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Review: Battlefield Heroes

2:00 PM on 06.27.2009   |   Anthony Burch

Review: Battlefield Heroes photo

Is it just me, or did Battlefield Heroes' release yesterday come seemingly out of nowhere? A few months ago, I couldn't turn around without seeing an interview or a news story about the open beta. Then, nothing. Then, with almost no fanfare or immediate pre-release hype, it spontaneously becomes available for free download.

In case you haven't been following it, Heroes is a fully featured cross between classic Battlefield 1942 gameplay (complete with control points, planes, and Nazis) and the free-to-play, microtransaction-based structure of  titles such as Maple Story. You can download the entire game for free from the official site, but you'll have to shell out a few dollars if you want your character to look more distinctive than the other grunts running around in Heroes' zany, cartoonish version of World War II. 

But does it work? Does the free-to-play structure and emphasis on persistent, RPG-like character building work harmoniously with the original Battlefield gameplay? 

Hit the jump for my personal answers to those questions.

Battlefield Heroes (PC)
Developer: EA Digital Illusions CE

Publisher: EA
Released: June 25, 2009
MSRP: $0.00 (optional clothing, expressions, and XP widgets can be bought via microtransactions)

Battlefield Heroes is based on an awfully compelling concept: it seeks to merge the grindy, microtransaction-driven addictiveness of games like Maple Story with the considerably deeper and faster-paced action provided by the Battlefield franchise. 

Unfortunately, it doesn't work as well as it could.

My first hour or so with Heroes was a bizarrely pleasant one: upon seeing the numerous character customization options and skill trees, I experienced a mixture of fear and attraction. My mind was filled with conflicting emotions -- "oh God, I hope I don't get addicted to this and spend the next three weeks building my character" and "oh man, I can't wait to get addicted to this and spend the next three weeks building a sweet-ass character." There were emotes and clothing available for purchase with "Battlefunds" (the Heroes equivalent of Microsoft Points that must be bought with actual Earth currency), and new weapons buyable with the free Valor Points players earn by doing well in combat.

The numerous abilities available for the three classes, each with the capacity to be upgraded five times, implied a depth of gameplay that would keep me enthralled for weeks. The temporary nature of the buyable items (health recharges have to be purchased, all weapons last less than a month, and all cosmetic items last a month unless you pay three times their initial price to permanently own them) suggested I would need to keep coming back to it over the next few months. The classic Battlefield gameplay revolving around capturing control points and depleting the opposing team's respawn tickets seemed warm, inviting. An hour after first booting up Heroes, I was fully prepared to devote a hefty chunk of time to plumbing its depths.

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My first character, a Commando (basically a cross between a sniper and a spy), was pretty satisfying. Characters earn Valor Points and experience points by dealing damage or capturing flags, which results in a feeling of constant reward. Did you shoot a guy once in the leg, only to have him turn around and annihilate you with five shotgun blasts? Don't sweat it -- you still got some XP and cash. Even though I sucked for the first ten minutes of my first game, I still felt like I was constantly building my character and reaping rewards from my own ineptitude. In a few minutes, I had enough Valor Points to try out two new weapons, each far more useful than my default guns. I felt progressively more powerful with every new ability I earned. Things were good.

Four hours and two new characters later, the picture was less rosy. 

It takes a while for Heroes' flaws to make themselves apparent, but they're impossible to ignore once they do. Even though there are only three classes, for instance, the Commandos still feel irritatingly overpowered. Their sniper rifles do incredible damage, they can remain permanently invisible to anyone more than a few feet away from them, and they seem to move faster than the other two classes.

Or what about the fact that you cannot switch teams or classes during a game? When creating a character, whatever faction and character class you choose for him are his for life. Initially, this makes sense: the beauty of RPG-esque character building is that for all the experience points and ability points and cash you sink into the guy, he's yours. That character is a permanent symbol of all the time you put into the game; he's a walking testament to your efforts. But in a multiplayer combat game, it's not enough to just enter a server with a fixed character and assume things will be all right.

