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Home Piracy updates

Pirates tell developer why they steal his games
6:13 AM on 08.17.2008, Jim Sterling 49 comments

Pirates tell developer why they steal his games photo
     Piracy

Indie game developer Cliff Harris has been trying to crack into the mind of a software pirate, calling for those who steal his work to confidentially come forward and explain themselves. Promising an amnesty of sorts, Cliff wants to know exactly why a vast amount of people take issue with paying for his game:

I know what I don’t know. And what I don’t know is WHY people pirate MY games. I might be able to get a general idea as to why people pirate stuff *in general* from reading warez forums, and every other story on digg, but I’m not interested in the general case. I want to improve my business, and ensure I stay afloat, and to do that, it would be mad to sit in the corner and ignore the opinions of that section of the public who pirate my games.

It's a unique idea -- reaching out to pirates instead of vilifying them -- and he seems to have gotten the knowledge he was after. This is the general summary of what the pirates told him:

• The information wants to/free anarchists think copyright shouldn't exist.
• Games are too expensive.
• The quality of gaming is too uneven.
• DRM is hurting the legitimate customers.
• Going to the shops is annoying.
• Because piracy is easy to do with low risk for getting caught.

Always amusing when a pirate accuses DRM of making them pirate, especially as Harris countered that by explaining his games don't even have DRM, save one. He also mentioned dropping the price of his game, as well as being pushed by piracy to improve the quality. A refreshing approach -- as many developers sit back and complain about piracy, at least one dev is being quite pro-active about the issue. It certainly won't stop everyone stealing from him, but maybe it'll guarantee at least a few more sales.


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PhazonYoshi's Avatar
PhazonYoshi at 08/17/2008 06:56
Because I can get the game for free with no concequences except that constant gnawing guilt when I play them. Also getting off my chair is annoying.
Cartman's Avatar
Cartman at 08/17/2008 07:16
Id love to be a pirate. Or a cowboy. Or a SPACEMAN. ..... SPAGHETTITESTICLES
Big Z's Avatar
Big Z at 08/17/2008 07:28
I pirate games because I'm too poor to buy them. Any money that finds its way into my hands goes right back to paying my college debts, and I simply don't have the funds to do much else.
bmaisey's Avatar
bmaisey at 08/17/2008 07:31
When I used to pirate games my rationalization was that I couldn't afford to buy the games so they were not loosing anything by me pirating them. This of course was complete crap; as if I was unable to pirate them I would have had the motivation to get a job so I could pay for them.
Neomotion's Avatar
Neomotion at 08/17/2008 07:42
Back in the day when i was a teenager, i would pirate games like beneath a steel sky, descent, etc etc. That was a bitch with the whole ms-dos thing. But i did it because i didn't have the funds to buy them.

Now as an adult with income, i buy my games. But i only buy the games which i deem worthy quality wise, which will give me enough playtime and joy (i bought Mass Effect, Pro Evo, Gears of War, GTA4, which by the way didn't last me as long as i'd hoped, Madden 08, and some other great titles). But it all depends on quality. That's the only way the developers these days will get my money.

So while not encouraging piracy, i can see where some people are coming from. Developers need to make sure there software are the best they can be, and people will buy them. Just not the crappy ones...
Holyetheline's Avatar
Holyetheline at 08/17/2008 08:32
I just buy all my shit. Who needs to steal?
ajaxender's Avatar
ajaxender at 08/17/2008 10:19
Why do i pirate? Because most of the games arent worth my money. But i have an internet connection and some of the games look like they might be fun to try.

Would i buy most of the games i have(or rather, had, i just had a clean up and deleted the ones i dont play; most of them), if i had the money and piracy was impossible? Nah. If i had money id buy a nice big LCD screen for my pc. Id buy a 360 or maybe a ps3. Id buy a guitar or two. Heck, i just wouldnt worry about my food budget, id make sure the car always had fuel, id buy alcohol more than once a month or so :P.

