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IO: Some reviewers didn't 'get' Kane & Lynch 2 photo

It would appear that "you didn't get it" has officially become the popular way of developers to escape acknowledging criticism of their games. While talking about Kane & Lynch 2, IO Interactive has joined the ranks of Silicon Knight, Factor 5 and Dark Energy Digital in transferring the blame of a poor review entirely to the reviewer.

"I think it's a game that you either love or hate," says general manager Niels Jørgensen. "It's interesting that we have scores ranging from 1/10 to 9/10, so we have critics that really loved it and those that didn't really get it."

A fairly innocuous comment at first glance, and I must voice my respect at IO for being cool and accepting of the fact that negative reviews happened without going completely insane like some people.

However, this implication of not "getting" games is starting to really disturb me, as it screams of a developer completely ignoring any and all complaints about a game, regardless of their validity. It's not a comment I think we should let slide. I am one of the few people who could claim to be a "fan" of the original Kane & Lynch. You can't argue I don't "get" IO's work.

My complaints -- that IO did nothing to build upon its narrative groundwork and refused to improve fundamental gameplay/technical issues -- isn't a case of "getting" it. It's a case of shit that needed fixing, and how can we expect IO to fix anything if it's going to shrug off valid problems with casual indifference? Not only does it insult the intelligence of the critic, it insults the very medium of videogames, that you are so arrogant as to refuse to acknowledge your own failings.

Developers need to stop this passing of the buck if they have any respect for their own work.








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Jim Sterling serves as reviews editor for Destructoid.com, head of the Podtoid podcast, and produces a number of news stories, original features, one-of-a-kind videos. With his passionate argumentative style, controversial opinions, harsh delivery, and dedication to brutal honesty Sterling is a name that you can't help but recognize. Likes PS2, iPod Touch, Silent Hill 2, Metal Gear Solid, Dynasty Warriors 3 Meet the rest of the team



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93 comments | showing # 1 to 50
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Monodi's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:25
Monodi
Don't they mean those that "got" it and those that were payed for the score?
TheOldHouse's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:27
TheOldHouse
I thought that maybe your review of kane and lynch 2 was way harsh as I couldnt believe it would be worse that the first.

Then I played it

WHAT A PILE OF SHIT.

Where did the interesting narrative go? The diverse settings? The attempt at originality? Seeing things as Lynch?

Go back to Hitman guys, and shut the fuck up.
Hipster Dante's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:28
Hipster Dante
My friend gives me an "I don't get the game" or "it's not for me" when I'm not totally into something.

Sometimes, they may be justified in saying that, but if they're not making something thats fun for the people it should be fun for, then they should figure that maybe they goofed.
Neroisonfire's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:28
Neroisonfire
Well of course you'd say that Jim. You didn't get the game in the first place :P
StingingVelvet's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:34
StingingVelvet
I like how THEY'RE the arrogant ones for not taking your opinions as gospel. Maybe your opinions ain't all that?

Not really about KL2 in particular, but there are definitely times when reviewers obviously do not get a game, or play it wrong, or whatever else. Jeff Gerstman's review and quick look video of APB spring to mind, where he played solo and then complained about the game missing things it has when you play in a team, as intended. People who complain about Dead Rising 2 being too hard to play straight through without restarting, people who complain about there being no big fucking quest arrow signs in Risen.

Unlike cinema there really are no game reviewers whose opinions I hold above my own, and I don't blame developers for feeling the same way. Most reviewers miss things about games I love or have much different priorities than I do. A "professional" game reviewer's opinion doesn't mean anything more to me than a random forum poster, to be honest, and I have to carefully read reviews to try and come away with what I might think of the situations the reviewer was presented with, rather than caring about the reviewer's opinion itself.
Xzyliac's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:34
Xzyliac
I can respect that. I don't think he meant anything by it. It just didn't sit well with some. Which is why we have reviews in the first place. I remember when everyone was gushing over the demo I felt like I didn't get it either. In my opinion it felt like it was bound to be one of the worst games of the year. But to that same effect I can see why some would like it. It had a lot of heart and did some neat things. It just did the fundamentals like shit.

