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"I am not saying offensive humor shouldn't be allowed. I am saying it shouldn't be targeted at somebody there, with you, asking you to stop it."
This is completely correct, and contrary to popular belief, she took it directly to Capcom on day 2 and Aris was supposedly reprimanded about it, this was stated on teamsp00ky's stream this morning. Aris was still allowed to stay on the show and make harassing comments, on day 5 he said "sexual harassment is part of fighting game culture" and is still there on the show on the very last day.
This is completely correct, and contrary to popular belief, she took it directly to Capcom on day 2 and Aris was supposedly reprimanded about it, this was stated on teamsp00ky's stream this morning. Aris was still allowed to stay on the show and make harassing comments, on day 5 he said "sexual harassment is part of fighting game culture" and is still there on the show on the very last day.
Jokes or not there is no excuse for shit behavior. if you want to tell those jokes fine but you must take responsibility for your "jokes"
Also, there's a vast difference between being an asshole, and telling jokes. Being humorous and being malicious are two different things, though that's not to say malicious shit isn't funny.
He's been mentioned, but yeah, Carlin was a perfect example of that difference. I'm so happy I got to see him live before he died. He opened the show with the pussyfart bit, it was all gravy from there on out.
He's been mentioned, but yeah, Carlin was a perfect example of that difference. I'm so happy I got to see him live before he died. He opened the show with the pussyfart bit, it was all gravy from there on out.
Has anyone watched the video yet? Around 7:32:00, they start really arguing, and Aris is just getting right up in SuperYan's face. He actually looks pretty threatening. She's moving away, and he just keeps coming closer.
Do you always resort to basing your articles on Twitter comments and forum hearsay when people refuse to speak about the situation with you directly?
its pretty obvious that if you ask someone not to do something and they do it anyway, they are being disrespectful.
but there's always people like that everywhere you go, it sucks but the only thing you can do is move on and ignore the idiot.
but there's always people like that everywhere you go, it sucks but the only thing you can do is move on and ignore the idiot.
" I've made jokes or called people things without knowing how problematic and stupid they were"
...and continue to do so, it seems. Aris isn't really a bad guy; if he knew how much it was bothering her, I'm sure he would have stopped. Miranda isn't some fragile feminist spoil-sport, either. It was a mismatch of personalities and it has noting whatsoever to do with gaming. By the way, claiming that there's a "myth that the FGC is full of entitled manbabies"; that'd be another dumb thing you've said about people. I've never heard that before and the only way I can think of that being in there is that at some point you decided that that was true, yourself. Also, trying to claim that SRK thinks one thing and NeoGaf thinks another is just wrong; they're forums, for discussion, not a hive mind. As much as you keep trying to bring this back to fighting games, they merely provided the venue; other than that, the issue is completely separate from any community and in fact, gender is irrelevant, too (as it always is). Someone said things another person didn't like, other person a)didn't realise the extent to which those things were hurtful, or b)is a dick. That's as far as this story goes.
...and continue to do so, it seems. Aris isn't really a bad guy; if he knew how much it was bothering her, I'm sure he would have stopped. Miranda isn't some fragile feminist spoil-sport, either. It was a mismatch of personalities and it has noting whatsoever to do with gaming. By the way, claiming that there's a "myth that the FGC is full of entitled manbabies"; that'd be another dumb thing you've said about people. I've never heard that before and the only way I can think of that being in there is that at some point you decided that that was true, yourself. Also, trying to claim that SRK thinks one thing and NeoGaf thinks another is just wrong; they're forums, for discussion, not a hive mind. As much as you keep trying to bring this back to fighting games, they merely provided the venue; other than that, the issue is completely separate from any community and in fact, gender is irrelevant, too (as it always is). Someone said things another person didn't like, other person a)didn't realise the extent to which those things were hurtful, or b)is a dick. That's as far as this story goes.
Agree completely on the personal element of this thing. Jokes are one thing, but being an asshole on a personal level towards one person non stop, is a different thing. And after being asked to stop only to keep doing it because he thinks it's cool to not give a shit, then there is no situation in which he is in the right.
The FGC is all about talking trash and blowing each other up, but it usually stays pretty focused on the games. You talk about how free the other person is, how much better you are and so on. You don't talk about their family, loved ones, personal issues, etc. Everyone knows there's a line, and if you cross that line it's not about the game anymore.
