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To the story hopefully it won't be more silly bullshit like having someone control a sparkly collecting shit like in Mario Galaxy.
So how much will this asymmetrical multiplayer console experience cost? Or perhaps you could tell us when we can expect to try it for ourselves?
@Excel
Sure, it's a bit like PC LAN gaming to a degree. With a null-modem cable you can have two PCs on one table connected together both playing C&C and moment you win, you can jump to your feet and give your opponent your biggest best O face.
Sure, it's a bit like PC LAN gaming to a degree. With a null-modem cable you can have two PCs on one table connected together both playing C&C and moment you win, you can jump to your feet and give your opponent your biggest best O face.
i was gonna say, arnt all online multiplayer games generally asymmetrical? since each player is playing the same game but on a different screen?
or is this more like, one player is playing the game like a RTS and the others are playing it like an FPS? as in different games, different screens, but together in the same game?
or is this more like, one player is playing the game like a RTS and the others are playing it like an FPS? as in different games, different screens, but together in the same game?
@ Excel:
I loved Pac-Man versus back in the gamecube days but thanks to all the cables and gameboys you needed, hardly anyone ever played it.
I loved Pac-Man versus back in the gamecube days but thanks to all the cables and gameboys you needed, hardly anyone ever played it.
I'd care more if they had something on the system worth playing. Pikmin 3 is a good start. But I can't muster a single fuck to give over another 2D Mario title.
So turning a hardware limitation regarding an inability to use more than one tablet (maybe two later on) at a time, and the requirement of regaining payers to use the waggle-wands into a shameless PR opportunity TOTALLY makes me excited.
@fetusmilk
Playing on different screens isn't what "asymmetrical multiplayer" means. It's that the players have different roles, playing the game in a substantially different way.
There's been a few PC titles to dabble in this, I can remember a couple games where one player would be playing an RTS title, seeing a huge world map and giving commands, where others would play as individual units, to them the game being more like an FPS or flight sim or whatever.
Pac-Man Versus on the Gamecube was a pretty good example of this. You had three people with Gamecube controllers playing as the ghosts in a Pac-Man stage. They shared a split screen view on the television, giving them each a limited 3D "third person" view of the maze.
The fourth player played as Pac-Man, viewing the whole map exactly like they were playing the old arcade game.
For such a simple concept it was a tonne of fun.
Playing on different screens isn't what "asymmetrical multiplayer" means. It's that the players have different roles, playing the game in a substantially different way.
There's been a few PC titles to dabble in this, I can remember a couple games where one player would be playing an RTS title, seeing a huge world map and giving commands, where others would play as individual units, to them the game being more like an FPS or flight sim or whatever.
Pac-Man Versus on the Gamecube was a pretty good example of this. You had three people with Gamecube controllers playing as the ghosts in a Pac-Man stage. They shared a split screen view on the television, giving them each a limited 3D "third person" view of the maze.
The fourth player played as Pac-Man, viewing the whole map exactly like they were playing the old arcade game.
For such a simple concept it was a tonne of fun.
If Paradox Interactive can bring asymmetric gameplay to the PC with Dungeonland, I am sure other studios can do it for the Wii U. Incidentally, I would love to see Dungeonland come to the Wii U.
what i do hope for is that all games that support online co-op will support offline co-op on Wii U: one person using wiiremote/standard controller on TV screen and another one using WiiU Pad as their screen. this should be THE standard for all games in my opinion.
Who am I kidding, The Wii U experience will just devolve into Waggleware, "use the tablet to hunt the pixel", or use the GamePad Pro to do direct ports of 360 / PS3 games. After this generation is done, the Wii U will become like the Wii, that sad little console that no one wants to write games for or port games to.
We're working on exactly this right at this moment here at Broken Rules: asymmetrical multiplayer for the Wii U. Actually we were talking about Pacman Versus just yesterday – it serves as a great inspiration. There is huge potential for straight-forward multiplayer fun with the Wii U. Our testers would agree but they're not allowed to talk about it (insert evil laugh).
I see we're starting the "It has no games" and the "it's features are underused" talk early, as in before it's even released.
Oh nintendo, people love to hate you
Oh nintendo, people love to hate you
This will be fun for Mario Party U (or whatever they end up calling it when it is inevitably released). For every other game ever, this will not be fun.
"Whether publishers take advantage of this potential (clue: they won't) is another matter entirely. "
I think they will
alot of devs took advantage of the ds second screen and made some really great exclusives
I think they will
alot of devs took advantage of the ds second screen and made some really great exclusives
@excel
Hunter/Hunted (I think that was the name) is the only thing that springs to mind for me. That multilayer was a blast.
Hunter/Hunted (I think that was the name) is the only thing that springs to mind for me. That multilayer was a blast.
Didn't Ubisoft demo their Rayman game at E3 with such a design? Two Players we're doing the platforming (forgive me as I have never played a Rayman game before so names don't come up) and the other played a new support character that would move scenery and objects around to help the move on, and some other parts as well that escape me for the moment.
