up and played by almost anyone doesn't automatically make it crap.
Let's be honest here, "meaningful, thought-provoking" games sell like shit. Casual games that do well mean that publishers will have more cash to take chances on intelligent and artistic titles they might otherwise pass on. And does nobody seem to realize that players who get hooked through casual titles are more likely to try out traditional games in the future? Jesus, use your heads people.
Let's be honest here, "meaningful, thought-provoking" games sell like shit. Casual games that do well mean that publishers will have more cash to take chances on intelligent and artistic titles they might otherwise pass on. And does nobody seem to realize that players who get hooked through casual titles are more likely to try out traditional games in the future? Jesus, use your heads people.
DinnertimeNinja makes some great points. i strongly agree with him, especially in his convoluted final sentence. (btw, is "ginormous" seriously a word now? wtf is happening to the english language?!)
this is the problem, people... gaming was already on its way to being accepted by the masses. there are over 100 million ps2's out there! the words PlayStation, Xbox, and Nintendo are household brand names. there was a feature-length film starring Adam Sandler and Don Cheadle with a scene that exemplified Shadow of the Colossus as art, and showed a man use it as a method of coping with loss. gaming has been winning the war, and wars need to be won slowly. something like the Wii that becomes a mega-hit all at once can flop just as quickly. the mainstream consumer has the shortest attention span of everybody. look at the fads. things can change very quickly. remember things like the Beanie Baby craze? how about boy bands?
think about this... i am 20 years old, and have been playing games my whole life. what is going to happen when i am 40? what about when all the people who have nothing but contempt for games (e.g. Roger Ebert) are gone? the war will be won. things like the Wii and a flood of casual games could potentially help, or potentially hurt the industry. what if a year from now people see the Wii and video games as "old news" or "just a fad?"
this is the problem, people... gaming was already on its way to being accepted by the masses. there are over 100 million ps2's out there! the words PlayStation, Xbox, and Nintendo are household brand names. there was a feature-length film starring Adam Sandler and Don Cheadle with a scene that exemplified Shadow of the Colossus as art, and showed a man use it as a method of coping with loss. gaming has been winning the war, and wars need to be won slowly. something like the Wii that becomes a mega-hit all at once can flop just as quickly. the mainstream consumer has the shortest attention span of everybody. look at the fads. things can change very quickly. remember things like the Beanie Baby craze? how about boy bands?
think about this... i am 20 years old, and have been playing games my whole life. what is going to happen when i am 40? what about when all the people who have nothing but contempt for games (e.g. Roger Ebert) are gone? the war will be won. things like the Wii and a flood of casual games could potentially help, or potentially hurt the industry. what if a year from now people see the Wii and video games as "old news" or "just a fad?"
i almost forgot... the whole "people will use casual games as a gateway to regular games" is a crock of shit. how many people that only know how to make microwaveable food move on to gourmet cooking? i know how to change the air filter on my car, but it never led to me rebuilding my engine (or even changing my own oil).
also, these companies are companies. think about it. they want to make money. if they figure out that they will only make money on the casual games, they will only make the casual games.
also, these companies are companies. think about it. they want to make money. if they figure out that they will only make money on the casual games, they will only make the casual games.
The same crowd that watches Heroes and Lost aren't likely to complain about ABC's Saturday morning lineup or bitch that they also air The View. Casual gaming on the rise is such a non-issue it's not even funny.
Companies need to go where the money is at, if that means pumping out a handful of casual games then so be it. Releasing several low budget great selling casual games will help minimize the risk when producing a larger, riskier more hardcore game. They need to diversify themselves and I don't see it as an issue at all, it's a part of business. Did you know McDonald's (until just recently) owned a successful chain of health-conscious, enviro-friendly mexican style restaurants? Or that drug companies produce the EXACT same drug but will sell it as a generic brand and for significantly less? It's (to a degree) the same shit, folks.
Also, I find it really fuckin' hard to believe that someone can complain that there aren't enough hardcore games on the market. There is SO much stuff released each year one person can't play them all.
Companies need to go where the money is at, if that means pumping out a handful of casual games then so be it. Releasing several low budget great selling casual games will help minimize the risk when producing a larger, riskier more hardcore game. They need to diversify themselves and I don't see it as an issue at all, it's a part of business. Did you know McDonald's (until just recently) owned a successful chain of health-conscious, enviro-friendly mexican style restaurants? Or that drug companies produce the EXACT same drug but will sell it as a generic brand and for significantly less? It's (to a degree) the same shit, folks.
Also, I find it really fuckin' hard to believe that someone can complain that there aren't enough hardcore games on the market. There is SO much stuff released each year one person can't play them all.
