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Not interested in the Wii U but you, as usual, make some very good and interesting points about the "standard" game set up. Perhaps Ninty is actually looking to shake it all up after all. I'm sticking with "just making a larger DS and lucking into a new paridigm" but we'll see...
Solid points all around. And I have to say, I've had very little interest in the Wii U since it was announced, as I was rather disappointed with how the Wii turned out long-term, but the more I see if it these days the more I am intrigued. I'm not an early adopter when it comes to hardware, so I look forward to seeing how this thing rolls over the coming months and years. In general, though, I think it's usually a losing prospect to bet against Nintendo.
No thanks.I foresee bullshit v games forcing the controller use.That batman gameplay looked awful with the gamepad.
As much as a I love my 360 it sucks that it thinks watching music videos is more important than buying games and DLC. If Nintendo can keep its focus on games and ends up getting a strong online community and exclusives than Nintendo can have my money.
Not sure if it will be enough to "Win" the next gen console war but there were some very good points made about smart TVs essentially offering all the online bells and whistles that consoles have been trying to gussy themselves up with over this last gen. Even worse in some of their cases in which they have also charged for the "privilege".
Smart TVs are already becoming the kind of standard 3D TVs never did. Not only are all those bells and whistles fast becoming par for the TV course, gaming is inching its tiny lil way in. The point where consoles become completely useless is going to come one day, and the only thing that'll make sure they don't fall off the face of the planet is making sure they offer something you just can't get anywhere else.
The more console makers push to create these substandard PCs masquerading around as games consoles, the deeper they're going to bury themselves.
The more console makers push to create these substandard PCs masquerading around as games consoles, the deeper they're going to bury themselves.
I haven't watched the video but I know this: Kids will see a tablet in commercials. Then, they'll see a Mario game and a Mini-game collection featuring a bunch of Nintendo characters and themes. Being played on the "tablet".
They will beg their mom and dad for it. My kids want it for the Nintendo factor alone. My son recognizes that it's not an iPad. He just wants to play Mario and Scribblenauts.
They will beg their mom and dad for it. My kids want it for the Nintendo factor alone. My son recognizes that it's not an iPad. He just wants to play Mario and Scribblenauts.
I think that the Console's independence from the TV is going to be a HUGE selling point, more so than alot of people are giving it credit for. I will hardly ever use it, but a a stay-at-home parent might. Especially if their kids get out of school at 3 oclock.
I didn't know your wife was involved with Jimquisition.
"Executive Thing-doer" is that thing you? ;D
"Executive Thing-doer" is that thing you? ;D
While you (Jim) bring up some excellent points on Nintendo focusing on the games I wonder if this focus Nintendo has is in part due to how comparatively small they are to Microsoft and Sony.
Both Microsoft and Sony's console branches are in large part 'side ventures' to the actual companies they're part of whereas Nintendo's "only branch" is Nintendo in gaming. You might say "Yeah but Sega made Pinball machines and Nintendo made Table cards" but that is not analogous to Sony and Microsoft.
Effectively I am saying Nintendo's focus on games may not be a pre-planned killer-move strategy but simply the fact that it is what they just do. The shoe maker is going to endeavor to make better shoes, after all.
Both Microsoft and Sony's console branches are in large part 'side ventures' to the actual companies they're part of whereas Nintendo's "only branch" is Nintendo in gaming. You might say "Yeah but Sega made Pinball machines and Nintendo made Table cards" but that is not analogous to Sony and Microsoft.
Effectively I am saying Nintendo's focus on games may not be a pre-planned killer-move strategy but simply the fact that it is what they just do. The shoe maker is going to endeavor to make better shoes, after all.
I like how idiots say that Microsoft's focus is somehow different or less focused on games because of a tiny fucking change in the dashboard. Because putting games 3rd means they no longer make videogames.
Fuck gamers. Seriously. Fuck them all.
Fuck gamers. Seriously. Fuck them all.
But, but, but, the Wii U isn't next-gen! It's not, it's not, it's not!
Oh, look, time for a diaper change!
Oh, look, time for a diaper change!
@Rammstein
You have to admit their focus on "exclusive" games have decreased a lot in the last few years. Both in their PR and releases, gaming is getting less emphasis.
