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Fallout 3 SecuROM shenanigans upset gamers photo

We got a tip today from an outraged gamer calling Bethesda liars for their use of SecuROM in the newly released Fallout 3. In case you forgot, Bethesda's Pete Hines mentioned a while ago that they didn't use DRM in their games -- or at the very least used the mildest form possible:

[Fallout 3 will be] pretty similar to what we did for Oblivion, which was -- we basically don't do any -- we do the mildest form possible. I actually don't know if I even want to get into what it is that we exactly do, but we try to be really noninvasive when it comes to that stuff.

The above quote is currently being thrown at Bethesda after the alleged discovery of SecuROM -- arguably the most hated and invasive DRM software available -- in the PC version of Fallout 3. According to reports, Fallout 3 won't run on a PC with "recognized" piracy tools installed -- that includes Daemon Tools, Sonic, Roxio and similar software. 

So, some people are having trouble playing Fallout 3, and the blame is being put upon SecuROM. According to another post, the SecuROM in this case doesn't install, it only runs from the disc, but it is still causing problems for some people.

The situation appears somewhat muddy, and we have contacted Pete Hines directly. We're awaiting some form of response before we go as far as to call Bethesda dirty liars along with the other pitchfork wielders. All I'll say is that it's amusing to see one particular Bethesda moderator demanding sources for Pete Hines' quotes as if he never said it. Even funnier was the fact that our own post was used as evidence.

Destructoid: Stockpiling quotes to be thrown back at developers since 2006.


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49 comments | showing # 1 to 49

MrSadistic's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 17:44
MrSadistic
First the numerous bugs and glitches on the console versions, and now this. Good job Bethesda.
Syn's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 17:49
Syn
bugs and glitches?

WHAT THE FUCK!

can no one FINISH THEIR GOD DAMN FUCKING JOB BEFORE THEY PUT THIS SHIT ON THE MARKET? AAARRRRGGGHHHHH
king3vbo's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 17:55
king3vbo
PROTIP: Steam version has no DRM, except for the online/offline mode thing on Steam.

Ahhhh yeah
ThunderHeartXI's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 17:59
ThunderHeartXI
Well, isn't that just shitty of them. Nero, a program that comes with cd/dvd burners is causing Fallout 3 to freak the fuck out. Protip: Some people just make images of the games they own so they don't have to change the disc.

The games industry: Alienating everyone since whenever.
Emrah's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 17:59
Emrah
I read a bit at the linked forum thread, and boy it is weak. Nero is also listed amongst piracy software, and the customer service told to guy to uninstall such software, leaving only windows default cd writing software. This is stupid. If this is the new securom, I will never be buying Crysis Warhead, because I think securom updates itself, leading to more screw-ups.

I have a bundle version of Nero, I have virtual daemon installed, and can play crysis without problems (I have the original, not the pirated version for those who wonder) I use Virtual Daemon for a couple of games I own, but don't want to risk scratching the disk everytime I play the game)
jellydoodle's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 18:05
jellydoodle
@king3vbo: thats just not true, for instance crysis warhead kept its securom for steam
DaedHead8's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 18:06
DaedHead8
I have the console version so no worries here. DRM sucks but it sucks worse when an otherwise awesome company lies about using it.
Gantz's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 18:06
Gantz
lol it ignores PowerISO for some reason.
mix's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 18:07
mix
I bought this on my PS3 and I'm glad I did as I have Daemon Tools but I don't think I've used it in like 2 years.

What are the said bugs/glitches for this game on consoles?
th0mas28's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 18:08
th0mas28
In order to install and play the game, I had to:

1) Click on Setup.exe in the disc instead of letting it auto-run.

2) Replace the game-launcher with the one downloaded from the link provided by the SecuROM warning.

In all, it was more troublesome than just pirating the game.
Dexter345's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 18:08
Dexter345
Interested to hear what the official statement is...
NotAZombie's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 18:10
NotAZombie
Fuck DRM, it makes me want to pirate the game. It does nothing to stop piracy and just hurts the real consumer.
killias2's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 18:15
killias2
Okay, let me get this straight, will the game not RUN if those programs are installed or not INSTALL if those programs are installed (but run, after installation, regardless of whether or not those programs are installed)? This could have a big impact on me buying this game.

Too bad. I was really looking forward to getting it.
moocow21's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 18:23
moocow21
@jellydoodle

Steam usually (I say usually - because there have been a few games where they didn't do it right away) indicates which games have 3rd Party DRM. If you look on the Crysis Warhead page it clearly says "SecuROM™
5 machine activation limit," while the Fallout 3 page has no 3rd Party DRM.

