When LittleBigPlanet was recalled due to a backing track referencing The Qur'an, a few of our more level-headed readers were quick to share such pearls of wisdom as "f*ck Islam." It's true that a handful of Muslims got offended by the music on the Sony forums, but in the case of at least one Islamic group, the recall of the game is more offensive than the Qur'an reference.
M. Zuhdi Jasser, M.D., president of the American Islamic Forum for Democracy stated that freedom of speech was important, even if he might personally disagree with what is being said. He also suggested that other Muslims who believe in tolerance and freedom think the same way.
"Muslims cannot benefit from freedom of expression and religion and then turn around and ask that anytime their sensibilities are offended that the freedom of others be restricted.
The free market allows for expression of disfavor by simply not purchasing a game that may be offensive.
…To demand that [the game] be withdrawn is predicated on a society which gives theocrats who wish to control speech far more value than the central principle of freedom of expression upon which the very practice and freedom of religion is based.
The fact that the music writer is a devout Muslim should highlight that at the core of this issue is not about offending ‘all Muslims,’ but only about freedom of expression and the free market."
Jasser has his head screwed on, and I really couldn't agree with him more. It applies to everyone, not just Muslims. We enjoy the benefits of free speech and democracy, but a worrying amoung of us want to do away with those benefits once we see or hear something we don't like. That kind of societal double standard needs to stop.
Jim Sterling serves as reviews editor for Destructoid.com, head of the Podtoid podcast, and produces a number of news stories, original features, one-of-a-kind videos. With his passionate argumentative style, controversial opinions, harsh delivery, and dedication to brutal honesty Sterling is a name that you can't help but recognize.
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Contest:
8:02 AM on 10.21.2008
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although "common sense" doesn't seem to be that common these days...
Perhaps certain people will learn a lesson here about not putting every Muslim into the same bracket when it comes to offensive material and thei reactions. Wow, they are all individual people with different feelings afterall.
Lots of growing up to be done out there.
There are a lot of democracy loving freedom of speech believing Muslims.
like yours truly
Nah, I'm jes' playing. Islam is the largest/fastest growing religion in the world. With so many believers, there are bound to be a few idiots amongst them. This man isn't one of them.
I'm glad this guy is reasonable but Salmon Rushdie and a couple of Danish cartoonists would like to have a word...
Kudos to the guy, said pretty much exactly what should be said.
QFMFT
I think if we're placing blame for the extreme kneejerk reaction, it should be on Sony.
While I like someone taking supreme responsibility for content, the move does now seem to have been a move of fear, rather than considering real market impact.
But I guess when you're the same guys putting out demon baby doll ads and throwing goat slaughtering greek parties to commemorate the release of God of War II, you've got to check yourself . . .
Glad to see someone with some smarts speak up about it.
I don't live in america and 99.99% of the people I know are open minded.
Also, Dr. Jasser sounds like a very wise individual.
Oh well, this just gives me a bit more time to play some Fable 2.
Little Big Planet will be one of those games that probley never looses its users, sort of like the sims. The sims got really boring for some really fast, but the hardcore fans of that game to this day are still loyal enough to buy any type of expanision that is released...or torrent it.
Freedom of speech is the single greatest freedom people can have.
...oh and you know someone is now just going to make a muslim terrorist themed level in retaliation, I'll call that.
I don't live in america and 99.99% of the people I know are open minded.
Except that, you know, the Muslims who complained about this sort of did that themselves. Which isn't to excuse those who engaged in that sort of behavior here, but yeah.
Because when someone made cartoons mocking their prophet they rioted, attacked embassies, and eventually caused the deaths of over 100 people by the time everything was done. Because in Iran people have been hanged for converting to Christianity, and one month ago they passed a new law codifying the death penalty for all apostates.
Maybe if we looked at pure numbers most Muslims are reasonable. I guess that doesn't matter when you have a sizable minority willing to murder anyone who disagrees with them.
Very good point.