This sort of thing makes piracy numbers pretty hard to get any meaning from. How many of the pirates would actually buy the game? I find that the games i actually spend time on are the ones i buy; i have no problem shelling out some cash if i know its worth the investment.

I actually think that good, clever indie developers have the least to fear from piracy. Games like Audiosurf and Everyday Shooter are definitely worth $10, and often provide a demo too. Im actually almost looking foward to my next student living costs payment, so i can buy the latter.

I guess what it comes down to, is: Make damn sure your game is worth every penny of what you charge for it! And having followed the link to Kotaku, it seems this guy has come to the same conclusion.
Dusty Gozongas's Avatar
Dusty Gozongas at 08/17/2008 10:21
I think the key to lowering the piracy rate is having a good online component w/ simple cd keys to ensure a personal copy. If that's the case for a game that I want, there's pretty much a 100% chance that I'll buy it (Battle.net, Halflife2/Counterstrike, Battlefield 2, etc.)
Eschatos's Avatar
Eschatos at 08/17/2008 10:49
The only one of those excuses that truly matters is the last one.
Holiday's Avatar
Holiday at 08/17/2008 10:53
People like free stuff. Too gaming in general can be quit expensive, especially with consoles.
Arcanum's Avatar
Arcanum at 08/17/2008 10:59
As long as you have to put down fucking money for games, there will be pirates. it's as simple as that.
Noah's Avatar
Noah at 08/17/2008 11:31
People pirate games the same reason everybody pirates music and movies...because it's free and anonymous. Torrents have also made pirating easier...it's faster to download a new cd than it is to drive to the record store and back. I never have and never will make excuses for piracy, and it's something I'll never boast about, but I do it.

When video game companies start folding like American Anime distributors, maybe people will smarten up, but until then...
flashbak's Avatar
flashbak at 08/17/2008 11:35
Look, developers do not understand that at the end of the day they are releasing a consumer product. Like most items that have different functional parts they need to release crap that works, period. If I go buy ANYTHING (other than software), and the crap doesn't work I return it and get a refund.

Personally I download before I buy to make sure 1) that the damn thing is fun 2) that it won't be over and done with in a sitting, and 3) that the damn thing works. If a developer doesn't overyhype their product, and releases it in a fully functional manner, then I will go and buy it. Often times I will never open the box, just let it sit. Afterall, the downloaded version doesn't have obscene drm that causes more problems than its worth.

I understand that it is a business and they have to make money to operate. They should also, however, have to run their business in an ethical manner. Know what? Not one developer out there does, so they reap what they sow.
Magesx's Avatar
Magesx at 08/17/2008 11:50
bawwwww they're too expensive ;o;
mikeyed's Avatar
mikeyed at 08/17/2008 11:56
This is a pretty horrible list of reasons/excuses, but the problem is it's pretty accurate.
KMCC's Avatar
KMCC at 08/17/2008 11:59
Well, I commend Mr. Harris for taking this approach.

Maybe people should limit their play time to quality games that they know are worth their time and financial investment.
sluxi's Avatar
sluxi at 08/17/2008 12:12
What's wrong with giving DRM as a reason? (except for this specific developer of course) I have refrained from buying Half-Life 2 & Orange Box because I don't like the DRM-nightmare that is Steam. Buy Positech games btw, I loved their Democracy game, it's educational and interesting to play. Haven't yet checked the sequel but I'm sure it is great too.
Tet's Avatar
Tet at 08/17/2008 12:15
Who pirates an indy developer's $10 game?
calpis's Avatar
calpis at 08/17/2008 12:26
I wish I was able to pirate Assassin's Creed for the 360 instead of buying it on day one and finding out how crappy/repetitive/under developed it was 4 hours later. Same goes for Halo3.

