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Fez Interview: 'The polygon is the new pixel' photo

Just like in movies and music, different aesthetics in videogames imply different levels of commercial ambition. See a film that's entirely in black and white with funny looking non-actors, or hear a song played with aggressive, sloppily played, distorted guitars, and you're likely to get the feeling that artists in question are more concerned with expressing their ideas than creating something with much potential for mainstream acceptance.

For a long time, "8-bit," low-res, made-by-hand sprite artwork has occupied that space in the videogame industry. See a new game that looks like something from the NES or Commodore 64 era of gaming, and you immediately think "indie."

Phil Fish, developer of the polygon/pixel hybrid game Fez, thinks that the association between sprite graphics and the indie scene may be changing. Here's why I think he's right.

Here's the full quote from Mr. Fish:

The reason pixel art is popular with hobbyist and independent developers is that it's fairly easy. It's manageable, and there are a lot of good tools out there. It's not just a retro-nostalgia thing. It just makes making 2D art assets that much easier, and as we start seeing more elaborate 3D games from hobbyists and independents, I think we're gonna start seeing a lot more stylized low-poly, no-texture Sega Saturn type 3D graphics. Again, not just for the retro kicks, but to keep 3D art asset creation manageable. Once you embrace that low-fi aesthetic, you simplify your life A LOT. It greatly lowers the bar of entry.
   
There's gonna be a huge revolution in 3D games soon as indies start experimenting more with what you can do with 3D space rather than spend 15 years making slightly more photo-realistic space marines running around on flat surfaces. All the time you won't spend painstakingly creating an over-elaborate sub-surface scattering map, is time you can spend really exploring the polygon. Here's a soundbite for you -- THE POLYGON IS THE NEW PIXEL.

Thanks for the soundbite, Phil. I'm going to take that bite and run with it.

When Mega Man 9 brought the 8-bit look back to the mainstream, it permanently changed the way gamers perceive the low-res sprite. For years, people associated the love of old-school graphics with a genuine love of gaming, bereft of intent to impress the masses or turn a profit.

When Mega Man 9 went on to make a huge profit, that all changed. "8-bit" was no longer seen as the visual language of the true videogame fan. Instead, they were seen as a fast an easy way to cash in on nostalgic adults in their 20s and 30s.

In short, 8-bit graphics have lost some of their "gamer cred." Sure, there are plenty of games that utilize this look to express a genuine love of gaming as a unique art form (Sword and Sworcery and Retro City Rampage are two examples that immediately come to mind), but on the whole, low-res sprites don't have the cultural significance that they used to.

It's sort of like how after Oprah used the term "bling bling," teenage gangstas immediately removed those words from their vocabulary. After 8-bit graphics started popping up in music videos, ads for the Black Eyed Peas, and TV commercials, they just weren't indie anymore.

That's where low-res polygons step in. Like Mr. Fish says, they have a lot of the same strengths as low-res sprites. It doesn't take a huge team or tons of money to create a game made of low-res polys, and in the right hands, they can look amazing.

Games like Minecraft, Toribash, Bit.Trip RUNNER, the games of Kenta Cho, and the Katamari series have proven that the "Voxel" look can resonate with a cross section of the gaming community. I hope that Mr. Fish is right in thinking that we'll be seeing more and more games embrace that look as time goes on.

It will be especially interesting to see if enough low-poly-looking games go mainstream, if they too will lose their indie cred. If so, what other look will step in to take their place? Could vector-based graphics make a comeback? Digitized "live-action" sprites like in the original Mortal Kombat games maybe?

As a fan of all types of graphics, I'd like to see an equal opportunity for every type of game to make it big, but could anyone ever want to play a game that looks like Pit Fighter ever again?








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Jonathan Holmes is the most lovable Associate Editor on Destructoid. Catch him on videos, original editorials, and on back episodes of the Destructoid Show and MTV's Road Rules. Jonathan is a retro gamer's gamer. Likes Mega Man 2, Resident Evil, Katamari Damacy, Bit.Trip, Metal Slug 3 Meet the rest of the team



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35 comments | showing # 1 to 35
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Jordan Devore's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 14:19
Jordan Devore
Even though I prefer sprites, at this point, I'd rather we get more low-res polygon games simply for a change of scenery.
dtomek's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 14:25
dtomek
While a voxel isn't really the same thing as a low polygon count figure, I would certainly find more appeal in either of those than live action sprites.
cbarrentos's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 14:39
cbarrentos
"Digitized "live-action" sprites like in the original Mortal Kombat games maybe?"
that would lead to some really cornball, cheesy, niche parody games.
...i'm all for it.
BoomingEchoes's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 14:39
BoomingEchoes
I think its very much about trends. Pixels were a trend because someone did some cool stuff and people jumped on board (plus it was cheap), someone else does something else and people jump on that. I think Pixels will never go away completely and once someone finds something else to do with them they could have a resurgence, and the same for vector and so on.

