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I actually spoke to Gabe after he posted about this and pointed out that IGN might be a little sensitive since I kinda, y'know, kicked up a bit of a stink over the PS3 review of Assassin's Creed. He agreed that it made sense.
Hmm i didn't get the same impressions from the first PA post but I do agree that this is absolutely ridiculous, especially the fact that the IGN guy felt the need to respond at all. And you wonder why gaming journalism doesn't get respect. Hmmmm, maybes its because most games journalist act like fucking 3 year olds.
heh
sad part is one reviewer criticizing another...especially game sites (as if any really have any standards or consistencies to reviewing)
5 rating scale works... 10 scale has been broken for years, decent games should be rated 5 and not 8.0 on a 10 scale... and yes AC introduced some new great things to gaming but horribly messed up some old basics of gaming... THUMBS DOWN
so sad
sad part is one reviewer criticizing another...especially game sites (as if any really have any standards or consistencies to reviewing)
5 rating scale works... 10 scale has been broken for years, decent games should be rated 5 and not 8.0 on a 10 scale... and yes AC introduced some new great things to gaming but horribly messed up some old basics of gaming... THUMBS DOWN
so sad
she also has some good money.. hence all the hype for this game for 2+ years without seeing anything marvelous before release....
"I've personally seen certain IGN staffers kick the homeless and menstruate on crucifixes."
Best sentence ever.
Also Nex hates white people.
Best sentence ever.
Also Nex hates white people.
The original article that "gabe" wrote didn't say anything insulting to reviewers.
The drama is entirely on IGN's side, like always. I don't know why this is an issue.
The drama is entirely on IGN's side, like always. I don't know why this is an issue.
I think its idiotic for you to call them on this by posting it on your site. Isn't that how dtoid got its start? By posting on some pretty idiotic shit? Personally I find that the gaming industry tries to pull fast shit on gamers and I've always found PA to be an honest voice among us.
I love PA and all but a 7 for Assassin's Creed sounds about right on the true scale. Maybe even a little generous. I'm playing it at my own pace and totally agree with the 1up review.
"most of you focused unnecessarily on its producer's breasts"
Unlike Destructoid itself, right? I'm not going to take the time to look it all up, but I remember several references to Jade Raymond's hotness on this very website, which only took a tongue-in-cheek tone after the "people just hype AC because of Jade Raymond" backlash. Prior to that, especially a few months before the release of the game, many Destructoid writers were seen drooling over her charming features on this very site.
Hey...I'm just sayin'. I love this site, but let's not pretend that some of Dtoid's finest had nothing to do with the ridiculous Jade-worship.
Unlike Destructoid itself, right? I'm not going to take the time to look it all up, but I remember several references to Jade Raymond's hotness on this very website, which only took a tongue-in-cheek tone after the "people just hype AC because of Jade Raymond" backlash. Prior to that, especially a few months before the release of the game, many Destructoid writers were seen drooling over her charming features on this very site.
Hey...I'm just sayin'. I love this site, but let's not pretend that some of Dtoid's finest had nothing to do with the ridiculous Jade-worship.
Dammit, I wanted you to argue with me.
Anyhow, I like PA for their honesty. Just as I like dtoid for theirs. I think they just wanted people to check it out regardless of the bad reviews. I don't think his original post was insulting anyone. More than anything, he pointed out that it must suck to try and review a game by a certain date.
I think the main problem with AC was that gamers thought it would be an action title. Then when they found out it wasn't, they didn't like it as much. Personally, I liked how subtle the game was. Yes it wasn't perfect, yes you did the same thing over and over, but to me it was still a solid game.
This, just like Mass Effect, should have been cooked longer. Try running through a level in ME without having it go in slow motion.
Anyhow, I like PA for their honesty. Just as I like dtoid for theirs. I think they just wanted people to check it out regardless of the bad reviews. I don't think his original post was insulting anyone. More than anything, he pointed out that it must suck to try and review a game by a certain date.
I think the main problem with AC was that gamers thought it would be an action title. Then when they found out it wasn't, they didn't like it as much. Personally, I liked how subtle the game was. Yes it wasn't perfect, yes you did the same thing over and over, but to me it was still a solid game.
This, just like Mass Effect, should have been cooked longer. Try running through a level in ME without having it go in slow motion.
AC is great. But I can see where people are coming from who don't like it. Either way, IGN was totally owned.
IGN last week stated (In Gamescoop) "Penny arcade is now trying to tell reviewers how to review games. Why don't they show me where 'the funny' is for their comics because I haven't laughed once" hah. That was one of the funniest lines I ever heard! Sorry but most of Penny arcade comics suck. And Penny Arcade got owned. They sound just like any other whinny fanboy that doesn't like a reviewer giving a game a lower score then they feel. 7.7 or even 7 isnt a bad game.
