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I had a lengthy discussion via Twitter last night with someone who thought I was attempting to squash Epic's First Amendment rights by telling Cliffy B "Saying SOPA is bad is great, but being a part of the ESA means Epic's statements are a fluff piece."
It turned out better than I thought any discussion on the internet could - we came to an agreement and never once resorted to name-calling. I was flabbergasted.
And that's my Cool Story of the day.
It turned out better than I thought any discussion on the internet could - we came to an agreement and never once resorted to name-calling. I was flabbergasted.
And that's my Cool Story of the day.
@Clowbog Beborp A rational debate between two individuals on the Internet that didn't result into rampant insults and typical Internet douchebaggery....I'm speechless, I thought such a thing was a myth.
@RyguyBeta Between two people that play Epic games, and had never interacted or known about each other's existence beforehand no less.
It happened to me and I still have a hard time believing it. It's like I found Sasquatch or something.
It happened to me and I still have a hard time believing it. It's like I found Sasquatch or something.
I think on epics part its a somewhat hollow statement. They simply don't agree with its current form they do not denounce it for what it is in its entirety. Smart PR move though kudos.
Just another gaming entity having their cake and eating it too.
You know, when it comes to the gaming aspect of all this, the double speak on the part of the industry is really as worrisome as anything.
You know, when it comes to the gaming aspect of all this, the double speak on the part of the industry is really as worrisome as anything.
Anyone see where google and facebook are thinking of shutting down on the 23rd in protest? That would be crazy
Yeah sorry Epic, while it is nice that you say you don't support SOPA. The fact that you are still a member of the ESA that adamantly supports SOPA sorta trumps your hollow PR stance.
@Dhaos
Also heard Amazon was amongst those that was going to shutdown, hadn't heard an exact date but I certainly hope they do and that others join them.
Also heard Amazon was amongst those that was going to shutdown, hadn't heard an exact date but I certainly hope they do and that others join them.
This is like if I was a part of some street gang that pulled a home invasion on some Epic employees houses, only for me to turn around and say "Yes I am a part of this gang, but I DO NOT agree with this group's course of action, so please don't blame me personally WHEN your families get beaten and raped. Please understand that we have to fight for our territorial rights in order to keep them, if some innocents get squashed along the way that was never MY intention so you can't possibly hold me liable for my gang's actions"
Fuck you, Epic. You are part of the ESA. THE ESA SUPPORTS SOPA. WHAT DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND?!?!?!
Fuck you, Epic. You are part of the ESA. THE ESA SUPPORTS SOPA. WHAT DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND?!?!?!
This is fucking bullshit. As long as they are members of the ESA and having made any comments about how the ESA supports SOPA, we shouldn't pay any attention to "Cliffy B." Epic games do the Activision dance and leave.
This may be a rash thing to do, but perhaps those members of the ESA are completely opposed to SOPA should just drop out of the ESA. Much like a lot of websites are changing over services that are opposed to SOPA, this could potentially change ESA's stance if they start losing support within their own organization.
This seems like textbook "having your cake and eating it too." You can be all down with the kids by being like "yeah we support free speech!" yet do nothing meaningful that backs that up. You don't distance yourself from a impotent/incompetant group like the ESA, you just play the safe, noncommittal middle and then jump to whoever's ship is still floating.
All of the companies, to my knowledge, who have backed off from their support of SOPA haven't done it because they learned any kind of moral or ethical lesson, they've done it because they won't get to have sex with as big a pile of money that they're used to because their customers turned out to be halfway savvy.
This just smacks of toothless, insincere PR.
tl;dr = fuckin' Jewbama! Where's the birth certificate?!
All of the companies, to my knowledge, who have backed off from their support of SOPA haven't done it because they learned any kind of moral or ethical lesson, they've done it because they won't get to have sex with as big a pile of money that they're used to because their customers turned out to be halfway savvy.
This just smacks of toothless, insincere PR.
tl;dr = fuckin' Jewbama! Where's the birth certificate?!
They support the ESA, therefore they support SOPA. Yeah another company to boycott. Of course most of Epic's fanbase is 12 year old 360 kids like Jimmyx who have no cluw what SOPA even is. They could probably support it and lose no business by it because of it.
Okay, so I may not know shit about any of this stuff going on with SOPA, but wouldn't the ESA give companies involved with it benefits OTHER than "Hey, we're the ESA, which means you support SOPA, and that's all we do!"
It's like an everyday job. There may be things that annoy you, but that doesn't mean you quit, giving up all of your insurance benefits. At least Epic isn't outright saying that they don't give two fucks about consumers' rights.