Maybe "get it" was a poor choice of words but I think I look at the entire quote and totally agree with him. I think there were a lot of flaws to hurdle over to get to the heart and there are definitely some who can jump those hurdles and love it. That's the interest effect of a polarizing game.

I mean that's how I feel about Brutal Legend. Brutal Legend is the textbook definition of broken game design. If I were teaching a class, no lie, I'd use it as a primary example of what a broken game is. But it had so much heart that I fell in love with it. The world, presentation, and idea maybe moreso than the game itself. At it's core it was terrible. But what decorated it is what I fell in love with.

If Icwere to review that game I'd probably give it more than it deserved. That's an example of a game I think some people get and others don't. It just kinda boils down to raw opinion without any justification.
NoMore's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:35
NoMore
I "got" the game. Got it and sold it on eBay for a bullshit high price. Seriously this was one of the worst games I've played.
Spaz's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:35
Spaz
I tend to think that Destructoid's rating system is based more upon a fun factor as you would call it. Things that distract from the fun get points taken off for. So meaning a 1 from Mr. Distruc means your game wasn't very fun.
Corduroy Turtle's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:36
Corduroy Turtle
Some consumers didn't "purchase" Kane & Lynch 2.
Onyx Oblivion's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:37
Onyx Oblivion
What if you don't "get" the game, and also don't "play the game right"?
Kizeeta's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:38
Kizeeta
Maybe they should focus less on the "getting it" side of things and should focus more on the "making good games" part. I hope the next Hitman doesn't get messed up.

In terms of style, I thought K&L2 was very unique, and I liked that. But as an overall game, it is pretty shit.
TheOldHouse's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:38
TheOldHouse
let me reiterate

not a fan of jim sterlings brand of journalism but he was spot on with that review

MORE LIKE 0/10 though.
carg0's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:38
carg0
speaking of "not getting it", Jim, are you still getting harassed by Deborah Jones? whatever happened with that?
Zepinephrine's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:42
Zepinephrine
It would be easy to flip their arguement and claim that those who scored the game highly are the ones who didn't 'get it'.
Darckcloud723's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:47
Darckcloud723
Am I they only one who like to look at a games highest score and compare to it's lowest score to help get an idea?
BoomingEchoes's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:48
BoomingEchoes
I totally agree Jim, this vapid excuse that we "didn't get it" is getting bad.. and strangely rolls in as fall does (Most memorably last year when Shaffer told us we didn't get Brutal Legend because we weren't playing it right -again as much as I love Shaffer, that shouldn't have happened)

Frankly I think its one part dodging criticism and one part absolute laziness on the part of the developers. I mean, If we were supposed to have come to a better conclusion for them so easily then why didn't they make it so we could get to that obvious (in their minds) point easier? And if they -and I guess I should say, since they- couldn't what does that say about their game, or even their abilities as developers?

Actually, this has me wondering what era of gaming we're in? And what I mean by that is in what era (golden age, silver age an so on) did the movie industry start saying "your not getting it" en mass? And possibly more importantly when did the need for that saying, in the main stream of that industry, stop?.. Cause that's the only indication I can see to gauge when this craziness will end.
Super Drybones's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:48
Super Drybones
Isn't this what every artist who stapled a fetus to a plank of wood says about his critics.
TheDeathWalrus's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:51
TheDeathWalrus
I read an article on IGN or 1up (cant remember) about this same statement, and its seems to me the developers were referring mostly to the tone of the game, though that really doesn't justify the lackluster gameplay.
Kraid's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:52
Kraid
I love how instead of saying "hated it" they say:"didn't get it".
Implying that those who didn't liked the game, played it wrong.

