I'm not sure I understand or agree with this. But otherwise. Good read.
I personally have a lot of disdain for gamer score, but not achievements.
@half left I believe he means during loads he hits the dashboard and goes to the achievement/friend page.
This. I'll make a quick edit to make that slightly clearer.
Bronze trophies do really seem quite worthless.
I've spent ages being a trophy whore, and now you've ruined my view on life!
Classic Sterling!
PS3 Trophies
These "useless topic" responses are generally my favorite. I write about videogames, absolutely none of my blog posts ever do, or ever will, matter. Let's not start attributing levels of relevance to a subject as silly as videogames, shall we?
I fully agree this is a silly topic. Just like everything we write about.
Seriously though, they should make trophies have some actual worth, by being able to buy stuff with your trophies, like extra content, swag, skins, or whatever.
"Reactions to firmware 2.7"
"1 Reason You Must Have InFAMOUS..."
Reborn's blogs.
This is how I see Trophies: I play a game, suddenly my game freezes for a moment, something pops up saying I got a trophy, I shrug, I keep playing.
I occasionally will be competitive with a friend or test my skill and see if I can "achieve" a high score to get a trophy, but that's really it. Negative points aside, it's just something extra and I'm okay with how it is. I owned a PS3 before Trophies were implemented, so it hasn't been a requirement for my game playing. Plus, some are just too hard to even attain without hours and hours of effort and practice.
If they do end up evolving it into something better, great. If not, then I'm okay with that too.
Things should improve if/when Sony puts trophy rooms into Home, and/or gives them some sort of meaning - extra themes, beta testing, anything like that would be pretty cool.
huh? Is Reborn trying to pick a fight for fight's sake?
Also, I agree. I care more about getting achievements than getting trophies. Then again, I've only had a PS3 for a few weeks.
I've read before that one of Sony's problems is the very Japanese way they have their company broken into isolated departments, each headed by a star (read: prima dona) engineer. Every department is following its leader in different directions, and so in the end, you get a range of products with oddly overlapping, yet not connected features and abilities. If I can find the article I'm thinking about before I get bored looking I'll post it.
I know achievements have driven me to get more out of a game in many cases, and improved my experience. If I had let my first impression of Army of Two stand, I wouldn't have picked it back up, but looking at ~100 gamerpoints sucked, so I went back and played it some more, and after spending a little more time with it, I got into the the game and enjoyed it. I ended up getting nearly all the offline achievements.
But you're right, the interface should be much quicker. It would make them a lot more easy to check.
Also, I should have my first Platinum soon. /whore.
With that said, the trophy system is so slow, I don't ever bother checking what I've accumulated. Plus, I kind of get annoyed when I finish a level in any game on the ps3 and all of a sudden I get a trophy. As with achievements, I feel that the pop ups on the screen ruin the immersion I'm trying to get with games.
Now, does it make me a hypocrite if I said I'm the number one fan of online leaderboards?
I can't believe it takes so long to just look at my trophies or others and if a game in general is multi-platform I'll buy it on my 360 for this very reason.
http://gadgets.boingboing.net/2009/02/11/the-psp2-and-the-ret.html
Its a good read in general, and relevent to this discussion.
Also, I totally judge other people by their gamescore. I'm not impressed if I see somebody with 100+ games played, and only 50-150 points from each. Not much of a gamer if he/she never finishes a game.
I don't particularly care, though. I enjoy (some) achievements/trophies for potentially giving me goals to reach, but I couldn't give a fuck less about cumulative gamerscores or trophy cards.
Is it;
A) Trophies fail to be relevant,
or
B) Trophies just aren't implemented as well as Achievements?
Hell, half of your gripes were about the XMB interface and had less to do with trophies and more to do with the abysmal amount of RAM the PS3 has.
I agree that I don't get quite as much satisfaction from Trophies as I do Achievements, almost purely because of that blip and bing, but I think the severe botching of the Bronze, Silver, Gold and Platinum trophies in your article is very misconstrued. Opinion or not, you are wrong.
