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My first reaction is: "This does not look like the Splinter Cell, Pandora Tomorrow, Chaos Theory I know. This looks like some extreme, generic, CoDish shit."
The final product will be some extreme, generic, slo-Mo, CoDish shit.
The final product will be some extreme, generic, slo-Mo, CoDish shit.
Hollywood action, if it works for survival horror, action hack 'n' slashers, and FPSs, why not stealth series, too? Who needs genres, anyway?
I never asked for this - Adam Jensen
I thought it looked fine, you had 2 approaches in all the games for the most part. They just michael bay'd the actiony approach more.
I thought it looked fine, you had 2 approaches in all the games for the most part. They just michael bay'd the actiony approach more.
Jim, you forgot a particularly stupid line he said in the Eurogamer review:
What people won't say, but what they'll dance around, is that is the price of freedom to protect Americans and their sedans and SUVs."
What people won't say, but what they'll dance around, is that is the price of freedom to protect Americans and their sedans and SUVs."
It doesn't have to look like the old games, games progress move into something else. However that does not mean it has to end up in one generic fireball of mindless shooting the badguys.
He's right. The fans have no idea what Ubisoft is doing.
But that's because Ubisoft doesn't have any fucking clue what it's doing anymore either.
But that's because Ubisoft doesn't have any fucking clue what it's doing anymore either.
If the space for competition is so deep and so broad, why is it that everything looks the same? Seems like there'd be room for different kinds of games.
Also, if fans have knee jerked and misunderstood, it is because Ubis marketing has misled us and tapped our knees. They put this content out there for judgment, and now they're upset the CoD fans still didn't care and their old fans don't appreciate the new direction.
Also, if fans have knee jerked and misunderstood, it is because Ubis marketing has misled us and tapped our knees. They put this content out there for judgment, and now they're upset the CoD fans still didn't care and their old fans don't appreciate the new direction.
That's just rhetoric in 2012 for you. Ridiculous. It's amazing, but people refuse to respect an opinion that differs from theirs. It's not that the gamers don't like the product...they're just stupid.
Gotta love personal insecurity.
Gotta love personal insecurity.
Will you just post that damned RE6 review, Jim? I need a larf.
OT: Splinter Cell was a STEALTH game, and so far they haven't shown us STEALTH. They showed us an action game. Therefore, we don't want this and fuck off.
OT: Splinter Cell was a STEALTH game, and so far they haven't shown us STEALTH. They showed us an action game. Therefore, we don't want this and fuck off.
Splinter Cell Conviction was great and at times it could turn very "Hollywood Blockbuster" action, i'll wait for the inevitable "Stealth" trailer to make an initial estimation but so far i'm not too worried for this game.
I'm keeping an open mind that this is just another Hitman: Absolution fiasco. Remember that last year? IO Interactive showed off gameplay and fans went apeshit! "YOU KILLED HITMAN!!! YOU TURNED THE SERIES INTO A GENERIC ACTION SHOOTER!!! I DON'T WANNA PLAY CONVICTICTION 47!!!!" etc. etc.
Then this year they showed up some proper Hitman gameplay and now everyone switched gears screaming, "GOTY!!! DAY 1!!!" etc. etc.
From what I've seen, it looks neat but I can't deny they're showing off all of the action-oriented approaches to attract new audiences. I just hope they finally reveal some gameplay akin to Chaos Theory. No title has ever been able to top that in stealth (except Thief II) so far for me.
Then this year they showed up some proper Hitman gameplay and now everyone switched gears screaming, "GOTY!!! DAY 1!!!" etc. etc.
From what I've seen, it looks neat but I can't deny they're showing off all of the action-oriented approaches to attract new audiences. I just hope they finally reveal some gameplay akin to Chaos Theory. No title has ever been able to top that in stealth (except Thief II) so far for me.
first off, dafuq is a "vertical slice"? secondly how is it OUR fault for the impression we got from what THEY showed us? if they didnt want us to have that impression, then dont show us something that will give us that impression. herpy derpy flerpy.
I'm excited about this. I don't like stealth in games (much more of a chainsaw to the face kinda player) so maybe I'll try this one.
Ubisoft has fallen to the michael bay-dubstep-dudebro gamers in terms of marketing, is anyone surprised?
Why can't we have another Chaos Theory?
