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Sega had to wait for them to finish it so they could swoop in and take control of it and not have to pay for the development work.
So now you're advocating piracy... Oh, I see; when it serves YOUR interests, its A-OK. Because I am sure that you have an excuse as to why this instance is OK, but others are not.
Why don't that just change a few character models and release it as "Paved Road of extreme discontentment?"
Just remember the first scene with the girl in Bruce Willis´ BANDITS... thats what all big devs do, you make dinner and they go away, you get kidnapped, they go to europe
Soo glad I got to play it before they took it down.. it's sad that a lot of indie devs are doing better with SEGA's franchises than they are themselves. SEGA has so many great franchises to work with, Alex Kidd, Streets of Rage, Phantasy Star, Wonder Boy, Crazy Taxi, and of course Sonic.. but they're so focused on this whole bringing back Sonic, which is fine in because who wouldn't love a Sonic game that lived up to him? But really SEGA needs to get themselves together and stop shutting down these people and friggin' hire them. These developers are the kind of people who can bring these awesome games back to life!
It's like sega WANTS everyone to learn to use bittorrent, and then proceed do freely download more than they should. heh.
These guys should follow the Gearbox and Duke Nukem 3D remake. As long as they are not making money, what's the problem?
Unless SEGA saw the Remake and realized it's popularity and how a proper Remake should be done and, say a year from now, they announce a Streets Of Rage Remake...
Unless SEGA saw the Remake and realized it's popularity and how a proper Remake should be done and, say a year from now, they announce a Streets Of Rage Remake...
i see it as sega is now going to do a hd remake of SOR. its the only reason why they would do this now
... was this a free fan remake, or were they charging money for the remade game? I can see Sega pulling support if there was profit involved, they wouldn't want to set precedent and they have their IP to protect... and even if it was a fan-made free project I guess it would depend on the direction taken.
There are just lots of variables that we may not be aware of...
There are just lots of variables that we may not be aware of...
Shouldn't they be surprised/glad that there is a rich enough fan base for one of their games, that someone even went out of their way to make their own game in it's universe? As far as I know, they weren't making money off of it, so I don't see reason for this.
They at least had the courtesy to give us a head start, I'll give them that. That's more than can be said for Square Enix and the cool-looking Chrono Trigger things that were mercilessly decapitated before release.
Maybe they just want to play it before everyone else.
I've got it, it's awesome, though a lot of the cool stuff from v4 has been strangely omitted and the shop system sucks.
I've got it, it's awesome, though a lot of the cool stuff from v4 has been strangely omitted and the shop system sucks.
It's great that the people who don't come up with something worth selling always think it's ok to rip off someone who has. Sega are not the bastards here, why should they allow anyone to use one of their IP's in any capacity? I mean, these guys decided to commit all this time into an IP that they did not own.
Lesson to be learned here kiddies, DO YOUR OWN SHIT. Stop paying homage to people who want your money, and not your admiration.
Lesson to be learned here kiddies, DO YOUR OWN SHIT. Stop paying homage to people who want your money, and not your admiration.
Glad I already have it. They should just change the title and palette swap the main characters. EAD Sega.
mellotron: Nobody's advocating anything. I never explicitly condoned anybody downloading this free fan community project.
Screw Sega. Fuckin' cunts, the lot of 'em.
I agree with Tiago, the world needs more cool developers like Gearbox.
I agree with Tiago, the world needs more cool developers like Gearbox.
What the heck, Sega? Fans of your game created a remake that took them 8 years to finish because they love your game, and you pull it down? I doubt anyone is still buying Streets of Rage, so it didn't cost you any money, so what the heck?
Well said Jim. "Bastard Corporate Bully-Boy".
Well said Jim. "Bastard Corporate Bully-Boy".
EA did the same thing to my cousin with Ultima 4 which was free to play online.
http://www.phipsisoftware.com/ultima4/Ultima4.html
http://www.phipsisoftware.com/ultima4/Ultima4.html
@ mighty_marcos
Agreed 100% Leave fan games for programming/game design practice. If you're going to put that much time and work into something (and it requires a tremendous amount, believe me) and have the talent on board to make it happen, why *wouldn't* you put all of that towards your OWN ideas rather than someone else's? If it's a success, you get the accolade! Besides, if you're paying tribute to something, any classic gamer worth his/her salt ought to be able to tell right away.