I think its also about advancements in technology and what becomes more openly available to people. I think more people having access to better stuff now gives way for someone to be able to play with voxels (and lower poly-counts) more then, say, 5 years ago, and provides the opportunity to expand "indie" into a catagory it wasn't in before, in order to attempt forming a trend at all. This could mean that pixels or vectors could never make a resurgence, or it could mean that when they do make one they'll end up being even more mindblowing.

As for Pit Fighter, lol.. I didn't even need to think that hard to remember what THAT game looked like.. But idk.. I would almost like to see another stab at something more akin to Primal Rage.
PhilK3nS3bb3n's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 14:47
PhilK3nS3bb3n
@Cryotek: Dude remember the first voxel games on pc? The sense of wonder they gave? Nostalgia...mmmm
PhilK3nS3bb3n's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 14:52
PhilK3nS3bb3n
Anyone remember the pc game that dropped you into a huge map and you had classes to pick from. You were black suited space marines with jump jets (not tribes or star/earthsiege) and had lasers and missiles. They used the engine a couple years later for the first delta force... Google has failed me.
Moderate Chop's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 14:54
Moderate Chop
13 year old me loved himself some Delta Force.
PhilK3nS3bb3n's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 15:01
PhilK3nS3bb3n
@Cryotek: Dude remember the first voxel games on pc? The sense of wonder they gave? Nostalgia...mmmm
PhilK3nS3bb3n's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 15:02
PhilK3nS3bb3n
Ha! It was Terra Nova. Great game. I was wrong about it's engine being used in delta though.
rexwolf2's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 15:04
rexwolf2
Interesting. I do love the retro aesthetics of RUNNER dearly, but I still love pixelated low-res sprites. I would love for RUNNER's style of graphics to become more widespread.
Excel-2011's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 15:07
Excel-2011
I just want to see a 16-bit revival already.
Ryan Aquilino's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 15:11
Ryan Aquilino
Anyone remember 3D Dot Game Heroes? totally ahead of its time. B)
Dv8thwonder's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 15:18
Dv8thwonder
Is this coming to Steam?
Nick Clinite's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 15:21
Nick Clinite
"I was into pixels before they were popular."
The Nakedest's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 15:27
The Nakedest
It is odd, because I was just thinking about this the other day. I realized that with 8-bit graphics, it is fairly easy to make something that looks good. Does not take too much time, just a fair amount of skill, and you have a product that you can be happy with. As you get more detail, into the 16 and 32-bit world, it only takes a little more skill to make a beautiful product.
The problem is when you make the next step to polygons. It goes from being something that a person with moderate artistic skill, a weekend, and paint can do, and makes it much harder. Was the transition to 3D necessary? Yes. Was it fun? Yes. Was it pretty? Not in the beginning. It is difficult to argue that early 3D games looked good.
Compare Super Mario Land to Mario 64. Both great games. At the time, they where top of the line graphics wise. But let us bring this to the modern day. If Nintendo was going to remake SML, all they would have to do is port it to whichever system they want, because it still looks great. But look at Mario 64, they HAD to redo the looks because it looked like ass, and people wouldn’t be happy. There was no way to get around it; polygons do not age nearly as well as straight up pixels.
But hey, these are just the ramblings of a senior, trying to put off doing his finals. Maybe when I have more time, I will try turning this into a full blow C-blog.
liddokun's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 15:28
liddokun
For the love of everything and anything, no more live action sprites!
James Sunderland's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 15:29
James Sunderland
Grew up with that shit. LOW POLYS 4 LYFE.
Jay Me's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 15:36
Jay Me
@Cryotek. It's a female fox isn't it?
The Nakedest's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 15:44
The Nakedest
Christ, I wish there was an Edit button. I meant to say Super Mario WORLD. But land is fine to...
Retrofraction's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 15:54
Retrofraction
Personally I hate MR.Fish, with that said I can agree with some of this arctical. It's nothing new... I mean isn't it obvious that a low res polygon are basically a pixel that takes up three dimensional space.

I do not think that 2D has lost its flair because megaman 9 sold well, that is a perposterus idea in the first place. If anything megaman 9 has introduced pixel art to a younger generation. Of coaurse we could talk forever about the topic and well with all mainstream art there are cridics that say thing that sell well are not art, and in fact history points out while they are not specifically important, they do make an impact on art in general.