Why can't we have another Chaos Theory?
i really don't get the hate on Blacklist, DMC, Phoenix Wright vs Layton and other similar projects - i love the fact that we get to experience different takes on well-known characters and IPs from other studios.
i love the fact that Call of Duty is being hated for being the same yet when publisher tries to make a spinoff that takes different approach to the IP it's "god forbid, how dare they. they're destroying the franchise" - make up your mind people.
i still don't get the DMC hate - it's not 5th entry in the series, it's a SPINOFF and Ninja Theory's take on the franchise which i'm actually glad that Capcom decided to do. it's an interesting take and more story driven game with fun gameplay twist.
i love the fact that Call of Duty is being hated for being the same yet when publisher tries to make a spinoff that takes different approach to the IP it's "god forbid, how dare they. they're destroying the franchise" - make up your mind people.
i still don't get the DMC hate - it's not 5th entry in the series, it's a SPINOFF and Ninja Theory's take on the franchise which i'm actually glad that Capcom decided to do. it's an interesting take and more story driven game with fun gameplay twist.
.. and once again, their PR seems to fail big time! He doesn't see an issue with stating
"There are some areas you'll have to play stealth, but there are areas where you'll find it hard if you don't use wide-open action."
... so what he's saying is that if you like stealth, you'll be forced to play parts of the game as an action game... and if you like action, you'll be forced to play part of the game as stealth. Does this actually please anyone?? They couldn't give gamers the option to play the game the way gamers want to play? This is 2012 not 1995... what he should have said was "the game can be played either as stealth or action".
"There are some areas you'll have to play stealth, but there are areas where you'll find it hard if you don't use wide-open action."
... so what he's saying is that if you like stealth, you'll be forced to play parts of the game as an action game... and if you like action, you'll be forced to play part of the game as stealth. Does this actually please anyone?? They couldn't give gamers the option to play the game the way gamers want to play? This is 2012 not 1995... what he should have said was "the game can be played either as stealth or action".
If fans misunderstood based upon what information was given them, it sounds like some PR needs replacing with more effective communicators.
What a joke.
What a joke.
The action and whatnot aint the problem, the PROBLEM is that they took out Michael Ironside and replaced him with a dude who sounds way too young!
My only problem with these games now is that even though these are direct sequels and not reboots, the main character is getting younger and more violent.
They should have made the main character a new guy, and old Sam could be his new handler, taking Lambert's old job. And Sam could be all like "YOU'RE A LOOSE CANNON, NEW YOUNG GUY! YOU'RE OUT OF CONTROL!" That would be preferable to this Benjamin Button meets CoD thing they've got going on.
They should have made the main character a new guy, and old Sam could be his new handler, taking Lambert's old job. And Sam could be all like "YOU'RE A LOOSE CANNON, NEW YOUNG GUY! YOU'RE OUT OF CONTROL!" That would be preferable to this Benjamin Button meets CoD thing they've got going on.
Wait a minute, wait a minute, WAIT A MINUTE. A "vertical slice" isn't indicative of the final product?! That's what a vertical slice is supposed to do! Someone needs to grab this joker by the back of his fucking head and shove his nose in the 'V' section of the dictionary. And then maybe in a pile of dog shit.
@sofik88
"i still don't get the DMC hate - it's not 5th entry in the series, it's a SPINOFF and Ninja Theory's take on the franchise which i'm actually glad that Capcom decided to do. it's an interesting take and more story driven game with fun gameplay twist."
None of that is really confirmed yet. It's rare that you see a publisher "reboot" a series but only in a separate time-line kind of thing. Considering that they've already made a semi-announcement for DmC2 it doesn't seem likely to me that the old series is just going to continue alongside it. If DmC was just a spin-off then yes, I wouldn't mind and I'd probably check it out to see an alternative take on the universe. But the term "spin-off" is conspicuously absent from most of Capcom's marketing material, though they have referred to it as a "parallel universe" so there's hope yet.
Regarding Blacklist, it looks dumb as shit but Splinter Cell has never really been my thing.
"i still don't get the DMC hate - it's not 5th entry in the series, it's a SPINOFF and Ninja Theory's take on the franchise which i'm actually glad that Capcom decided to do. it's an interesting take and more story driven game with fun gameplay twist."
None of that is really confirmed yet. It's rare that you see a publisher "reboot" a series but only in a separate time-line kind of thing. Considering that they've already made a semi-announcement for DmC2 it doesn't seem likely to me that the old series is just going to continue alongside it. If DmC was just a spin-off then yes, I wouldn't mind and I'd probably check it out to see an alternative take on the universe. But the term "spin-off" is conspicuously absent from most of Capcom's marketing material, though they have referred to it as a "parallel universe" so there's hope yet.
Regarding Blacklist, it looks dumb as shit but Splinter Cell has never really been my thing.