Even that guy came out and apologised saying that he "knows what it's like" when games are delayed and that, at most, he expected the game to be released as planned but the song to be "quietly removed" weeks later in a patch. I guess Sony's reaction did more to turn people against the Muslim community than anything else, when really they weren't demanding anything as drastic as a delay. But, that was the only way I guess.
"It's quite normal to play music and be inspired by the words of the Prophet Mohammed. It's my way to attract and inspire people towards Islam."
http://kotaku.com/5066316/man-behind-littlebigplanet-song-says-quran-quotes-are-quite-normal
Seriously though - are people still arguing over this? While it is a damned if you do damned if you don't situation, I do believe that Sony made the right decision just taking it out.
Now can we all get passed this nonsense and get back to talking about how much this game rocks!
But the statement made by this very level-headed gentleman is both true and false at the same time. While I believe the vast majority of Muslims do believe in freedom of all kinds, there are those who are so over the top about their beliefs that they would not just kill you or me to make their point, but themselves as well. I think that is the scariest thing about the Islamic extremists that we in the west see.
I think the catering to the few might just serve the masses in this case...I mean, the same people that this was withdrawn because of are the same people who tried to kill a cartoonist for drawing a certain prohets likeness...As well as putting a woman on trial for her life because the grade school kids she was teaching named a teddy bear a certain prophets name.
I think any kind of ideal that is catered to because of fear, as opposed to having respect for that ideal is sad, and unfortunate. But what would we say if MMs building was attacked by some screwball? It is a sad commentary on where we are as a society, globally, that something so minor could create actions like this. It isn't like the game had a derrogatory attack on Muslims, or their book of faith...
I totally agree with you. Fringe extremists could pick up on a song like what was supposed to be in the game and interpret it as an exploitation. Now do you place your bets, release the game, and hope no one uses the situation to justify an action or do you inconvenience the majority to play it safe?
Or how about this: the game would be released and spark a backlash from radical groups thus causing the conservative base to stand up for video games; in a sick twisted way the controversy could go pretty far in legitimizing games as expressive forms of art by founding two polarizing points of view.
jus' devil's advocate ovah heah :p
And I repeat what I said over at Kotaku: This was a calm request involving no threats of Jihad, and was likely done not because Sony's afraid of jihadists, but rather because Sony wants a whole lotta Muslims to also buy LBP. Fewer offended Muslims = more sales.
From what I've gathered, this was akin to a song in the game containing the words "Jesus was a dumbass". This, then, would lead to fewer Christians playing the game, and would also be removed once someone spotted it and complained.
You think an ant turns to another ant and says I'm not going to help build this bridge of ants with you because you wear a head dress or believe in a different 'god' than I do. No, the ant does what it and all the other ants need it to do. Much like any other organism in a social structure.
Religion separates us, not binds us. It pushes us away from one another because of conjecture defended with blood thirsty intent. And don't try to tell me religions are peaceful. They are only peaceful to the follower within that social-theistic grouping.
Does anyone believe in Zeus? or Apollo? How about any Aton Egyptian deity? Thor? anyone believe in him? Gods are things we use to attach explanations to things we cannot explain. And without agreeing that it is just conjecture, we sit amongst ourselves butting heads.
Religion needs to stop. Believe what you want to believe, but for the love of existence stop pushing each other away.
And calling a whole group of people terrorists, wife-beaters, any insult or even go against them because they choose to believe in a religion just isn't right.
You can share your views about how you think religion is pointless or how it seperates "us" but for them it works, and for most of the people living in this planet they get along with any other minority group.
"Those who uphold religion should not be considered citizens"? Really? Fucking really? Holy Goddamn shit. Are you kidding me? Dear God, I hope there's a missing qualifier there...
What the fuck is wrong with society? We preach about tolerance and acceptance, then turn around and want to ban religion and stone all those who practice it. Bunch of fucking hypocrites. Absolutely disgusting. My religion brings me closer to others, if anything. If I didn't practice any religion, I wouldn't give a fuck about anyone because, frankly, outside of my faith, I can't think of a reason to care about anyone other than myself. Blame religion all you want, but religion has never harmed anyone -- people harm people. Religion is just another excuse, a scapegoat.