Agreed 100% Leave fan games for programming/game design practice. If you're going to put that much time and work into something (and it requires a tremendous amount, believe me) and have the talent on board to make it happen, why *wouldn't* you put all of that towards your OWN ideas rather than someone else's? If it's a success, you get the accolade! Besides, if you're paying tribute to something, any classic gamer worth his/her salt ought to be able to tell right away.
I love it and honestly feel that if Sega does have their own plans, the only thing they could improve on is the graphics. It's just about perfect as far as beat em ups go and it's a shame that Sega isn't supporting it :/
3 things:
1 - Sega sucks because they can't make good old-style games (i.e. sonic remake vs sonic 4).
2 - Sega was a b*tch to cut it off after EIGHT YEARS of making. Just to remind you that we're not talinkg about a company, but passionate independent developers.
3 - I've already got mine last week so Blow Me, Sega! You're cool no more!
1 - Sega sucks because they can't make good old-style games (i.e. sonic remake vs sonic 4).
2 - Sega was a b*tch to cut it off after EIGHT YEARS of making. Just to remind you that we're not talinkg about a company, but passionate independent developers.
3 - I've already got mine last week so Blow Me, Sega! You're cool no more!
"We're not funding Shenmue 3, we promised to stop making Sonic games in an ad for a bad Sonic game but we're gonna keep making bad Sonic games, and... oh, wow, Streets of Rage?! We forgot all about that IP. Let's threaten to sue the guy who's making a not-for-profit homage to it and remind people that it's ours and, no, we WON'T make a new one."
Oh, Sega, you're so good at trolling.
Oh, Sega, you're so good at trolling.
Only reason I could see them really needing to do this is if they are planning something for the series.. But I highly doubt it to be the case...
One, serious, question I do have though: What makes this any different then someone doing a fan-made sonic game? Sega hasn't seemed to have much issue with those despite them coming out far FAR better then anything they've done with the character over the last decade.
One, serious, question I do have though: What makes this any different then someone doing a fan-made sonic game? Sega hasn't seemed to have much issue with those despite them coming out far FAR better then anything they've done with the character over the last decade.
I love how Sega's the villain for not wanting to lose sales of their various currently-available versions of Streets of Rage. Fan remakes are theoretically cool, but that's not your copyrighted material and it really should be seen as a hobby, not some grand project.
What really surprises me is that anyone is surprised this happened. Has a single "fan remake" that features a fully downloadable game (and not just a patch for a rom or somesuch) incorporating copyrighted material ever NOT been taken down? Sega didn't exactly drop some big evil legal hammer down, just politely requested it be taken down. Maybe these fans should have spent those 8 years doing an homage or something, with original characters and stages but similar tones? Something that could stand independently and look good on a resume?
It's sad to see some talented people see their work taken down, but this is hardly a "Bastard Corporate Bully-Boy" move. Ah well, Jim, never let it be said you don't keep things interesting.
What really surprises me is that anyone is surprised this happened. Has a single "fan remake" that features a fully downloadable game (and not just a patch for a rom or somesuch) incorporating copyrighted material ever NOT been taken down? Sega didn't exactly drop some big evil legal hammer down, just politely requested it be taken down. Maybe these fans should have spent those 8 years doing an homage or something, with original characters and stages but similar tones? Something that could stand independently and look good on a resume?
It's sad to see some talented people see their work taken down, but this is hardly a "Bastard Corporate Bully-Boy" move. Ah well, Jim, never let it be said you don't keep things interesting.
For those that asked, yes it was a free remake. It was not being sold.
As for contacting Sega in advance, the FAQ says that they did and links to a post with the following text: "I would like to say that we did actually contact Sega last year through an e-mail message regarding the use of copyrighted material, to which they answered asking us to send a formal letter to their legal department, so that's what we did.
We accepted the ESA policies regarding the DMCA as well, otherwise this website would not exist anymore."
Now, it is possible that the project went beyond the bounds of the original request. Perhaps Sega didn't know the scale of the project, or just what was being done with what material. It is also possible that offering a homebrew Wii version was a problem. (From what I've seen, SORR runs on the Beats of Rage engine, which has been ported to the Wii as a homebrew app, and Wii support is mentioned in the SORR FAQ.) Or most likely it was just a case of someone at Sega noticing several websites promoting a fan-remake of SOR, and any agreements made beforehand just didn't matter.
