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It's always surprising how much gameplay and controls evolve and change over the generations. I've noticed for a while now that reviews of ports and remakes will comment on visuals and sound being upgraded, but now-clunky controls and gameplay are left untouched and end up cracking the rose-tinted glasses of nostalgia.
This has been the response to JSR across the board. I really hope it doesn't discourage Sega from releasing JSRF on Xbox Live.
It's not often I feel the need to criticize a review, but that was a terrible review.
I'm loving HD to death. It has some minor issues and annoyances, but no more than any other game released today. For the price it's more than worth it if you had even the slightest interest in the original.
The only real problem is that the port has some minor sound and textutre/tearing that the DC version didn't.
I'm loving HD to death. It has some minor issues and annoyances, but no more than any other game released today. For the price it's more than worth it if you had even the slightest interest in the original.
The only real problem is that the port has some minor sound and textutre/tearing that the DC version didn't.
Strange, because I didn't hear anything about the developers actually changing anything to such a great game; because nothing really needed changing apart from the camera (which got changed).
So it must be blasphemy that they didn't change a few things (that they didn't say they were going to change anyway) that are barely noticeable in gameplay.
'It may be a good game, but if it had been released for the first time today, many would see it as unfinished.' - uh, yeah, but it wasn't. it's clearly a re-release of an older game and is perfectly acceptable for what it is. Hell, you could say the same thing about any game from over 5 years ago, so what's the point you're trying to make here? That quality f products should not improve all over time and that we should stay in a constant stream of mediocre titles just so in 5 years time a game still seems 'finished'?
The main part of this is that it is a 're-release' (a word you use yourself in this review); you do realise it has a different meaning than 'remake', right?
In conclusion - What the hell are you giving this a 6.5 for?
So it must be blasphemy that they didn't change a few things (that they didn't say they were going to change anyway) that are barely noticeable in gameplay.
'It may be a good game, but if it had been released for the first time today, many would see it as unfinished.' - uh, yeah, but it wasn't. it's clearly a re-release of an older game and is perfectly acceptable for what it is. Hell, you could say the same thing about any game from over 5 years ago, so what's the point you're trying to make here? That quality f products should not improve all over time and that we should stay in a constant stream of mediocre titles just so in 5 years time a game still seems 'finished'?
The main part of this is that it is a 're-release' (a word you use yourself in this review); you do realise it has a different meaning than 'remake', right?
In conclusion - What the hell are you giving this a 6.5 for?
I still find it amusing that you guys would review HD ports but didn't bother to review the Xbox version of "The Witcher 2" :P
I always preferred JSRF. That game is a more fully realized version of this. Still, having this title will do fine by me. If the game only contains new visuals, that's A-Okay by me!
What this image represents;
The Window - What could have been a good review
Man smashing window - The Reviewer
Man in green - Me.
The Window - What could have been a good review
Man smashing window - The Reviewer
Man in green - Me.
D'oh. I always found JSR's controls too much to be worth bothering with. Loved Future though, was hoping this might nick the updated controls from that. Whoops.
Best just keep my fingers crossed for a JSRF port, then.
Best just keep my fingers crossed for a JSRF port, then.
I loved many Dreamcast games, but this was one game that never gave me that uki-uki-waku-waku feeling.
Ahem. Silent Hill HD Collection just dropped by to remind you that dicking with a game in the re-release is an "AWFUL FUCKING IDEA and you are retarded".
He's kinda mean that way.
He's kinda mean that way.
"I was hoping there would be some improved controls in this HD release"
Where in HD version does it mean they would fix the controls?
Do you honestly expect them to re-make the whole engine to "fix" the camera system that all the fans of the original expect?
"the fact that not much else was expanded upon is a bit upsetting"
I mean seriously what do you expect?
Do you expect Sega to completely remake the game and refine the controls to a new system, and balance up some of ratios in game-play?
You are looking to hard for a 2012 AAA downloadable release. Sega does not have the budget nor the fan basis to remake the first game.
HD version was only claiming to update the graphics for the new version; NOT FIX GAMEPLAY, NOT FIX THE CAMERA (WHICH REALLY WOULD BE A PAIN IN THE @$$ TO FIX) and WORRY ABOUT RATIOS.
I mean yeah this game is not amazing by today's standards, but it was made in 2001 where half of the programming did not exist.