I'd be fine with this if it was just another situation when someone crossed the line. Happens all the time. But the "OMG a real girl! boobies!" element to this is just so fucking pathetic and reinforces every negative gamer stereotype. To have that happen on Cross Assault is just fucking embarrassing for the entire community. That's what pisses me off the most.
The FGC is all about talking trash and blowing each other up, but it usually stays pretty focused on the games. You talk about how free the other person is, how much better you are and so on. You don't talk about their family, loved ones, personal issues, etc. Everyone knows there's a line, and if you cross that line it's not about the game anymore.
I'd be fine with this if it was just another situation when someone crossed the line. Happens all the time. But the "OMG a real girl! boobies!" element to this is just so fucking pathetic and reinforces every negative gamer stereotype. To have that happen on Cross Assault is just fucking embarrassing for the entire community. That's what pisses me off the most.
Zero tolerance against sexual harassment. Thats it. Youve been told to stop, it means to fucking stop! Shut your trap and change your tone.
That bearded boy needs to learn to stuff it.
Shame on Capcom for letting this happen.
That bearded boy needs to learn to stuff it.
Shame on Capcom for letting this happen.
I love how we get into the whole, "What about this? What about this?" realm when this subject EVER comes up.
How about this: Don't sexually harass women. Unless you've got some reason to believe a girl wants you making cracks about her breasts or legs or the fact that she has a vagina, just stop. You've no god-given "right" to make anyone feel just as uncomfortable as you want whenever you want. Perhaps the right to SAY what you say, but then people have the right to tell you you're an asshole for it, too.
People "self-censor" every day: it's called tact. Not always saying 100% of everything that might fly across our brain at a given moment. It's a lost art, seemingly.
How about this: Don't sexually harass women. Unless you've got some reason to believe a girl wants you making cracks about her breasts or legs or the fact that she has a vagina, just stop. You've no god-given "right" to make anyone feel just as uncomfortable as you want whenever you want. Perhaps the right to SAY what you say, but then people have the right to tell you you're an asshole for it, too.
People "self-censor" every day: it's called tact. Not always saying 100% of everything that might fly across our brain at a given moment. It's a lost art, seemingly.
Saying shocking shit to be funny really isn't that impressive. It's not that it can't be funny, it just takes absolutely no skill. Anyone can blurt out something offensive. It's really a moron's only way to be humorous. It is a craft and an art to make really good jokes. Even Carlin's most shocking jokes have a lot of thought and depth to them.
Shock should be a means, not an end.
Shock should be a means, not an end.
One look at that guy clearly shows he stopped giving a shit about ALOT OF THINGS, a long long time ago.
If you want to know how much of douche Aris is and how just thick his, check the iPlayWinner video archives:
http://www.twitch.tv/iplaywinner/b/309876812
CROSS ASSAULT - DAY 5 - BBS HQ at 4:25:00
How he tries to justify what he does to Miranda.
"...it's not right to harass anyone to the point of them being uncomfortable, BUT you should be able to if you want to... and that's because we're in America... you should be able to if you want to."
Like not only does he just not make sense, he seems to just not follow how life works. Every time I hear that bit I'm just lost for words.
http://www.twitch.tv/iplaywinner/b/309876812
CROSS ASSAULT - DAY 5 - BBS HQ at 4:25:00
How he tries to justify what he does to Miranda.
"...it's not right to harass anyone to the point of them being uncomfortable, BUT you should be able to if you want to... and that's because we're in America... you should be able to if you want to."
Like not only does he just not make sense, he seems to just not follow how life works. Every time I hear that bit I'm just lost for words.
Whether someone asks you politely or not, if they ask you at all to stop telling jokes about a certain subject, you should keep your trap shut. And if you don't, you're a dick.
Aris is a cool guy, that's how he is. Miranda should have spoken up sooner. And some verbal abuse for like a week for $25k? I'll take that any day.
@tristrix
I bet you don't say that when someone crosses your boundries, even if they were "just kidding".
I bet you don't say that when someone crosses your boundries, even if they were "just kidding".
@Dan
No, she should've said, "Stop" and he should've stopped.
"Boys will be boys" isn't an argument. "That's how he is" isn't an argument. Raping is "just how a rapist is." That means precisely dick.
No, she should've said, "Stop" and he should've stopped.
"Boys will be boys" isn't an argument. "That's how he is" isn't an argument. Raping is "just how a rapist is." That means precisely dick.
