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I thought the problem was that the Japanese were obsessed with the handhelds, which are dominated by vanilla RPGs and games made by relatively few big companies. For example, the top 25 best selling DS games in Japan are either made by Nintendo or Square Enix. The PSP's top games are a bit more varied, but are still topped by Monster Hunter and Square Enix RPGs. The best selling console game not made by Nintendo this generation is FF13, with under 2 million copies.
They play too much Love Plus.
That's it! Give them a nude patch for their Love Plus games if they do a good job.
That's it! Give them a nude patch for their Love Plus games if they do a good job.
When _i_ say this it's racist, when the Japanese developers say it, it's OK.
Fuck off weeabos.
Japan: Get your shit straight. Stop with tentacle rape and transsexual Generic JRPG's.
And before some weeaboo tries to counter with "LOL AMREIKANZ R STOOPID FPS ONL" I don't even own a copy of Halo or Gears.
I play GOOD games, not GENRE's. Which is why I havent played a japanese developed game in forever.
Fuck off weeabos.
Japan: Get your shit straight. Stop with tentacle rape and transsexual Generic JRPG's.
And before some weeaboo tries to counter with "LOL AMREIKANZ R STOOPID FPS ONL" I don't even own a copy of Halo or Gears.
I play GOOD games, not GENRE's. Which is why I havent played a japanese developed game in forever.
Oh and I'd like to clarify(WTB Edit feature) that anything Shigeru Miyamoto does, I buy. Also, street fighter games but THAT'S IT!
Nintendo and Capcom dominate my gaming purchases. I'll enjoy Japanese games while Japanese developers and anti-Japan fanboys cry.
Now I am Kojima fan but I'm afraid I'm going to have to stop this Kojima dick sucking contest. The man talks a good game but he also is a selfprofessed Twilight fan. So let's all just take a step back and soak that in for a minute...
Well, considering that most Japanese gamers eat up RPGs, Fighters and Rhythm games, yeah, I'll agree.
it's so true. all of the japanese games that i've bought this gen have been decent, but not great. it's kind of depressing, because i love their style. of course, you still have your kojima, capcom, and nintendo, so it ain't all bad. anyway, it must be pretty bad if kojima is talking about it publicly.
I follow Kojima on twitter, and I also agree on his thoughts on western/eastern developers. I mean when we look at games from Kojima and Shigeru Miyamoto, for example, they make great games and sell very well worldwide, with a lot of creative freedom in design.
Then we have a lot of western developers making games such as; Boderlands, Braid, Dragon Age, Left 4 dead 1 & 2, et al. and these are fantastic success stories. No one knew, well maybe except Valve, that these games would be such successful games and franchises. And it does sort of tell that games should be a bit unique and different without alieniating its audience.
Or maybe the war for HD is the real problem versus SD and digital content. But all in all I feel Kojima, for the most part, is correct.
Then we have a lot of western developers making games such as; Boderlands, Braid, Dragon Age, Left 4 dead 1 & 2, et al. and these are fantastic success stories. No one knew, well maybe except Valve, that these games would be such successful games and franchises. And it does sort of tell that games should be a bit unique and different without alieniating its audience.
Or maybe the war for HD is the real problem versus SD and digital content. But all in all I feel Kojima, for the most part, is correct.
Although I guess japan can be pretty single minded themselves.
"xbox 360 has no games. WAIT!!! SUPER TURN BASED DRAGON FIGhTErS!! GIMME A 360 DESU DESU!!"
"xbox 360 has no games. WAIT!!! SUPER TURN BASED DRAGON FIGhTErS!! GIMME A 360 DESU DESU!!"
Like Jessicaaah said, it has a lot to do with their culture and the way it suppresses the individual.
There are so many customs and "proper" was of interacting with people and reacting to situations, and it's all drilled in to their heads from the moment they start going to school; it's like they are drained of any kind of individualism.
There are so many customs and "proper" was of interacting with people and reacting to situations, and it's all drilled in to their heads from the moment they start going to school; it's like they are drained of any kind of individualism.
At the top end of japanese development, I think that their corporate studio culture has a lot to do with it. Because so many japanese devs are very based in a culture that doesn't let young talent thrive or get a break on the big stage, they do themselves a disservice in the long run. Staff also need to not be ridden so hard, that they end up burnt out, having little life and sleeping at work. Meeting goals is great, but staff are not cattle and should be treated better, in a creative environment.
What they should be doing, is letting young guns try their own little game projects, on the side with XNA and PSN. The cost of development is significantly low, so they can focus on their core concept, fun gameplay and a chance to shine. Whereas many western devs have embraced these cheap methods, all we see from eastern devs are dojinshi games, and while these are of a high standard, they still are enrenched in old game designs.