You have to admit their focus on "exclusive" games have decreased a lot in the last few years. Both in their PR and releases, gaming is getting less emphasis.
I took a few days after pre oders went up to even try and pre order the Wii U, well that was mistake, no matter where I go pre orders are sold out. nintendoisdoomed.
Anyway I completely agree with this. Another reason (besides all the points you listed) I think Nintendo has the upper hand come the new consoles is that while everybody and their mothers try and make the best new tech demo, devs will be able to budget their games and release them in the Wii U. While studios left and right are closing down due to the enormous budgets placed on games released for the next xbox and ps3 and for not breaking the 3 million mark.
@Rammstein
Their lack of retail exclusives is the indicator on their commitment to games. Their press conferences are another. It's not just the dashboard.
Anyway I completely agree with this. Another reason (besides all the points you listed) I think Nintendo has the upper hand come the new consoles is that while everybody and their mothers try and make the best new tech demo, devs will be able to budget their games and release them in the Wii U. While studios left and right are closing down due to the enormous budgets placed on games released for the next xbox and ps3 and for not breaking the 3 million mark.
@Rammstein
Their lack of retail exclusives is the indicator on their commitment to games. Their press conferences are another. It's not just the dashboard.
Really interesting point. It'll take quite a bit to get me excited about the WiiU, but I'll bet that I'll end up buying one within a year or so. As the Wii comes to a close, I really am realizing just how much I loved the little guy. Maybe even my favorite console this generation! *GASP*
So Microsoft are Satan because they refuse to buy more exclusives the way Sony throws money at them? OhYou.png
Fuckin' gamers man. Real scum of the Earth sometimes.
Fuckin' gamers man. Real scum of the Earth sometimes.
Personally, I'm not so sure that Smart TVs are going to make consoles obsolete in the near future, but I do like Nintendo's approach of putting the games first. Sure, there's a whole bunch of other stuff surrounding the Wii U, but just the fact that the games take center stage is almost like a breath of fresh air.
Although personally, I'm getting one because it looks fucking sweet.
Although personally, I'm getting one because it looks fucking sweet.
Parents speak with their wallets. The cheap low end 360 will look good this holiday season.
Oh yeah, Sony makes TVs. They MAKE them.
Oh yeah, Sony makes TVs. They MAKE them.
Isn't this a contradiction? TVii is more media intensive and focused than anything we've seen on a console yet. I don't see how you can describe the WiiU as more games focused than other consoles when they've created the most tech converged product.
Your point about allowing console experiences into your hand, though, is dead on. It also makes me think Sony is batshit insane for not capitalizing on that market with Vita and full Remote Play over local wifi. If there is a hardware deficiency within the current PS3s' builds (which I doubt, since hackers have achieved most of the work without any Vita/PS3 firmware tweaking), then the latest revision should have tackled that. I hope this act of folding their hand before their competition even releases is a sign of future dedication of the link with the PS4, otherwise... Fuck.
Your point about allowing console experiences into your hand, though, is dead on. It also makes me think Sony is batshit insane for not capitalizing on that market with Vita and full Remote Play over local wifi. If there is a hardware deficiency within the current PS3s' builds (which I doubt, since hackers have achieved most of the work without any Vita/PS3 firmware tweaking), then the latest revision should have tackled that. I hope this act of folding their hand before their competition even releases is a sign of future dedication of the link with the PS4, otherwise... Fuck.
I don't PS4 or Xbox 720 will be out in 2013. Most likey fall 2014 or early 2015. This give Wii U almost two years ahead of Microsoft and Sony. It gives Nintendo a hige boost for the next gen consoles
Completely unrelated to this (maybe).. Are we seriously going to call next-gen consoles, next-gen, when we having stopped calling this generations consoles that?