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What if you find that your entire team is made up of Soldiers, but you need some Commandos to take out a guard post? In any other game, you'd simply switch classes, take the guard post yourself, and switch back. Or, what if one team is slaughtering the other team simply because they've got better players? In a regular multiplayer shooter, the teams would automatically rebalance in order to make things fair.  In Heroes, you're locked into the same team configurations no matter what, unless a huge number of people leave and are replaced by new people. This almost entirely reduces any possibility for cooperative, strategic gameplay, especially when you consider the fact that a lot of players seem like they're just out to get as many XP and Valor Points as they can, the rest of the team be damned.

The game constantly struggles with satisfying both the needs of a persistent, stat-based RPG and those of a compelling multiplayer shooter without ever combining them into a coheisve whole. For instance, players take a metric asston of damage before dying, because that way you can score lots of experience and valor points by blasting away at them. After a few hours of play, however, the seeming ineffectiveness of every machine gun or explosive begins to get frustrating and tedious. I threw three grenades at a Gunner, then shot him four times with a shotgun, and watched in furious horror as he killed me with less than ten HP left.

There are planes, because this is a Battlefield game, but all the control points are surrounded by buildings or trees (perhaps to force players in close proximity to one another so they can pick away at one another with close range weaponry and get a ton of points), thus making the planes effectively useless except as a means of transportation.

There are only three maps with more presumably on the way in order to keep players coming back on a quasiregular basis, constantly eyeing the new gestures and clothing items in the shop, forever tempted to open their wallets and engage the microtransaction model head-on. But these maps become downright boring after a few hours of play, and even the satisfying XP system and legitimately interesting abilities (like a Soldier powerup which makes your SMG fire incendiary rounds for a limited time, or a Gunner perk that allows you to eat all nearby explosives and convert them into health) can't save the core gameplay from degenerating into unfortunate tedium after you've experimented with each class and their different weapons. 

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On a slightly different note, I want to discuss one aspect of Heroes' microtransaction system.There's some legitimate concern to be had over the game's buyable XP "widgets" that, for a few real-life dollars, will double the amount of XP or Valor Points you get while playing for a certain period of time. One could rightfully claim that such an item rewards those players with deep pockets over those who rely on personal skill. As it turns out, however, it never really felt like an issue to me. I felt very little compulsion to keep playing the game after sufficiently experimenting with all three characters, and I subsequently just didn't have time to get frustrated that some dude was earning twice as much XP as I was just because he plopped down a few extra bucks. The game gets dull far beforesuch larger questions of paying money for character power have the chance to become relevant.

However, the game's replayability may definitely become more of an issue as time goes on. When newer, cooler weapons and items start popping up in the shop, and more varied maps become available, perhaps the cash-for-levels system will become a legitimate issue. This will also mean, however, that the actual act of playing the game will become a much more varied, enjoyable, and longterm experience than it currently is -- a fair trade, perhaps.

Opinions are divided on Battlefield Heroes' revenue format, but I was honestly hoping the whole microtransaction structure would work to its favor. An ideal version of Heroes would be as consistently addictive and intrinsically satisfying as a mindless grindfest like Maple Story, while still providing actual depth and intelligence provided by its essential FPS gameplay. As it stands, however, the game we've been presented with works against itself more often than it does not. Perhaps the inevitable flood of subsequent map, weapon and shop updates will provide more depth and replayability, but the I also fear the design may possess some intrinsic contradictions that no patch can fix. Battlefield Heroes is a highly recommended download if only because it is both free and a total blast for the first few hours, but you might be surprised at just how quick and easy it is to fall out of love with it.

Score: 4.0

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56 comments | showing # 1 to 50
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Amaru's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 14:04
Amaru
Played the beta; it sucked.
Zantetsuken's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 14:05
Zantetsuken
I hate the idea of microtransactions, I dread to think where it would lead the gaming industry.
unreal999's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 14:09
unreal999
is this suppose to be 4/10? If so I really don't understand why, because it's one of the most fun free game I have played in a VERY long time.
Aurain's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 14:09
Aurain
The things you posted in the comment when you hove over the pictures were interesting, but the bubble doesn't stay up long enough for you to read and appreciate them.