@Pistolaero
It's exactly what I thought it would be. I just didn't expect to be doing the same things over and over. Don't get me wrong though, what the game does well, it does really well, but eventually you get bored and it gets predictable. The only thing really motivating me to complete it now is the story.
It's exactly what I thought it would be. I just didn't expect to be doing the same things over and over. Don't get me wrong though, what the game does well, it does really well, but eventually you get bored and it gets predictable. The only thing really motivating me to complete it now is the story.
"I've personally seen certain IGN staffers kick the homeless and menstruate on crucifixes."
...I died laughing
...I died laughing
Meh, IGN sucks, and the fact that no one even knows the name of the guy on the IGN podcast, well, put it this way.
Two people write at penny arcade, gabe, tycho.
How many writers can you name from IGN off the top of your head?
Also, AC is not a bad game, i was reluctant at first, but i'm slowly playing it, and its not bad at all.
At least when you go to penny arcade you dont have to click through a ad every 2 seconds.
Two people write at penny arcade, gabe, tycho.
How many writers can you name from IGN off the top of your head?
Also, AC is not a bad game, i was reluctant at first, but i'm slowly playing it, and its not bad at all.
At least when you go to penny arcade you dont have to click through a ad every 2 seconds.
@ Nex-
First Pistol, now me...what, you don't want to argue? I'm actually a little hurt by this.
Anyway, it's not so much that I have a problem with the Jade worship or even Jade jokes. I enjoy the mythical thought of an attractive, intelligent woman who likes video games and doesn't have herpes and/or stretch marks as much as anyone else. I'm more annoyed with the inevitable backlash of Jade-mania and those who use it as an excuse to hate on a pretty good game. It's one thing to not like something based on its own merits (or lack thereof). But with the recent backlash against "overly-hyped" games I get the distinct feeling that many of the detractors are trying to balance out the hype or ridiculously positive reviews by going the other direction and shitting on something that doesn't the fecal treatment.
First Pistol, now me...what, you don't want to argue? I'm actually a little hurt by this.
Anyway, it's not so much that I have a problem with the Jade worship or even Jade jokes. I enjoy the mythical thought of an attractive, intelligent woman who likes video games and doesn't have herpes and/or stretch marks as much as anyone else. I'm more annoyed with the inevitable backlash of Jade-mania and those who use it as an excuse to hate on a pretty good game. It's one thing to not like something based on its own merits (or lack thereof). But with the recent backlash against "overly-hyped" games I get the distinct feeling that many of the detractors are trying to balance out the hype or ridiculously positive reviews by going the other direction and shitting on something that doesn't the fecal treatment.
Nex,
are you a MexiCan or a MexiCan't ?
Inquiring minds want to know
;)
G.R.A.W. 3 Mexico Strikes Back!
are you a MexiCan or a MexiCan't ?
Inquiring minds want to know
;)
G.R.A.W. 3 Mexico Strikes Back!
I want to point out something really quick. AC to me is kind of like Shadow of Colossus. It wasn't about all out action. It was a subtle game, one where you could lounge around with Aggro (sp?) and still have it be enjoyable. Animation played a huge factor.
AC is similar to this. It's about Altair's interaction with the crowd, how he animates, etc...
Which makes me wonder, why then did IGN give SOC a 9.7? It is also fairly repetitive, is it not? Find a monster, climb it, kill it, repeat. Everyone in the media couldn't get enough of it. To me, AC is pretty much the same.
I can't recommend AC to anyone just like back then I couldn't recommend SOC as well. Why? Because not everyone will enjoy this.
AC is similar to this. It's about Altair's interaction with the crowd, how he animates, etc...
Which makes me wonder, why then did IGN give SOC a 9.7? It is also fairly repetitive, is it not? Find a monster, climb it, kill it, repeat. Everyone in the media couldn't get enough of it. To me, AC is pretty much the same.
I can't recommend AC to anyone just like back then I couldn't recommend SOC as well. Why? Because not everyone will enjoy this.
I've personally seen certain IGN staffers kick the homeless and menstruate on crucifixes.
That was fucking awesome.
That was fucking awesome.
PA & IGN suck. Dtoid is all we need. While other sites require you to take sides as they bitch about this or that, Mr. Dtoid requires only that you fill his bukkake bowl. You will find Mr. Dtoid is both kind and generous.