I have seen gameplay videos of the two different approach's and it look really great, the stealth is very reminiscent of the old school and the action one is very "Conviction"... and even then the fans are mad.
I don't get you people.
I don't get you people.
Kakulukia
Here you go http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jwpUzS8bJgw
PLEASE keep in mind that this is the E3 build of the game, so the AI and animation isn't finished yet.
Here you go http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jwpUzS8bJgw
PLEASE keep in mind that this is the E3 build of the game, so the AI and animation isn't finished yet.
Seems like a tough game to sell at this point, you get the feeling that the whole Tom Clancy thing for Ubisoft is kind of on its last legs?
The latest Ghost Recon game came out and disappeared pretty fast and no one knows what the hell is up with that Rainbow Six game they announced last year. It makes sense that feel they need to streamline it a bit but they don't need to be dicks about it. I don't think it will ever be this huge game that they want it to be though
The latest Ghost Recon game came out and disappeared pretty fast and no one knows what the hell is up with that Rainbow Six game they announced last year. It makes sense that feel they need to streamline it a bit but they don't need to be dicks about it. I don't think it will ever be this huge game that they want it to be though
""What people won't say, but what they'll dance around, is that is the price of freedom to protect Americans and their sedans and SUVs."
Furk yeah murrica support our troops and protect our freedoms from brown men with towels on their head
Furk yeah murrica support our troops and protect our freedoms from brown men with towels on their head
We are reacting to information you have given us. Unless you are hiding something from us don't say we are uninformed, we're not stupid.
I think the bigger point is... people were actually talking about Splinter Cell Blacklist? Pretty sure this is the first I've heard of it since E3.
@Scotty,
Splinter Cell series used to be a really really amazing series. It actually didn't try to copy MGS and did its own brand of stealth.
MGS was about kooky arcade style stealth, Splinter Cell was about shadow shadow shadow and realism.
So different, really fun and really very interesting.
Michael Ironside's voice was iconic as David Hayters to Cell fans.
Now... Now the series is taking cues from popular brands and homogenizing with jingoistic propoganda...
You can see how a nuanced stealth game turning into... this. is upsetting to longterm fans. Especially given the cynism of the character is now jingoistic BS.
Splinter Cell series used to be a really really amazing series. It actually didn't try to copy MGS and did its own brand of stealth.
MGS was about kooky arcade style stealth, Splinter Cell was about shadow shadow shadow and realism.
So different, really fun and really very interesting.
Michael Ironside's voice was iconic as David Hayters to Cell fans.
Now... Now the series is taking cues from popular brands and homogenizing with jingoistic propoganda...
You can see how a nuanced stealth game turning into... this. is upsetting to longterm fans. Especially given the cynism of the character is now jingoistic BS.
I really liked the art direction in Conviction, so I'm disappointed they've moved away from that. The Blacklist dev session at Eurogamer Expo primarily discussed motion capture, but the animation I've seen looked unappealing and uncanny valley. And no Ironside.
Pass.
Pass.
So he says "If it makes you squeamish and uncomfortable, maybe that's the point. I always know when we're onto something that's really touchy and interesting when we get reactions like that. But the truth is it's really happening. That's the truth. We all know it's really happening all over the world. People are doing horrible things for -- what, the right reasons?" Fair enough, I can side with that, but then RIGHT AFTER decides to say "IT NEEDS TO BE MORE LIKE A HOLLYWOOD MOVIE GAIZ THAT'S WHAT SELLZ LAWLZZZZZ"
Depicting scenes of torture and expecting them to have resonance only to follow it up with Hollywood-esque scenes of heroic murdering and "LOOK HOW BADASS THIS IS, GUYS" is fucking stupid. If this game was like the old splinter cell games, which generally focused on eliminating a few enemies in a very specific way, the torture stuff could definitely fly and have resonance. When someone's getting tortures and 10 minutes later Sam Fischer flies in and kills a bunch of nameless middle eastern "terrorists" with headshots, sci fi technology, and Uncharted-esque punches?
Ubi pls.
Depicting scenes of torture and expecting them to have resonance only to follow it up with Hollywood-esque scenes of heroic murdering and "LOOK HOW BADASS THIS IS, GUYS" is fucking stupid. If this game was like the old splinter cell games, which generally focused on eliminating a few enemies in a very specific way, the torture stuff could definitely fly and have resonance. When someone's getting tortures and 10 minutes later Sam Fischer flies in and kills a bunch of nameless middle eastern "terrorists" with headshots, sci fi technology, and Uncharted-esque punches?
Ubi pls.
@MindKiller89
DmC is a Prequelboot Alternate Universe Spin-off Rebranding. Not even Capcom or Ninja Theory know what the game is supposed to be for the franchise.
