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Manhunt 2, round 2: Take-Two comes out swinging photo

Finally! After a worrying period of silence, non-specific delays, and vague mumblings about standing behind the game, Take-Two havespoken out about their true feelings on Manhunt 2's recent savaging at the hands of the world's ratings boards. It seems going quietly into the night isn't high on their list of things to do today ...

Speaking at a recent meeting, Chairman Strauss Zelnick stated that the company is "dealing with the challenging development in a professional and highly focused manner" and plans to release the game "as unvarnished and unchanged as possible" and "in a responsible fashion."

He went on to be highly vocal about the current state of the ratings system, the changes that need to be made, and what Take-Two intends to do in order to get Manhunt 2 out and into the hands of its intended audience. Hit the jump to find out what he said. 

We don't see ourselves in the AO business, and if we find ourselves there, it would be because we have a title we consider art and entertainment, that we consider appropriately rated at AO, that we’d like to bring to market.

In that instance, one has to ask oneself what is the purpose of a rating if it means that effectively the title can't be released. 

Zelnick continued that the problem "doesn't fall at the doorstep of the retailers," and that it's

...not correct to be critical of retailers, because this is a voluntary ratings organization in the U.S. We have to be critical of ourselves if we've allowed a system to develop that prevents us from bringing a title to market.

In adding that this sitituation is "something we have to address," he also noted that Take-Two's CEO is on the board of the ESA, and pointed out that the company "could envision changes that would make sense." He continued:

The notion of having a rating we don't think is appropriate is one issue. If we feel a rating is appropriate and we can't bring it to market, that seems somewhat nonsensical, and both issues need to be addressed. 

Zelnick was also open about the fact that Take-Two are

...absolutely looking at digital downloading... We're in that business aggressively,

and notably added

We do think its terribly important to bring original producers' and creators' vision of Manhunt 2 to the public.

If that we means we have to be clever about how we distribute it, we will be ambitious and aggressive about bringing that to market. 

Good news? Most definitely. The fact that we live in a day and age in which the games industry is bigger than Hollywood, yet still can't produce creative works intended for an adult audience without fear of this kind of treatment, beggars believe. While solid and responsible ratings are the cornerstone of a legitimate, eclectic entertainment medium, a situation in which works can be effectively banned from their intended audience devalues the whole system and puts us back at least ten years.

The industry needs to make a mature and responsible stand here in order to shake up some outdated perceptions and create a more workable system for the modern-day gaming climate. Who knows, in inciting this kind of a reaction, this whole Manhunt 2 mess might actually turn out to have done us a favor in the long run. 

[Via Gamasutra. Thanks to the eight thousand people who sent in the tip. We love you all.] 


Continue: More Take-Two stories





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37 comments | showing # 1 to 37

angeldsouza's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 12:23
angeldsouza
Yeh, totally agree with this, it's a all a big farce, nobody kicks off when Leon gets his head chopped off with a chainsaw in RE4. Whoooo GOOOO Manhunt 2
DJDuffy 's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 12:27
DJDuffy
this might be slightly premature, but what the hell:

Snaileb 's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 12:27
Snaileb
"...absolutely looking at digital downloading... we're in that business aggressively, "

Sounds like a threat.
Joe Burling's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 12:27
Joe Burling
How many Joe Burlings must tip?
David Houghton 's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 12:28
David Houghton
As many as possible.
GuitarAtomik's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 12:31
GuitarAtomik
I agree except for the fact that the retailers ARE the problem. If Wal-Mart and Best Buy stocked AO games, I doubt any of the big 3 would have a problem releasing them on their consoles. They do have the right to refuse it but when they stock UN-RATED fucking movies and proudly display and advertise them, they look a little hypocritical.
BlindsideDork's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 12:34
BlindsideDork
Not that most care but EB Games/GameStop have this down as 10/01/07 release...hmmmm
whackmushrooms's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 12:34
whackmushrooms
if thats swinging i would hate to see this guy in a bar fight .. release it anyway spend a shitload on ads telling people to buy it online ;) thats swinging.
Johnny Blaze's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 12:35
Johnny Blaze
he also noted that Take-Two's CEO is on the board of the ESA, and pointed out that the company "could envision changes that would make sense.".