@mellotron:
From what I remember, rather early on in Jim's anti-game piracy crusade, he said that it was specifically videogame piracy that couldn't be justified, and was more supportive of stuff like music and movie piracy.
As for contacting Sega in advance, the FAQ says that they did and links to a post with the following text: "I would like to say that we did actually contact Sega last year through an e-mail message regarding the use of copyrighted material, to which they answered asking us to send a formal letter to their legal department, so that's what we did.
We accepted the ESA policies regarding the DMCA as well, otherwise this website would not exist anymore."
Now, it is possible that the project went beyond the bounds of the original request. Perhaps Sega didn't know the scale of the project, or just what was being done with what material. It is also possible that offering a homebrew Wii version was a problem. (From what I've seen, SORR runs on the Beats of Rage engine, which has been ported to the Wii as a homebrew app, and Wii support is mentioned in the SORR FAQ.) Or most likely it was just a case of someone at Sega noticing several websites promoting a fan-remake of SOR, and any agreements made beforehand just didn't matter.
@mellotron:
From what I remember, rather early on in Jim's anti-game piracy crusade, he said that it was specifically videogame piracy that couldn't be justified, and was more supportive of stuff like music and movie piracy.
@Gryzor:
For the same reason people buy useless collectible trinkets and do cosplay at conventions. They've found something they enjoy and identify with. And judging from the reactions here, the guys that worked on this Streets of Rage remake did a pretty good job.
Working within an existing framework also gives rookie developers an easy way to learn the ropes. The first time I ever messed around with game programming was the Wolf 3D source code. I didn't know how to build a game from scratch, and that was a great place to start.
For the same reason people buy useless collectible trinkets and do cosplay at conventions. They've found something they enjoy and identify with. And judging from the reactions here, the guys that worked on this Streets of Rage remake did a pretty good job.
Working within an existing framework also gives rookie developers an easy way to learn the ropes. The first time I ever messed around with game programming was the Wolf 3D source code. I didn't know how to build a game from scratch, and that was a great place to start.
I just finished playing through it for the 16th time, and as a long time fan of the original series, I can safely say Sega will probably never make a game this good. With so much content, so many new characters, and all the music remixes sounding so good, it's a SOR fan's wet dream. What sucks even more, is that while version 5 was the final version, there were still some bug fixes that needed to be addressed, but now I guess we might never get that patch. Oh well, I guess I should count myself lucky since I got it before Sega decided to be a total dick and shut down a awesome game 8 years in the making...
Glad I actually jumped on it when I could. But this does suck for the people who has to look around.
While the game has some problems that I don't like, it was extremely done well. I could only hope Sega at least gives the jist on what's going on. For having all this work go down, be cool from the start, then turn around and do this must mean something happened somewhere. I want to believe Sega's going to look at it, evaluate it, then hire the team to help create either a new SoR or redo a SoR game in HD or something.
While the game has some problems that I don't like, it was extremely done well. I could only hope Sega at least gives the jist on what's going on. For having all this work go down, be cool from the start, then turn around and do this must mean something happened somewhere. I want to believe Sega's going to look at it, evaluate it, then hire the team to help create either a new SoR or redo a SoR game in HD or something.
Sterling: You all but implied that shit, and you did it purposely. Who ya foolin.
Anyways, right, this is piracy on some level. It SEGAs IP. Unless Jim maybe I'm not understanding the Jim Sterling Piracy Guidelines, which reads something like "Piracy is no good for many reasons, and if you make any excuses then you're a liar". Maybe he forgot to tell us the "Unless..." part? Are there exceptions?
So it's OK to pirate (Megauploader lolol) as long as "It's a community-made remake of a fucking 16-bit title" ?
Anyways, right, this is piracy on some level. It SEGAs IP. Unless Jim maybe I'm not understanding the Jim Sterling Piracy Guidelines, which reads something like "Piracy is no good for many reasons, and if you make any excuses then you're a liar". Maybe he forgot to tell us the "Unless..." part? Are there exceptions?
So it's OK to pirate (Megauploader lolol) as long as "It's a community-made remake of a fucking 16-bit title" ?