I'm pretty sure the SecuROM version bethesda used is just the one with a cd check => no DRM on the Steam version.
buzski's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 18:36
buzski
filthy dirty liars
NinjaElf's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 18:56
NinjaElf
so buy it and dl the secuROM free version. I did that. And just so you all know. This game fucking rocks. Also learn to work around.
moominsean's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 19:11
moominsean
i don't even bother with pc games anymore. i have enough reasons to be pissed off at my computer without having to be mad at my games as well.
Kyousuke Nanbu's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 19:27
Kyousuke Nanbu
I've played for 15 hours on the 360 version, no bugs here.

And YAY DRM, good thing I don't bother with PC gaming.
Too Much Coffee Man's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 19:54
Too Much Coffee Man
They do use the mildest type of SecuROM but it's still SecuROM. SecuROM sucks. Infamous for making ppls CD/DVD drives stop working even making Windows lock up entirely.

Activision at least didnt use that crap w/ CoD4.
Alexradl's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 19:55
Alexradl
There's apparently a bug on the PS3 version where the game freezes for a couple of seconds every time you get a notification (a friend signs on or sends you a message). I haven't experienced it because I turned off my notifications so I didn't have to deal with it.

DRM sucks. I can't believe game companies actually think it is going to prevent piracy.
mix's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 20:19
mix
@Alexradl

Thanks!

I've had mine turned off for a while now.

I just wish you could turn that feature off on LBP as I don't really care that one of my friends just played a level and got a such and such score....lame
Victor Stillwater's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 20:47
Victor Stillwater
Will you folks offer information on any potential future patch that would alleviate the Securom issue if one gets released?
MechaMonkey's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 20:51
MechaMonkey
"Destructoid: Stockpiling quotes to be thrown back at developers since 2006."

lolol
tgammet's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 21:09
tgammet
He's not a liar at all here. In this case that is the mildest form of SecuROM and something that's been in place for years. Even in Oblivion as he stated. While I disagree with the methods used in some recent EA titles like Mass Effect, this sounds pretty valid to me.
Clbull's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 22:21
Clbull
Fallout 3 has SecuROM DRM?

That makes me a saaaaad panda.
Izmir the Astarach's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 22:24
Izmir the Astarach
Got my CE yesterday. It installs fine, and it only does a CD check during initial setup, just like Oblivion. So what he said is 100% correct. I have Daemon Tools installed and that caused no problems at all.

And the Windows Live integration is great, so I don't mind punching in a CD key for that.

I get so sick of this harping. A few years ago we didn't even call a CD check DRM.
akathatoneguy's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 22:51
akathatoneguy
ARRRGGGHHH! Anger! Disappointment! Righteous Indignation!

Can we get a "exclude stories about DRM" checkbox on the Dtoid main page for those of us who are sick of the bitching and posturing and complaining and justifications from both sides? While we're at it, an "exclude media-parents-celebrities blaming games for crime or moral corruption/rather tepid quote from popular developer taken out of context/complaining about others complaining about review scores/drumming up controversy over nothing/bitching about anything not related to actual game play and features" checkbox would be great.

Or we could just have a "No stories by Jim Sterling" checkbox.

Bah-zing!
ArchArbiter's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 22:55
ArchArbiter
I have DTools installed and F3 is running beautifully. Sucks for you guys, I guess.
Ninjasnake's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 23:37
Ninjasnake
Secure rom is ruining pc gaming. It's not like they are going to lose any money from piracy because if they were going to pirate it you weren't going to make any money from it in the first place. Stop lying to the people that are going to be the ones to give you their hard earned cash for your game.
dsky's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/29/2008 23:52
dsky
I have DTools RUNNING and Fallout installed and plays with no problem.
akathatoneguy's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/30/2008 01:11
akathatoneguy
Also, I have DTools, Sonic, and PowerISO running, a Windows Media Player window open playing stolen prego porn, a stereo in the background playing illegally downloaded CDs by 80's one hit wonders, and I'm wearing a pirate hat while using my laptop on a pirate SHIP. And it's running fine for me.
sacredchao's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/30/2008 01:35
sacredchao
I too have DTools and Fallout running with no problems.
unacomn's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/30/2008 03:07
unacomn
Actually Securom is babycakes compared to Starforce, that one does permanent damage :)
Also, the dark side is immune to DRM.
Azereki's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/30/2008 03:30
Azereki
Installed the game and ran it perfectly fine. Also, it looks so much sexier on my PC than it ever will on my 360. Bunch of whiners, imho.
TheStripe's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/30/2008 03:58
TheStripe
So are any of you whiners actually having problems with the game?