At times, I think its also this crazy loyalty syndrome they have for PS3, that also holds them back. So what you want about 360, but its much easier to develop for, and get a game up and running on the thing. If more japanese devs embraced its more positive aspects, I think we'd see more varied product and chances taken.
The transition from 2D to mostly 3D is also still hurting them. Lack of investment and training in 3D tech for some is taking its toll, meaning less talent coming through. And those who have the talent, aren't encouraged enough, to pass on their knowledge to feed the circle.
You know though, much of this could easily be solved, by the japanese government making sure that what young people they do have, from a dwindling birthrate pool, should learn english next to japanese, from an early age. Their thnking is too regional and not global enough, but through english, they could travel and learn much more.
What they should be doing, is letting young guns try their own little game projects, on the side with XNA and PSN. The cost of development is significantly low, so they can focus on their core concept, fun gameplay and a chance to shine. Whereas many western devs have embraced these cheap methods, all we see from eastern devs are dojinshi games, and while these are of a high standard, they still are enrenched in old game designs.
At times, I think its also this crazy loyalty syndrome they have for PS3, that also holds them back. So what you want about 360, but its much easier to develop for, and get a game up and running on the thing. If more japanese devs embraced its more positive aspects, I think we'd see more varied product and chances taken.
The transition from 2D to mostly 3D is also still hurting them. Lack of investment and training in 3D tech for some is taking its toll, meaning less talent coming through. And those who have the talent, aren't encouraged enough, to pass on their knowledge to feed the circle.
You know though, much of this could easily be solved, by the japanese government making sure that what young people they do have, from a dwindling birthrate pool, should learn english next to japanese, from an early age. Their thnking is too regional and not global enough, but through english, they could travel and learn much more.
@Rammstein
Don't forget Pokemon! Pokémon is still a good series, and the recent HeartGold/SoulSilver games were given very positive reviews.
Don't forget Pokemon! Pokémon is still a good series, and the recent HeartGold/SoulSilver games were given very positive reviews.
Adding to that last post, look for example at all the japanese dev studio that have broken free from the big boys.
Suda 51's Grasshopper
Sakaguchi' Mistwalker
Platinum Games
We've had some sweet product from them. All three have broken free and are thriving nicely, making the games they dream of, without the corporate suit mentality chasing and breaking their will and creativity. More individual start ups need to happen out there, but like anywhere it can be tough, money funding options aside.
Perhaps what Japan needs is annual XNA development contests, back by a eastern style GDC (has GDC ever thought of this I wonder), in order to help breed a new field of talent and ideas, like we have in the west. Not sure if MS do anything like this, but with the right help and promotion, it can only help the industry out there.
Suda 51's Grasshopper
Sakaguchi' Mistwalker
Platinum Games
We've had some sweet product from them. All three have broken free and are thriving nicely, making the games they dream of, without the corporate suit mentality chasing and breaking their will and creativity. More individual start ups need to happen out there, but like anywhere it can be tough, money funding options aside.
Perhaps what Japan needs is annual XNA development contests, back by a eastern style GDC (has GDC ever thought of this I wonder), in order to help breed a new field of talent and ideas, like we have in the west. Not sure if MS do anything like this, but with the right help and promotion, it can only help the industry out there.
Hmm... My favorite 3rd parties are Capcom, Treasure, and Platinum Games. I can't really complain about any of their fare. Maybe I just don't care about innovation, though.
@cowboy ttop sorry but I don't want microsoft any where near japanese gaming. Nain reason why japanese gaming is failing is because they try to hard to make games more westernized and ms would ruin it even more.
Call me crazy, but I still don't see anything wrong with the current state of Japanese gaming. I have no clue where all this panic is coming from.
Of course, the only genric shootan SPASHE MARHEEEENZ that's caught my eye so far is Vanquish, so maybe I'm just missing out on something.
Of course, the only genric shootan SPASHE MARHEEEENZ that's caught my eye so far is Vanquish, so maybe I'm just missing out on something.
Dear Mr. Kojima, I would love to work with you on a game. I am plenty motivated. I would like to make a game about sharks who steal holidays from small children. I think this is important.
The end.
The end.
the day me motivator came to my school was the best day of my life. however i must add - i now at 24 years of age, suffer from a major lack of motivation. thanks derek, thanks for nothing.
@Sayword
I think you mistake me, and are frankly overacting like a fanboy, with the MS is evil bit, since Sony are just as evil. I mention MS, because they are more open to such suggestions and ideas, whereas Sony like to thumb-twiddle, take ages and do little. At the end of the day, it matters not which does so, both Sony and MS should get behind such competitions, as such talent can end up working on their systems. And is sushi somehow any less japanese if its sold in a local supermarket, than a dedicated restaurant? No, it not. Put aside your fear of MS melding in the creative side of japanese games, making them more western, it's not going to happen. Its up to japanese devs to do that thinking.