Or are we going to signify it as "Next-Next gen" so that all the uninitiated understand we're not talking about the 360, PS3 and Wii any more. Cause its ridiculous how many writers are still calling this generation "next-gen"
Or are we going to signify it as "Next-Next gen" so that all the uninitiated understand we're not talking about the 360, PS3 and Wii any more. Cause its ridiculous how many writers are still calling this generation "next-gen"
I don't think PS4 or Xbox 720 will be out in 2013. Most likey fall 2014 or early 2015. This give Wii U almost two years ahead of Microsoft and Sony. It gives Nintendo a huge boost for the next gen consoles
I agree with the points you're making, Jim. However, the Wii-U still faces a major challenge when it comes to online connectivity, an area where Sony and Microsoft have them at a significant disadvantage. Nintendo has not made an online service yet that has been intuitive or easily accessible, and it hasn't demonstrated this with the Wii-U in any real way at this time. If they can crack that nut and deliver a terrific online experience for gamers, then I'd say they have a shot. Until then, I don't see the hardcore using the Wii-U as their primary source for gaming.
@Rammstein
Did anybody says they are Satan? We just noted that they put less emphasis on gaming as of late. We're "scum of the Earth" for saying that? Not sure I follow you...
Did anybody says they are Satan? We just noted that they put less emphasis on gaming as of late. We're "scum of the Earth" for saying that? Not sure I follow you...
As someone who owns a smart tv, I can tell you that I don't give a crap what my Xbox can do besides play game. I never, ever use it to stream video because my tv already does that. Hell, I have a blu-ray player that has Netflix. I never use Xbox for music or news or anything besides playing games because I have a million other devices that do those things more conveniently. That's why I've never understood the complaints that the Wii doesn't play DVDs or the Wii U doesn't play blu-rays. Honestly, how many of you don't already have devices that do those things?
I've actually been thinking about this for a while now, and in a weird twist I think the Wii U has potential to be the most "hardcore" system. Nintendo has taken their universally successful Wii and built on it to offer games for everyone. At this point, everyone is playing catch-up with Nintendo. Nintendo's done the casual thing, dominated, and moved on. Meanwhile, the competition sees that there's something to that and starts copying it too little to late. So now we've got Move and Kinect, which Sony and Microsoft are stuck with. But what's this? Nintendo is planning a controller with a touch screen? Better have similar functionality! Except that functionality isn't built into the hardare and requires you own an additional device that costs hundreds of dollars. And where Nintendo sees their innovation as a way to provide unique gameplay, Sony uses the Vita to connect as a controller or to stream games while Microsoft uses smart glass to, uh, pull up random factoids about games or call plays in Madden.
I've actually been thinking about this for a while now, and in a weird twist I think the Wii U has potential to be the most "hardcore" system. Nintendo has taken their universally successful Wii and built on it to offer games for everyone. At this point, everyone is playing catch-up with Nintendo. Nintendo's done the casual thing, dominated, and moved on. Meanwhile, the competition sees that there's something to that and starts copying it too little to late. So now we've got Move and Kinect, which Sony and Microsoft are stuck with. But what's this? Nintendo is planning a controller with a touch screen? Better have similar functionality! Except that functionality isn't built into the hardare and requires you own an additional device that costs hundreds of dollars. And where Nintendo sees their innovation as a way to provide unique gameplay, Sony uses the Vita to connect as a controller or to stream games while Microsoft uses smart glass to, uh, pull up random factoids about games or call plays in Madden.
Rammstein, please enlighten me on 360 exclusives coming out soon. Im seriously beginning to completely forget the 360. It used to be my system of choice
I don't think smart televisions will be a threat to game consoles in the next generation because while they can come pre-loaded with the latest entertainment apps (e.g. Netflix, Hulu, etc.) they won't be able to play video games. However, I think as cloud gaming becomes more mature it will one day probably render consoles obsolete. We'll all probably be downloading cloud gaming apps on our smart televisions which we can use to play the latest video games streamed via the internet. When that day comes, not even the Wii U would be able to survive that.
The thing about the Xbox, though, is everything you're describing can be changed in a simple update - and M$ has proven they're willing to scrap and replace the entire UI every so often. So, once Windows 8 and the crappy "Don't-call-it-Metro-anymore" interface bomb, or they discover that people aren't using all the social crap, they can go back to making a proper game console with an update or two.
I'm not against buying a Wii U, but they're going to have to do better than a toy tablet and year-plus-old ports of PS3 and 360 games to repeat the Wii success, it seems to me.