Better bring the supersize Waaaaambulance.
PrinceofCannedPeaches's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/30/2008 04:27
PrinceofCannedPeaches
I had some problems, but they weren't really bothersome. Maybe a 15-minute delay, tops. I mean, Jesus, do some people ever get caught up in this. The detail page that SecuROM refers to if it discovers software actually HAS a patch that bypasses it, and if that fails to work you could always NOT get a No-CD crack. I doubt Bethesda would find something wrong with that.

Some people...
Kaspar's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/30/2008 04:53
Kaspar
Umm, there is no SecuROM in Fallout 3...

This is bullshit.
Archanai's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/30/2008 05:46
Archanai
Pirates will always find ways around, so I just don't see much point in devs and publishers trying. There will always be pirates, however unfortunate that may be.
Transbot's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/30/2008 07:34
Transbot
Not seeing any Secu-Rom here.
Holyetheline's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/30/2008 08:41
Holyetheline
I don't see any SecuRom in Fallout 3... I don't know what this dude is talking about.
tr0tsky's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/30/2008 09:45
tr0tsky
Works fine for me, and I have Daemon Tools installed. I haven't seen any SecuROM stuff.
hardwareguy's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/30/2008 10:37
hardwareguy
It runs the SecuROM check each time you launch the game, you can tell cause it has that horrible lookign spinning CD ROM cursor. I have Daemon Tools installed and Fallout 3 works just fine for me.
Josh Tolentino's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/30/2008 10:54
Josh Tolentino
Haha, disc-based advocates! The Steam version is superior!
Ragewaar's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/30/2008 12:10
Ragewaar
@unangbangkay

Incorrect. DRM now exists to prevent the sale of second hand games, as opposed to preventing piracy.

You cannot sell your non-physical game, thus they have won.
LoweSox's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/30/2008 12:21
LoweSox
The game has been running fine for me.

My specs: 60 GB HD, 256 MB XDR DRAM - Integrated, 256 MB Nvidia RSX, IBM Cell 3.2 GHz...

Okay, so I don't even know how to spit specs like a PC gamer enough to make fun of PC gamers, so my attempt will now die in vain.

Whatever the case, the console makers need to get it through their heads that the reason why next-gen PC gaming isn't 'dead' is because they've refused to tighten their footgrip on its throat.

/unnecessarily violent analogies

If consoles started offering keyboard/mouse interface across the board, wining and dining developers to make versions of their MMOs available, and maybe even offering a friendlier/more affordable version of their toolset to the grassroots development community, I guarantee we'd all be happier people. Because that's what the PC industry has: interface flexibility, MMOs, and a user-driven corner of the games development. Hardware customization is expensive and alienating, while hardware uniformity is convenient and inclusive -- you could buy all three next-gen consoles, plus a handheld for the price it costs to build a PC with similar capabilities.

Obviously, what I'm arguing is partly that consoles adopt what make PC gaming preferable -- that consoles in a way become PCs themselves. So maybe I'm not at all anti-PC gaming, just a poor individual who would rather spend <$1000 on a console and not have to miss out on a handful of experiences for twice the price.

And, to make this all topical, it's ironic that console software is 100X (note: obviously an empirical value) more protected than PC software, with none of the hassle.
Volomon's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/30/2008 16:34
Volomon
I'm starting to dislike Bethesda.
Pixelated's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/31/2008 15:43
Pixelated
Go to gamecopyworld and download a fucking crack, end of story! I buy games I like and don't support companies I don't like (EA and Ubisoft). If it's your virtual drive software that's causing the conflict just disable it, it's really that simple.

Bethesda has the right to protect their property and didn't lie by including this particular form of Sony's InSecuROM. It does a disc check to make sure you have the physical copy in the DVD tray and not mounted in a virtual drive.

What's the difference between this and Oblivion which also used DRM?
A Ton of Berries's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/31/2008 17:41
A Ton of Berries
Well, all I can say is

"Fallout 3 has stopped working.
Windows can look online to find a solution to the problem.

[rape/rape some more]
cjpkiller's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/31/2008 21:24
cjpkiller
that is actually making me not buy this game.
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