Wow, Dtoid along with the rest of the gaming community really miss the point here. While the sexual harassment was present, there isn't a need to polarize a community that you have almost no knowledge of, and starting to apply your logic for situations you don't even fully understand. Aris has apologized everyday since day 2 about 100 times, and super_yan didn't complain on stream TO PREVENT outsiders like dtoid and Giantbomb white knighting.
I feel for super_yan and dislike Aris, but all the article does is single out TWEETS and quotes sources like NeoGAF to sensationalize the issue. I wonder why super_yan refused an interview from you guys. Public disorganised shit-show? Trying to polarize Shoryuken? Don't drag others into your biased viewership rally.
I feel for super_yan and dislike Aris, but all the article does is single out TWEETS and quotes sources like NeoGAF to sensationalize the issue. I wonder why super_yan refused an interview from you guys. Public disorganised shit-show? Trying to polarize Shoryuken? Don't drag others into your biased viewership rally.
@Revuhlooshun: Fucking this, thank you. Delving into shocking/offensive territory is never funny in and of itself. If there's a joke you really wanna make about a subject that's normally off-limits, a would-be comedian needs to consider the subject matter as a penalty to the joke, of sorts.
As in, you better make the payoff well worth it. It's not that it's never acceptable to go there, but once you're 'there' you have an obligation to be really, really fucking funny.
Also, this dynamic changes once shit gets personal.
As in, you better make the payoff well worth it. It's not that it's never acceptable to go there, but once you're 'there' you have an obligation to be really, really fucking funny.
Also, this dynamic changes once shit gets personal.
Super_yan on twitter: "lol fuck Destructoid. They tried to get me to talk to them several times and I ignored it so they made a post anyway.. jerkoffs."
If I were in a situation like her I would do the same thing: laugh about it. It's that laugh you do where you're uncomfortable and you want it to stop but you don't want to make a huge deal of it and look like "the bad guy" by having a hissy fit. As a chick I'm gonna say the crap he was saying was wrong and if he were on my case like that I wouldn't have wanted to say "stop" like that cause I'm a passive person. I enjoy competition but I don't necessarily want to trash talk. I'm not saying Miranda is the same but I think it's rather unfair that everyone assume she was just cool with it and laughed cause she liked the attention.
I agree with some of what Jim says, but there is a little more to the story I think. First Aris acted liked a dick can't argue against that. When this thing blew up aris apologized to Miranda about what he said. If this whole sexual harresment was a big deal she would have left on the first not last day. Also according to sherry another female on the show, told Miranda to tell aris to stop making fun of her and he would have but she didn't. She Ignored the advice and didn't tell him to stop. If she thought the sexual harresment was bad she would stop laughing about it. Just like you stop making fun of Holmes. What happened was bad little bad for the FGC, but they will move on
Christ almighty, this issue is deeper than it should be. The notion than anyone has an inherit right to be discriminatory is absurd, and practically criminal. And the idea that this fighting game competition requires emotional fortitude against personal attacks rather than skill in VIDEOGAMES is childish and self-serving.
Additionally, VIDEOGAMES.
Additionally, VIDEOGAMES.
I've seen similar situations many times. That guy acted like an asshole, for sure, but the girl was just laughing nervously and did nothing. Of course he knew it made her uncomfortable, he was pushing it to provoke a certain reaction he wanted from her. Being polite is good and all, but sometimes you have to tell people to fuck off properly.
After watching Super_Yan make an absolute tool out of herself on Twitter, I change my stance to the following.
"Fuck both of them. They're both idiots who people shouldnt care about"
"Fuck both of them. They're both idiots who people shouldnt care about"
"it's only a joke if everybody is laughing"
No way, not at all. That's not how jokes work. Often times, they are at the expense of someone. Those are the good ones, IMO.
No way, not at all. That's not how jokes work. Often times, they are at the expense of someone. Those are the good ones, IMO.
People complaining about sites like Dtoid "white-knighting" have to realize that if esports wants to be legitimized, it'll have to go through these growing pains. Every sport goes through these controversies: proper conduct on and off the playing surface, changing mentalities and rule updates, crackdowns on certain attitudes and even some traditions, boundaries that can and cannot be crossed, etc. Don't think of it as an attack on your gaming culture, see it more as being called out on immature behaviour. Take the criticism and grow with it. Being combative over it does not make the fanbase look good.
