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Home Halo updates

Halo Wars' controls trump the mouse and keyboard

1:40 PM on 11.24.2008, Brad Nicholson 34 comments

Halo Wars' controls trump the mouse and keyboard photo
     Halo
Halo Wars handles better than a PC RTS. At least, that’s what the guys at Ensemble (the developer of the game) seem to think. In a recent interview with CVG, lead designer Graeme Devine noted that the game trumped the typical PC and mouse setup and noted that he “wouldn’t say it if [he] didn’t believe it.” He also commented on the fact that Ensemble spent the majority of their first year in development simply ironing out the supposedly stellar controls.

From the interview:
We spent the first year of this project just working on the controls. Without the controls working it's pointless even doing the game. We actually took Age of Mythology and we set ourselves a target. One of our testers, who's a hardcore RTS PC guy came over and told us that it's easier to play with the controller than it is with a mouse and keyboard.
Devine went on to say that when the tester said that it was better, Ensemble “gave [themselves] the green light” with the lofty project. Using Age of Mythology as a benchmark is an excellent idea, although I question if a Cyclops has anything on a Warthog. Too bad we won’t ever see a mash-up on that scale.

Next page: More Xbox 360 stories




king3vbo's Avatar
king3vbo at 11/24/2008 13:45
The above statement better be a case of this:



There's no way. It's impossible. Just give up already.

[/PC Fanboyism]
Rainbowblack's Avatar
Rainbowblack at 11/24/2008 13:50
wow that title is quite possibly the biggest flamebait i have ever seen.

INCOMMING!!!!
Kyousuke Nanbu's Avatar
Kyousuke Nanbu at 11/24/2008 13:53
Console gaming proves how much better it is than PC gaming.
Druid 01's Avatar
Druid 01 at 11/24/2008 14:02
i think most gamers are gonna be disappointed by the way this controls. console games don't have the ability to control in as complex ways as pc games, yet. not because their any worse, but because the form of the traditional console controller vs. mouse/keyboard is simply far to simplistic in comparison.
casualweaponry's Avatar
casualweaponry at 11/24/2008 14:09
There's no way I can get my micro on with a damn joypad. But I'm a Halo whore so I'll definitely give it a try.
John Johnson's Avatar
John Johnson at 11/24/2008 14:13
I just think of it this way: would you rather navigate your desktop with a joystick or a mouse? There's a reason that mice are ubiquitous; they simply work best for the types of precision manipulation required for most computing tasks. Coincidentally, it's this type of precision manipulation that drives RTS's. You can probably come close, but I really doubt it'll be the same.
Drakonikarma's Avatar
Drakonikarma at 11/24/2008 14:20
I fully agree with the guy above me. ^ He's awesome and is probably also well endowed despite the lack of avatar.
mrelusive's Avatar
mrelusive at 11/24/2008 14:23
I'm sure Halo Wars will be fun with the controls they have, if they are making such a bold claim. But trumping PC controls in other departments? Like the above comment, there's a reason nobody wants to use a gamepad to manipulate a desktop.

Sure, you can hammer a nail with a wrench. That doesn't necessarily mean it's any more fun or less error-prone than just simply using the right tool for the job.
AgentMOO's Avatar
AgentMOO at 11/24/2008 14:27
Ha! That's what they always say
Timmeh's Avatar
Timmeh at 11/24/2008 14:28
lol, I seriously doubt that the controls will be better unless they've stripped this game down so far it barely qualifies as an RTS.

@Kyousuke: Yes, just like the recent Red Alert 3. Oh wait, the controls for that were FUCKING HORRIBLE compared to keyboard/mouse.
craineum's Avatar
craineum at 11/24/2008 14:28
yeah... we shall see, I tend not to trust what the developer says about their own game.
Zeno's Avatar
Zeno at 11/24/2008 14:29
You can't trump PC controls for RTS. Console controls give vectors, mouse controls give coordinates, and in an RTS coordinates are everything. The only effective way to do RTS on a console is to put a mouse on that console.
Funktastic's Avatar
Funktastic at 11/24/2008 14:31
On a controller it is damn near impossible to have the precision, speed, micro, and macro required to play an RTS game properly . . . it just doesn't work.
mrelusive's Avatar
mrelusive at 11/24/2008 14:35
Now, if the next-next-gen consoles included Wacom tablets, then they could safely claim they trumped M/KB. ;)
killias2's Avatar
killias2 at 11/24/2008 14:45
Lawlz, believe it when I see it.
Wedge's Avatar
Wedge at 11/24/2008 14:57
Call me when they figure out how to make RTS games involve actual strategy without being some kind of cyborg. I imagine it'll be sometime when they have reliable voice command tech, as that's the only way I can figure doing it.
Sharpless's Avatar
Sharpless at 11/24/2008 15:48
I await the PC fags' wailing and gnashing of teeth.

I don't know... RTSes are the only PC games a mouse and keyboard are good for. We shall see.
JoeTom's Avatar
JoeTom at 11/24/2008 16:08
Well sharpless, thanks for highlighting your douchebag inclination early on. I'm gay and a PC gamer so I guess that makes me a PC fag? Fuckwit.

In more relevant news, the mouse and keyboard setup is also win for FPSs, RPGs (especially Diablo-esque games) and MMORPGs, amongst others.
killias2's Avatar
killias2 at 11/24/2008 16:10
"I await the PC fags' wailing and gnashing of teeth.