@tirkaro
The evidence is there, if you dig and look enough hard enough, and a good few well know names in the japanese industry have expressed their concern before Kojima. Hits like Demon's Souls, Bayonetta and perhaps the upcoming Vanquish are games that buck that trend, that are catered to a global audience, by staff that know their tools, their games and how get the best of them. However, while japan had schools teaching game design etc long before us, what they might be learning is now in question, and perhaps hasn't evolved enough with the global pool of tricks and skillsets, especially with regards to 3D graphics, animation technique and software, AI, along with other skills.
Vanquish looks awesome, but notice there's no multiplayer from Mikami. This is a shortsighted mistake, IMO. It could be said that Mikami isn't thinking in a global mindset, where this is the norm, but I guess its his vision. If he didn't have the japanese talent to pull it off, he should have been straight up about it IMO, and perhaps he could have easily seeked help from a western dev, seasoned in that area or Capcom. Maybe I should hold my tongue though, as Bishock was single player only first and very awesome.
A few links for you, Tirkaro
http://www.dailytech.com/Japanese+Game+Development+Continues+Decline/article14050.htm
http://asiangeek.asianweek.com/2008/12/06/whats-wrong-with-japanese-game-development/
http://www.hardestlevel.com/717394384/can-gaming-survive-without-japanese-game-developers/
http://kotaku.com/337683/japanese-game-developers-in-trouble
On a better note, perhaps an eastern GDC might be a good idea. I think their side of the industry needs something like it badly.
I think you mistake me, and are frankly overacting like a fanboy, with the MS is evil bit, since Sony are just as evil. I mention MS, because they are more open to such suggestions and ideas, whereas Sony like to thumb-twiddle, take ages and do little. At the end of the day, it matters not which does so, both Sony and MS should get behind such competitions, as such talent can end up working on their systems. And is sushi somehow any less japanese if its sold in a local supermarket, than a dedicated restaurant? No, it not. Put aside your fear of MS melding in the creative side of japanese games, making them more western, it's not going to happen. Its up to japanese devs to do that thinking.
@tirkaro
The evidence is there, if you dig and look enough hard enough, and a good few well know names in the japanese industry have expressed their concern before Kojima. Hits like Demon's Souls, Bayonetta and perhaps the upcoming Vanquish are games that buck that trend, that are catered to a global audience, by staff that know their tools, their games and how get the best of them. However, while japan had schools teaching game design etc long before us, what they might be learning is now in question, and perhaps hasn't evolved enough with the global pool of tricks and skillsets, especially with regards to 3D graphics, animation technique and software, AI, along with other skills.
Vanquish looks awesome, but notice there's no multiplayer from Mikami. This is a shortsighted mistake, IMO. It could be said that Mikami isn't thinking in a global mindset, where this is the norm, but I guess its his vision. If he didn't have the japanese talent to pull it off, he should have been straight up about it IMO, and perhaps he could have easily seeked help from a western dev, seasoned in that area or Capcom. Maybe I should hold my tongue though, as Bishock was single player only first and very awesome.
A few links for you, Tirkaro
http://www.dailytech.com/Japanese+Game+Development+Continues+Decline/article14050.htm
http://asiangeek.asianweek.com/2008/12/06/whats-wrong-with-japanese-game-development/
http://www.hardestlevel.com/717394384/can-gaming-survive-without-japanese-game-developers/
http://kotaku.com/337683/japanese-game-developers-in-trouble
On a better note, perhaps an eastern GDC might be a good idea. I think their side of the industry needs something like it badly.
I agree that Japan has a lack of motivation. But to say the west has more? Thats not entirely true...
@Xagnos
I disagree. I think anywhere else but japan, has more motivation. Besides that, its also a matter of numbers, (japan vs a good few other countries game efforts). Not hard to do the math of who'll have more determination.
EG. We are now starting to see more games from eastern europe. Metro 2033 was really good, from a small developer trying to make their way in a highly competitive market. Size and money are no longer a barrier to entry, that even you and I can whip up a game and sell it. When eastern europeans have a better command of 3D tech etc (and can speak english), to create games, that's very worrying, with Japan's game developement future in mind.
Areas that have much more motivation are the likes of dojinshi manga in japan, where works are created every year, that they have their own con Comiket, to push the stuff. If games had the same kind of outlet in japan, backed by the industry, they'd be cultivating more of their talent, instead of cannibalising it. Correct me if they do have something like this in japan, and they do, they still need help.