I'm not against buying a Wii U, but they're going to have to do better than a toy tablet and year-plus-old ports of PS3 and 360 games to repeat the Wii success, it seems to me.
The Wii U very well could "win" next gen in terms of sales, I don't know and I really don't care. If sales mattered, the iphone and the kinect would be history's greatest gaming devices. What I care about is that this tablet gimmick could very well do more harm than good, and if I have to look down at my lap to scratch around every 30 seconds to play the next zelda, then it has lost with me. Otherwise I wish they would just knock 100 dollars off of the console and give me a tablet free version of the console, but I'm sure it's going to be required.
You dont have to dig too far into press releases and statements made by xbox brand managers around 360s launch to read directly that tbeyre not at all interested in games or game making.
Google it. They outright say that the xbox brand exists because its the easiest way into the consumers iiving room.
Nintendo will win, this gen and in the long run because 1) theyll have a two year head start thatll sway the naysayers eventually and 2) they're the only company out of ms, sony, apple and whoever else thats ONLY interested in making games and machines that play games.
Google it. They outright say that the xbox brand exists because its the easiest way into the consumers iiving room.
Nintendo will win, this gen and in the long run because 1) theyll have a two year head start thatll sway the naysayers eventually and 2) they're the only company out of ms, sony, apple and whoever else thats ONLY interested in making games and machines that play games.
Pretty much agreed.
As pessimistic as I have been about the Wii U, I do think it has the best chance in the next console gen. At least for me.
When I think of what the next PS of Xbox would be, it's undoubtedly a $400+ machine. I don't see how they could bump up graphics in a way that's so amazing it makes me want to spend $400 on a new console. Especially when a gaming PC for the same price will undoubtedly be better in terms of performance.
The Wii U might not have everything I want in a game device, but it at least offers some things other platforms don't. I'm having trouble imagining anything of actual value coming from new Sony or MS hardware. Only the few exclusives they both bring in to drag me towards those consoles. I'm sure a lot of their improvements will be things that could easily be added to the current consoles with software updates.
As pessimistic as I have been about the Wii U, I do think it has the best chance in the next console gen. At least for me.
When I think of what the next PS of Xbox would be, it's undoubtedly a $400+ machine. I don't see how they could bump up graphics in a way that's so amazing it makes me want to spend $400 on a new console. Especially when a gaming PC for the same price will undoubtedly be better in terms of performance.
The Wii U might not have everything I want in a game device, but it at least offers some things other platforms don't. I'm having trouble imagining anything of actual value coming from new Sony or MS hardware. Only the few exclusives they both bring in to drag me towards those consoles. I'm sure a lot of their improvements will be things that could easily be added to the current consoles with software updates.
BRILLIANT JIM! I may not always agree with your progressiveness politically, but goddamn, your Jimquisitions are always SPOT ON!
here's where the real future of gaming lies
search your heart! you know it to be true! consoles are an obsolete hardware that are on their way out
search your heart! you know it to be true! consoles are an obsolete hardware that are on their way out
There's some truth here, but I think you're underselling the potential of SmartGlass. It has a lot of the same ideas behind it as the Wii U, but it works with that -other- huge existential threat to gaming consoles: tablets/smartphones.
Obviously, it's not entirely clear exactly how far Microsoft will go with the potential of SmartGlass, and they're not building the entire future around it like Nintendo is. However, from this vantage point, it seems like a more sensical and less clunky response to today's trends than the Wii U.
Obviously, it's not entirely clear exactly how far Microsoft will go with the potential of SmartGlass, and they're not building the entire future around it like Nintendo is. However, from this vantage point, it seems like a more sensical and less clunky response to today's trends than the Wii U.
I've been hearing that for as long as I can remember following tech news. And yet, consoles are more popular this gen than ever before.
Well. SONY has taken the Playstation name ran it into the shit. MS is no longer interested in selling you a console. They are selling you a set top box with streaming services that happens to play games. So yeah, the next few years will be generous to Nintendo.
PC will be starting "next-gen" with probably 50-60 million people on Steam alone. Have fun competing with that, Sony and MS.