I've part of Shoryuken and the FGC for ten years now and let me just state one thing:
The majority of us in the community think the 'Cross Assault' reality show is a crock of shit.
Almost all of us are siding with Aris going overboard and being out of line.
We all love the raw, gritty nature that comes with tournaments like trash talking, rivalries and what not but this is a stupid show with stupid drama with some unfortunately stupid individuals.
As a friend said on the subject:
"Video games are not meant to be that serious. Reality shows are dumb.
By forcing the former to be oh soooo serious and combining it with the latter, you get the exact embodiment of this ridiculous 'pro gaming' and 'e-sport' culture that SRK is dwelling in today.
Some people call that 'hype'. I call it stupidity. "
The majority of us in the community think the 'Cross Assault' reality show is a crock of shit.
Almost all of us are siding with Aris going overboard and being out of line.
We all love the raw, gritty nature that comes with tournaments like trash talking, rivalries and what not but this is a stupid show with stupid drama with some unfortunately stupid individuals.
As a friend said on the subject:
"Video games are not meant to be that serious. Reality shows are dumb.
By forcing the former to be oh soooo serious and combining it with the latter, you get the exact embodiment of this ridiculous 'pro gaming' and 'e-sport' culture that SRK is dwelling in today.
Some people call that 'hype'. I call it stupidity. "
@DrunkPunk Good jokes attack the powerful, not the marginalized. Dude in a tuxedo slipping on a banana peel and falling into horseshit? Hilarious and well-loved.
Making a woman uncomfortable by being a creeper, safe in the knowledge that no one will call you on your bullshit? Not funny and not acceptable.
Making a woman uncomfortable by being a creeper, safe in the knowledge that no one will call you on your bullshit? Not funny and not acceptable.
Also shouldn't it also be reported that Miranda accepted the apology?
I'm just saying, if you actually want to report on something a couple of days late you could at least listen to guys like Spooky who are actually up to date on us and not present a hilariously biased article that none of the parties represented actually approve of.
I'm just saying, if you actually want to report on something a couple of days late you could at least listen to guys like Spooky who are actually up to date on us and not present a hilariously biased article that none of the parties represented actually approve of.
Attention Jim Sterling
Aris != The Fighting Game Community
Stream Monsters != The Fighting Game Community
Lets just get that straightened out, kthx.
Aris != The Fighting Game Community
Stream Monsters != The Fighting Game Community
Lets just get that straightened out, kthx.
As Optimus Pime would say "Freedom is the right of every sentient being."
If you don't want to hang with loser duchebag's who don't know how to act around women, don't be a "professional" gamer.
On the other hand, is the show any good? Capcom making a show about how awesome Capcom stuff is, is like the videogame version of Hugo. Pretentious with good graphics.
If you don't want to hang with loser duchebag's who don't know how to act around women, don't be a "professional" gamer.
On the other hand, is the show any good? Capcom making a show about how awesome Capcom stuff is, is like the videogame version of Hugo. Pretentious with good graphics.
Wow, just when I wanted to side with the lady because armis was legitimately being a tool ( not in the harassment way, but in the "okay dude, get off it. You're acting like 19 year old me and I fucking hated 19 year old me") she goes and has to be a total jerkoff.
Classy.
Yeah, you know what? Fuck em both, gamer or not they suck at being people.
Dat PR, tho...
Classy.
Yeah, you know what? Fuck em both, gamer or not they suck at being people.
Dat PR, tho...
A bunch of overgrown manchildren pretending that pressing buttons on a controller is a sport instead of playing real sports, acting like overgrown manchildren?
Well, color me surprised.
I find the whole "e-sports" thing to just be an embarassment, especially when I see claims about how it's just as legitimate a "sport" as actually playing real sports. Chess is not a sport, it's a fucking game.
These guys play games that might require some degree of mental intelligence and capability, but actual sports add real physical excellence to the package, which is not part of pressing buttons on a controller.
Fucking pathetic.
Well, color me surprised.
I find the whole "e-sports" thing to just be an embarassment, especially when I see claims about how it's just as legitimate a "sport" as actually playing real sports. Chess is not a sport, it's a fucking game.
These guys play games that might require some degree of mental intelligence and capability, but actual sports add real physical excellence to the package, which is not part of pressing buttons on a controller.
Fucking pathetic.
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