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Yep -- we're recording an extra episode of Podtoid this week (in addition to the sexism episode, which you should be listening to as we speak). In this special EX-2 Gaiden Plus Alpha edition of Podtoid, we'll be talking exclusively about Metal Gear Solid 4. Brad Rice, Chad Concelmo, Aaron Linde and I (sorry, but Sir Sterling still hasn't gotten his hands on it) will be discussing as many aspects of the game as we can, and we'd like to be helped along with a few reader questions. We can't pay $25 to the best question, unfortunately, but we'll still ask your question on the air and that'll be sort of cool. I guess. Either way, we're gonna talk about MGS4. What would you like us to talk about?
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53 comments + 73450 views
The final gameplay sequence.
just, wow.
As I trust this episode will contain many spoilers, I ask two spoiler-related questions:
1) What is your single favorite scene or moment from MGS4?
and
2) What with the ending, do you think Kojima will give in like he did after MGS2 and MGS3 and make a fifth game?
In the documentary, he says that he thinks there will be more Metal Gear games, but he wants to take a step back and let a new director create the new games(s).
First off, let me say that I loved MGS4. Even with my complaints, I still think it's one of the greatest experiences to be had through a digital medium.
------------------------
*Spoilers?*
I'd like to hear your opinions on the length of gameplay.
The only problems I had with cutscenes were the major importance put on a certain unremarkable character (Akiba/Johnny). The events of the ending sequence regarding his relationship were almost cringe-worthy.
Aside from that, the redundant exposition could have been improved or shortened for conciseness with better translators and editors.
Personally, I thought Act 1 and 2 were nearly flawless.
Act 3 could have been much more interesting if we could actually have witnessed the resistance fighting after following the member.
What were your takes on Act 4's design?
Personally, I was wholly disappointed in that it was filled with the worst designed enemy of the entire series. The nostalgia was impeccable but the almost soldier-less design of the act missed its potential.
How about your thoughts on Act 5?
Aside from the cutscenes, it consisted of a bridge, a boss, hallways, and the final fight. I seriously was hoping for some MGS2 Tanker action once inside Outer Haven.
-------------------
Will there be a similar gameplay experience coming out focusing on the mid-action stealth, but without the infusion of the heavy storyline?
On MGS4 launch day, did Dtoid get a noticeable drop in traffic? Do any big games have this effect? I, for one, was too busy playing the game to come on the internet.
On a more game-related note, did you relish the gameplay the first time round, or just rush ahead with the story? Personally, I'm treating myself to a slow playthrough now that I've seen (and been very moved by) the ending.
Simple question which I would genuinely love to know your answers too:
Why do you care?
Awww man... it's too soon! :(
Won't listen for the sake of losing the surprise of the experience...
How do you guys feel about the article over at kotaku, that basically claimed the game had a second meaning behind the obvious war is becoming to controlled, etc. and that is actually an allegory on the state of video games like mgs4. They said that the opening in a call of duty 4 -esque locale, starting with an actual gun as opposed to just a knife, and the ferquant pun "no place for Hideo" tells a story how games are becoming to identical in this case military shooters.
Also, please tell me I wasn't the only one who cringed when Otacon made the joke about changing discs in act 3 and then says more or less good thing we have blu-ray!1! it was the only codec scene, I was forced to skip.
What was the worst( I.E most disturbing)backstory of the beast corp beauties?
Maybe it was just me but were the guns a little bit too accessable? after all just pull up the menu and buy some stuff off of Drebin.
Did anyone else think Meryl's shoulders were massive?
Postpone that shit till Jim can get a playthrough.
What role do you think, should Snake take in the next game? Main character again, or what i would prefer, the mentor for a new guy, with just a few quick cameos?
Ok, that would be like in the plant section of MGS2, but I think that role fits him.
I will watch it, but with my eyes and ears closed :)
Hah, I'm going to be listening to this in several months after I manage to play MGS4 somehow.
What did you think about Snake really coming out as a three- dimensional character and how did you notice it coming out the most? Do you think this is revealed to the player better with Snake's continual deterioration?
Is it polite that we put spoilers in our comments even though they are probably all spoiler filled? Anywho,
-SPOILERS-
Anyone else feel Meryl is a dirty tramp? I mean, she pretty much falls out of love with Snake cause he's old now, then falls in love with a guy who looks like Snake when he was young! Personally, I hope she dies in a fire.
And how hot was Naomi?
Secondly, what are your thoughts on Metal Gear Online?
Ooh yes, Naomi. What a confusing character, what did you guys think of her and her role in the story?