Glad to see some one with common sense about video games is on the board to give adult gamers a voice for what the feel they can play..
bluemeep's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 12:38
bluemeep
@GuitarAtomik: Now, now. You can't possibly deny the artistic vision of the unrated version of Frathouse Hyjinks 3: The Boobening. Shit's deep, man.
twesterm's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 12:41
twesterm
To tell you the truth, I'm glad the game got rated AO and I'm glad Take-2 is in the situation they are in.

They can whine and complain that their game is art and shouldn't be censored, but at the end of the day, they knew that Sony and Nintendo won't release an AO game on their consoles and they know what makes a game AO. It's their own fault for trying to push the boundaries over and over again and they finally got burnt. Now they're just trying to dig themselves out of their own grave by being loud and obnoxious which probably really isn't going to help.
twesterm's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 12:43
twesterm
Also, if they were truly so adamant about the public seeing the original creation, they would just make it a downloadable PC game and leave it at that. They gambled and they lost and they have to try to make of it what they can.
Rockvillian's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 12:44
Rockvillian
Now I know how to sell my games. Thanks Rockstar!
David Houghton 's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 12:44
David Houghton
whack: The problem with that is that Nintendo and Sony won't allow the game to be released on their formats until the rating is dropped to M, so something has to be done in the ratings area first. If you were talking about a downloadable PC release though, I can see that happening at some point.

I find Take-Two listing the game for pre-order at six different outlets on their site fairly telling of their current attitude.
ConsFEARacy's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 12:44
ConsFEARacy
2 many 2's two digest!
GuitarAtomik's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 12:47
GuitarAtomik
@bluemeep

I'd buy any movie with "The Boobening" in the title.
bluemeep's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 12:57
bluemeep
You're talkin' to a guy that owns two copies of Teenage Catgirls in Heat.

But yeah. Sometimes you have to wonder when there's a five foot cardboard standee advertising copies of Hostel with extra human drippings sitting in plain view.
GuitarAtomik's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 13:16
GuitarAtomik
I think retailers are just afraid that AO automatically means full on hardcore virtual porn (the sex kind), which technically if such a game were released, that would be true.

Maybe we just need a harder rating than AO or a "porn" descriptor for anything involving more sex than a normal "R" rated movie.MAybe they wouldn't be so scared of it then and just refuse to carry anything with a "porn" descriptor.
Mxyzptlk's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 13:18
Mxyzptlk
I would be willing to bet 5 Quatloos that Manhunt 2's content would have gotten an M rating if it was submitted before the Hot Coffee scandal. The ESRB is pulling this shit to make themselves appear relevant to grandstanding "think of the children" legislators. That's what this really is about.
Joseph Leray's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 13:19
Joseph Leray
I'm still kind of undecided on this issue -- on the one hand, Manhunt is definitely AO material. People that aren't adults shouldn't be playing it.

On the other, Nintendo, Sony, and retailers are all well within their rights when they decided what will or won't appear on their consoles and stores.

The real problem is that we live in a society where these companies would receive so much backlash for carrying adult-appropriate content. If Sony and WalMart were free of nanny-group backlash, I don't think there would be a problem. Like I've said before, this is more than a gaming industry problem and more of a societal problem.
jerrt's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 13:29
jerrt
man, this is good news. i'm glad the conversation is still open to discussion.
subnet6's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 13:34
subnet6
Lets not get on a high horse about Take Two "deserving" this or that. I firmly believe Take Two has already built out an M version of this game. I think the submission of the AL version was a stunt. I think they made the game as violent as possible with the INTENT to get an AO rating, just so they could follow up with an already built M version to save the day. I think they will muck about in the press to delay things and build hype till the holidays, and then release the M version on consoles and the AO version for download and make a lot of cash. If you think they are not in control here, I think you're mistaken. They have been shoveling edgy content for nearly a decade. I think they know exactly what they're doing.
GuitarAtomik's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 13:51
GuitarAtomik
I don't know though. I've heard reports from people that played it that said it didn't seem much more violent than any other M rated game. They felt it was AO as in kids shouldn't play it but in the same way that kids shouldn't be playing GTA.

