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Pachter: Music games gave us too much value for money photo

It's no secret that the over-saturated music game genre isn't doing as well as it used to. Analyst Michael Pachter believes there is one big reason for 2009's music game decline -- the games didn't withhold enough content. 

"Publishers have probably done themselves a disservice by giving us way too much value for our money with each of these games," explains the mighty soothsayer. "You just get way too much content. The installed base has a lot of music, and they don't really need a lot more. It's sort of like buying more books when you have a stack of books left to read. You just don't."

Really? I thought it was because people saw DJ Hero, said "that sh*t looks absolutely retarded" and then left the music game genre alone to jump the shark as it's done. People just don't have enough room for anymore pieces of plastic crap, and I don't think "value" has much to do with it. With Activision releasing about five Guitar Hero games a year, I reckon the market has simply reached breaking point.








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48 comments | showing # 1 to 48
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Chris Carter's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 10:04
Chris Carter
LEGO Rockband has "value" with 45 songs? I'd say most music games don't have enough content.

I easily agree with you Jim. Despite DJ Hero being the freshest thing since Guitar Hero 1, people are just fed up with plastic toys. Even years before Rock Band, a lot of people (myself included) had Karaoke Revolution, and played Drums at local arcades. It's been saturated for quite a while.
eduh's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 10:12
eduh
header is so good
Kraid's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 10:16
Kraid
Patcher should GTFO.
GooN's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 10:19
GooN
picture is no good... lol

RIP Britney Murphy... The world lost another blah blah blah
whatisdelicious's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 10:19
whatisdelicious
Oh look, another instance of Michael Pachter telling us something that actually makes sense but we as gamers don't want to hear, so we ridicule him for it without really thinking it through.

Great. I love these.
Crock23A's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 10:20
Crock23A
Rock Band 2 is the best music game out there and it's over a year old. Keep the content flowing...1000+ songs and counting!

Add the harmonies to Rock Band 3 next year and let me keep my existing library of downloaded music. Also let me customized the background of the note tracks to add some variation to the half of my TV I am actually looking at while playing.
Smuckers's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 10:24
Smuckers
yeah i got rock band 2 w/instruments and beatles rock band (game only). I don't want anymore plastic crap and if i feel like new songs i'll dl a couple . I don't see myself purchasing another music game in the future.
Strandli's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 10:28
Strandli
What?!
One of the very few games entitled to the "too much value" title, is The Orange Box, that was a STEAL!
I can't understand Pachters logic here, it's abnormally stupid today.
DF's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 10:32
DF
Yeah, oversaturization helps no market. The fact that GH5 came bundled with GH Van Halen? Good God! Next they'll be putting in GH Popular Bands A-Z in cereal boxes.
TehBuLL's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 10:32
TehBuLL
ya, i should buy things that cost more than what they are worth...someone should teach the main fundamental of economy to Pachter, supply and demand. they keep supplying shit i dont want.
nummy6's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 10:33
nummy6
DJ Hero is the only music game I own. And I love this hell out of it.

People who say its shit just havent played it yet.
Holyetheline's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 10:33
Holyetheline
I loved that episode of TVGSWID! hahaha It was one of my favorites!
nummy6's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 10:33
nummy6
*the
Nephlabobo's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 10:33
Nephlabobo
Yes, withholding *more* content is going to sell more games, Pachter.

What a knob.
KrazyKraut's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 10:38
KrazyKraut
the header is awesome...like ya sun-glasses
KwikPwn's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 10:42
KwikPwn
Wow, Pachter is amazing, how can he analyze data that's already in and still get it wrong?
Kvb's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 10:45
Kvb
That's right. The decline of the music game has nothing to do with the 20 Guitar Hero games we've gotten since Guitar Hero 1, a mere 4 years ago.
sprldr's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 10:59
sprldr
Does anyone remember Music 2000 for the PS1?

I had fun with that.
mizzougrad01's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 11:29
mizzougrad01
Pachter and everyone else on the Bonus Round can go fuck themselves!
Master Snake's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 11:38
Master Snake
What happened to you, Pachter? You used to be cool...