I'm more inclined to see what this can bring in hopes it would make fun games built up with the WiiU, instead of just dismissing it on the spot.
I'm more inclined to see what this can bring in hopes it would make fun games built up with the WiiU, instead of just dismissing it on the spot.
It just seems problematic to me to
a) base your entire system around a kind of gameplay that has rarely worked and always been problematic
b) not have games to show us that convince us you're really got it figured out
a) base your entire system around a kind of gameplay that has rarely worked and always been problematic
b) not have games to show us that convince us you're really got it figured out
They're going to be severely limited by the Wii U GamePad not having a processor of its own. Right now a deeper asyncronous multiplayer experience means "a 5th player can poke bridges and elevators and make them do stuff."
@stealth
Gotta disagree with you there stealth. There are very few games on the DS that TRULY take advantage of both screens. Most great DS games have your attention focused on one screen 90 percent of the time, while the other screen could easily be replaced by a HUD or pause screen. The only DS games I can think of that could ONLY be done on a two screened system are The World Ends With You, and Henry Hatsworth. The DS also has its two screens in the same field of vision, so it's even more cumbersome to change your attention from one screen to another with the Wii U.
@the story
Multiplayer is in fact the only place where these gimmicks are acceptable if they are actually optional (these gimmicks are more and more stretching the bounds of the word "optional"). Otherwise yeah, nintendo comes out with some control gimmick, and only one or two developers actually take good advantage of it, the rest just ignore it, or completely ruin the game by tacking it on.
Gotta disagree with you there stealth. There are very few games on the DS that TRULY take advantage of both screens. Most great DS games have your attention focused on one screen 90 percent of the time, while the other screen could easily be replaced by a HUD or pause screen. The only DS games I can think of that could ONLY be done on a two screened system are The World Ends With You, and Henry Hatsworth. The DS also has its two screens in the same field of vision, so it's even more cumbersome to change your attention from one screen to another with the Wii U.
@the story
Multiplayer is in fact the only place where these gimmicks are acceptable if they are actually optional (these gimmicks are more and more stretching the bounds of the word "optional"). Otherwise yeah, nintendo comes out with some control gimmick, and only one or two developers actually take good advantage of it, the rest just ignore it, or completely ruin the game by tacking it on.
I still don't want to be the one 'stuck' with the gamepad. It's something i'd give to a younger sibling to keep them out of the way of the game.
"I think they will
alot of devs took advantage of the ds second screen and made some really great exclusives"
That's a portable, easier to take risks, console wise not many devs gave a fuck about the wiimote or its unique features.
alot of devs took advantage of the ds second screen and made some really great exclusives"
That's a portable, easier to take risks, console wise not many devs gave a fuck about the wiimote or its unique features.
So.. He basically just rehashed a lot of what was said at the last 2 E3's?
Cause they've talked about this before, and I think they think that if they keep throwing the word "asymmetrical" around, that no one will look it up and find out its not some awesome-cool word, or that it means someone gets boned out of using that tablet.
"Of course, this is all true in theory. Whether publishers take advantage of this potential (clue: they won't) is another matter entirely. "
I don't see how its really a theory. If they don't allow the use of more then one tablet (Yes, I know, they say we'll be able to use 2 *at some point*, but it won't be at launch), and a game uses the tablet at all while more then one play, then its asymmetrical.
The only way its going to be different is if they bail out because they realize they've pissed people off and started fist fights in living rooms across the globe. It'll be the next "throw your Wii-mote at your TV momement" and they'll either have to stop asymmetrical gameplay, allow more then 1 tablet to be used sooner, or pack their games with drugs to calm people the fuck down.
Cause they've talked about this before, and I think they think that if they keep throwing the word "asymmetrical" around, that no one will look it up and find out its not some awesome-cool word, or that it means someone gets boned out of using that tablet.
"Of course, this is all true in theory. Whether publishers take advantage of this potential (clue: they won't) is another matter entirely. "
I don't see how its really a theory. If they don't allow the use of more then one tablet (Yes, I know, they say we'll be able to use 2 *at some point*, but it won't be at launch), and a game uses the tablet at all while more then one play, then its asymmetrical.
The only way its going to be different is if they bail out because they realize they've pissed people off and started fist fights in living rooms across the globe. It'll be the next "throw your Wii-mote at your TV momement" and they'll either have to stop asymmetrical gameplay, allow more then 1 tablet to be used sooner, or pack their games with drugs to calm people the fuck down.
@Excel
You can't think of an example because it hasn't really happened. Devs/publishers have been too into giving everyone the same experiences, because telling people they're not included is pretty much the exact opposite way you usually sell a game experience.
You can't think of an example because it hasn't really happened. Devs/publishers have been too into giving everyone the same experiences, because telling people they're not included is pretty much the exact opposite way you usually sell a game experience.
@llort het
Weve had this discussion before if I recall. Did you play bowsers inside story? or jump ultimate? or layton? or any other game that uses the screen to its fullest
I dont know what ds you were playing but I could never see both screens at the same time, it was 1 or the other
Weve had this discussion before if I recall. Did you play bowsers inside story? or jump ultimate? or layton? or any other game that uses the screen to its fullest
I dont know what ds you were playing but I could never see both screens at the same time, it was 1 or the other
@hushlorentz
It does have it's own processor.. and memory..