I don't know... RTSes are the only PC games a mouse and keyboard are good for. We shall see."

I'm not going to jump out the damn window if the consoles finally get RTS's right. I just don't think it can happen, at least not unless the RTS's play radically differently.

Also, while I've played FPS's both ways, there are still lots of people who prefer FPS's with keyboard mouse.

Finally, I have yet to see console games embrace modding like PC games have. Sure there's shit like LittleBigPlanet, but I've heard very mixed reviews about the extent to which modding is really open and such. Nothing comes even close to the wholescale game conversions that are commonly attempted with PC games.
king3vbo's Avatar
king3vbo at 11/24/2008 16:29
YOU'RE ALL A BUNCH OF
Cube's Avatar
Cube at 11/24/2008 16:57
@joetom

Sharpless just lives up to his name, too Dull in the mind to handle more than 8 buttons at once and don't know a thing about PC games so I just learn to ignore him.

and the rest of the console boys have a 99.9% chance they never used or been with in 12 feet of real PC hardware to play a game with in there life and most likey there PC is something like this from wallmart or best buy.





http://www.idg.no/multimedia/archive/00020/Mattel_Barbie_PC_20283a.jpg



yes If I had this I would hate PC games and there controls too.




img]http://www.idg.no/multimedia/archive/00020/Mattel_Barbie_PC_20283a.jpg[/img]




So how many lies and false hype do game makers say before there game ships?
JoeTom's Avatar
JoeTom at 11/24/2008 17:04
@king3vbo

What's the image?? It won't load for some reason, now you've left us hanging... :D
TheBigFeel's Avatar
TheBigFeel at 11/24/2008 17:04
@Zeno: I have to put on my nerd glasses for this. _Technically_ mice don't give coordinates; they give directional vectors just like joysticks do. The trick in using joysticks for an interface is that the magnitude of these vectors is bounded while mice can send numbers as large as you can move your hand quickly. So you have to do things like determine what your maximum speed is, but still maintain control in slow speeds. This is done by a non-linear remapping of the magnitudes, which can be a bit of an art and when done poorly leads to sluggish or overly zippy controls.

Tablets do use absolute coordinates, and touchpads work in coordinates internally but usually convert them to vectors when communicating the input.

blah blah blah, long story short is I suspect we'll only see a genuine improvement on the fundamentals of RTS control when multitouch hits critical mass. How awesome would it be when one hand holds down the unit type you want while the other hand places it. Rapid context switching is rapid.
Cube's Avatar
Cube at 11/24/2008 17:23
That hardware level tracking diff is what makes a mouse 60 times better console boys just seem to think a mouse a huge ass table top analog stick and I find that funny.

When you can plain see the damn analog stick cant match a mouse on the moving a course or a crosshair in anyway shap or form not een close.


It is like playing street fighter 2 with a the genesis 5 buttion controler rather than a arcade stick It does not work and it sucks.
Cube's Avatar
Cube at 11/24/2008 17:26
SO Unless they added AI crap that plays the game for you like they do with HALO 3 that almost aim for you with it's lame ass AI so you have a chance at hitting any damn thing with a controler.


It will suck.... hell if they do make most of it auto play it will still suck like halo 3 and it's damn auto aim.
Redzie's Avatar
Redzie at 11/24/2008 17:35
Cant wait for those 12 year old Halotards try to play this game and bitch just because its not like the other Haloes.
Lemon's Avatar
Lemon at 11/24/2008 18:16
Here is what I don't get.All Xbox360's have three fucking USB ports!!! Why can't Microsoft just let us use mouse and keyboard?!?!Would it be so fucking difficult to send a patch out with some drivers!?!

Pisses me off.
Sharpless's Avatar
Sharpless at 11/24/2008 19:49
Okay, so a million PC dipshits can parade around Destructoid spouting their arrogance and bile, and when I say something against the pricks, suddenly I'm the one who's being a twat? Hey, congrats, guys. Way to turn a blind eye to your own stupid fanboyism.

Honestly, some people don't deserve to play fucking video games, least of all Valve's.
killias2's Avatar
killias2 at 11/24/2008 21:27
"Okay, so a million PC dipshits can parade around Destructoid spouting their arrogance and bile, and when I say something against the pricks, suddenly I'm the one who's being a twat? Hey, congrats, guys. Way to turn a blind eye to your own stupid fanboyism. "

Since when do PC fans dominate Dtoid? If anything, 360/PS3 fans seem to have made this place their playground a long time ago. Not that any of this matters. I still can't believe the childish regard people have for their favored platform (PC, 360, PS3, Wii, DS, PSP, whatever). It's like some retarded version of our political process.
TheBigFeel's Avatar
TheBigFeel at 11/24/2008 23:34
@Sharpless: Cube is a PC troll. At least I think he is; half the time I can't parse what he's saying. Don't let it bug you.
Freefall's Avatar
Freefall at 11/25/2008 03:53
Where's all the people saying:
"HALOEZ SHOULD HAVE STAYED AN FPS!!!11eleventy1!!one!1!11

dissapointment.

Ah well, at least the developers seem to thing the control scheme is top notch, Hopefully there's gonna be a demo so I can test it out myself.
Noah's Avatar
Noah at 11/25/2008 07:34
I agree with Lemon....WHY can't I just plug a mouse and keyboard in....you could on the Dreamcast couldn't you? Or was that the Saturn?
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