@ MusashiX2:
Your comparisons are rather ridiculous; you're making the gap seem much wider than it actually is. There's a world of difference between heating up a hot pocket and competing on Iron Chef. With gaming it's a few more buttons to manage and more complex controls. It's much more like learning to drive with an automatic and eventually graduating to a stick shift. If someone has the basics of driving in place, if so motivated they can learn the rest in a single afternoon. The point is once their foot is in the door, it's a lot easier to get them to try out something more advanced.
If you think that game publishers are only going to focus on the guaranteed money makers, then you haven't been paying attention for the last decade or so. Publishers have been doing this for years with licensed titles. They make film or TV tie-ins in order to earn money to make original IPs. The game industry (along with film and television) for the most part (ahem, EA) knows that there's a balance between creative expression and making a profit. Film studios make most of their money off huge Hollywood blockbusters, yet still find the time to make art house movies. The same is true of video games.
Your comparisons are rather ridiculous; you're making the gap seem much wider than it actually is. There's a world of difference between heating up a hot pocket and competing on Iron Chef. With gaming it's a few more buttons to manage and more complex controls. It's much more like learning to drive with an automatic and eventually graduating to a stick shift. If someone has the basics of driving in place, if so motivated they can learn the rest in a single afternoon. The point is once their foot is in the door, it's a lot easier to get them to try out something more advanced.
If you think that game publishers are only going to focus on the guaranteed money makers, then you haven't been paying attention for the last decade or so. Publishers have been doing this for years with licensed titles. They make film or TV tie-ins in order to earn money to make original IPs. The game industry (along with film and television) for the most part (ahem, EA) knows that there's a balance between creative expression and making a profit. Film studios make most of their money off huge Hollywood blockbusters, yet still find the time to make art house movies. The same is true of video games.
Mxyzptlk, do they not also pick up action figures to play with their kids? They also play Peek-A-Boo, I wouldn't exactly call that an in depth endeavor.
@ TheRob91:
Yes, but I've never left my action figures out to come back and find my mom and dad playing with them. However, I have left the Wii over at my folks house and found them playing Wii Tennis and Bowling with each other while I was gone. I've also seen them hide the DS from each other so they could get dibs on playing Brain Age first after work.
Yes, but I've never left my action figures out to come back and find my mom and dad playing with them. However, I have left the Wii over at my folks house and found them playing Wii Tennis and Bowling with each other while I was gone. I've also seen them hide the DS from each other so they could get dibs on playing Brain Age first after work.
On somewhat of a side note, I think its funny that if someone doesn't support the rise of shit games(I have decided to stop calling them "casual", as it seems like such a controversal term) then they automatically only play sequels of big hits.
Why is this a conflict? I remember the same arguments being made when the Playstaion's popularity heralded the death of gaming, only to go on and produce some iconic gaming experiences. And also some unimaginable dross, but there we go. In other forms of media the "casual" and the "hardcore" manage to exist side by side, each appealing to a market. Guess what, I enjoy Umberto Eco, Primo Levi and James Joyce just about as much as I have enjoyed Tom Clancy, J.K Rowling and Dr Seuss.
If you want the games you like to continue, support them by buying them - hence proving that the market exists and that you are worth developing for. The ones you don't like, don't buy - its called market forces.
And from my own personal experience, as a long time gamer now with a family the 'casual' approach is a godsend. My whole family now finds the whole game thing a lot more accessible - my wife loves Guitar Hero while my eldest daughter like Zelda: Twilight Princess and Wii Bowling. Its all good.
If you want the games you like to continue, support them by buying them - hence proving that the market exists and that you are worth developing for. The ones you don't like, don't buy - its called market forces.
And from my own personal experience, as a long time gamer now with a family the 'casual' approach is a godsend. My whole family now finds the whole game thing a lot more accessible - my wife loves Guitar Hero while my eldest daughter like Zelda: Twilight Princess and Wii Bowling. Its all good.
Nintendo promised a Revolution, and we got games where you shake the remote to earn "style points". Then, while Nintendo is releasing boatloads of sequels and games like Donkey Kong Bongo Blast, they are criticizing 3rd party developer for not being innovative. And of course, the hardware is crap.
And for this, they are getting tons of money.
The problem isn't casual gaming. It's the age old problem where people are not being critical of their purchases. Put something in a pretty box, and tons of people will go out of their way to convince themselves that it's good.
If I actually enjoyed the Wii games I've played, I wouldn't be so hard on the system. But, casual gaming is pretty much all about image. The games are thrown together with very little effort, there's no craftsmanship, and unless you've never played anything better, they just aren't fun.
Not to say that I want a $600 game machine, of course.
And for this, they are getting tons of money.
The problem isn't casual gaming. It's the age old problem where people are not being critical of their purchases. Put something in a pretty box, and tons of people will go out of their way to convince themselves that it's good.