Every trophy does contribute to the overall "XP bar" that gets you to the next level, even Bronzes. Bronze trophies are like fighting the frogs and shit right outside of Midgar. They aren't doing much for you, but fight enough of them and you'll definitely see some progress. Low on money/health but need to level up? Frogs are the way to go. Low on skill but want to get your trophy level up? Bronze is the way to go.
Since there are so many Bronze trophies, getting a Silver/Gold/Platinum trophy feels all the more rewarding. Silvers are like Skittles in a sea of wheat. Golds like a Sams Club pack of Skittles, but with less STD's. And Platinums are like becoming the President and declaring all the fucking Skittles yours. There's so much to the reward, and most games I've played with Trophies have them in all of the right amounts.
What's more, is that these are merely different ways to equate something without a numerical value to something entirely encompassed and existing as a numerical value. Bronzes are your 5's, 10's, 20's and 50's. Your Silvers are like 50's through 100's. And Golds are like 100's to 200's. Platinums? Just that little bit extra patting you on the back and saying, "You did it. You did good, kid." for getting that full 1,000.
That's also one of the brilliant things that Sony did with the formula they copied. The Platinums are the best damn things ever. Getting one of those is like getting every pack of Sour Skittles, Crazy Cores, Island Dream Cream Team Skittles and whatever the fuck else, and then having God himself part the sky, reach you with his voice and say, "You know what? Have a fucking cake."
Otherwise, I completely agree with the rest of your article which should have been called "An Example of Why The XMB Needs To Go".
Btw, I'm following you on Twitter you reacharound, we should flirt sometime. Same name. -WINK-
I am a whore about my Steam Achievements though...fucking Force-a-Nature...
Bomber (Get 15 bombs in bombermode) that shit needs to be a gold if not a platinum!
No.
Acheevs/Cups let the developer think that Replay value = Fulfilling a list.
Games like FF7 had such great Replay Value because they introduced the side quests gently and they were totally optional, such as Chocobo Breeding. Acheevs/Cups ram it down your throat and say "YOU ! HAVE YOU BRED A CHOCOBO! FUCKING DO IT!", it kills the sense of replayability and makes it so it's practically part of the main quest.
Seriously, unless they give me actual stuff to have off of the PSN store or net me cetan items in games or HOME, they can fuck off for all I care.
I never have, and never will get all the fuss about achievements or trphies, or the Steam achievements. They don't give you nothing at all, except robbing you of your life and wasting your time. Sure, you can brag like a prick, but everyone will think you are a arsehole. My penis is big enough without adding invisble numbers at the end of it. Screw having a e-penis, I have no want or need to waste my gameplaying time running after a bunch of invisble numbers or a crappy trophy.
I play games so that I can enjoy them and actually have a relatively stress free experience, why in God's name would I want to ruin that stressing over five bloody points or a stupid, digitized bronze trophy?
Trohoes and acheivents are not needed at all, IMHO. Play games so you enjoy them, not so you can earn a bunch of trophies or points, IMHO, that is.
If you want trophies or achievements to have value, Microsoft and Sony should create a marketplace where points/trophies/whatever can be traded for things more tangible than a number, either in-game or outside of the game. That way, players can at least earn something more valuable than a number on a virtual card, and you can still do the OCD thing and gloat to your friends that your number is higher than theirs.
In all seriousness, I like getting trophies, the XMB for me is fine except on Home but I don't need to check it on there as you have text/voice chat anyway.
The games that don't have them, it doesn't bother me, games that do have them, adds some more play time but it hasn't affected the way I play until after I've finished the story and side quests etc.
@ superezekiel: That was one funny post.
It really depends what community of friends you have. As in my Games Design course all the 360 gamers are always arguing about who's got the most achievements and who boosts, and I find that sad, as they are literally shouting at each other about virtual life achievements, I certainly would not want to become part of that.