Nice enough review, Not going to try the game.
Looks too much like TF2, and I despise that Memetic piece of shit.
Jordan Devore's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 14:10
Jordan Devore
I agree for the most part. Worth checking out, but it gets old pretty fast.
neveranything's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 14:15
neveranything
The argument you made about balance is the same that's made with any PvP structure in an MMORPG. I'll use the PvP Battlegrounds in World of Warcraft as a shining example. Unless you plan out an entire group to play the BG with, you're stuck with whatever random group of people queuued up for it, meaning you could end up with a group of lower armored mages against they're worst enemy, a bunch of high DPS rogues who are known for sneaking up and tearing a mage to shreds in a matter of seconds.

You can balance out the classes all you want, but at the end of the day each class is going to end up being weak against another. The only way to really balance a game of class based PvP would be to have specific numbers of each class per match, which means potentially longer queue times.
Insd's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 14:20
Insd
The reason for not switching teams or classes, is the upcoming meta game. Commando's have the lowest health, and can be un-cloaked by enemy commando's with a skill.

On a different note, I'm disappointed in most of dtoiders. Many of you have simple and over aggressive minds. I think it's time to move on.
PhazonYoshi's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 14:24
PhazonYoshi
4? Four? Forty Percent?

Well, crap, I was looking forward to this game. How could free battlefield possibly go wrong?

Ah well, all the issues you posted are solvable, so hopefully the dev cycle hasn't ended yet, and nor should it with this sort of structure. Constant dev keeps people coming back.
UglyDuck's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 14:25
UglyDuck
A ton of ass - an asston, would be an imperial asston. A metric version would be an asstonne.



...no, there's really no way to redeem myself after that comment.
Sharpless's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 14:26
Sharpless
Harsh score. Would've gone with a six, myself. If I had a better computer, I'd probably play it more. Needs more variety and more kick.
Zantetsuken's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 14:29
Zantetsuken
And I, lnsd, am disappointed in your grammar.

EN GARDE
GoldenGamerXero's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 14:30
GoldenGamerXero
Before more people are swayed by the low score he said himself that playing for the first couple of hours is quite an enjoyable experience. Considering this is free you could do a hell of alot worse. It's worth every penny =)
Vedicardi2's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 14:41
Vedicardi2
I'd say 4.5 =w=
Swizzler121's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 14:48
Swizzler121
the one thing that ruined this game is punkbuster. punkbuster is almost as broken and horrible as SecurROM. when I tried the game it would instantly boot me even though I had all the proper firewall ports open and was running the browser, game, and punkbuster in admin mode. bottom line is punkbuster is a steaming pile of crap, and sticking a nice game in a pile of crap doesn't fix the problem.
DaedHead8's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 14:48
DaedHead8
I agree with this review completely. Good job Rev.
Swizzler121's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 14:54
Swizzler121
the one thing that ruined this game is punkbuster. punkbuster is almost as broken and horrible as SecurROM. when I tried the game it would instantly boot me even though I had all the proper firewall ports open and was running the browser, game, and punkbuster in admin mode. bottom line is punkbuster is a steaming pile of crap, and sticking a nice game in a pile of crap doesn't fix the problem.
wardrox's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 15:08
wardrox
I found it to be about right for the price I played.
Blackhat's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 15:09
Blackhat
Does it still not allow inverted mouse controls? Because that was great in the beta.

Then again, the second I realised I'd been shooting the same guy for 2 minutes, who didn't seem to notice, pretty much ensured I'd never touch the game again.

Good to see it's still the same after the beta.
unknown user's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 15:12
unknown user
i love this game... played in beta too, dont understand your strange rating...
AgentMOO's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 15:15
AgentMOO
It looks like they got the TF2 formula completely wrong. They have the art style, but the multitude of class choices and free content made the game.
Onlineatron's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 15:18
Onlineatron
If this had scored 9.0 would the rating been 'Buy it'?