*chortles*

Also, I literally LOL'ed at mizzougrad01's comment. Thanks for that one...
Volomon's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 11:51
Volomon
I say he's got it backwards, it offers to little value. It's like buying a car, instead of books. Who the hell goes out and buys another one, it's to expensive to replace the one you got every few years just cause you want to stay in the tread.
SASUGA RIVAL's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 12:12
SASUGA RIVAL
He is full of shit.
Vanilla Gorilla's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 12:19
Vanilla Gorilla
Actually Rock Band DLC is just shit. I continue to buy it, but only when it is not shit, but when it is shit, I don't buy it, so shit.

If Rock Band 3 won't let you import all your Rock Band 2 content, that will officially be the end of the rhythm music game genre. Pachter can quote me on that if he wants.
Andrew5329's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 12:29
Andrew5329
So dozens of Guitar Hero remakes half of which recycle songs from previous games... way way too much value....
Tascar's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 12:31
Tascar
Umm, I'm pretty sure that Michael Pachter did not say that music games were failing because "the games didn't withhold enough content."

From his discussion on the Bonus Round, which is where I initially heard Pachter's thoughts on music games, I think he made it clear that the issue was simply that there was an over saturation of these games on the market. Given that so many people had already bought tons of Guitar Hero and Rock Band games and very likely not even finished all of the content on the existing games, it's quite possible that they simply didn't consider Beatles Rock Band an essential purchase, especially when many of the older games had been so heavily discounted by that time that in comparison, they might have been seen as a better value for the money than Beatles Rock Band. I think he also conceded that the appeal of the Beatles may have been overestimated as a selling point.

As for "DJ Hero," in that same episode of Bonus Round, I don't remember if Pachter said anything specific about that game other than that he felt that it was a much harder sell than the Guitar Hero / Rock Band games because it's easier to sell the idea of a guitar game than a DJ game, which I think most people would agree with.

So yeah, Pachter did indeed say that music games were "giving us way too much value for our money" but I do not think he meant that the studios should be withholding content from its games.
mrplow8's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 12:48
mrplow8
I think it's because they got greedy. You can get away with releasing a sequel every year that's basically the same as the previous year's game(see Madden), but when you start releasing the same game every month you've crossed the line.
KingSigy's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 13:17
KingSigy
You know what? I agree with this. Maybe if solid games didn't come out, we'd still be grabbing up shitty track packs. But the fact that one developer (Harmonix) decided to create an amazing track list of 84 songs means that I shouldn't have to deal with only 40 tracks and 20 real good ones.
Electrium's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 13:29
Electrium
I might agree with him, but I don't think the word value has anything to do with it. We're sure as hell oversaturated with music games, that much is obvious. But when I think value, I definitely don't think of $120 plastic turntable video games.
KwikPwn's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 13:33
KwikPwn
I think the problem now facing them is that they've half assed their business model. They need to decide what the draw is.
If they want the game itself to be the draw they need to allow players to import their own tracks, CDs and mp3s included,then release a new game every year or two that will sell on the merits on the improvements over the previous iteration.
On the other hand if they expect the draw to be the music itself and want to make their money with multiple yearly releases and dlc the games have to be alot cheaper, on par with their cd counterparts, and throwing in a digital copy you could listen to on your iPod/Zune would make buying tracks for the games much less painful.
I feel that by not definitively choosing one model or the other, they're choking the life out of the genre.
zanthox's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 13:59
zanthox
Oh my goodness, I gotta watch that again. I forgot how hilarious it was.
shinryu's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 14:14
shinryu
of course there was gonna be a dip in sales. did they expect everybody to buy new instruments all over again for GH5 and shit?
AceFlibble's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 14:28
AceFlibble
Pachter's a fookin' gay.

But seriously, it really is such a simple answer I don't know why he even bothered commenting on it; they pumped out too many games and the market for rhythm games has crashed, or is at leats in the process of doing so.
Roek's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 14:42
Roek
I sort of agree with Pachter's stance. Between my brother and I on the same Xbox Live account, we've bought enough Rock Band DLC to equal the value in price of another Rock Band 2 game ($60 disc-only) and then some. Then I was impressed by Guitar Hero 5 and picked that up when it came out as well, which ended up giving me some duplicate songs but mostly favorable new stuff to play. And then there was Beatles: Rock Band, which I got the first DLC for (All You Need is Love) and the first two full albums.