I have been reading Penny Arcade for years (same for IGN) and although I haven't wasted my time listening to the IGN podcast (or any podcast ever, for that matter) I feel as though IGN is sort of out of line here.
I read the post when it was originally on PA (after having already read IGN's review the day prior) and just felt as though Gabe was pointing out to the general public an ample thought: don't base your opinion on a single review. Reviews are opinions and it's always best to form your own because it's the only one that ever matters (unless you're in court). Such is a quality reminder that some people may forget about from time to time. He simply enjoyed it and though other people should know they could too if they so chose.
Alright. What's the big deal then?
To have IGN feel the need to (apparently) attack PA for what they (and they actually meaning Gabe, Tycho has today defended his stance in the matter which I also feel is bullshit to call HIM out on, Nex) said is stupid. IGN felt the need to call out PA for calling out IGN (which, if you believe Gabe, wasn't even the case at all). THAT IS RETARDED to the Nth degree.
IGN spouts scores all the time and expects people to just do as they say. PA is a much tighter knit community that simply gives recommendations on fun games. IGN takes reviews as purely business matters. PA plays games they actually enjoy.
I side with PA.
I read the post when it was originally on PA (after having already read IGN's review the day prior) and just felt as though Gabe was pointing out to the general public an ample thought: don't base your opinion on a single review. Reviews are opinions and it's always best to form your own because it's the only one that ever matters (unless you're in court). Such is a quality reminder that some people may forget about from time to time. He simply enjoyed it and though other people should know they could too if they so chose.
Alright. What's the big deal then?
To have IGN feel the need to (apparently) attack PA for what they (and they actually meaning Gabe, Tycho has today defended his stance in the matter which I also feel is bullshit to call HIM out on, Nex) said is stupid. IGN felt the need to call out PA for calling out IGN (which, if you believe Gabe, wasn't even the case at all). THAT IS RETARDED to the Nth degree.
IGN spouts scores all the time and expects people to just do as they say. PA is a much tighter knit community that simply gives recommendations on fun games. IGN takes reviews as purely business matters. PA plays games they actually enjoy.
I side with PA.
Although I love and admire PA for their charity, comic, and expo I think sometimes their internet fame goes to their head.
Assassin's Creed may or may not be a shitty game and IGN may or may be a shitty site but they don't really need to point the fact out and say they are wrong. IGN has a right to retaliate against an unprovoked attack of the opinions.
Assassin's Creed may or may not be a shitty game and IGN may or may be a shitty site but they don't really need to point the fact out and say they are wrong. IGN has a right to retaliate against an unprovoked attack of the opinions.
Shadow of the Colossus is different though since it's a focused experience. Yes, essentially you're going from one "boss" to the next with traveling in between but each boss is like a puzzle and I would say the majority of the game involves you actually in battle with them. Since the traveling in between is so serene and scenic, it doesn't feel repetitive and it's always a different path. Not to mention the traveling really doesn't take up that much time.
AS's game play on the other hand is repetitive because it's an open sand-box world where you do the same thing over and over every mission. You approach the city, save a monk who then sneaks you in, and then you do one of 4 or so different investigation missions to get permission to assassinate the target. That's where AS trips up because there was so much potential in having different ways to investigate. But it's the same things repeated over and over. At least mix it up and let me sneak into the city a different way. Granted, the actual assassinations are generally unique to each other and fun but it's over and done so quickly that it's hard to overcome the rest of the faults.
So yeah, the difference is that SotC is very focused and minimalist. In this way I think SotC compares better to Portal than Assassin's Creed actually. Assassin's Creed is just repetitive.
AS's game play on the other hand is repetitive because it's an open sand-box world where you do the same thing over and over every mission. You approach the city, save a monk who then sneaks you in, and then you do one of 4 or so different investigation missions to get permission to assassinate the target. That's where AS trips up because there was so much potential in having different ways to investigate. But it's the same things repeated over and over. At least mix it up and let me sneak into the city a different way. Granted, the actual assassinations are generally unique to each other and fun but it's over and done so quickly that it's hard to overcome the rest of the faults.
So yeah, the difference is that SotC is very focused and minimalist. In this way I think SotC compares better to Portal than Assassin's Creed actually. Assassin's Creed is just repetitive.
falinter: What attack of opinions? Krahulik pretty much said that people shouldn't NOT play Assassin's Creed because some review gave it a 7 and called it repetitive. He gave some reasons why he think it's worth checking it out, and that was it. He was critical of review methods that force reviewers to rush through a stack of games to get articles out on a deadline. He didn't call out IGN or anything. His next article attacked IGN for throwing a fit over his review scores. If you've seen his attacks on Jack Thompson and some others, he can get pretty excessive. I'm not saying it's right, but I'm just saying his original thoughts on AC were not an "unprovoked attack" on IGN's opinion.
