Apart from that SO FUN!
Awesome review, I had a lot of good laughs at this line.....
"I'm old enough to remember when it was commonplace for videogames to include stuff like the entire Russian senate joining together to form a gigantic robotic centipede without any explanation. "
The hay day of gaming how I'll miss thee.
As I was playing through, near the beginning, I echoed your sentiments about the lack of a true co-op mode. But as I got further in the game (particularly the 'swordfight' boss), I realized a two-character co-op mode would have been nigh impossible to pull off. Too much going on on-screen at once, and not enough room for a second player to 'hide' from bullets.
Otherwise, awesome review!
But this is definitely on the long term list!
Among the enthusiast croud, this game was well known and loved, so reading your review kind of set my head spinning, as the enthusiast croud were really the only buyers the first time around, and it was pretty successful.
But now I'm showing my age . . .
This will sell well in Japan, and I know tons of other communities who will be touting this triumphantly. Your review seems a bit . . . uninformed. Not inaccurate, by any means. Just uninformed.
Also, I liked it better when bosses were referred to as Commanders. A little extra weirdness on top never hurts.
I actually did have the N64 version imported, but gave it away as a christmas gift to a friend waaay more into shmups and anime stuff that I was at the time. Glad it came to VC.
I didn't get around to playing the first Sin & Punishment until Jan of 2009, but it completely blew my mind when I did. When I choose my game of the year, I like to consider all the games I played that year, not just the ones released that year. Sin & Punishment was totally my 2009 GOTY. I'm excited to hear that the sequel lives up to its predecessor.
PS. Have I mentioned how cool it is that you're finally a regular in a Dtoid podcast? I always said to myself, Destructoid needs to have Tron sharing his wisdom in audio form ASAP! Now the day's finally here, and it's glorious.
I appriciate Treasure and Nintendo's efforts to make this game for the fans. Obviously, given how niche the genre is, no one is expecting this game to sell that well. I'm not sure what exactly would qualify for good sales as far as the near extinct bullet hell genre goes. There's no doubt in my mind that this game is going to unfortunately bomb. Still, I thank Treasure and Nintendo for offering this game to the few fans that love the genre and the franchise.
So far, I have beaten the game twice and plan on playing it death just as much as the original game.
After having beaten the game twice, I'll include my own thoughts on the game:
- Yes, the human character models look are creepy and ugly. Fortunately, the game's bosses and environments look great.
- Crappy story. It's vague, confusing, and forgettable. It also doesn't help that the dialogue and voice acting are about as generic as you can get. Fortunately, none of it has any signicant impact on enjoying the fast-paced, inventive, unpredictable, satisfying gameplay. Yes, the cut scenes are skippable.
- The Wii remote's IR pointer has proven its worth in the past and on more than one ocassion, but it has never been put up to the test that Sin & Punishment 2 demands. Thankfully, it passes with flying colors. The control scheme is intuitive and the IR pointer is fast and precise.
- In terms of controllers, the Wii remote's IR pointer works flawlessly with how fast and precise it is that it is. You'l find little reason to want to even try out dual analog (though the option is available).
- I see the game's short length as a good thing. It's long enough to provide a suffiecent amount of satisying content and features more boss battles than plenty of other longer games out there. It's just good to be able to commit to a short game with a sort of pick up and play style to it (despite how challenging it can be) that's great for multiplay playthroughs.
- The complaint of a lack of a true 2 player local co-op is stupid.
The game is already chaotic enough as it is (in a good way) with loads of enemies, giant bosses, and bullets flying everywhere. Now you want to throw in a second player? Did I mention that it can be hard enough to keep track of your character on screen in some areas of the game ? Quite frankly,Treasure went with the pratical solution by just having a 2nd player act as the reticule and not a fully playable character.
Good review, though. It truly is a 3D Bullet Hell. Would explain why I keep dying on normal. I'm no good at bullet hell games...
How did you feel about R-Type Final on PS2 (assuming you've played it).
It's probably my favorite shmup and the perfect example of a game not needing a long first-playthrough length to still be a great value.
It's one of only 10 PS2 games that I still own physical copies of.
If you're only going to judge a game based on its length, then you've missed out on a lot of great games.
What Sin & Punishment lacks in gameplay length, it makes up for with constant action and high replay value.
Honestly, the sequel doesn't have a stage that can compare to the wow factor of the original game's flying battleship stage. However, every stage is well designed and paced.Plus, there's more variety in the environmental levels.