Although "The quality of gaming is too uneven" is still just an excuse, it's also very valid.
zeroword's Avatar
zeroword at 08/17/2008 12:33
First of all, I don't think anyone pirates his games. I have seen his website and I personally have no desire to play any of them. Why is it when a developer sees low sales he/she assumes it is because their games are being stolen and not because there is no interest in the product?

I pirate games to try them. I buy every game I love and wait for the others to go down in price. Sometimes it's necessary to pirate a game just to play it. I would have never been able to play Seiken Densetsu 3 otherwise. I also own Japanese copies of the GBA Mother 1/2/3 and I think I should be entitled to the English translations.
flamesofchaos's Avatar
flamesofchaos at 08/17/2008 12:48
"• The information wants to/free anarchists think copyright shouldn't exist."

Everybody likes things free, however nothing is free and what people should be paid for what they worked hard on. Piracy kills jobs and developers are then caught in the crossfire and ultimately lose their jobs.

"• Games are too expensive."

While I do think when games cost 60 or more it's bullshit. There always of checking out sites like cheapassgamer.com or wait till stores have a sale on those games.

"• The quality of gaming is too uneven."

Agreed but that's a well known fact.

"• DRM is hurting the legitimate customers."

I agree but it's a necessary evil when piracy exists. So in reality these "anarchists" that think that everyone deserves everything for free is hurting legit customers that want to support a developer and publisher with the purchase of a game that the customer is interested in.

"• Going to the shops is annoying."

Now that's a big BS excuse, if your that lazy to go to a store then just shop online, get a digital distribution copy of the game if it's for PC/MAC.

"• Because piracy is easy to do with low risk for getting caught."

That's unfortunately true, there should be more severe measures against piracy. There are a few companies that are cracking down on piracy big time.
whormongr's Avatar
whormongr at 08/17/2008 12:58
I was going to write the guy, but I have never nabbed any of his games- in the end I buy games, and I pirate games. why? because there are a ton of games out there and most are crap- I support games that I like because I want the developers to get the message the this is more of what I want to see in games and I am sending my vote with my wallet. In the end though nabbing a ton of games that I never would have bought in the first place and playing them part of the way through and seeing that they are crap in no way that I can see would affect any bit of income to the developers. The same holds true for music and movies and any other IP that people complain about "piracy" (I am an independent musician on indie labels so I go through this debate with people all of the time). In the end you can't be upset that people have copies of your material without paying for it- if you have been losing sales you need to take a deeper look at why people would in the end not WANT to pay for it- in the end result of all things I see piracy in all IP's being a combination of 2 things 1. quality or interest and 2. price- people don't mind dropping a couple of bucks for something if they have the $ and it is something they like. I can say that when it comes to games I will buy the game if I like it AND if it is worth the $ (this is where the DRM comes in- I was going to buy spore and sims 3, but if the same DRM is on it that is on mass effect I will pirate it to get a copy sans the DRM.
Tuxy's Avatar
Tuxy at 08/17/2008 13:39
I pirated DS games so I could sample them. Since Nintendo are too lazy to release anything of the sort through Wii console.

I used to pirate PC games, now I just buy my games. I appreciate the work gone into creating a game. But I'm very picky which games I buy.

It's nice to see a developer atleast taking a different approach. For the people who don't think their games are worth buying. If this results in better games, they could possibly make more profit.
EternalDeathSlayer's Avatar
EternalDeathSlayer at 08/17/2008 15:23
Piracy is wrong, and that's all there is to it. Not being able to afford a game is no excuse to steal it, considering you don't need it.

All of those reasons are a crock of shit.
Mekanikles's Avatar
Mekanikles at 08/17/2008 15:54
It's very simple: I pirate most of my games due to my bad economy (and lazyness) but the other day I decided to go buy GTA IV for my 360. I walked into my local videogame retailer (Gamestop) gladly willing to spend money on something that's been out for quite some time. However, they wanted fucking 699skr (100$) for it so I said fuck that and bought a chipped Wii instead. I don't care a bit if the industry goes down the crapper. I'm perfectly satisfied with indie games anyway.
Mrjoemama's Avatar
Mrjoemama at 08/17/2008 16:52
Pirating is stealing. Would you walk into the retail store of choice and walk out with a product valued at about 30-60 dollars?
Im OK's Avatar
Im OK at 08/17/2008 18:29
They do it because they can easily get away with it. If robbing a Wal-mart or EB to get free games were as easy, more people would be doing that too.