I demo'd DJ Hero in stores and like it, and it seems that other people who stopped by have the same feeling (most of the time the demo is being played by someone). I just feel like I've had plenty of music game content lately, as well as other new games that have come out that demand more attention.
poonster's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 14:47
poonster
no it's not the giving away too much content, the reason DJ Hero isn't selling is absolutely because it just plain is "retarded".these new peripherals are getting dumber and dumber,quick example the Tony Hawk skateboard <----not selling either.
Gerardo Paz's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 15:08
Gerardo Paz
DJ Hero doesn't sell because your dropping as much money for a Rock Band set but only for one accessory. I bought DJ Hero and been playing the thing non stop for two weeks. The songs are addictive and I love ALL of them which is a rarity in ANY music game. However its pricey and lack of a party mode which is a good justification for those looking to buy Rock Band. Pretty much you know you'll be playing with other players so you're getting a pretty good value.

Also unlike Tony Hawk Ride, the DJ Turntable is actually responsive and is fun to play with.
mi55ter's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 15:18
mi55ter
This Pachter guy really talks a load of shit, doesn´t he. First, "Borderlands sent out to die", and now this
Slick Icarus II's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 15:20
Slick Icarus II
As fantastic as DJ Hero and Beatles Rock Band were, I can't see myself ever buying another piece of plastic. I already got my Rock Band 2 instruments, Guitar Hero 3 guitar, DJ Hero turntable and DK Jungle Beat bongos. I think I'm set on the instrument front. I won't be buying another piece of plastic till my Rock Band 2 stuff craps out.
Syn's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 16:00
Syn
I call shenanigans. I still don't have any reason to buy RB, I've got maybe 20 DLC songs on GH5. I've listed over 40 bands that I would like to see ONE song from, if they released one ALBUM from each of those bands the number of songs available would increase by 50%.

But whatever, I don't care, I'll just go play with my real guitar if these tools don't want my money.
Gameboi's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 16:41
Gameboi
As a guitar and music fan, I love these games. However, when you wake up one day to find out you now have a collection of plastic guitars cluttering the house, and each collection seems to be little more than new songs added, you reach a point where you don't need any more sequels. You either download new songpacks, or just jam with what you have... which is plenty in my opinion.
DarkTetsuya's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 19:15
DarkTetsuya
keep it down! do you *want* bobby kotick to hear you? God only knows if he wanted he'd charge $300 if he thought he could...
Roek's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 22:18
Roek
I sort of agree with Pachter's stance. Between my brother and I on the same Xbox Live account, we've bought enough Rock Band DLC to equal the value in price of another Rock Band 2 game ($60 disc-only) and then some. Then I was impressed by Guitar Hero 5 and picked that up when it came out as well, which ended up giving me some duplicate songs but mostly favorable new stuff to play. And then there was Beatles: Rock Band, which I got the first DLC for (All You Need is Love) and the first two full albums.

I demo'd DJ Hero in stores and like it, and it seems that other people who stopped by have the same feeling (most of the time the demo is being played by someone). I just feel like I've had plenty of music game content lately, as well as other new games that have come out that demand more attention.
Fo0dNippl3's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/21/2009 23:59
Fo0dNippl3
I'd normally be the one to jump in and defend music games, but after the announcement of Green Day: Rock Band, I'm just fucking done. I thought DJ Hero was a lot of fun and I am a huge Harmonix fanboy, but short of Rock Band Network, I'm done. I can't take shit like Green Day: Rock Band in stride.
attacanteblue's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/22/2009 03:36
attacanteblue
Shhhhh, want to know something the internets don't want you to know? DJ Hero sold 1.2m+ copies. But shhhhh, don't tell anyone, they still have lots more "DJ Hero bombed" stories to write.

[re-lurks]
jymkata's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/22/2009 04:38
jymkata
I was wondering when Grandmaster Fuck-Knuckle would show up again.
VGSWID needs more of him. And of "Pretentious Videogames Journalist-Mime"
missionmom's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/22/2009 07:27
missionmom
"that shit looks retarded"
wow is all I can say. what exactly does retarded look like anyway. ever stop to think about how your words hurt people in the special needs community? Bet not.
D Chap's Avatar - Comment posted on 12/30/2009 09:44
D Chap
Its amazing how quickly I went from being totally in love with the guitar hero franchise to absolutely not caring about it.

Once the franchise split and rock band came into existence things just out of control.
ralf20010's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/23/2010 04:54
ralf20010
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