DmC is a Prequelboot Alternate Universe Spin-off Rebranding. Not even Capcom or Ninja Theory know what the game is supposed to be for the franchise.
So he says "If it makes you squeamish and uncomfortable, maybe that's the point. I always know when we're onto something that's really touchy and interesting when we get reactions like that. But the truth is it's really happening. That's the truth. We all know it's really happening all over the world. People are doing horrible things for -- what, the right reasons?" Fair enough, I can side with that, but then RIGHT AFTER decides to say "IT NEEDS TO BE MORE LIKE A HOLLYWOOD MOVIE GAIZ THAT'S WHAT SELLZ LAWLZZZZZ"
Depicting scenes of torture and expecting them to have resonance only to follow it up with Hollywood-esque scenes of heroic murdering and "LOOK HOW BADASS THIS IS, GUYS" is fucking stupid. If this game was like the old splinter cell games, which generally focused on eliminating a few enemies in a very specific way, the torture stuff could definitely fly and have resonance. When someone's getting tortures and 10 minutes later Sam Fischer flies in and kills a bunch of nameless middle eastern "terrorists" with headshots, sci fi technology, and Uncharted-esque punches?
Ubi pls.
Depicting scenes of torture and expecting them to have resonance only to follow it up with Hollywood-esque scenes of heroic murdering and "LOOK HOW BADASS THIS IS, GUYS" is fucking stupid. If this game was like the old splinter cell games, which generally focused on eliminating a few enemies in a very specific way, the torture stuff could definitely fly and have resonance. When someone's getting tortures and 10 minutes later Sam Fischer flies in and kills a bunch of nameless middle eastern "terrorists" with headshots, sci fi technology, and Uncharted-esque punches?
Ubi pls.
@OMGWTFBENTIME
Well 24 and Call of Duty are popular and makes a lot of money, Ubisoft wants a lot of money, so mindlessly and lazily copying 24 and CoD is a obviously the best move for the franchise.
Well 24 and Call of Duty are popular and makes a lot of money, Ubisoft wants a lot of money, so mindlessly and lazily copying 24 and CoD is a obviously the best move for the franchise.
most stealth games are just repeat trial and error and thats jus gay so its good that Ubi finaly see that and switch to more fun stealth of Assasin Creed
Also Ubisoft kind of has a point with people doing baseless hate, yes it will most likely be more of an action game than the classics but lets be honest its not a resident evil 6. Also remember the always on drm, the moment the announced that they had stopped using it they had not brought out a game using it in ages essentially having lots of hate about the drm being used long after they actually stopped using it in new games.
Whatever he says, the gameplay demonstrations speak for itself, it's not that they PLAYED it actiony, it's that the mechanics are MADE actiony and shallow.
It's the same problem I had with conviction, no shadow meter, guards go down like flies with the ridiculous mark-and-execute move, no sound meter, constant movement speed, no traditional interrogation, no smart objective based level design etc. etc. etc.
they fucked up, and it looks like they are continuing to fuck up, traditional splinter cell is officially dead (I still had hope for conviction to be but a departure) I just hope the indie scene can keep proper stealth games alive, it looks like Mark of the Ninja and Dishonored does it well at least.
But yeah, this makes me sad, it's basically a one-man ghost recon now (featuring no Micheal Ironside either, he sounds like your generic action hero protagonist).
It's the same problem I had with conviction, no shadow meter, guards go down like flies with the ridiculous mark-and-execute move, no sound meter, constant movement speed, no traditional interrogation, no smart objective based level design etc. etc. etc.
they fucked up, and it looks like they are continuing to fuck up, traditional splinter cell is officially dead (I still had hope for conviction to be but a departure) I just hope the indie scene can keep proper stealth games alive, it looks like Mark of the Ninja and Dishonored does it well at least.
But yeah, this makes me sad, it's basically a one-man ghost recon now (featuring no Micheal Ironside either, he sounds like your generic action hero protagonist).
I loved the last game. I don't know what to think about the new one. I saw the E3 demo and it seemed alright. I don't like to watch too much footage of a game I expect to buy. I am worried about what I am hearing though. I don't want it become a Resident Evil 6 fiasco where the series turns itself into EVERYTHING to please EVERYONE.
What is this? Ubisoft trying to be the victim here? With such a big list of lie, theft and screw ups? Ah!
Great post, Jim! Totally agree and while I am looking forward to Blacklist, they should have either shown as much emphasis on the non-violent stealthy version as much as the action-oriented version since the release of the first trailers.
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