LULZ.
575446's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:58
575446
I love how he says that the reviewers either loved the game or didn't get it.
The way he phrases it totally excludes any possibility for a third option.
You know, the "we made a game that blows big donkey sausage" option.
I could shit on a piece of canvas and say you don't get it, but that doesn't make it a work of art, does it?
575446's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 15:59
575446
Oh, and someone should be freaking shot for creating a new, retarded meme.
It hasn't even been a week and I want to punch someone in the face every time I see a "you don't get it" joke in a review's comments...
asyouburn's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:04
asyouburn
well, i understand where he's coming from, because i really liked it
BalloonFighter's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:05
BalloonFighter
Never played either game but I see how you may have to be open to the characters to appreciate the game but thats no excuse for a game to suck.
Gilgamesh1317's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:07
Gilgamesh1317
What, is the industry suddenly getting flooded with snooty, artsy-fartsy pricks who simply ignore critics with "They just don't get it"?

This had better not be the start of a trend...

Incidentally, there are some occasions where reviewers actually don't "get" a game, as in don't get the point of it (Shadow Of The Colossus springs to mind; several critics shrugged it off as an unfinished Zelda clone as opposed to a series of dramatic boss fights). The cases of Kane & Lynch 2 and Hydrophobia are not some of these occasions.
comradetrotskii's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:08
comradetrotskii
Perhaps Destructoid should be the first to introduce a new scoring system to appease developers. Every game released automatically gets a 10/10, or a 8/10 if the publishing company isn't currently using the site for advertising. In addition to this though is the DIDN'T GET IT score which is a numerical representation of how the reviewer doesn't get a game. The DIDN'T GET IT score is then subtracted from the review score. 0 is the the ultimate score here, meaning the reviewer totally fucking got that shit. A DIDN'T GET IT of 7 or 8 indicates that the reviewer, while acknowledging that the game they just reviewed is perfect in every single way, just wasn't playing it properly and consequently totally never got it, probably because they are a slobbering fuckwit. Thankfully there will be plenty of time to discuss the levels of slobbering fuckwititude displayed by the reviewer as we no longer have to be concerned with trivial matters such as the quality of the videogame in question.
Sæglópur's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:11
Sæglópur
Did IGN wipe the cum off of their chin after that massive blowjob?

Seriously, did IO pay them for that interview/postmortem?
Budogenkai's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:11
Budogenkai
I play video games

This wasn't a video game, it was a beta
Jim Sterling's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:11
Jim Sterling
"I like how THEY'RE the arrogant ones for not taking your opinions as gospel. Maybe your opinions ain't all that? "

Did I say that? No I didn't. It's the complete disregard of opinions as not "getting" it that grates. Most of my criticisms about Kane & Lynch 2 aren't related to its style, and the game isn't trying anything "new" for me to not understand. Most of my complaints are legitimate problems of design, not of style. I am not saying my opinions are gospel, but I don't think it's right for developers to just shrug them off as a case of "they didn't get it, so fuck them."

It's the implication that the only way you could dislike the game was if you missed something or you did something wrong. It's become incredibly popular among both developers AND gamers to blame the reviewer entirely for disliking a game. I think that's bullshit. Sorry if you don't "get" that.
comradetrotskii's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:13
comradetrotskii
575446 said:

I could shit on a piece of canvas and say you don't get it, but that doesn't make it a work of art, does it?

Unfortunately my friend this has pretty much been the basis of modern art for at least half a century.
Jim Sterling's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:15
Jim Sterling
"I read an article on IGN or 1up (cant remember) about this same statement, and its seems to me the developers were referring mostly to the tone of the game, "

That's even worse. He basically is ignoring the content of reviews (because style is the LAST of that game's crimes) and saying "They scored it low. They must not like our awesome art style."