...So, wait. Is a "12" covered in porn and glitter good? Hell, I should be looking for some of those instead of reading game reviews!
Penny arcade is decent most of the time but when I buy the assassins creed game and there is a Penny Arcade Assassins Creed comic book inside I think they lose most credibility when calling out other peoples reviews. Plus Penny Arcade started this, I don't think they should get a pass just because they are a small hip community, even cool guys can be douche bags sometimes.
Sorry. Had to be done.
But yeah, I think the original point about not basing your opinions of a game you haven't played on someone else's review is pretty valid. ESPECIALLY if you just go by the score.
I once wrote for a site (now defunct) that didn't include scores in our reviews. This meant people had to actually READ the things, which a lot of people don't do. They just skip to the score.
In short, arguing is stupid. People are stupid. IGN is stupid. PA is... therefore technically stupid, but I still find them funny.
Also, Jade Redmond's breasts.
If you read Gabe's first post
http://www.penny-arcade.com/news/show/22310
he never calls out IGN specifically. The only time he mentions IGN was when he was talking about how Adversting for his site works. Quote
"There are about four or five reviews of the game with scores in the low to mid 7's. I want to cover some of the common complaints these reviewers had in case anyone out there is worried about them."
He didn't call anyone out by name. He was 'addressing common complaints'
Also, Destructoid acting like it's above the internet bickering is ridclous at best. The best part about the site is the inyouface tell-it-like-it-is attitude.
http://www.penny-arcade.com/news/show/22310
he never calls out IGN specifically. The only time he mentions IGN was when he was talking about how Adversting for his site works. Quote
"There are about four or five reviews of the game with scores in the low to mid 7's. I want to cover some of the common complaints these reviewers had in case anyone out there is worried about them."
He didn't call anyone out by name. He was 'addressing common complaints'
Also, Destructoid acting like it's above the internet bickering is ridclous at best. The best part about the site is the inyouface tell-it-like-it-is attitude.
NUB = Me
@ Nex
"I'm Italian."
Same shit.
I'm actually Mexican, and yes...we have magic powers that allow us to fit many people in 1992 Honda Civics.
@ Nex
"I'm Italian."
Same shit.
I'm actually Mexican, and yes...we have magic powers that allow us to fit many people in 1992 Honda Civics.
@ ArrestedDeveloper
its true that Penny Arcade is involved in the advertisement of the game itself. But they've also stated a few times that they don't endorse anything without trying out some sort of build of the game, no matter how far along it is. In other words, they only endorse games that they actually enjoy, not ones that just shove money down their throats.
its true that Penny Arcade is involved in the advertisement of the game itself. But they've also stated a few times that they don't endorse anything without trying out some sort of build of the game, no matter how far along it is. In other words, they only endorse games that they actually enjoy, not ones that just shove money down their throats.
I've got to side with Penny Arcade here. Too much authority is given by gamers to reviewers and review sites. A review is merely an opinion given for the purpose of giving an impression of a game. Gabe was clearly just saying, "Hey, I like this game, reviews be damned. Don't let a review discourage you from trying this out, if you want to."
IGN - who, by the way, have always sucked and will evermore continue to suck profusely - were just being oversensitive pricks. Gabe never even mentioned them by name, until they started overreacting to his original post. Believe me, IGN doesn't want to fuck with Gabe or Tycho.
IGN - who, by the way, have always sucked and will evermore continue to suck profusely - were just being oversensitive pricks. Gabe never even mentioned them by name, until they started overreacting to his original post. Believe me, IGN doesn't want to fuck with Gabe or Tycho.
I'm surprised at how many people continue to say that PA "attacked" IGN when it was even explained on the PA site that they hadn't targeted IGN specifically, and even cited a different score (7.0) than what IGN gave the game! The links are all there, people. I've never even visited Penny Arcade before today, and I was able to see what took place. Are you guys who keep saying IGN was provoked just plain stupid, or too lazy to click on the links, or what?
I'm surprised at how many people continue to say that PA "attacked" IGN when it was even explained on the PA site that they hadn't targeted IGN specifically, and even cited a different score (7.0) than what IGN gave the game! The links are all there, people. I've never even visited Penny Arcade before today, and I was able to see what took place. Are you guys who keep saying IGN was provoked just too lazy to click on the links, or what?
I think it's sick that nex is targeting IGN and PA just because they're sympathetic to white people. You make me fucking sick.
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