[Editor's note: SurplusGamer writes about how much he hates random battles for his Monthly Musing. -- CTZ]
You've just found out that the king is secretly using his own citizens as test subjects in some terrible experiment. A complex web of intrigue has led you here but you are finally ready to confront him in his own throne room and find out what he has to say for himself. Is he truly evil? Or is he being controlled by some outside force, mysterious and ten hours of gameplay away? Whatever the answer, now is the moment of truth. You're prepared, the entrance to the castle laid out in front of you. The answers you have been waiting for are just seconds away! In just a few more steps--
$%#&! The screen suddenly smooshes up and you find yourself dumped into a battle with a giant beetle, completely ruining the moment.
Yes - I
hate random battles.
The way I understand it (from my non-existent and quite possibly not 100% accurate research) is that way back in the mists of time when someone was making an RPG, they found that it was quite resource intensive on those clunky computers to have monsters roaming around the map. They could cut out all of that and save computing power for other things if they make it so that a battle just 'happens' every so often as the player walks around.
Some years later, when things had improved and developers rejoiced at being able to do things that they could only dream of before, JRPG developers were busy pretending that the nineties had never begun.
For some inexplicable reason, the random battles (among other things) remained as a holdover from that past era, as if they were an essential aspect of the gameplay rather than a simple convenience/necessity for the programmer. There were brilliant games like Chrono Trigger that showed just how much non-random battles can add to a JRPG while taking nothing away. Yet random battles persist and through some sort of sleight-of-game, many people are still convinced that they are actually a good idea.
You may very well be one of them. Yeah. You.
Having random battles, to me, is like having a really obnoxious personal trainer. They mean well and work hard to get you fit but they're so focused on throwing challenges at you that they doesn't realise that maybe you'd just like stop to admire the trees in the park for a while, or that perhaps you've been working a little too hard and now isn't the time for another run around the block. They're completely oblivious to your wants and needs.
That's how it is with random battles. They scream: 'I don't care about what you want, you will traverse this field at my pace and you'll love me for it. I don't care if you're out of potions and want to find a save point, boo-sodding-hoo, here's a nice skeletal horde for you. I don't care if you're only three paces away from the plot development that you've been playing five hours to reach - you can pointlessly fight this gelatinous blob first, just because I say so.'
All this, of course, is assuming that you actually know where you're going and we all know that that isn't always the case. Nothing gets my random battle hatred up more than going through five random battles only to reach a dead end, then having to go all the way back with another five battles just to correct my navigational error. Sure, I can give myself the illusion of choice by using 'escape' when I don't want to fight but it's not usually certain to work and it still leaves me feeling like the game is wasting my time and that pisses me off like nothing else.
GRAARGH, or some other such furious outcry.
And another thing! When you have random battles, instead of having screens teeming with life you tend to get empty worlds. I suppose you are expected to suspend disbelief and just imagine that there are really plants the size of buildings walking around catching the team unawares. Well, that's a victory for the imagination, I guess but wait - this is a visual medium we're dealing with. If you seriously believe that the designer's 'artistic vision' is to ignore graphics in favour of the monster-populated world the player can imagine in their head then you're fooling yourself.
To this day there is only one game with random battles that hasn't driven me too crazy to finish it and that's Final Fantasy X, which I know is an unpopular choice for some. Its path is so linear, avoiding a lot of the backtracking that I mentioned earlier, and the enjoyable combat system, randomness-aside made it just about tolerable enough for me to get through once - but never again.
You know what? I'd like to finish Final Fantasy VI, VII, VIII and IX someday, too. I hear Dragon Quest 8 is excellent and it was charming for the ten or so hours I could bear playing it. There are many other games I can add to this list.
The sad thing is, it's just not going to work as long as my desire to explore their rich, interesting worlds and stories is countered by the utter hatred I feel for their miserable random battles.
Contest:
6:17 PM on 09.10.2008
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This is just another crappy mechanic that should have been phased out with the evolution of technology but, as you say, there's a significant part of the RPG crowd that think that random battles are an essential part of the JRPG, and developers seem rather resistant to change themselves.
Even so, my biggest pet peeve about random battles is that it impedes my obsession to explore the world. If there are two paths in a dungeon, I want to go both ways ... but you know 11,000 random battles will be the end result.