I am exsited for the indi game Voxatron: which is completely made of voxels, and plays in the vein of robotron

However, I think that flat space is not going to disapear so quickly, mainly because if you think about it all the 2D side scrollers used mainly flat space, and most FPS also use flat space for prossesing issues. While our computers are much more powerful today they really cannot go that far yet, and even when they can go that far I do not think that it will be nessasary for gameplay.
Ardent Snow's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 16:24
Ardent Snow
why do indie developers always have to make some sort of exclamation about the future of gaming.... Is that how they think they can stay relevant.... No one needs to make claims about the future of anything. This stuff reminds me of the angry birds asshats.
manasteel88's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 16:56
manasteel88
All I care about is games that have a look that matches what they are going for. Whether that's polygon, pixels, or 3d renders.

I want their vision to be presented in the most accurate way possible.
The Sama's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 17:19
The Sama
I can definitely see where he's coming from, and as an aspiring indie developer, I think maybe I should look into this, because 3D graphics always seemed like they would be more difficult... I have experience with a few programs (Rhino and Sketchup) but I cannot understand Blender at all.
Rifter01's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 17:36
Rifter01
<3 pixels.. Holding out hope for 16-bit re-revolution. ;) Scott Pilgrim vs. the World did pixelart awesome as well recently.
Kaggen's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 18:13
Kaggen
Cool, I think he is partly right :P
Baines's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 21:30
Baines
@The Sama

I believe Blender revels in being obtuse and only semi-functional from a UI standpoint. For years, any complaints about the UI led to the defense that Blender was focused on maximum performance for skilled users, and that you should just learn the interface because the way Blender did it was better for everyone. (I vaguely recall one of the Blender tutorials pointing out that one particular useful feature, I think in regards to auto-saving, was effectively hidden in otherwise dead space of an equally hidden pull-down window. If you didn't read a tutorial, you might never realize the pull-down was there. If you did find the pull-down, you might not pull it downward enough to find the option.)

Strangely, when 2.5 was released, it had a major UI change that made it look like other 3D utilities. Also strangely, it still seemed to be only semi-functional from a UI standpoint. Things are there, but only half-realized. Like you can now move a panels window from the default horizontal orientation to vertical orientation, but the panel layouts and functionality are all arranged with the assumption that you will only use horizontal orientation. I spent a few minutes moving all the individual panels, only to find that it still just wasn't going to work the way I wanted, and went back to the default horizontal layout.
Doctor Tran's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/16/2011 21:40
Doctor Tran
Welp. Looks like it's time to jump this 8-bit hipster ship onto the next bandwagon. Captain Chiptune McHornrims is going overboard, it's best we follow second-hand-suit. Seriously though. Trend-whoring and trend-hopping is utterly moronic. Abandoning practical forms of game creation just because it's gone "mainstream" is a terrible thing to do. The neopixel game has always been a little overhyped, but they were never bad. And they are certainly no worse now that the legion of cheapo iphonic imitators have cropped up. The only difference is that there are more now. More to sift through. But the good ones remain good.

This is not to say I'm against exploring so-called "indie" polygons, in fact, having grown up in the 90's, I have my fair share of polygon-nostalgia, which is probably more warranted than my admittedly inappropriate pixel-nostalgia, so yeah, maybe this is a good thing. Alls I'm saying is that mainstreamanization changes nothing.
Wedge's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/17/2011 00:11
Wedge
Shut up. Just shut the hell up. I hope to hell dumb shit like that doesn't become trendy. I like lo-fi 3d just because I think it's easier to work with than 2d.

And guess what, people have already been doing this shit for years, before you fake ass hipster "indies" started trying to decide what is cool.
PwnanObrien's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/17/2011 03:49
PwnanObrien
8 bit Pixel Art is like a Myspace page. The good thing is any fucker can do it. The bad thing is that any fucker can do it.
Enzi's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/17/2011 04:37
Enzi
What a hipster.
PTibz's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/17/2011 10:09
PTibz
2D, 3D, Voxel, Or Polygon. I just want an interesting art style and interesting form of play. As long as the two work well with one another in a symbiotic way then it's all good.
Jonathan Holmes's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/17/2011 14:24
Jonathan Holmes
Phil Fish is not a hipster. Hipsters conform to a pre-set formula towards non-conformity. That's not what Phil Fish does. He's just a dude trying to make the best games he can with the resources at his disposal.

I think that will come across to anyone who plays Fez.
BadStar's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/17/2011 15:26
BadStar
Hipsters are a myth.
Stigmeyer's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/19/2011 10:52
Stigmeyer
If he really wanted to make the best games he would make them for the PC and PS3 too...and 3DS. I think this would be stellar on the 3DS.
sunshinewht2's Avatar - Comment posted on 05/19/2011 21:44
sunshinewht2
This is the current state of affairs in the industry, and customers are being well served with a continuing stream of innovative products and a wide variety of choices.

<a href="http://www.dressesshop.com/">Dresses</a>
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