It won't be discussed right now, but the Wii U gamepad can actually play small games itself independent of the Wii U system..
There will be more about this closer to the launch.
It does have it's own processor.. and memory..
It won't be discussed right now, but the Wii U gamepad can actually play small games itself independent of the Wii U system..
There will be more about this closer to the launch.
@BoomingEchoes:
The only example of attempted asymmetric mutiplayer I can think of is from Team Fortress 2's developer commentary. Originally, teams consisted of a commander who watched the entire game play out and issued orders and the normal players who actually fought. Valve cut the commander role because it wasn't popular with playtesters, even though they really liked the idea at the time.
The only example of attempted asymmetric mutiplayer I can think of is from Team Fortress 2's developer commentary. Originally, teams consisted of a commander who watched the entire game play out and issued orders and the normal players who actually fought. Valve cut the commander role because it wasn't popular with playtesters, even though they really liked the idea at the time.
@Stealth Yeah, 3 games... Since when did continuing the imagine of the background constitute using two screens well?
[img]http://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&source=mog&hl=en&gl=us&tab=wi&q=bowser's%20inside%20story&sa=N&biw=320&bih=544#i=42[/img]
Nintendo, home of the largest annual iterative sequels, and creator of controller paradigms that serve as solutions to problems that don't exist.
[img]http://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&source=mog&hl=en&gl=us&tab=wi&q=bowser's%20inside%20story&sa=N&biw=320&bih=544#i=42[/img]
Nintendo, home of the largest annual iterative sequels, and creator of controller paradigms that serve as solutions to problems that don't exist.
He listed 1 game so i listed 3. If I wanted to keep going I could have but I wanted to spare him a wall of text.
"creator of controller paradigms that serve as solutions to problems that don't exist."
Pachter, is that you?
"creator of controller paradigms that serve as solutions to problems that don't exist."
Pachter, is that you?
@Jinx 01
Nintendo isn't really basing the WiiU around asymmetric gameplay. They are basing it around single player controller-with-touchscreen gameplay.
They are only promoting asymmetric gameplay as a feature because they knew they couldn't afford to push the idea of people buying enough extra controller-with-touchscreen controllers. Heck, Nintendo couldn't even successfully push the GC-GBA link, which was created under the theory that everyone already owned a GBA.
Of course even that might not matter if the Wii U isn't physically capable of driving four screen-controllers simultaneously. But again, Nintendo was focused on the single-player experience. They wanted a new gimmick to push the WiiU, and economics meant that they couldn't expect to share that gimmick equally across all possible players.
Nintendo isn't really basing the WiiU around asymmetric gameplay. They are basing it around single player controller-with-touchscreen gameplay.
They are only promoting asymmetric gameplay as a feature because they knew they couldn't afford to push the idea of people buying enough extra controller-with-touchscreen controllers. Heck, Nintendo couldn't even successfully push the GC-GBA link, which was created under the theory that everyone already owned a GBA.
Of course even that might not matter if the Wii U isn't physically capable of driving four screen-controllers simultaneously. But again, Nintendo was focused on the single-player experience. They wanted a new gimmick to push the WiiU, and economics meant that they couldn't expect to share that gimmick equally across all possible players.
I love Critters!! The movie encapsuled all that I love from 80's horror. Did anyone else read this in Iwata's voice? CANT UNHEAR
@mrandydixon:
lol yeah. though the system still managed to do great somehow (even if I personally despised it)
@Baines:
The single-player-with-touchscreen thing isn't that great or tested either, is it? Or did the DS do something similar, I never had one. I just no appeal in anything that takes my eyes away from an HDTV to look at a tiny screen instead.
lol yeah. though the system still managed to do great somehow (even if I personally despised it)
@Baines:
The single-player-with-touchscreen thing isn't that great or tested either, is it? Or did the DS do something similar, I never had one. I just no appeal in anything that takes my eyes away from an HDTV to look at a tiny screen instead.
"I've never played the Wii U, but I know what I'm talking about somehow."
There you go. No need to read 90% of the comments now.
@Andy
The Wii Remote+Nunchuk is the best controller created if programmed correctly, and Nintendo and third-party developers have proved that time and time again. Red Steel 2 and Metroid Prime 3, for example, have better controls that any other FPS on any other platform, bar-none. If Nintendo can make the GamePad's features work like the IR sensor on the Wii Remote, everything will be fine.
There you go. No need to read 90% of the comments now.
@Andy
The Wii Remote+Nunchuk is the best controller created if programmed correctly, and Nintendo and third-party developers have proved that time and time again. Red Steel 2 and Metroid Prime 3, for example, have better controls that any other FPS on any other platform, bar-none. If Nintendo can make the GamePad's features work like the IR sensor on the Wii Remote, everything will be fine.
Ha ha, you could play Spy Party on one system like this as long as you make the person with the big controller thing go into another room.
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