What are your thoughts on the B&B's - as boss fights, sure, but also as characters? And, in giving them the backstories that he did, and making their appearance one of beauty rather than the typical child soldiers shown in the media on the news, documentaries, etc, do you think Kojima trying to send about the effect of war on the people who live and grow up in the conflict-filled regions of Africa, South America, etc. where the sorts of events that occurred to these four take place?
I have only ever watched somebody play a Metal Gear Solid game, and I feel like I ought to see what everybody is spooging over. So, since I want to start back at the first Solid game, I just have a simple question as to how to do it.
Should I get the recently released Essential Collection for $30 which has (I think) the games released in their original forms, or should I spend significantly more to get Twin Snakes, Substance, and Subsistence?
So here's the thing
I've come to terms with the fact that, as this growing up adult, I'm not gonna get my own PS3 anytime soon. And further, MG4 for 360 isn't coming out until SpaceCat finishes the fight.
So two questions: If I watch the story/gameplay on some streaming video site, am I realyl cheating myself, or is that a reasonable "its better than nothing" for this experience.
Also, given that, I'm assuming this podcast is cool kids only and if I plan to experience MGS4 in anyway, I should just hold off from listening to PEX-2GPA, right?
Who was your favorite Beauty and the Beast unit? I think I liked Screaming Mantis the best.
I can say pretty confidently that you oughtta get Essential. Twin Snakes sucks from a story point of view, Substance is included with the collection, and Subsistence, while nice, isn't totally necessary. You can buy that one separately if you end up really liking the Essential Collection.
I'm assuming that there will be spoilers?
i didn't think tiwn snakes was that bad!
a few things:
- of course, they are going to release a special edition of MGS4 in the same vein of substance and subsistence.
what extra bonuses would you want?
boss rush mode? VR missions? extra online modes? the whole game cut into a movie? an-in game podcast with jim sterling doing impressions?
now that the snake story is complete, where do you feel the series should go? (because it sure as hell isn't over completely) prequels? side stories? remakes of the first two original metal gear games for psp?
I'd also be interested in hearing thoughts on the hallway in Act V. I found it to be one of the most emotionally powerful parts of the game, and one of my favorites.
In this edition, did they update it so Rev is no longer invincible during his verbal uppercut? Did they give Aaron Linde a way to counter projectiles? Will Chad be given a gimpy dolphin ball? Will anyone understand these references?
Anyways, onto the topic at hand. METAL GEAR.
Not having the game myself, or a even a PS3, I feel that a small portion of me died so I went and looked for as much as I could about the game so I didn't feel left out. My research has left me with the following questions. And yes they contain SPOILERS, but anyone posting here should know better than to get butt hurt about it.
So, here we go.
Does anyone feel that the whole Psycho Mantis connection in the game seem a little forced? I've only read about it so I can't experience it as Kojima intended, but to me it seems a little flimsy.
When did nanomachines become the answer to all life's problems?
How does one die from being violated by a beautiful woman?
Is Big Boss Frankenstien?
When will Otakon ever have success with a woman?
After all is said and done, why do I still hate Raiden?
A gun that shoots tornado's? When did Snake become Mega Man?
That's all I can think of. I suppose I would have better questions if I had sold my soul for a PS3 and been able to play this game, but for now I will continue to rely on the internet until I get an actual job with benefits and all that stuff. Have fun, because I have a feeling in a few years Destructoid will remake this podcast will better sound quality so they can milk it for more hits.
ok, we all love the game. (i know i do) but not every game is perfect.
any problems you'd like to talk about?
(like the fact that the game DEMANDS you to play a certain way, despite the fact that they claimed you can play any way you want)
Tubatic:
I believe we're gonna do as much spoiler-free commentary as humanly possible at the beginning, for people in a position like yours.
the game was clearly more cutscene that gameplay. was this a problem for anyone, or was it perfect the way it was?
do you feel that MGS4 was a tiny comment on all the recent "four-quel" movies that have been released and will be released (indiana jones 4, die hard 4, rambo 4, and beverly hills cop 4) , where they beloved main character is old and everyone knows it?
Thanks Anthony. And I didn't even have to wait for you guys to record to get my answer.
do you think that trailers to the game gave too much away?
Careful, thar be SPOILERS ahead!
Am I the only person in the world that thought that the fight between Liquid Ocelot and Snake at the end was very cliche?
I felt the same way about the fight at the end of the original MGS, and wasn't exactly thrilled to see it return at the end of this game.
What I flipped shit for was the part where you fought the Metal Gear Ray inside Metal Gear Rex. Do you guys think that this section could've or should've been longer?
Finally, how about that end segment in the corridor!! My wrists were as broken as Snake's old man face after that ordeal. Why couldn't Otacon just go through in the Mk. III?
metal gear solid: the movie
i know you've talked about it briefly, and i agree that metal gear solid, being the cinematic game it is, doesn't NEED a movie, but it's going to happen regardless.
but what would you want out of a movie adaptation? with the rumors that christian bale would play solid snake, do you think that's a good choice?