You really leave me with the opinion that you think it was a sloppy port and could have used JSRF controls; " I was hoping there would be some improved controls in this HD release, as there were in the pseudo-sequel Jet Set Radio Future." but you forget how different those two games really are. Not to say that either is better, but I personally prefer the controls from JSR over JSRF.
Honestly I sort of wished you review was a bit more objective to the material as it was, not that it deserves 10 but 6.5 is a bit low for how ground breaking this game was. It seems to me that your only complaints were the controls and camera, in which the score should have been an 8 or 8.5.
Cause you got to hand it to Sega to not be like George Lucas and F*** the original up by constantly editing it even if it improves it. Because it is those flaws that make it the same game we played way back when.
Where in HD version does it mean they would fix the controls?
Do you honestly expect them to re-make the whole engine to "fix" the camera system that all the fans of the original expect?
"the fact that not much else was expanded upon is a bit upsetting"
I mean seriously what do you expect?
Do you expect Sega to completely remake the game and refine the controls to a new system, and balance up some of ratios in game-play?
You are looking to hard for a 2012 AAA downloadable release. Sega does not have the budget nor the fan basis to remake the first game.
HD version was only claiming to update the graphics for the new version; NOT FIX GAMEPLAY, NOT FIX THE CAMERA (WHICH REALLY WOULD BE A PAIN IN THE @$$ TO FIX) and WORRY ABOUT RATIOS.
I mean yeah this game is not amazing by today's standards, but it was made in 2001 where half of the programming did not exist.
You really leave me with the opinion that you think it was a sloppy port and could have used JSRF controls; " I was hoping there would be some improved controls in this HD release, as there were in the pseudo-sequel Jet Set Radio Future." but you forget how different those two games really are. Not to say that either is better, but I personally prefer the controls from JSR over JSRF.
Honestly I sort of wished you review was a bit more objective to the material as it was, not that it deserves 10 but 6.5 is a bit low for how ground breaking this game was. It seems to me that your only complaints were the controls and camera, in which the score should have been an 8 or 8.5.
Cause you got to hand it to Sega to not be like George Lucas and F*** the original up by constantly editing it even if it improves it. Because it is those flaws that make it the same game we played way back when.
Wait, please tell me that the camera has been fixed to the right analog stick. Playing it recently on Dreamcast, I think having the Tag/Camera button being the same hurt a lot of the gameplay in certain areas... If that was fixed, the HD version is a must buy for me.
This review reads like you were expecting them to remake the game from scratch instead of port it to HD consoles.
Don't get me wrong, JSR has its faults, but it sounds like you were expecting them to magically turn it into JSRF in the porting process.
It also has a "This game is too hard! I want easy games!" sound to it. JSR was always unforgiving. It was from before we started making sports games with "sticky" controls that fixed your mistakes for you. They're not going to change the core design of the game in a port.
I'll be getting this when the Vita version finally drops. (Though it should be cross-play/cross-buy) but I'm really hoping they port JSRF. As others have said it's a much more fully realized game and it's held up better with time since it does have those "sticky" mechanics that make it more forgiving.
Don't get me wrong, JSR has its faults, but it sounds like you were expecting them to magically turn it into JSRF in the porting process.
It also has a "This game is too hard! I want easy games!" sound to it. JSR was always unforgiving. It was from before we started making sports games with "sticky" controls that fixed your mistakes for you. They're not going to change the core design of the game in a port.
I'll be getting this when the Vita version finally drops. (Though it should be cross-play/cross-buy) but I'm really hoping they port JSRF. As others have said it's a much more fully realized game and it's held up better with time since it does have those "sticky" mechanics that make it more forgiving.
@Retro - The DMC HD collection 'fixed' the controls of the first DMC game, and thank fucking God for that.
Times change, what used to be perfectly fine might now be a noticeable hindrance. Some times notable hindrances turn a great game (8) into an alright one (6).
Times change, what used to be perfectly fine might now be a noticeable hindrance. Some times notable hindrances turn a great game (8) into an alright one (6).
The reactions to this review are going "Oh well." or "SOMEONE'S OPINION DOESN'T MATCH MINE? BURN THE WITCH!"
Just because the game was good on Dreamcast doesn't mean it will transition well to this generation of consoles. An HD re-release is a good opportunity to spruce up the game, and maybe fix some issues that were present in the original. Also, several years ago lots of you were young, and now you're looking from a nostalgia perspective, and not from a critical perspective.