I don't dare to argue with the great one (anthony) as his superior intellect will pummel me into a pulp. But is it really necessary to review a free game?
Anthony Burch's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 15:20
Anthony Burch
I was extremely nervous about reviewing this given not only that it's free, but because so much of its longterm value is inherently tied to the inevitable stream of updates and shop additions and all that other shit.

Jim told me to stop being a pussy and review it, though, so I did.
Zantetsuken's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 15:24
Zantetsuken
Well Anthony, you were honest about it.


People will get this regardless of any review simply because its free to play.
Onlineatron's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 15:30
Onlineatron
=D Got a laugh outta that last sentence.
DV2FOX's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 15:35
DV2FOX
i hate the game,...main reason: FIREFOX EXPLORER ONLY...not via windows like all the games...Dr.NOOOOOO....EA/BF Team KILLED THIS GAME...but yea,also SUCKED
CWal37's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 15:40
CWal37
I could never understand why my friend would play this over TF2. I convinced him to buy TF2, and the next day he got into the Heroes beta. I had been in it for months and told him he'd get bored. He's been playing it for nearly three months now and hasn't touched TF2. I think there's something wrong with him.
Davram's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 15:45
Davram
Yes but, I could never fall out of love with YOU, Anthony. /swoon
Exquisitor's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 15:58
Exquisitor
The lack of depth is what killed it for me. In BF1942, you got better as a player the longer you played, and teamwork actually determined whether you won or lost. BF:H? Not so much so.
Infininja's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 16:07
Infininja
I downloaded it. I was immediately annoyed that in addition to having an EA account (which I already had) I needed a username, and then on top of that, after clicking "Play Now" I was booted out of the game and told I needed a character name. I had a limited number of character slots and didn't really know anything about the different classes, so I just went for the red commando class on a whim. I found a German name website and started scrolling down the list.

The first name I entered greeted me with a "Character Created!" screen and right below that a nondescript error about my name of choice. I went through about 15 more names receiving the same error, and even a couple first and last name combos that at least had the courtesy to remind me names must be alphanumeric (no spaces, and thus no first and last names). I can only assume names must be unique and my choices were already taken.

I finally entered "Comeonletmeplay" or something of the sort and it was accepted. Having never played Battlefield before I hopped into the tutorial. Pretty basic. Half the button commands it told me to do stuff did not appear on my screen ("Press to enter a vehicle."). Helpful. I finished the tutorial (after realizing I can't fly planes with a keyboard and mouse) and decided it was time to join a game. I made it into one match that I was booted from before even loading the level. Every other time I was told a match could not be found. My options were to try again, pick a new character, or create a new character. I can only assume the last two options existed because my team's side was full. ??? I don't have any desire to try again.
Los255's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 16:25
Los255
TF2 >This game
MarginalMeaning's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 16:39
MarginalMeaning
I have to agree on the ability to change classes, or at least change equipment. I found it kind of annoying that on a map with tanks, my gunner has a bazooka, but did not have it equipped, but you can't change any equipment unless you actually exit the game and change it in the menu (and that means actually quitting the game). I also noticed that when I was playing that every few minutes or so it would just freeze for like 5-10 seconds, and of course I would be dead after that freeze. A little frustrating to say the least.

Oh well it just came out and it's free, I'll probably stick with it to see if it gets better. It's definitely one of the better free to play games out there.
Onlineatron's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 16:54
Onlineatron
@DV2FOX

Huh?
I was playing on my explorer browser yesterday. You have to set Explorer as your default browser (Internet options > Programes > Make Default).

Simples.
Droll's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 17:22
Droll
I strongly disagree with scoring a game that is free. A review, as a source of information could be useful to a consumer. But to score a free game? Isn't it easier to just tell the player to download it and see for themselves? If the product is free, than the consumer SHOULD be checking out the product. The whole port of scoring a game is to provide a short hand means of quality for a potential player, a means of helping them spend their money on good products. With a free game, though, what is the value of a score? It's free.