Repost from before, since that cast wasn't about MGS:
Because MGS4 was just released, I've been thinking lately about player agency in game stories and how much interactivity we each require to justify a game's validity as a game. I'm not a fan of the series, which may make my opinion unpopular on this podcast, but I have played MGS 1-3, so I've given the series a fair chance. Kojima wears his cinematic aspirations on his sleeve, but it seems to me that the MGS series offers so little interactivity that it's a wonder he doesn't just make movies instead.
I'm not intending to bash the games here, I'd just like to know what the cast thinks is the minimum level of interactivity we should expect from a game, and whether the MGS series gains anything for being video games instead of just movies. Did Kojima miss his calling?
by the way, i think the corridor scene was one of the greatest moments in video game history.
it makes a tribute of the torture scene from the first game, while providing a HUGE dramatic effect on the player, as the world crumbles around snake and the player.
@iwontusemyname
I think it was absolutely perfect the way it was, and I thought there was quite an equal balance between cutscene viewing and gameplay.
Besides, if anyone went into the game NOT thinking that there would be long cutscenes, that's their own fault. This game had to tie THE ENTIRE SERIES TOGETHER. It was a given, even if there weren't any reports all over the internet about the cutscene lengths. But I loved every second of it, and I don't think it should have been done any other way.
As far as questions and stuff to talk about, how about your predictions for a possible 360 version? I know people are probably sick of hearing the rumor, but I'm curious as to what you guys personally think.
@pedrovay2003
i feel the same way completely.
and speaking of a 360 version, i heard rumors that MGS might even make an appearance on the wii. thoughts on that?
the in game advertisements:
did you think that it was not tasteful? did you think it made the game seem even more like a blockbuster movie?
did any moment make you cry?
do you think we've reached a point in the medium that could make players feel as emotionally connected as novels, movies, and so on?
how do you feel about EGM's refusal to review the game?
you guys, being notorious for honest opinions, review the game differently than others because it's such a huge hyped release with an insanely devoted fanbase.
MGS4 on the Wii may be the dumbest thing I've ever heard in my life.
Now, a port of MGS1-3 or maybe a MG1/2 remake, on the other hand..
@ aaron
i agree completely. the rumor i heard never said it was going to be MGS4, per-say, but a "Metal Gear Solid" game.
i'd think MGS2, because of all the MGS2 references in smash bros. brawl (the suit, the cypher, ray, and so forth.)
but possibly it might be a side story, similar to acid that hones on the strength of the system.
let's talk music:
how was it for the latest game?
man, i ask a lot of questions.
thanks for giving me the time, if any! and i mean that quite sincerely.
shigeru miyamoto has made a lot of great original games, but he will probably be remembered arguably for specifically mario and zelda.
do you think kojima will ever be able to top himself with another series?
by the way, this next question is for anyone else:
i bought the first two solid games when they first came out, but skipped the 3rd. and now i bought the essential collection recently, but MGS3 doesn't have the 2nd disc with the original MG titles.
my question is, as a mac user, is there a way or a place where i can NOT download them to NOT play on my computer?
I'm curious if you think Konami will double-dip like they did with Substance and Substanance.
I'm pretty sure I'd buy MGS4 again, even if all they added to the box were used needles.
how do you feel about the fact that the game was, every-time it could, showing all the tits and ass of nearly every female character (specifically naomi and the beauties)?
ok, one more question, specifically geared towards rev:
i know that you disliked MGS3 and had a very lukewarm feeling of MGS2 due to it's story elements. now that 4 has dropped and you've played all the way through it, how have your feelings changed on 2 and 3?
ok, i think i'm done.
thanks for listening, rev! i love the show!
Here's my question:
Where I the only person who got dissapointed with the lack of humanoid enemies at the last two acts?
The dwarf gekkos and the FROG units kinda ruined the game a bit for me.
I wanted to see more PMC soldiers that I could sneak through with the help of Playboy and hold-ups and such.
Who was your favorite member of the BB Corps in terms of the story behind her and your favorite in terms of the actual fight?
From the perspective of being blabbering little 14 year old girls when it comes to anything Metal Gear, what do you think 4's biggest flaw is?
Would you like to see Kojima's fourth-wall breaking shenanigans continue into his future, non-metal gear games?
What do you guys think about the rumored "Metal Gear 3: Revolver Ocelot"(slight info here?
Also, what did you guys think about the pacing of MGS4? Which MG/MGS game did you think had the best pacing?
Do you hope that MGS4 actually is the last MGS game Kojima works on, so he can work on other projects? If so, any previous projects you want him to continue?