That said, this review, nor any review, shouldn't keep you from enjoying the game. You're entitled to your own opinion, and the reviewer is entitled to theirs.
Also, sorry, but... "Where in HD version does it mean they would fix the controls?" This comment cracks me up, because it implies the controls are broken to begin with, yet it should be ignored because the game is a "classic".
Just because the game was good on Dreamcast doesn't mean it will transition well to this generation of consoles. An HD re-release is a good opportunity to spruce up the game, and maybe fix some issues that were present in the original. Also, several years ago lots of you were young, and now you're looking from a nostalgia perspective, and not from a critical perspective.
That said, this review, nor any review, shouldn't keep you from enjoying the game. You're entitled to your own opinion, and the reviewer is entitled to theirs.
Also, sorry, but... "Where in HD version does it mean they would fix the controls?" This comment cracks me up, because it implies the controls are broken to begin with, yet it should be ignored because the game is a "classic".
Man, I used to play this game for hours on my Dreamcast, I'm definitely getting it today(specially since I get a discount with PS +).
@Phil
"same issues I had with the original when it was released on Dreamcast, and I was hoping"
"released for the first time today, many would see it as unfinished"
I really didnt see any merit to a 6.5 based on what i've read, other than the reviewer was hoping for changes that didnt come in the final package. I dont seem to be the only one either, though perhaps I set the tone.
Thoughts?
"same issues I had with the original when it was released on Dreamcast, and I was hoping"
"released for the first time today, many would see it as unfinished"
I really didnt see any merit to a 6.5 based on what i've read, other than the reviewer was hoping for changes that didnt come in the final package. I dont seem to be the only one either, though perhaps I set the tone.
Thoughts?
I have not heard of this reviewer before, and to be honest this is probably one of the worst reviews I have read on this site.
The reviewer had so many preconceptions on updates that they wanted in the game, and was not happy to find that Sega was being true to the original material and only updating the city textures. (because cell shaded models do not need updated when upscale)
I just really do not understand why the reviewer would get that the "HD" version would be very different from the original.
Typically when companies want to change and remake a game with updated controls and visuals, they call it "remix" "rebirth", or even "neon".
"HD" in this tablet age means the exact same game but with better textures, Like Grand Theft Auto: Chinatown Wars HD.
The same game, but with better textures.
So I really cannot understand how the reviewer in this age would assume that they would update the controls.
But to give them the benefit of the doubt I went to Sega's site to get their description of what the game offers.
"Tag, grind, and trick to the beat in SEGAs hit game Jet Set Radio!
Fight for control of Tokyo-to, mark your turf with graffiti, tag walls, billboards, and even rival gang members! Perform tricks and flips on magnetically driven in-line skates, but watch out for the local police force!
Heritage Collection treatment:
Coming to PlaystationŽNetwork/Xbox LIVE Arcade/PC Digital Download, Jet Set Radio is part of Segas Heritage Collection series and now features lush HD visuals, developer interviews, and amazing fan-created graffiti.
Classic Beats:
Skate to the funky tunes of Pirate Radio! Jet Set Radio still features 29 of 30 tracks from the original Dreamcast release
Express Yourself:
Choose from a massive catalog of classic and new graffiti or create your own and use it to tag walls, billboards, cars, and even rival gang members!
The gangs all here:
Recruit more than 10 playable characters to your gang, each with their own unique graffiti!"
So you do not have to be smart to notice that no where Sega was advertising that they have updated the controls/game-play, so why would you expect them to change it??? In fact it is listed in the "Heritage Collection"
Now I figure the reviewer is a cool guy, but I feel like he had it out for this game. He did not even mention that the game includes an interview from the developers. I do not know if he just skipped it out of rage, but he forgot to review a big feature of the game.
This is the original Star wars for better or worse its flaws is what makes it what it is. I would rather have the same experiences than get a digitally remastered edition that changes the way it feels.
You would have to change a lot of this game to make it control like JSRF they would have to go through and re-map EVERYTHING basically build the game from the ground up, and if you are already doing that you might as well make a new engine... and soon the costs would be to high just for a game that did not have a huge audience.
It also seems like this is a Blue-ray release of a film made in the 90's. It is going to be a straight port, they might adjust the sound for surround sound and loss-less codex but they are not going to re-edit the original film and release it as the theatrical release.