If jRPGs have to keep the system, let me spend my money on items to ward off random battles.
@gohangvo
Good point about the special items, I guess - but having items like that almost seems to me to be like an open acknowledgement that people DO want control over when they fight. And, of course, RPGs don't have to keep the system.
Thus, it was changed back (though I believe you can still see the enemy on the field).
So, to an extent, developers are FORCED to keep it the old way. Nostalgia and comfortable for many, annoying and outdated for others (and the minority, apparently).
Therefore, if the system is going to be used, I would hope developers implement some form of compromise for those who want to skip ahead.
Also, I forgot to mention two more items that make for fast-travelling in 'DQ8' - the bird and the boat. All of that in addition to items that can be equipped to ward off battles rather than using MP (which helps in dungeons).
However, that teaches the player that they need to go out and grind to be able to survive upcoming encounters. By taking away random encounters, and using in a system similar to Earthbounds, it forces the player to be responsible on behalf of his characters, otherwise they will never progress anywhere in the plot.
I completely understand, and agree with, what surplusgamer is trying to say, and it irritates the hell out of me also when I just want to get somewhere, and I don't even know when I'm going to have waste more time than I even want to.
Good write-up btw, I hope this gets put on the front page.
Also, I heartily agree. Random battles are a holdover from a time when compromises had to be made. They now serve no purpose other than to be familiar, which is stupid. FF:MQ might have been a weak Final Fantasy game, but at least you could pick a path through the enemies in the game, or kill them all if you wanted to grind and get treasure. Similarly, Zelda II had enemies spawn and chase you if you left the safety of the path, but you could still avoid them if you tried.
Random battles need to die.
Thanks, although this and a bunch of other monthly musings got shoved off the c-blog home page pretty quickly due to the sudden influx of PAX posts that happened.
Also, yes. I've heard some people who like random battles say that it ensures players are levelling up at the right rate but I think that's a weak reason. If the pacing of the game is right and the combat interesting enough to make people want to do it, you shouldn't have to force players into fighting, they'll do it by themselves. I guess Persona 3 is a good expression of that because every night you make a conscious decision whether to go to the tower and explore/fight.
You got front page anyway! Yay!
Also, that was a fantastic write-up. I hate random battles too.
funny too how when you are trying to level up, nothing attacks you. you can walk back and forth for 15 minutes and get attacked twice.
The big problem with them is that they jerk you out of your zone - if you are expecting to get into a fight, you are fine with it, its just the fact that you are trying to get somewhere or do something, and all of a sudden you are thrown into a battle without any warning.
As you said, you are punished for exploring their world.
To give an example of how I hate random encounters so, back when I still had my Dreamcast, I picked Grandia II over Skies of Arcadia because of the former's lack of random encounters. I know Skies is widely loved by the gaming community, but I couldn't get past this horrible flaw. Granted, it also helped that Grandia II had one of the best RPG combat systems at the time.
Fuck I love Final Fantasy VI.
Also, ironically, I found X among the many games, and actually the first, that I quit expressly because of the damned random battles. Seriously, there was this one dirt road with like 500 monsters on them, and every single one could kick my ass. And if I managed to beat them by some miracle, WHOOP, I walk 3 feet and the cycle repeats.
Ugh.
I hate when that happens.
Also, watch out for spoilers regarding that last image of yours...
so I feels yas
but thats the real reason for the RBs. level ups and random drops. Also it helps develop the character. There are a lot of good reasons for them besides developers being dicks.
But this artical sounded more like someone crying because they suck at the JRPGs then real criticism. If your out of potions and looking for a save point then your doing something wrong.
What would you do to improve the system then if you took out RB's. Have real time battles? Might as well play DMC or some useless beat em' up like that. you think random battles are repetitive wait till your mashing X for 80+ hours ;)
Look at Blue Dragon - say what you want about the game (wasn't really my thing), but the combat system was fine. The enemies were all onscreen, you knew a battle was coming for you when you approached that chest or that zone exit.
The immersion you felt while playing wasn't disturbed.
There are plenty of turn based RPGs that have gotten around the Random Encounter problem, some of them preserving turn based battles in their entirety, some of them branching out into new, interesting ways to resolve the level/loot issue.