Uh ... no. The art style made me physically hurt, but that's NOT the worst of it.
Mastrmeatwad's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:15
Mastrmeatwad
I agree with what you wrote Jim. Totally. And about IO's game-it was garbage. I can usually get through playing any game on any console, but it was a mess- I think it was worse than the first-the camera-didn't like. The sad part is that the developers are in DENIAL and protecting their ego from honest critisism-that is accurate; which hurts the gamer because their denial will allow them to continue making crappy games. Shame.
StingingVelvet's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:21
StingingVelvet
@ Jim

Looking on metacritic (the bane of my existence) I see that KL2 on PC has more 7+ reviews than >6 reviews, so I don't think there is the general air of failure you want to portray. There were things you didn't like but someone else might, and there were things that bothered you that others would consider minor. That could easily mean you didn't "get" what they were going for, rather than the game having bad mechanics.

I know many reviews knocked the game for the fact you can still get shot while in cover which honestly I consider a GOOD thing, as cover should not make you magically invincible if your arm is sticking out. So while many would say the cover system was "broken" because you could still get hit, I would say those people didn't GET the cover system's more realistic goals of offering cover.
Toadofsky's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:21
Toadofsky
Typical demeanor of developers who think they're movie directors, and don't listen to constructive criticism, or just don't listen to changes that could be necessary.

These are the kind of developers (Sakamoto seems to fit the bill nicely) that unfortunately infest the gaming industry, who think that they're artists, when in fact, their so called "art" couldn't cut it as a daytime movie.
Microshock's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:26
Microshock
Point is Jim, you had a dumbass score. A 1 out of 10 is only for the shittiest of the shit games.

Kane and Lynch 2 might've been bad to you but that doesn't mean it's downright unplayable turkey turds.

You like causing controversy and you bullshit reviews all the time to do it.
Captain Freak's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:27
Captain Freak
Jim, Its become quite clear that Developers have become human. You know, greed mixed with arrogance and stupidity.....were doomed.
Montag 451's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:28
Montag 451
While I like your style of journalism and you are a witty writer I still think the 1 was an attention grabber rather than a true score. I totally agree KaL2 is a bit meh but by Destructoids own scoring system a 1 is a totally broken unplayable mess. From your review I cannot see how you could score it a 1 except for your broken expectations.

I rented and gave it a bash. Not a game I would play again and didn't finish it but a game with absolutely no redeeming feature? Can't see it myself. The controls worked as well as most games I've played, the graphics achieved what they set out to do and it played okish. 4-6 range for me, 4 if it didn't float your boat, 6 if it did.

Of interest do you still stand by your assertion it is a 1? Is Quantum Theory really a better game? If you had to play one of them again which would it be?
Jim Sterling's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:30
Jim Sterling
"You like causing controversy and you bullshit reviews all the time to do it."

Got any actual evidence to back that libel up, son?
J Ball's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:31
J Ball
KL2's metacritic is so high because 80% of reviewers don't use the first half of the 10 point scale. Which probably insures that they don't upset publishers and keep getting review copies of games because having reviews pre-release is what gets readers.
J Ball's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:33
J Ball
capitalism, ho!
Jim Sterling's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:33
Jim Sterling
StingingVelvet: Argumentum ad populum is not a winning debate tactic.

That aside, I totally disagree with you on cover. You claim getting shot at behind cover because your arm's sticking out is realistic? I say it's totally UNrealistic, because nobody would be fucking dumb enough to leave their arm sticking out.

You can't argue realism in this situation because it would be totally unrealistic for someone to enter the same cover stance, every time, even if it keeps their head above cover or their arm sticking out. Of course, it's unfair to demand that developers have endless animations depending on the cover, but at the very least, making cover that actually provides COVER is a better start.