If I actually enjoyed the Wii games I've played, I wouldn't be so hard on the system. But, casual gaming is pretty much all about image. The games are thrown together with very little effort, there's no craftsmanship, and unless you've never played anything better, they just aren't fun.
Not to say that I want a $600 game machine, of course.
@Mxyzptlk
my comparisons are "ridiculous" because you elevated them past what i intended. i didn't say "competing on Iron Chef." i said "gourmet cooking." e.g. pasta with a cream sauce, or some sautčed chicken with vegetables. nothing out of the realm of possibility for an average person.
the key words in your manual transmission analogy are "if so motivated." think about that for a second.
my comparisons are "ridiculous" because you elevated them past what i intended. i didn't say "competing on Iron Chef." i said "gourmet cooking." e.g. pasta with a cream sauce, or some sautčed chicken with vegetables. nothing out of the realm of possibility for an average person.
the key words in your manual transmission analogy are "if so motivated." think about that for a second.
Mxyzptlk, its still just mindless drivel, and you and I both know they are viewing it as such. Its like a virtual crossword puzzle, just something to pass the time. Its like saying that making movies like White Chicks will magically make people appreciate Requiem For A Dream or The 25th Hour. The skyrocketing popularity of the Wii due to its casual games is due to the fact that the people that it brings in DON'T WANT the other types of games which were ALREADY populating many, many more homes than gaming had been in before. Hence they did not get a cheaper PS2 with a massive game selection, and at half the price. They are attracted by the popularity of the overrated Wiimote and like the games that the Wii is putting out - mindless time wasters.
And for the record, I am in favor of immersion through control scheme (DDR, Guitar Hero, Duck Hunt, Bass Fishing, Steering wheels), but these work much better with a controller that is specifically designed for ONE game, and does something extremely well, rather than a couple things in a somewhat mediocre manor.
Quite frankly, I don't see why people want games to be accepted by everyone anyway, fuck society, who needs em?
And I'll end on a quote by Bill Cosby -
"I don't know the secret of success, but the secret to failure is trying to please everybody."
And for the record, I am in favor of immersion through control scheme (DDR, Guitar Hero, Duck Hunt, Bass Fishing, Steering wheels), but these work much better with a controller that is specifically designed for ONE game, and does something extremely well, rather than a couple things in a somewhat mediocre manor.
Quite frankly, I don't see why people want games to be accepted by everyone anyway, fuck society, who needs em?
And I'll end on a quote by Bill Cosby -
"I don't know the secret of success, but the secret to failure is trying to please everybody."
@ MusashiX2:
Exactly, if so motivated. Not every person who gets into a casual game is going to graduate to the next level. But the chances are better of them doing so once they've tried it out. Some is better than none.
@TheRob91:
I disagree completely that it's "just something to pass the time". I don't get calls from my mom asking if I can bring over the paper so she can do the crossword. I do get calls asking if I can bring over the Wii next time I visit. Like I said, some people are going to be content with just the casual games. But many are going to think to themselves, "Hey, these things are pretty fun. I wonder what else is out there?"
You can consider the Wiimote overrated (and I agree it's got flaws). But try giving a non-gamer the option of playing a game where all they have to do is swing a remote like a tennis racket, or explain to them game that requires them to figure out two analog sticks, four face buttons, and four shoulder buttons... There's a reason the Wii appeals to the casual crowd so much, besides it being the new hotness.
Exactly, if so motivated. Not every person who gets into a casual game is going to graduate to the next level. But the chances are better of them doing so once they've tried it out. Some is better than none.
@TheRob91:
I disagree completely that it's "just something to pass the time". I don't get calls from my mom asking if I can bring over the paper so she can do the crossword. I do get calls asking if I can bring over the Wii next time I visit. Like I said, some people are going to be content with just the casual games. But many are going to think to themselves, "Hey, these things are pretty fun. I wonder what else is out there?"
You can consider the Wiimote overrated (and I agree it's got flaws). But try giving a non-gamer the option of playing a game where all they have to do is swing a remote like a tennis racket, or explain to them game that requires them to figure out two analog sticks, four face buttons, and four shoulder buttons... There's a reason the Wii appeals to the casual crowd so much, besides it being the new hotness.
Good post. I don't feel like reading any of the comments right now, though. I'll just say that, whatever argument may or may not be occurring in the comments, it's Jim Sterling's fault.
Musashi seems to forget that Clover studios fucking went under because the Hardcore audience wasn't enough to sustain their losses for their art. If the gaming industry was expanded, maybe fantastic games like Okami and Psychonauts would have actually been successful and studios like Clover would still be around.
This argument is largely raised because gaming is loaded with pissy Prima Donnas.
Marc Ecko's game wasn't that good, but if you remember he said something along the lines of "the fashion industry has some bitches, well, gaming's got some *real* bitches. I'm going back to fashion".