Honestly, the more I think about it, the more I think Xbox is the best positioned tech player to really move the state of technology forward. That's not just including or discussing the game industry, although I think it'll have implications for gaming as well. Obviously Apple is in -fantastic- shape with the iPhone and iPad. Google is doing very well with Android, and they're generally ahead of the curve on tech stuff. Sony's PS3 brand is total potent, and they've really been building on their first and second party stuff over the last few generations. Nintendo is probably the best video game developer in the world, and they're launching first.
However, Microsoft has bits and pieces spread everywhere. They dominate the PC market. With Windows 8 and RT, they're launching an impressive assault on the tablet market, and with Windows Phone 8, they're running a similar a strategy on the phone market. I'm betting on more success on tablets than phones, but I think both are open questions. They're also a powerful force on the console market.
Beyond all of these pieces.. they're focusing -A LOT- on getting it all to work together. SmartGlass is Console + Tablet or Phone. Windows 8, RT, and Phone 8 are essentially attempts to get Desktop + Tablet going. Through their new app store, there might be a unified store front across phones, tablets, desktops, and gaming consoles.
I know you all, as gamers, could care less about all of this. But it's a HUGE leg up for Microsoft going into the next generation, and, if they can find a way to capitalize, it could very well lead to Microsoft dominating an entire generation of technology. This will have obvious negatives we'll all bitch and moan about, but at the heart of it will be something good: the merging of technologies.
I think we can all agree that, sooner or later, there won't be a real need for consoles or PCs. Once tech costs are low enough, capabilities cheap enough, and mobility high enough, you'll just need one small, portable piece of tech to take the role of everything. There will still be separate displays and interfaces, but these won't require any internal capability themselves. As such, they'll be more like appliances and less like the technology of today. I'm not sure how the current trends in costs, size, and power could lead anywhere else.
However, the question is.. how do we get there? Who wins? Who loses? What shape does it all take? I think there are ways that could be more painful and drawn out. Ways that will lead to lots of companies blowing up and new ones forming. But, if Microsoft plays its cards right, it might take us all there, through today's general infrastructure and without completely upending the gaming, tech, and PC industries.
Of course, Microsoft is run by idiots who routinely fumble their chances for greatness. They are in the best place in terms of tech and infrastructure to get this stuff moving early, but that says absolutely NOTHING about whether or not they'll be able to take advantage of that placement.
/super long rant over
However, Microsoft has bits and pieces spread everywhere. They dominate the PC market. With Windows 8 and RT, they're launching an impressive assault on the tablet market, and with Windows Phone 8, they're running a similar a strategy on the phone market. I'm betting on more success on tablets than phones, but I think both are open questions. They're also a powerful force on the console market.
Beyond all of these pieces.. they're focusing -A LOT- on getting it all to work together. SmartGlass is Console + Tablet or Phone. Windows 8, RT, and Phone 8 are essentially attempts to get Desktop + Tablet going. Through their new app store, there might be a unified store front across phones, tablets, desktops, and gaming consoles.
I know you all, as gamers, could care less about all of this. But it's a HUGE leg up for Microsoft going into the next generation, and, if they can find a way to capitalize, it could very well lead to Microsoft dominating an entire generation of technology. This will have obvious negatives we'll all bitch and moan about, but at the heart of it will be something good: the merging of technologies.
I think we can all agree that, sooner or later, there won't be a real need for consoles or PCs. Once tech costs are low enough, capabilities cheap enough, and mobility high enough, you'll just need one small, portable piece of tech to take the role of everything. There will still be separate displays and interfaces, but these won't require any internal capability themselves. As such, they'll be more like appliances and less like the technology of today. I'm not sure how the current trends in costs, size, and power could lead anywhere else.
However, the question is.. how do we get there? Who wins? Who loses? What shape does it all take? I think there are ways that could be more painful and drawn out. Ways that will lead to lots of companies blowing up and new ones forming. But, if Microsoft plays its cards right, it might take us all there, through today's general infrastructure and without completely upending the gaming, tech, and PC industries.
Of course, Microsoft is run by idiots who routinely fumble their chances for greatness. They are in the best place in terms of tech and infrastructure to get this stuff moving early, but that says absolutely NOTHING about whether or not they'll be able to take advantage of that placement.
/super long rant over
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