Despite my qualms, the most interesting part of the review is the notion that the RPG mindsets of grinding xp and getting loot are not at all compatible with the cooperation requirements of the team based shooter. Isn't it interesting that these adopted play styles, molded and shaped by our own gaming experiences, would result in a game where the player's expectations and own personal goals are seemingly in conflict with the game itself? It goes to show how powerful the "training process" is in games. Heroes seems to be a game with different players seeing completely different games.
Johnny Justice's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 17:29
Johnny Justice
I share the same qualms but I somehow find myself enjoying it more.

But the way, there have actually been four maps since before it when open beta, not two.
Timmeh's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 17:30
Timmeh
@Droll

If a game is a piece of shit, people may not want to waste the bandwidth and time downloading it. The review (that thing above the score) and the 4/10 suggest that installation would be swiftly followed by removal, resulting in an all around waste of time.
Chris Carter's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 17:59
Chris Carter
@Droll
I see what you're saying, but if people downloaded every single free game ever made, we'd be busy 24/7 for months on end. When someone gives Cave Story a 10/10, and BF: Heroes a 4/10, it means "check out Cave Story, and only the biggest shooter fans will like BF: Heroes".
WastelandTraveler's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 18:45
WastelandTraveler
I personally found this game quite enjoying, I played in the beta for the longest time but I have not played the open release yet.. but are you serious? only two maps in this version? Man in the beta we had like 5.. I'm surprised they didn't include those in the public release.

And as for the commandos being over powered, it all depends on who you are going up against, if you are a high level commando going against a low level soldier you are going to destroy them, however if that soldier has created their character right, and got the types of perks to counter commandos, then the stealth will mean nothing to a well trained player. In beta I came across many many people playing other classes that became a challenge for me to fight against as a commando simply because of the skills they were using against me.

Why no mention of the mission system?.. like the missions you can run through.. which can pretty much eliminate the thought of micro transactions for players that just want to play the game and don't care for personal aesthetic, because the missions will give you a mountain of XP & Valor Points for your perks so you could easily match up with anyone who purchased them via micro transaction.

And the whole team balance issue, even if the teams were even, and one side had nothing but good players and the other side had shitty players.. no game really balances past the point of having even numbers.. so if one team is better than the other that's just the way of the game.. get better at it. My friends and I in the beta would team up with each other, join a server and talk on ventrilo so we could work our way in controlling the maps in BF Heroes, and it worked very well for us, it was really no different than the coop experience that bf1942 gave us.

Now sure you are locked to one side, given the character you use to keep that rpg feel and I can understand not being able to switch teams may suck but that's the intention of the game. You go into any rpg style game where you play with other people, you usually get your friends to join one specific side so you guys can work together in the game. Its really just the same approach with this game.. you get a friend into the game, have him choose the side you are on, you join a server and help him gain experience by playing with you.

The game really is not all that bad, sure it has some imperfections at the moment, but considering its free I can let that slide. It's definitely a game like other rpg-shooters, that requires more than just a few hours of play to get to know and understand, it took me a week or so before I really got into the swing of the game and started to understand how each class worked and what their abilities were. In terms of it being fun, well that's up to each person.. if you enjoyed the crazy shenanigans of 1942, and like the approach cod4 took with the perk system, you may like bfheroes. If that isn't your style of play.. you probably wont get into all that much.
Wedge's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 18:48
Wedge
Oh and then there is the fact the gameplay is a dumbed down borish piece of rubbish made for ten year olds.

Really it's quite bad, it feels more like an RPG with light shooter elements than a proper shooting game. The characters are slow and floaty, you have weapons and "spells" on a skill timer, and weapons lack any real impact, just draining someone's HP until one person dies.

Oh and the sound effects. Good god the sound effects...