So it saddens me that a reviewer on THIS site gave this game a low score cause they did not change everything. (I know he did not say everything, but for what he is asking for it would require it)
The reviewer had so many preconceptions on updates that they wanted in the game, and was not happy to find that Sega was being true to the original material and only updating the city textures. (because cell shaded models do not need updated when upscale)
I just really do not understand why the reviewer would get that the "HD" version would be very different from the original.
Typically when companies want to change and remake a game with updated controls and visuals, they call it "remix" "rebirth", or even "neon".
"HD" in this tablet age means the exact same game but with better textures, Like Grand Theft Auto: Chinatown Wars HD.
The same game, but with better textures.
So I really cannot understand how the reviewer in this age would assume that they would update the controls.
But to give them the benefit of the doubt I went to Sega's site to get their description of what the game offers.
"Tag, grind, and trick to the beat in SEGAs hit game Jet Set Radio!
Fight for control of Tokyo-to, mark your turf with graffiti, tag walls, billboards, and even rival gang members! Perform tricks and flips on magnetically driven in-line skates, but watch out for the local police force!
Heritage Collection treatment:
Coming to PlaystationŽNetwork/Xbox LIVE Arcade/PC Digital Download, Jet Set Radio is part of Segas Heritage Collection series and now features lush HD visuals, developer interviews, and amazing fan-created graffiti.
Classic Beats:
Skate to the funky tunes of Pirate Radio! Jet Set Radio still features 29 of 30 tracks from the original Dreamcast release
Express Yourself:
Choose from a massive catalog of classic and new graffiti or create your own and use it to tag walls, billboards, cars, and even rival gang members!
The gangs all here:
Recruit more than 10 playable characters to your gang, each with their own unique graffiti!"
So you do not have to be smart to notice that no where Sega was advertising that they have updated the controls/game-play, so why would you expect them to change it??? In fact it is listed in the "Heritage Collection"
Now I figure the reviewer is a cool guy, but I feel like he had it out for this game. He did not even mention that the game includes an interview from the developers. I do not know if he just skipped it out of rage, but he forgot to review a big feature of the game.
This is the original Star wars for better or worse its flaws is what makes it what it is. I would rather have the same experiences than get a digitally remastered edition that changes the way it feels.
You would have to change a lot of this game to make it control like JSRF they would have to go through and re-map EVERYTHING basically build the game from the ground up, and if you are already doing that you might as well make a new engine... and soon the costs would be to high just for a game that did not have a huge audience.
It also seems like this is a Blue-ray release of a film made in the 90's. It is going to be a straight port, they might adjust the sound for surround sound and loss-less codex but they are not going to re-edit the original film and release it as the theatrical release.
So it saddens me that a reviewer on THIS site gave this game a low score cause they did not change everything. (I know he did not say everything, but for what he is asking for it would require it)
If he didn't like it, he didn't like it. Ease off people! If you think the game's still great, then enjoy it. Some people just really notice the degradation of some games more than others.
Although, I recently played JSRF, and that game still holds up really well compared to JSR. I prefer the high speeds, and platforming than tagging and avoiding police.
Although, I recently played JSRF, and that game still holds up really well compared to JSR. I prefer the high speeds, and platforming than tagging and avoiding police.
@Raby: Yes:
While the techniques are simplistic in their execution -- your skates magnetically attach to any grindable object -- you'll find yourself fighting with the camera and clunky movement controls, just as you did with the original. The skaters all perform like bricks on wheels -- not much tight handling -- while the tagging motions are hit or miss in their responsiveness.
The analog controls are actually not as responsive as one would want, which is made all the more difficult when trying to tag while being bombarded by tear gas and gunfire.
While minor camera control is now mapped to the right analog stick, there are still prevalent clipping issues, and the presentation tends to block visuals at the most inopportune times.
As the game cuts away to watch the cops frustratingly stomp their feet as you make a daring leap away, you remain in motion, so by the time the view cuts back to you, you have to quickly orientate your character so you don't fall or get caught just as you escape. This is only exacerbated by the lengthy fall or trip animations as you helplessly tumble from heights.
To me, those are giving valid reasons for his score. remember also, a 6.5 means:
Alright: 6s may be slightly above average, or simply inoffensive. Fans of this genre will still thoroughly enjoy them, but a fair few will be left unfulfilled.
While the techniques are simplistic in their execution -- your skates magnetically attach to any grindable object -- you'll find yourself fighting with the camera and clunky movement controls, just as you did with the original. The skaters all perform like bricks on wheels -- not much tight handling -- while the tagging motions are hit or miss in their responsiveness.