/thread
Im OK's Avatar
Im OK at 08/17/2008 18:32
Btw, in case it's not clear enough in my previous comment, in my opinion pirates == douchebags.
Velt's Avatar
Velt at 08/17/2008 18:58
Well, I dont know the rest of you but how about not shiping the games to some places like south america on release date? Or even two years after?

If its not on steam then I cant get the game without paying 120 dollars (games+shiping+taxes), and thats expensive. Since they dont care to bring the games here then I dont care pirating them, they are not loosing money with me anyway.
mistic's Avatar
mistic at 08/17/2008 21:37
wow speaking of captain obvious :-)
keener's Avatar
keener at 08/17/2008 22:02
i like this guys style. instead of bitching and moaning and making things worse for everyone, he is actually trying to create a situation that can be appealing to all parties.

if ever i am interested in a game by this developer, i will most certainly pay for it, if not for anything else other than he is making an honest effort to create a quality product and connect with potential buyers in a way ive not seen any other developer even attempt.
Arttemis's Avatar
Arttemis at 08/18/2008 00:45
Piracy is popular because it's free. That will always be attractive to many people.

To increase sales, developers and publishers need to stop this gradual push toward higher prices AND they should make their games far more accessible (in stores and online).
If the major blockbusters were $20-40 and could be downloaded without this fucking bullshit DRM, sales would sky rocket.
RWarrior1CO's Avatar
RWarrior1CO at 08/18/2008 00:46
Feh, nothing but the usual weak excuses. The anarchism one really upsets me, though. I mean, what, those guys think that games with multi-million dollar budgets should be released for free? That's not the way the world works, idiots! Why should people like Epic Games go through all that effort and expense to get nothing in exchange?
hjd uk's Avatar
hjd uk at 08/18/2008 04:32
I selectivly buy games that are worth the purchase. Havent pirated a game in ages. As for the 'expense' excuse good god you whingers have it easy, in the UK we can easily have to pay $65 - $75 a game.
hjd uk's Avatar
hjd uk at 08/18/2008 04:38
oh and "Who pirates an indy developer's $10 game?"
Shameless c***s thats who.
auntnadia's Avatar
auntnadia at 08/18/2008 05:37
i am NOT paying over the odds for a download of a crappy old nes game. nor do i want to spend any more money on street fighter 2. i've bought that game a thousand times, for the promise of a new character or some nice HD visuals.

i'm fed up of paying almost a days wages for a game that's been overhyped. i hate that feeling of being ripped off by a game and i can only trade it in for half the price the next day.

that's why pirating is so tempting. i still buy as many games as i ever did, but for the price i feel is fair and only if they're worth my money.
exodus1925's Avatar
exodus1925 at 08/18/2008 06:23
Hats off to the good man
Chilly's Avatar
Chilly at 08/18/2008 07:46
We pirate because we're poor, we pirate because we can. Arrrh.

People should be happy people pirate their stuff. From an artistic point of view, if nobody pirated, stuff wouldnt receive the attention it deserves (or doesnt).
Tull's Avatar
Tull at 08/18/2008 08:01
People who use the games are expensive excuse to pirate games are scum. I have one thing to say to them: go get a J-O-B.
Mr B Natural's Avatar
Mr B Natural at 08/18/2008 09:20
Argument #1 - "Why do i pirate? Because most of the games arent worth my money."

Oh christ. Their not worth your "money" but they are obviously worth your "time" because you spent your day looking for it, downloading it, cracking it, installing it and playing it all the way through. Time = money. 60 dollars isn't going to prevent you from paying for college and if you got a good enough pc to play new to semi-new games then you got the money to buy games.
Piraters are such crap.