Also there are no valid comparisons to TF2 to be made with this game at all. Not in the slightest.
Anthony Burch's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 19:56
Anthony Burch
dyslixec:
"Why no mention of the mission system?.. like the missions you can run through.. which can pretty much eliminate the thought of micro transactions for players that just want to play the game and don't care for personal aesthetic, because the missions will give you a mountain of XP & Valor Points for your perks so you could easily match up with anyone who purchased them via micro transaction."

Really? The missions I got primarily gave me less than 200 valor points at a time, which became kinda pointless once I reached my max 999 VP and had already bought all the weapons I needed.
madman0017's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 20:18
madman0017
Honestly, the game felt sloppy as hell to me. That's why i deleted the beta. It's just not fun at all to me.
Droll's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 20:27
Droll
I strongly disagree with scoring a game that is free. A review, as a source of information could be useful to a consumer. But to score a free game? Isn't it easier to just tell the player to download it and see for themselves? If the product is free, than the consumer SHOULD be checking out the product. The whole port of scoring a game is to provide a short hand means of quality for a potential player, a means of helping them spend their money on good products. With a free game, though, what is the value of a score? It's free.

Despite my qualms, the most interesting part of the review is the notion that the RPG mindsets of grinding xp and getting loot are not at all compatible with the cooperation requirements of the team based shooter. Isn't it interesting that these adopted play styles, molded and shaped by our own gaming experiences, would result in a game where the player's expectations and own personal goals are seemingly in conflict with the game itself? It goes to show how powerful the "training process" is in games. Heroes seems to be a game with different players seeing completely different games.
Caffeine Knight's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 20:27
Caffeine Knight
I expected a free to play game to have some pretty serious issues, seeing as you don't have to pay anything. I only have one question:

For a money grubbing jew (AKA, completely broke) like me who will absolutely take no part in any micro-transaction whatsoever, is it worth playing? Will I feel seriously handicapped (Not gameplay-wise) or will I still have a good time?
WastelandTraveler's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 20:31
WastelandTraveler
The first serveral or so missions don't give as much, but the more you do the higher the rewards become tho sometimes it will vary. But yeah they do help out a lot in the long run. I remember when I first went through the game and only did about 5 or 6 missions and didn't think much of them, but when I started doing more and more, I started to rank up my VP and XP with the mission rewards that it pushed me far enough to purchase my perks & weapons for my character. I didn't play that much, maybe only an hour or two every couple of days so it really helped me out getting on top with some of the other big guns that played it every day.

But this again was back in the closed beta, I'm not sure if they changed the xp count & vp count gained by the missions at all from when I last played. I was going to check it out in a few to see what else they changed.
Anthony Burch's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 21:07
Anthony Burch
Caffeine Knight:
I haven't spent any cash on it and probably won't in the forseeable future, but I'm still enjoying aspects of it. I mean, hypothetically I might have more fun if my character was wearing a Jack Harkness overcoat rather than the default attire, but it's not a huge deal.

dyslixec:
Aha. Well, I really hope they release some new, more expensive weapons to justify those missions, because as it stands I've got like 1200 VP and nothing to spend it on.
IceMax's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 21:45
IceMax
I thought there was 4 maps? There were 3 in the beta, then they just added a new one right before the game launched
Monodi's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 23:17
Monodi
Aww it was looking so awesome
Darren Nakamura's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/27/2009 23:52
Darren Nakamura
I'll probably download it and pay zero for more stuff.
greks224's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/28/2009 00:49
greks224
Taking your advice and downloading now.
Gavin's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/28/2009 03:53
Gavin
Tried it today and liked it for what it is: A FREE and CASUAL online shooter with RPG elements. They aren't trying to aim for diehard FPS players...this is for a totally different audience. I wouldn't spend any money on it but I had a fun time getting my National Gunner up to level 7 this evening.
LikeaRollingStone's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/28/2009 09:32
LikeaRollingStone
It got a 4.0, and you say I should download it? I'll give it a go I suppose.
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