The analog controls are actually not as responsive as one would want, which is made all the more difficult when trying to tag while being bombarded by tear gas and gunfire.
While minor camera control is now mapped to the right analog stick, there are still prevalent clipping issues, and the presentation tends to block visuals at the most inopportune times.
As the game cuts away to watch the cops frustratingly stomp their feet as you make a daring leap away, you remain in motion, so by the time the view cuts back to you, you have to quickly orientate your character so you don't fall or get caught just as you escape. This is only exacerbated by the lengthy fall or trip animations as you helplessly tumble from heights.
To me, those are giving valid reasons for his score. remember also, a 6.5 means:
Alright: 6s may be slightly above average, or simply inoffensive. Fans of this genre will still thoroughly enjoy them, but a fair few will be left unfulfilled.
I agree with this. I loved jet set radio on the dreamcast but after playing this I forgot how fucking frustrating it is. It's only fun about 25% of the time. The rest is me getting pissed at the shitty controls. Even with the improved camera the game plays like shit. Lots of people are going to be surprised at how poorly this game holds up.
Also, for the record, I'm not agreeing with this review. I'm just saying I felt he justified the score he gave. Buying this shit TONIGHT. WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.
Now, hopefully we get Future too.
Now, hopefully we get Future too.
@Arttemis
I know you like to point out the obvious, but in this case you need to do more re-search.
DMC was developed for the PS2, a system that is easily trans-coded and ported to other systems. It would have taken them little to no effort to change the controls for the first game.
The Sega Dreamcast used GD-roms a B*** to code and trans-code, that is why when sonic adventure 1&2 were ported to GC and PS2 xbox Sega had to rebuild the whole game in an engine that would work on those systems. Not to mention that JSR never had the attention/budget that DMC ever had.
Changing the controls in JSR means re-maping the world as it would make skilled tricks insanely easy. They would have to move a crap ton of object as everything is perfectly spaced as it is.
This game's reviews back in the day were 10s not 8.
I know you like to point out the obvious, but in this case you need to do more re-search.
DMC was developed for the PS2, a system that is easily trans-coded and ported to other systems. It would have taken them little to no effort to change the controls for the first game.
The Sega Dreamcast used GD-roms a B*** to code and trans-code, that is why when sonic adventure 1&2 were ported to GC and PS2 xbox Sega had to rebuild the whole game in an engine that would work on those systems. Not to mention that JSR never had the attention/budget that DMC ever had.
Changing the controls in JSR means re-maping the world as it would make skilled tricks insanely easy. They would have to move a crap ton of object as everything is perfectly spaced as it is.
This game's reviews back in the day were 10s not 8.
@PhilK3nS3bb3n
This was an obvious reach to people that wanted a version to play on their HD TVs.
Why the hell would he expect more than just a Texture update?
He was even talking about them adding new content. Which is a nice idea, but that should be saved for a new game in general.
This was an obvious reach to people that wanted a version to play on their HD TVs.
Why the hell would he expect more than just a Texture update?
He was even talking about them adding new content. Which is a nice idea, but that should be saved for a new game in general.
Ha. I loved JGR too guys, but seriously... it does not hold up well. I knew this one a few months ago when I got it and a Dreamcast again. That you guys are blinded by nostalgia (and believe me, I'm buying the Vita version of this) doesn't change that this review is quite valid.
Shitty review. HD collections are meant to update the graphics. That's why they're called <b>HD</b> collections. Not complete game overhauls.
@Retro: I'm not his defense force. Just said, I understand why he scored it the way he did. Then provided examples as to why, I thought that. I don't agree with the review at all and think the new content/rebuild ideas are ignorant. See above comment for how I feel on jsr and the review.
Game's still fantastic after all these years.
Although, i'm experiencing data corruption and freezing problems frequently. Anyone else having this problem?
Although, i'm experiencing data corruption and freezing problems frequently. Anyone else having this problem?
I never was big on this game back in the day. I'll definitely buy it when there's a Sega sale on the marketplace though.
Sounds like its the same game with better graphics. Fine with me, its my all time favorite game. I guess a new area or new characters would be cool, but gonna buy it day one on the PC.
It's all good Retro. I respect you too and love seeing someone get passionate about a game they love.
@Law: How about you shut your whore mouth? Huh? ;)
@Law: How about you shut your whore mouth? Huh? ;)
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