The realism argument doesn't work in the least. Broken cover systems like K&L2's are even less believable.
Felipe Choque's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:51
Felipe Choque
Hey, i like this game, a lot. It's not as hard as some people say, and the story is simple, but interesting.
Sherwood513's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:55
Sherwood513
Kane and lynch was fun because of who I was playing with. We made it fun in spite of itself. Haven't played the sequel yet, and am not gonna go out of my way to try it.
AriesWarlock's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:58
AriesWarlock
Agree with the general idea, most reviewers fail to understand games that are not what the masses want. One example, Lost Planet.
amtalx's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:58
amtalx
@Jim:

Calling your reviews 'bullshit' was pretty harsh on that poster's part, but you can be a little divisive with your scores. Giving a 10 to Deadly Premonition definitely garnered a lot of interest for a game that otherwise would have fallen into obscurity. People STILL talk about that review. If your goal was to bring attention to a game you enjoyed on a personal level, mission accomplished.

However, the rest of the world knows that 10s should be reserved for undeniable gaming milestones. Deadly Premonition certainly had it's campy charm, but landmark achievement in gaming it was not. Similarly 1s should be reserved for the most unsalvageable mess. KL2 was a mediocre game at best, but certainly not anywhere near a 1.
soberbandana's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 16:59
soberbandana
Jim, you are right that developers should not use a lame excuse such as the "crtitcs just didn't get it" to justify their shitty games. However there are times when critics legitimately don't get a game. For example, you hated Alpha Protocol for reasons that you articulated very well. However, I personally loved that game. A lot of the flaws you mentioned didn't bother me because I am used to playing skill based shooter RPGs such as Deus Ex, Vampire:Bloodlines, Stalker ect which often have the same "problems". For example, in the first level of Deus Ex all your skills are so low that you can shoot someone at point blank range and still miss them. If you are used to playing responsive modern FPS's I can imagine that you would find this atrocious. A lot of gamers however don't. I am not saying you were wrong in giving AP a bad score (it was rather buggy, we can agree on that) but obviously our different opinion of the game was based on our different experiences as gamers.
Jim Sterling's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 17:02
Jim Sterling
aktalx: You're implying that I don't believe the scores I hand out. I do. Look at how many tens I've given in my career (spoiler: two) and tell me that I don't reserve that number. I fully believe in Deadly Premonition as a game that deserves a 10, because it was the perfect storm.

Saying I hand out scores just for attention is wrong, and nobody has evidence of any kind to back up what is a pretty hefty accusation.
Malik's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 17:02
Malik
It's completely possible to not 'get' a game. Everyone knows several people on a message board that dislike/hate Shadow of the Colossus because of its emptiness and exclusively boss battles. They certainly didn't 'get it', but are perfectly within their reasons to not like it. K&L2 is however a bad example to take this philosophical stance considering there were many minor and major technical issues that were wrong with this game.

I don't take issue with developers pointing this out because I don't believe all opinions are equal and valid as far as discussion goes. There can be invalid critiques. I'm surprised anyone who even knows what a thesis paper is would argue the contrary.
Jim Sterling's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 17:04
Jim Sterling
soberbandana: I would never argue that critics get it right all the time. Hell, I disagree with reviews all the time. However, to uniformly disregard any negative review as not getting it is horrendous behavior.

Saying "you don't get my game because it's innovative" is a disgusting cop-out. If someone genuinely failed to understand a game, that's a different issue, but uniformly ignoring any negative press with a "fuck 'em" attitude is what I'm attacking.
wisearse's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 17:07
wisearse
"It would appear that "you didn't get it" has officially become the popular way of developers to escape acknowledging criticism of their games."

wow, this is getting stupid...if this really catch on, this "let's make a some game, give negative reviewers the finger, and hope it sells" developer mentality, we, the gamers, are so gonna get screwed. :(
Sean Daisy's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/04/2010 17:09
Sean Daisy
Jim, though I agree with the principal that it is a fool who dismisses criticism when it is applied constructively, I contend that IO's is a comment we can let slide.

The confidence of the reviewer in their craft should be sufficient not to let the handful of developers who choose to dismiss them cause concern; those who are fans or not fans of the game have already made their mind up. The middle ground will stick to who or what they initially trusted anyway.
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