Of course if you start to enter ConspiracyLand, it's possible they only let people play the M version and then sent the ESRB the AO version.
ExpertPenguin's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 14:11
ExpertPenguin
Either way, it's the making of what seems like a very good catalyst for change.
908peruvian's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 14:25
908peruvian
I JUST STARTED PRACTICING MURDERING IN
THE ORIGINAL MANHUNTFOR THE XBOX!
I CANT WAIT ANY LONGER!!

I'M DEFINATELY GETTING THIS WHEN IT HITS THE SHELVES!

RATING BOARDS CAN LICK MY BALLS!!

BetaMaster's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 14:27
BetaMaster
"We do think its terribly important to bring original producers' and creators' vision of Manhunt 2 to the public.

If that we means we have to be clever about how we distribute it, we will be ambitious and aggressive about bringing that to market. "
This comment kinda threw me off. Interesting. What does he mean by "be clever"?
Or does he just mean a PC port?

Anyway, I'm really glad to hear this news. The video game industry needs to start being treated with the same respect the movie inudstry has. It's not the little nephew you walk up to at the family reunion barbecues, pat on the shoulder, and ask him if he's been a good boy. The industry's definitely matured and that needs to be accepted.
Mappy's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 15:03
Mappy
It's about time my Wii had some death simulation, I do hope it's released over here.
Touch's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 15:42
Touch
[i]This comment kinda threw me off. Interesting. What does he mean by "be clever"?
Or does he just mean a PC port?"[/i]

Maybe he means they're gonna distribute it through mail order or something like that. Mind you, I think the console makers can still prevent that from happening if the rating isn't changed.
BigPopaGamer's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 15:49
BigPopaGamer
"In that instance, one has to ask oneself what is the purpose of a rating if it means that effectively the title can't be released. "

"...not correct to be critical of retailers, because this is a voluntary ratings organization in the U.S. We have to be critical of ourselves if we've allowed a system to develop that prevents us from bringing a title to market."

Ha ha ha, I love this. Zelnick is basically telling the ESRB to go fuck themselves and lick balls while he dips them in maranara sauce. He's getting the game out there anyways. Ha ha ha.

"absolutely looking at digital downloading... We're in that business aggressively, "
Take that MPAA & RIAA

@subnet6 I don't doubt that they had a lot of this planned from the beginning. It's great publicity, for free man.
Churchhills Dog's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 16:48
Churchhills Dog
Maybe they should embrace the AO and use it as a gimmick to sell game via the web and DD. They could actually go back and make it even more controversial by adding a snuff segment etc.


well.....I'd buy it anyway
InfernoDragyn's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 17:26
InfernoDragyn
my Amazon pre-order for the game was recently updated to a sepetember ship date. Usually if something isnt coming out they just outright cancel the order, but it might be telling that the release date was just moved.
Holyetheline's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 17:51
Holyetheline
What the hell about that stupid Playboy AO rated game? You all remember that crap? Nobody cried about it being released with the AO rating.
Im OK's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 20:30
Im OK
I think their issue (as well as mine) is not with the AO-rating itself, but with the fact that the AO-rating has become a de facto ban, thanks to all the namby-pambies.
Tron Knotts's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 21:10
Tron Knotts
My main issues is with console developers controling what software can or can't be produced for said hardware.

Why is that ok with anybody? What if there were CD players that wouldn't play songs with swears in them, or DVD players that wouldn't R rated movies?

Would anyone buy them?
Trevor McGee's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/10/2007 22:33
Trevor McGee
@ Holyetheline

That Playboy game was rated M on all consoles and even the PC. There was an expansion to it planned that was rated AO, but that was only available for the PC and it was never released anyway, so that's why no one complained.
xenon's Avatar - Comment posted on 07/11/2007 08:21
xenon
"The fact that we live in a day and age in which the games industry is bigger than Hollywood, yet still can't produce creative works intended for an adult audience without fear of this kind of treatment, beggars believe."

It is to be said that not even the movie industry (Hollywood and worldwide) can produce AO titles that aren't relegated to the porn market. Middle Age, here we come. Levelled down to the most uptight and prudish.
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