I mean, look at the history of the prima donna bitch throughout gaming history, another great example is when "hell levels" were fixed in EverQuest. The argument was "we had to play a game that played like shit to get to level 46 (or whatever), you can't just go and fix that and make it possible for someone with family obligations to get to level 46 this century".
This is the same reason Final Fantasy keeps selling. Oooh, sick burn! Not really. But I still can't figure it out.
Marc Ecko's game wasn't that good, but if you remember he said something along the lines of "the fashion industry has some bitches, well, gaming's got some *real* bitches. I'm going back to fashion".
I mean, look at the history of the prima donna bitch throughout gaming history, another great example is when "hell levels" were fixed in EverQuest. The argument was "we had to play a game that played like shit to get to level 46 (or whatever), you can't just go and fix that and make it possible for someone with family obligations to get to level 46 this century".
This is the same reason Final Fantasy keeps selling. Oooh, sick burn! Not really. But I still can't figure it out.
Can any of the doom sayers name one form of entertainment where deep, artistic examples have gone the way of the dinosaur because of the examples that appeal to the masses?
Books-nope
TV-nope
Movies-nope
Music-nope
Anyone?
Books-nope
TV-nope
Movies-nope
Music-nope
Anyone?
"Hardcore" gamers are scared that the one place in their life where the are constantly catered to (other than the Sc-Fi channel) is going to be taken from them.
And I personally think that's awesome. I hope that the Wii will win and cause hardcore gamers to quit gaming, so I will no longer be associated with their fat, nerdy asses.
Same with comic books. Since DC and Marvel went bankrupt due to their regurgitation of the same "hard core" product (Super hero comics with gatefold covers), the field has greatly broadened. Autobiogarphical comics, romance comics, horror comics, etc. This has brought a lot of people into reading comics that never would before, and drove some of the losers out.
And comics are making more money because of it.
And I personally think that's awesome. I hope that the Wii will win and cause hardcore gamers to quit gaming, so I will no longer be associated with their fat, nerdy asses.
Same with comic books. Since DC and Marvel went bankrupt due to their regurgitation of the same "hard core" product (Super hero comics with gatefold covers), the field has greatly broadened. Autobiogarphical comics, romance comics, horror comics, etc. This has brought a lot of people into reading comics that never would before, and drove some of the losers out.
And comics are making more money because of it.
I miss Mxy's comments.
Also the Wii can still bite me. I am still laughing over Nick's "6 minute ab's videogame" comment regarding WiiFit.
Also the Wii can still bite me. I am still laughing over Nick's "6 minute ab's videogame" comment regarding WiiFit.
This is all further proof that gamers will find anything to bitch about, just for the sake of bitching.
Bill Gates could write every Xbox 360 owner a check for 1,000 dollars and gamers would bitch that they have to get up off of their Cheeto-stained couches to cash it. Some people simply cannot be pleased.
I'm all for the so-called casual movement in gaming today. I can now enjoy a hobby with my entire family that I previously was only able to enjoy alone or over the internet with anonymous strangers. And the "hardcore" games are still there for me to play whenever I have a bit of alone-time to kill. It's win-win.
Bill Gates could write every Xbox 360 owner a check for 1,000 dollars and gamers would bitch that they have to get up off of their Cheeto-stained couches to cash it. Some people simply cannot be pleased.
I'm all for the so-called casual movement in gaming today. I can now enjoy a hobby with my entire family that I previously was only able to enjoy alone or over the internet with anonymous strangers. And the "hardcore" games are still there for me to play whenever I have a bit of alone-time to kill. It's win-win.
I don't really have a problem with "casual gamers" "taking" development time. There have been quite a few of these "casual" games that I've enjoyed very much. Elite Beat Agents is even part of the "Touch Generations" brand that's aimed directly at people who don't play games, and EBA has become my favorite game of all time. Fuck Zelda, I've got goddamn Canned Heat.
Plus, I've seen in more than one case where a casual gamer has played enough, and thus started "leveling up" to less casual-oriented games. My mom played a mean Gears of War, and that's not bullshit.
Plus, I've seen in more than one case where a casual gamer has played enough, and thus started "leveling up" to less casual-oriented games. My mom played a mean Gears of War, and that's not bullshit.
everybody that is saying gamers bitch about everything probably spends most of their time reading only stuff related to gaming. EVERYBODY bitches about EVERYTHING!
case in point: Donovan McNabb was booed when taken by the Philadelphia Eagles at the NFL draft. he was booed by Philadelphia fans. he took them to a super bowl. ever see people boo during a Sony or Microsoft keynote speech at the old, bigger E3?
case in point: Donovan McNabb was booed when taken by the Philadelphia Eagles at the NFL draft. he was booed by Philadelphia fans. he took them to a super bowl. ever see people boo during a Sony or Microsoft keynote speech at the old, bigger E3?
follow