I personally want him to work on a new Zone of the Enders and *spoilers i guess* the Rex vs Ray fight in act 4 only made me want it more *end spoilers*.
I'd just like to correct something Jim brought up regarding sexism in Oblivion in today's podcast:
He mentioned that playing as a female character in Oblivion is pointless because it makes you weaker. This is only conditionally true. In some race/sex combinations, female characters start with a lower Strength stat than men do. In all cases, a different stat makes up the difference. For every race, there are difference between the sexes, but not necessarily in their starting Strength stat. In all cases, this only affects your starting stats, and has no effect on your maximum development. You just start a little bit behind in that stat, and a little ahead in a different one.
For Bretons, males start with 40 Strength and 30 Speed, where as females begin with 30 Strength and 40 Speed. In the context of the game's fiction, Bretons are generally considered a magic-favoring culture, so chances are that speed would have helped him more than the strength.
The other races which have Strength disparities are the Khajiit cat-people (40/30, traded off for Endurance which increases your health and encumberance) and the Redguads (50/40, traded off for Personality).
In any of these cases, playing as a female character would hardly ruin your whole game. You can increase a given stat by up to 5 points per level, so in two levels Jim could have caught up.
The game doesn't document any of this stat nonsense, so obviously Jim had to go outside the game to discover that he had "wasted" 12 hours. His source should have explained a little better.
Sup, got another question i just thought of.
Any easter eggs you found in the game that resonate with you?(not including the flashback scenes in Act 4 or any unlockable music tracks)
I found one where if you call Rose after dying, Snake will talk about having dreams of dying.
Ok, one more question. *spoiler warning just in case*
What do you think about the use of the split-screen camera during the Snake vs Gekko/Raiden vs Vamp fight in act 4 and the corridor scene in act 5? Is that(or just multiple camera angles on one screen generally) an effect you'd like to see more of in other games?
Also, I apologize for any spelling and grammar errors I made in my posts.
(You guys getting sick of these yet :P)
What do you guys think will be the name of the inevitable discount priced MGS4: Submachine Guns of the Patriots and what do you think about this practice of screwing over the early adopters by Konami?
Personally I'm pulling for MGS4: Sub Sandwich (delicious) or MGS4: Subversion where they add a remake of MGS from Liquid Snake's perspective. And the re-releases suck because now I have to avoid spoilers for at least a year!
Were there any things you enjoyed in the previous games that you would have wanted in MGS4?
Granted, I've only played MGS2 and 3.
If I want to go back and play old saves, do I have to do the 3 gig install every time I change stages? Or do they install on the drive and stay there just adding up space? I would rather just leave them on there so I can play whenever I want. Also, what do you think of the fact that drebin items actually go on sale on Wednesdays and Sundays? Doesnt that just make people think that they should AVOID playing until those days instead of encouraging more play? Im on stage 3 and I think Im happy with the weapons I already have. (silenced sniper and a pistol plus the placed gas explosive.) Did you listen to the podcast in game yet? Did you notice that Otacons desktop wallpaper is for the Poilicenauts anime? I feel that this game has the same quality level graphics as Resident Evils cutscenes, but without fixed camera angles. Its great. Protip: dont change your octocamo to the color from the bedspread in the room at the end of stage 2. I had to do the whole 90-minute cutscene in this cat pukey pink/shite colored cloth uniform! What do you think of the fact that they charge 7 bucks for people to have extra online characters? I think its kinda lame... and the sound pack sux for a first offering, but I liked the red octocamo, hope they make more... They should make it so that you can buy their crap from the PSN store like everything else, not from their separate 1996 encoded website.
How well do you think the gameplay in MGS4, and the MGS games in general, hold up to a person who doesn't care about the story? Your average Mountain Dew-fueled, homophobic Xbox gamer.
Do you think that they over did the cutscenes? D0 you think it needed a lot more gameplay?
Random Questions
Did Naomi actually lose her bra... or was something else going on when they took her away in act 2?
Did you guys find the hidden UFO reference in that same part in act 2? Anyone else feel that was kind of creepy with a voice over talking about being abducted?
Also, was shooting fat little gerbils as much fun for you guys as it was for me? (gtfo of my radar!) Too bad I couldn't eat the little guys. "Mmm, tastes like chicken."
How well did Hideo Kojima's humor work for you guys? Personally I found myself muttering, "enough with the cigarette jokes with Sunny already. It wasn't funny the first 3 times." Or with Johnny, "I get it, he has the runs. Fucking shut up about it already."
Knife kills - Were they out of place for Snake? Or was it more of a nod to MGS3? Personally I would have rather snapped knecks again, but maybe Snake is getting old and cranky, hehe.