Also, the last level with the people porking in the background is so classic. The creators of the R-type games have always thrown sexually provocative images in their games, but with that level, they finally just came out and said "Yeah, we're horny".
I love that.
So yeah, R-type Final rules, 9.0 or 9.5 for sure.
@ llort het- Your comment is wrong.
@ MowDownJoe- Obviously you haven't read Razak's awesome review of Flower, Sun, and Rain.
@ Hiltz- I actually really like the story to the game. The more I play it, the more it resonates with me. That said, it helps to turn on the Japanese voice acting.
@ Tristero- Daaaaw! Rye ruv ru too!
@ ICLHStudios- Most of the sequel is like that sequence in the original where you fly around on the telepathically levitated piece of metal and shoot strangers. Like I implied in the the review, it's pretty awesome.
@ Hiltz and DrRockso- I don't wish the game had "true" 2-player co-op, but I knowthat a lot of people will. That said, I don't think that giving us that option would have effected the game negatively, and if it did, you could just go back to one player.
Options are always good.
@ The-Excel- I don't think the game is too short, but again, other people will (see llort het)
@ SBC Slam- Weird. How does my review seem uninformed?
Also, the game came out in Japan last year, and didn't sell all that well (I think it sold about 40,000 total). That's better than MadWorld (4,000) but a lot less than a lot of other Wii games (Xenoblade, Taiko Drum Master, Resident Evil: Darkside Chronicles), and obviously way less than the Wii's bigger titles.
@ ekm29- If you can spam dodge in the later levels and still do well, then you must be awesome at the game. I tried that, hoping to get the game done for review more quickly, and I go my ass kicked.
It's not you, necessarily, it's me. I am a very old school enthusiast, and so I am blessed with memories of a community that, admittedly, not everyone was a part of. Magazines like Diehard Gamefan, GameGO, and websites like www.the-nextlevel.com (wherein I posted under the pseudonym Captain Vegetable) were the places we all got our info and shared our opinions, and we were all VERY into video games. Everyone owned a Saturn when they cost an arm and a leg, most of us had played/owned Rakugaki Showtime (I still own mine), Treasure and Cave were idolized.
Coupled with the fact that I have at least a decade on everyone who posts here at Dtoid, I have a very, and often radically different view of this here sub-culture in bygone days.
Sin & Punishment was all but required in that community, and as it was a joint production by Nintendo and Treasure, two of the most vaunted developers in the world (to us), it was always given its due. Wario World for the GameCube was the same, as both of those selfsame developers colaborated on that, too (which I cannot recomend enough; if you own a Wii, try to find a copy).
So, you see, Star Successor was all but expected by the likes of myself and the the-nextlevel.com community. Meaning that to read some of the things you said in your review, though accurate, wrung a bit "uninformed" to myself.
That's all. :-)
Now, seriously, go find Wario World. It's the tits.
As for uniformed, I think I get what you're saying. If I were writing this review for an import enthusiast and/or shmup site, I would have approached things differently.
Anyway, my sincere hope is that the import enthusiast and/or shmup fans that this game was localized don't pirate the game, but sadly, I'm guessing that's what's going to happen.
I understand that you were writing for your audience, and it's why I was very possessive of my opinion. I realize it really only applies to me, and so I hope I didn't seem out of line, or ungratful. It was just my 2 cents.
I will be buying the game, and I already own Deathsmiles. I hear what you're saying about the pirates, and I'd love to know who they are so's I can gobsmack the fuck out of 'em.
Enjoy your 4th!
I'll have to try switching over to the Japanese VO work then.
Anyway, I respect your opinions and continue to enjoy reading your reviews.
Thank you Jonathan Holmes for actually writing something about the narrative. I totally got into the retroness of it and how well it fit with sinning and punishing. Every other review I've read for this has glossed over the story by saying its just bizarre and you probably won't care anyway.
Well I care.
Besides, it'd get hard to dodge some of the later bullet formations if 2 players keep bumping into each other.
My guess is that Treasure didn't include dual-character co-op because it doesn't really fit with the game's plot, particularly the last stage. That, and they figured that the consequence-free 2P co-op would be more appealing to "the Wii crowd", which makes me sad.
Anyway, having any sort of co-op is better than what the original Sin and Punishment had, and other great 3D shmups like Panzer Dragoon Orta, so I can't complain.
Other people will though.

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