"I pirate it cause I can't afford to buy it."
Oh christ again. If you're pirating a NEW to Semi-NEW game that needs sales to stay afloat then you have a PC that can handle this NEW game. That PC costs enough to buy 10 or so games. The time you spent downloading the game, you could have worked part time and actually bought 2 games with your time. OR you can wait till it legitimately met your price-point and played it then. You don't HAVE to play a game. PC gaming is expensive and it's not the games that make it the expensive part.
Piraters are such crap.

Argument #3 - "Fight the power!"

Oh christ. What power? Are you oppressed? White middle class men/teenagers are so oppressed! You're not fighting anything by being so strongly materialistic that you can't even afford to keep up with yourself. And if you want to "fight" whatever it is you're "fighting" then get off your desk chair and out of your mom's basement and do something about "it." Whatever that it is.
Piraters are such crap.

Here, let me tell you why people pirate (I did my own survey)...
People are cheap, self-centered, self-righteous, not apathetic, self-entitled (especially), and just plain dumb.
Demtor's Avatar
Demtor at 08/18/2008 10:10
Ahhh piracy. The debate continues as always. Nice to hear a dev stop whining long enough to try and understand it. Good luck though, everyone pirates for so many different reasons that in the end the reason why they do it doesn't really matter. Because as this list above shows... there's always an excuse when you need one.

It's the reason why they DON'T pirate, that should be given more attention.

For me, when a game company strives to actively please its fans with GOOD quality games, you'll find me giving them my money.

-Portal? Yup.
-Bionic Commando remake? Yes please, here's my money.
-MGS4? Thank you Kojima, have some American green.
-Castlevania in 2D? Roger that, Iga likes sprites and so do I.
-What is this Pixel Junk Eden demo? Oh... love it, bought it.
boatorious's Avatar
boatorious at 08/18/2008 11:24
Pirates are always going to have a reason, just like criminals always have a reason, just like ninja's in MMO's always have a reason.

"It's ok that I'm going to screw you out of money, let me explain why ..."

At that point the pirate has left rationality and you aren't going to get them back.

The exception, of course, is legal buyers who want to avoid the DRM. Still (probably?) legally wrong, but doing so doesn't necessarily indicate a moral failing.
Bans's Avatar
Bans at 08/19/2008 10:05
Most people who do pirate to tell you the truth don't even know why they do. Sure they'll use the excuse "information should be free" but that doesn't really seem to fit the need to make sure you crack a copy of Chicken Invaders 3.

I used to pirate tons of software particularly Photoshop and such. Studies have shown in the cases of actual useful software like Photoshop there is a turn around where people end up paying for the software because they find it so useful so they eventually become customers. But then you factor in the differences between a game and photoshop and you'd see why someone would purchase photoshop instead of lets say mass effect. (Support, long term use of the software, updates, etc..)

Game developers usually release a game and then forget it. They promise DLC but rarely deliver (if at all). This is why games like TF2 for PC are really good, they consistently fine tune it, release new maps, class updates, etc. If people see support for the game they will be more likely to buy your product but if have a dismissive attitude towards your game, so will your consumers and they will save their pennies. Look at the games that are the most successful, console and PC, those are the ones that have regular updates for performance and content..

But most pirate get a game because they can get it for free till they see the short comings of it..
DibbityDan's Avatar
DibbityDan at 08/19/2008 18:22
I would pirate a game if it was out of print, or hard to find. Something like Commandos or Fallout.
hjd uk's Avatar
hjd uk at 08/20/2008 05:23
Bwark-Kupo's Avatar
Bwark-Kupo at 08/21/2008 02:25
I don't really understand the "I pirate games because most games are crap" argument. Why would you want to play crap games?
poyraz's Avatar
poyraz at 11/15/2008 05:24
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