As for Trophies I'm glad they haven't made as much of an impression as I don't spend hours obsessing over them. Sure I'll go out of my way to get some of them but I don't buy games JUST for trophies like I know people do. I am a trophy whore but only on games I like, but I have too many at the moment so I spread it out which games to get em on. I only start going for trophies after I've finished the game, as it adds a new experience to the game, unless I get them automatically for playing the game etc.
The only games that the XMB are slow for for me is GTA4 and LBP. Maybe all your PS3's are faulty...
At the end of the day, I'm glad I got my PS3 before they came out, I'm glad they came out eventually, and I'm happy with the XMB and trophies in total.
Steam achievements in TF2 actually unlock weapons, but that's dumb for different reasons and probably changing.
Check the latest Singstar ones that unlock features and items in HOME - this is surely the future, trophies 'achieved' will be used to unlock cool stuff that actually adds something to the whole PSN experience...
I say bring it - looking forward to GTA V trophies that unlock unique minigames in HOME etc... Achievements might have the edge at the moment but like the whole 360 thing - they won't stand in the face of the Sony's world domination long term gameplan.
Will the EA '10 Fifa, Tiger Woods etc games link to their new HOME sports centre? I wouldn't bet against it.
Trophies are just starting to find their feet - check back this time next year to see how much more they have 'achieved'.
Nice one.
I don't want to upset those who are homephobic out there, but I think they could use home to improve the players connection to their trophies. Let us display them in our apartments, for instance. The problem here is that home still hasn't done anything to draw the obsessive gamer in beyond an occasional stroll. So they'd also have to fix that as well.
I think that if they made home more desirable, they could then use home to expand the desire of the trophy idea. Of course there are several other avenues they could take, this is just my idea.
Sorry, I was referring to the 360 and PS3 in that staement, I knew about the TF2 achievments and what they unlock, it was my distain towards achievements that got the better of me and spurred a blanket staement.
But, as in Rev Anthony's post a few months ago, the fact is that as soon as a update is released on TF2, a massive, but not total, majority make the game into a achievement whoring shitfest. Sure, servers are still there for normal play, yet the fact is that a few dickwads DO come into the game and start ruining it, due to their pathetic need to get a damn pop up and a weapon they could easily get on a private server, if they bothered.
TF2 is still a wonderful experince to play, yet it's undeniable that the achievements have changed the landscape and the ameplay of the game. They don't riun the game, no, not at all, but they sure do make it needlessly fustrating to play, at times.
Oh, and I don't play on private servers, I have no steam freinds. :(
Don't you love it when you're in a game and you want to see the clock so you press that PS button on your controller only to be greeted by a clock that is covered up by a battery? WHO THE FUCK THOUGHT THAT WAS A GOOD IDEA? All they have to do is move one up or one down but nope, they're right on top of each other. Good one you fucking idiots.
Oh yeah and high 5 on adding text chat 2 years too late.
Fuck you XMB you suck.
The XMB is fully capable of sorting, so I hope that functionality comes soon- sort by most recent, alphabetic, trophy value, whatever makes sense.
A) Trophies fail to be relevant,
or
B) Trophies just aren't implemented as well as Achievements?"
They are part and parcel of the same overall point, that Sony isn't doing a good job with Trophies. I don't see how the central point of the article is unclear.
I don't care about trophies on my PS3, none of my friends care, my kids don't care, and most importantly my students don't care. However, 360 achievements and gamer score are serious nerd cred on a high school campus.
Only PS3 trophy I would want is "Watched 100 Blu-Rays" or something like that
So I can deal with the shortcomings described in this article. What's disturbing to me is that you can only log in with one user profile at a time when using the PlayStation 3, meaning that you cannot locally share in the Trophy grubbing process with friends. This detracts from co-op experiences on the PS3 for those of us who are used to gaming on the Xbox 360.

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