I find it obscene that people DO go to churches and DO pray to invisible amorphous beings and DO get the power to change things because they whine moan and attack whenever their 'faith' is questioned or comes into criticism.
I am offended by their offense. But I am told I should just sit back and let this go on and be all right with it. I will tell you the stereotype of religion isn't a warmongering terrorist faction... it's the leftist acceptance that it's all about peace and harmony. Which in all honesty is the BIGGEST lie that they have perpetuated through out our entire history.
It's about control. It's about power. It's about guilt. It's about being able to voice your needs and wants without anyone else being able to ask for justification because you can cry foul and the rest of your clandestine brethren will stand at your side to protect and cover one anothers asses.
"Oh...no it's not...my grandma goes to church and she's a sweet lady." It's not about that. It's the church, not the sweet normal person that goes to it. It is the church that tells them to raise their arms up to protect the massive lie. THAT...is why Little Big Planet is being pulled and changed. THAT is why those who complained or warned about this did so. It is all because someone else told them that if they love their god...they will defend their god. You think it's respect? When did commercialism ever respect ANYTHING but profits? It's FEAR.
Everyone in a religion is against atheists because they feel they are attacked. There is no sense of common respect or opening to discussion. There is god and that is it... It is fairy tale and completely ass backwards to social commonality.
If it weren't true there would not be different types of religion, different types of churches, different types of television programming, different types of schools, censorship of the masses, watering down of holiday rituals, tip toeing on egg shells, massive wars, genocidal actions, social mores that peel back the ability of free speech and entitlement to free information, cultural segregation in certain areas of the world, violent outbursts in the name of a deity, etc.
Yes, there are people who go to church or believe in god that are stable. But they still believe that they are ruled by a power higher than what is here on Earth. And I can't believe I have to say something as fantastical as that, but they do. And believe it or not THEY BAND TOGETHER! In North America how else would have Bush won 2 consecutive terms in office if it weren't for the bible belt? I mean they even REFER to it as the bible belt on newscasts...that's fucking disgusting.
Norwegian Black Metal bands attack churches because the Christian presence back in 990 "AD" completely spread through Scandinavia, pushing the older religion of Vikings out. Is that ok? That this has happened, they should just sit back and be all right with it?
Well, lets look at it from their side... tell me if this sounds ok that someone believes in the quote following and will live their lives by it, protect it, argue it's real, and will even die or attack for it:
"Thor: The Norse God of Thunder, When he rode across the sky in his enormous chariot drawn by goats, there was thunder and lightening. His weapon was the hammer Mjollnir. Thor was the god of farmers and seafarers, always ready to protect humans against the dangerous giants of the underworld."
It's ok for someone to believe in that? They did. They followed that a thousand years ago. The only reason it seems silly is because NOW it seems like a fairy tale. It doesn't seem real because of the way society is now. Plus ethnocentrism reigns over everyones views. Let's believe in Santa too, why not? Ghosts, Vampires, Werewolves, Tooth Fairies and the rest... it's ok that people, in large groups mind you, believe in this? If they did, you would have to accept their beliefs as well(according to the idea of respecting religious ideologies).
Or perhaps a lowly carpenter that spontaneously was born in a womb of a woman who never slept with anyone that was rung up, nailed to a tree, whipped and stabbed until he bled to death and then got up and walked around fully aware and fine after 3 days...that's a zombie...people believe this. The 'son of God' is a zombie. Why is that ok that people believe in that? And more so where do they get off saying he died for all our sins when not everyone KNEW who he was, CARED that this happened, or was even THERE! How can you voice your opinion on the matter if the guy claims it(or those who interpreted it) say it with only a few looking on.
What's better is this:
"To accept Jesus into your life, you must admit that you are sinful, understand that Jesus died for those sins, and that you need to change."