Mellotron: You're reading so much into this. I'm not sure that I said, anywhere at all, that it was okay. Also fairly certain that no exceptions have been made from my officially stated line of, "I don't judge you as a person for pirating, I merely ask that you don't make it sound noble and think of the potential negative impact."
Seems to me that joking about encouraging downloading this particular game falls within my guidelines. I think you've been watching one too many science fiction films if you see a darker conspiracy at play here.
Seems to me that joking about encouraging downloading this particular game falls within my guidelines. I think you've been watching one too many science fiction films if you see a darker conspiracy at play here.
Oh how I love the companies that come down on people who infringe on their IPs that neither make any money, nor have any plans to incorporate in the future.
For the future, keep stuff like this underground and leak it via anonymous sources, so the Big Bad won't come around again to take it, and once again sit on it for a few more decades.
For the future, keep stuff like this underground and leak it via anonymous sources, so the Big Bad won't come around again to take it, and once again sit on it for a few more decades.
So when you say that you don't judge people for Pirating Jim, your whole hissy fit about Crysis 2 should be cancelled on PC because of the leak was you being misunderstood yes?
@Jim Sterling:
I originally wrote a piece defending your side. The SORR guys had previously contacted Sega and followed Sega's instructions. You mentioned this yourself in your news posting. I wrote a paragraph wondering where Mellotron even got the idea of "piracy".
Then I reread the initial post, and the Megaupload part that you refer to as a joke is encouraging people to download a game that Sega has had pulled. You are not only mentioning Megaupload as an option, your joke is saying that the game is worth the search and download. You *are* telling people to download a title that has been pulled on request/order by Sega.
People responsible at the SORR forums have been trying to discourage the reuploading and spreading the game, and when the news thread turned to people promoting reuploading the game as a way to stick it to Sega, the thread was locked.
I originally wrote a piece defending your side. The SORR guys had previously contacted Sega and followed Sega's instructions. You mentioned this yourself in your news posting. I wrote a paragraph wondering where Mellotron even got the idea of "piracy".
Then I reread the initial post, and the Megaupload part that you refer to as a joke is encouraging people to download a game that Sega has had pulled. You are not only mentioning Megaupload as an option, your joke is saying that the game is worth the search and download. You *are* telling people to download a title that has been pulled on request/order by Sega.
People responsible at the SORR forums have been trying to discourage the reuploading and spreading the game, and when the news thread turned to people promoting reuploading the game as a way to stick it to Sega, the thread was locked.
@mellotron
GO FUCK YOUR FACE!!! Don't be such a Douche!
Piracy as applied to this case doesn't really apply. If anything it is a copyright infringement issue. These devs aren't releasing something that Sega made into the wild for free; thus depriving Sega loss of revenue off a game they(Sega) spent money and resources developing. Sega didn't give a shit about this decade old unused IP until these guys proved that there was a marketable interest. Do you honestly think Sega would have spent a dime developing this game without knowing that a real demand was present? Sega essentially allowed these guys to do all the hard work of a proof of concept and then stomped on their throats. These guys weren't even charging for this game, wtf Sega!
GO FUCK YOUR FACE!!! Don't be such a Douche!
Piracy as applied to this case doesn't really apply. If anything it is a copyright infringement issue. These devs aren't releasing something that Sega made into the wild for free; thus depriving Sega loss of revenue off a game they(Sega) spent money and resources developing. Sega didn't give a shit about this decade old unused IP until these guys proved that there was a marketable interest. Do you honestly think Sega would have spent a dime developing this game without knowing that a real demand was present? Sega essentially allowed these guys to do all the hard work of a proof of concept and then stomped on their throats. These guys weren't even charging for this game, wtf Sega!
Man I haven't even played this yet, but I *knew* something like this was gonna happen (it always does) so I downloaded it right away when I could. Yay!
Unfortunately Sega pretty much *has* to do this in order to protect the legal rights to their IP. I'm no law-talkin'-guy, but as I recall from discussions where this has happened in every single other instance of a fan remake being taken down, if Sega doesn't step in it means they essentially forfeit any protections that they have on the series.
It's some complex crap and I'm not explaining it well. It's all out there on the internets if you want to look it up.
It's some complex crap and I'm not explaining it well. It's all out there on the internets if you want to look it up.
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