I disagree. I think anywhere else but japan, has more motivation. Besides that, its also a matter of numbers, (japan vs a good few other countries game efforts). Not hard to do the math of who'll have more determination.
EG. We are now starting to see more games from eastern europe. Metro 2033 was really good, from a small developer trying to make their way in a highly competitive market. Size and money are no longer a barrier to entry, that even you and I can whip up a game and sell it. When eastern europeans have a better command of 3D tech etc (and can speak english), to create games, that's very worrying, with Japan's game developement future in mind.
Areas that have much more motivation are the likes of dojinshi manga in japan, where works are created every year, that they have their own con Comiket, to push the stuff. If games had the same kind of outlet in japan, backed by the industry, they'd be cultivating more of their talent, instead of cannibalising it. Correct me if they do have something like this in japan, and they do, they still need help.
Wait, what? Nintendo, Capcom, Treasure, (usually) Square Enix, Level 5, Konami, Namco, Atlus, etc, etc
Japanese games are easily on par with western games.
Japanese games are easily on par with western games.
Not to start a war of listing things; but Capcom, Square Enix, Atlus. To me these are the only heavy hitters left in Japan. The vast majority of my gaming sustenance comes by way of EA, 2k, Activision, Ubisoft, and Microsoft. Oh, and etc.
@bustaballs
Go away a rethink that. Those names are the cream of japanese development, but they are a mere fraction of japanese game devs out there. If anyone should have any idea, its japanese developer themselves. It seems that some gamers, hear the harsh truth from western devs first and deny it, then hear it from the eastern horses mouth and still dismiss there's a problem. That kind of fan laced denial will only seek to bury the japanese industry further.
The first step is realising and acknowledging that there is a problem.
I do think that Kojima really needs to follow Mikami's way, and get away from the MGS license. I'd sure we'd all love to see what else he can do beyond it.
Go away a rethink that. Those names are the cream of japanese development, but they are a mere fraction of japanese game devs out there. If anyone should have any idea, its japanese developer themselves. It seems that some gamers, hear the harsh truth from western devs first and deny it, then hear it from the eastern horses mouth and still dismiss there's a problem. That kind of fan laced denial will only seek to bury the japanese industry further.
The first step is realising and acknowledging that there is a problem.
I do think that Kojima really needs to follow Mikami's way, and get away from the MGS license. I'd sure we'd all love to see what else he can do beyond it.
How bizarre, when some of the greatest games I've (we've?) played are Japanese.
Maybe not, though. I have the notion that Jap studios run counter to the "everyone contributes to the game design" concept. If true, I wouldn't exactly be inspired to work on a game that is planned entirely by Mr. Kojima. Making scenarios and programming gameplay dictated on-high sounds boresome. Who knows?
Also, could be a case of "PC gaming is dead!" Or, "the sky is falling, come 2012!" No? Err.. 2024! No? Err.. 2145!
Maybe not, though. I have the notion that Jap studios run counter to the "everyone contributes to the game design" concept. If true, I wouldn't exactly be inspired to work on a game that is planned entirely by Mr. Kojima. Making scenarios and programming gameplay dictated on-high sounds boresome. Who knows?
Also, could be a case of "PC gaming is dead!" Or, "the sky is falling, come 2012!" No? Err.. 2024! No? Err.. 2145!
Japanese games > Western games. They may not have the sales they once did, but they're still a lot better on the whole.
I keep forcing myself to buy the so-called cream of the Western crop, and keep ending up bitterly disappointed. I've played two Japanese games rated below 5/10 this month and enjoyed them more than ME2 / RDR / Uncharted 2 / Batman added together. I want to like what we do here (I even work in the industry, for my sins) - but consistently fail to get anything out of them.
I should mention at this point that this does not apply to indie games whatsoever - Flower is one of my favourite PS3 games, for example.
Heavy Rain was the only vaguely original western (non-indie) title I've played that at least tried something original this generation, despite being heavily flawed. But I heard Deadly Premonition was better anyway!
I keep forcing myself to buy the so-called cream of the Western crop, and keep ending up bitterly disappointed. I've played two Japanese games rated below 5/10 this month and enjoyed them more than ME2 / RDR / Uncharted 2 / Batman added together. I want to like what we do here (I even work in the industry, for my sins) - but consistently fail to get anything out of them.
I should mention at this point that this does not apply to indie games whatsoever - Flower is one of my favourite PS3 games, for example.
Heavy Rain was the only vaguely original western (non-indie) title I've played that at least tried something original this generation, despite being heavily flawed. But I heard Deadly Premonition was better anyway!
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