Random Encounters are a relic from a time where consoles lacked the hardware to make any other system viable. It is an outdated relic from the past, and needed to die after the end of the 8 bit era, but has been kept alive by lazy developers.
You didn't seriously drag out the old 'you're just complaining because you suck at it' argument, did you?
Maybe I'm out of potions because I've just had to go through 10 battles to get to a village that I was going to in order TO BUY SOME POTIONS.
Have you tried Final Fantasy XII? It does away with the random battels in favor of a more active real time approach.
Random batteles is one of the reasons I can't get through most RPG's. Thankfully, FFXII doesn't have any
I sure did because You suck if your useing potions. :) especialy in a FF game.
Also it lends toward a lazyness that is becomeing a problem with the "casual gamer" crowd. Nobody wants to work for that new sword or plot reviel.
@Capn Birdseye
I don't think the not knowing is the problem. Hell thats the biggest draw of Resident Evil games. you never knew when you were going to fight something. I don't think a zombie taping you on the shoulder and asking you to fight is intreging entertainment.
Really i think most gamers like RB's. Look at FF12. they fixed the RB problem and everybody hated on it. Then again i did compare Gambits to seting up ACL's in a Cisco router. Pain in the ass.
besides 10,000,000 FF fans can't be wrong. can they?...
@Elitechief: Actually I mentioned FF12 in an early draft of this, but it got edited out because I was sort of going off topic. Basically, I have played ff12 and I got a lot further but still didn't finish. I think it was firstly because although I thought it was an improvement on random battles, the system wasn't that interesting. Not having random battles doesn't automatically make it GOOD, of course. But mainly it was just that I didn't enjoy the FF12 world that much, it never drew me in in the same way that FF7 did (until I just got few up with the random battles)
At least you admit it. thats the first step ;)
Also, Super Mario RPG was a sweet game. I guess it was cool that it didn't have random battles, but mostly it was just a sweet game.
I really hope someone will mod FF VII and a few other good jpgrs so random battles no longer occur and you get extra exp on bosses (so your char won't fall behind with growth). I'd need REALLY boring month to play these without such a change.
I'm a huge fan of how the Tales games does it. You can always see the enemies on the screen. They're generic blobs pretty much so you're never really sure what you're going to fight which helps keep things random and unexpected. Plus most of the time you can avoid them if you really want.
Yes, I like random battles and I'm also 25 years old... which is like 40 in gaming years.
I grew up with the random battle systems and have come to expect them with my jRPGs. They force you to successfully manage your party as well as think ahead about health/items and can you reach the next save point or not. Thats part of the game, and I like it. I enjoy feeling like every fight is making me stronger, which they do. If they aren't, I should be moving on anyways.
I feel like I should be constantly challenged as the party I've put together kicks ass. Show me what you got game, bring it! If something is too hard, I simply pull back on the reigns, slow down, and level up.
When I come to any dead end in a jRPG, it does annoy me. But whatever. I'm hoping to gain levels before a boss fight anyways. I could either pace in front of a save point 10 times or go down a dead end and come back. Same difference to me.
If your playing an RPG to explore, then yes, random battles doesn't work well in that regard. There are other RPGs for that. A lot of them are probably not Japanese either. Its different play styles for different folks.
Random battles are just one of many reasons I have a lot of trouble tolerating any jRPG that isn't Chrono Trigger. Most of those reasons go back to the whole 'Japanese developers have trouble innovating their game mechanics' thing you mentioned.
Also, I lol'd heartily at that little exchange with LordBobo. And here I thought we didn't get much crossover with GameFAQs forum users.
Why not have "Story Mode" that readjusts the math so that casual gamers (or those with jobs/families) can enjoy the game with 10% of the fighting. Standard mode for most people, and Hardcore for those who don't mind walking 3 feet at a time across the game and hit level 99 by the time they finish.
That's why I always kept a "Cheat" disc in the case with whatever JRPG I was trying to beat. I'm not sure what I'll do now, since it looks like that type of thing won't be around for this generation of consoles.
There's no excuse for developers to not include an easy mode.
Yes, although that seems to me to be a strange thing to say - you can grind in either set up. It's just that random battles -force- you to grind. If that's something you'd do anyway, by choice, what's the difference?