I'm sorry...why do YOU or I have to change? I've probably committed less 'sin' than most of the devout Christians.
People curse and hate upon people like Hitler or Kim Jong-Il or Saddam Hussein or Osama Bin Laden, to name a few KEY personnel in the hate files, but the thing you don't seem to connect to these assholes is they are exactly like the British assholes and the Mesopotamian assholes and the Chinese assholes and the Norsk assholes and the Incan and Mayan assholes that spread their beliefs across their lands fighting anyone else who dared contradict or believe in anything other than what they said. They, for all intents and purposes, were modern day crusaders and just like any other culture. The problem is society continually evolves. And what they were doing is an old barbaric tactic called CONQUERING. It's how the world was grown. And guess what was at the head of it all? The Monarchies and Religion.
But we call them evil. All fueled by the need to push their belief systems upon those they saw below them. Not necessarily religious beliefs, but beliefs none the less, pressed upon the backs of those who don't want them.
The King said to the Priest, "You keep them stupid and I'll keep them poor!" That quote is a personal fav of mine.
You can try to call me a hypocrit saying I am pushing my beliefe of not beliving upon the religious. But there is a major difference there. I am discussing the lack of conjecture, and the focus upon community. It's somewhat Nihilistic I suppose. But looking upon religion in an objective way it has brought upon such a massive steamrolling message of 'embrace your fellow man unless he speaks ill of your god, for you must do unto others as they have done to you'...perhaps it's time us heathens returned that methodology BACK unto the religious? What if the game was taken off the market to put IN Quran quotes and Muslims just HAD to take it? You wouldn't allow that. Don't hurt the peaceful Muslims, you're just stereotyping. No. It's called saying Fuck You to a Catch 22.
Vatican City is a mockery of Christianity and for some reason they just don't see it. All the splendour and lavished wealth...it would make St. Francis of Assisi vomit on the pulpit.
Great stories...but I'll be damned if you expect me to respect anyone believing any religion if ANY ONE PERSON died in the defense, propagation, or benefit of some 'GOD'.
I'm sorry if this offends you, but I can't help but be mighty pissed off just because I have to put up with another slab of bullshit because the idiots of the world have banded together again to over throw something that really shouldn't matter.
I see this as silly and aggrivating as Britney Spears being famous, rich and considered a star or musician.
The world is stupid and Religion is proof of it.
So, you're saying that, because you find religion to be illogical or irrational or whatever, people shouldn't be allowed to practice it? Because that's essentially what you're saying, whether you mean to or not. I don't really understand how you can hold that position. I'm an evangelical Christian, yet I would never want to restrict someone from believing what they believe, nor would I condemn anyone for being unlike me. Free will is a great thing. I don't have to like what you choose to do with it but, hallelujah, it's pretty fucking sweet.
Your stance doesn't offend me, even though you seem to think, or want to think, that it does. I just find it shocking and somewhat incredible. Really, the only things that offend me are personal attacks on Jesus Christ and comments that hurt other people. Otherwise, I usually have more productive uses of my mind and emotions than being offended by something.
Religion is NOT universally about control, power, or guilt. None of those three things ever come into play in my own personal faith. To me, my faith is about a personal relationship with that benevolent, invisible amorphous being and following the teachings of Jesus Christ as best as I can. Religion has been misused by mankind for centuries. That is where your grievance really lies, with man's misuse of it.
Actually, I did end up reading all of that. That's a hell of a comment; I apologize for not matching it. Anyway, no hard feelings, and I'll just say this in closing: Yes, I agree, Christian beliefs (as well as other religions') are wacky. Really fucking wacky, in fact. But that said, I'd rather believe in a really fantastic, ultimately beneficial lie, than a bleak, hopeless truth. If there is no God, I don't see life as being worth living.
Or you could, you know, just not read it.
So, the publisher recalled the game because there was something in there that they didn't want in their game. People shouldn't have the freedom to withhold something that accidentally slipped into the final product?
People do realize this is private enterprise and not public property paid for by tax money, right?