It's like an everyday job. There may be things that annoy you, but that doesn't mean you quit, giving up all of your insurance benefits. At least Epic isn't outright saying that they don't give two fucks about consumers' rights.
I think it an opportune time to bring up the Civil Rights Act. It was all for ending segregation (which is great, btw) that the government itself enforced. However, no one bothered to look at the fact that it was at the expense of property rights. It is the complacency of Americans that stick their head in the sand, that has set the standard to allow bills such as SOPA to rear their ugly head. We must scrutinize all un-American legislation to the same extent as SOPA. Most bills are labeled benevolently, but their intent never is. See the Patriot Act for exhibit B. Nothing patriotic about it.
RON PAUL 2012- WILL REPEAL or NOT ENFORCE:
SOPA, NDAA, THE PATRIOT ACT.
RON PAUL 2012- WILL REPEAL or NOT ENFORCE:
SOPA, NDAA, THE PATRIOT ACT.
Ok epic thats ONE step in the right direction. Now if you can just fix that whole cliffy b hating gays thing. Then we will be cool with you.
@RockWall
While I think you came off as a bit of a jerk, I do agree with the guilty by association thing. I have no idea why so many people are condemning Epic for OPPOSING SOPA.
While I think you came off as a bit of a jerk, I do agree with the guilty by association thing. I have no idea why so many people are condemning Epic for OPPOSING SOPA.
Yes, guilt by association.
Because if there's one thing the average sharp-minded consumer is well-aware and extremely tired of, it's LYING-ASS BUSINESS ETHICS! Deceitful pricks will tell us whatever they think we want to hear to keep the money rolling in. This sounds like damage control of a sort. Epic can say whatever the hell they want publicly, their position of standing firm with the ESA clearly indicates to me that no matter how bad they think the current iteration of SOPA might be, they are not interested in the least in doing anything to hinder it.
Epic's words say "we don't agree with SOPA". Epic's actions seem to support SOPA, indirectly or otherwise. When you deal with people in your daily life, which do you put more trust in...what they SAY or what they actually DO?
Because if there's one thing the average sharp-minded consumer is well-aware and extremely tired of, it's LYING-ASS BUSINESS ETHICS! Deceitful pricks will tell us whatever they think we want to hear to keep the money rolling in. This sounds like damage control of a sort. Epic can say whatever the hell they want publicly, their position of standing firm with the ESA clearly indicates to me that no matter how bad they think the current iteration of SOPA might be, they are not interested in the least in doing anything to hinder it.
Epic's words say "we don't agree with SOPA". Epic's actions seem to support SOPA, indirectly or otherwise. When you deal with people in your daily life, which do you put more trust in...what they SAY or what they actually DO?
Clowbog:"lengthy discussion" and "twitter" is quite the oxymoron. The fact you did THAT, and the miracle that followed, I'm shocked.
@pedrovay2003
Ah well, I'm not sure detraction is very deserving of courtesy. It makes it quite clear that I see there is a problem with this post.
@Mrdraven
Yes, because a company's open letter stating they do not support the bill means next to nothing. And this conspiracy involving their deceit to us innocent consumers totally warrants more attention than the ESA or the bill itself.
Regardless of Epic's true intentions, it hardly matters. Focus on the real problem, not your paranoia.
Ah well, I'm not sure detraction is very deserving of courtesy. It makes it quite clear that I see there is a problem with this post.
@Mrdraven
Yes, because a company's open letter stating they do not support the bill means next to nothing. And this conspiracy involving their deceit to us innocent consumers totally warrants more attention than the ESA or the bill itself.
Regardless of Epic's true intentions, it hardly matters. Focus on the real problem, not your paranoia.
@Clowbog Beborp
That's an amazing story but just to bring you back to reality, "GO FUCK UR SELF. CLIFFY B RULEZ & SO DOSE GEARS OF WAR!?!!"
That's an amazing story but just to bring you back to reality, "GO FUCK UR SELF. CLIFFY B RULEZ & SO DOSE GEARS OF WAR!?!!"
@RockWallOfMight359
Exactly, a company's open statement does not hold much water for me or many others these days. We have adopted a "wait and see" approach due to all the statements and promises constantly made that are constantly broken. I don't consider myself a conspiracy theorist at all in this matter. I can see how this appears to make me paranoid, I look at it more like real-world skepticism. It doesn't matter what they SAY to us. PROVE it.
I'm not sure what makes you think I was trying to focus the attention on Epic and not the real problem as you said, SOPA. This article is about Epic's statement, so that is what I focused on. Perhaps you should start to consider that maybe Epic's statement does not dissolve them of any sort of responsibility in this matter
I absolutely emailed Jim's letters from the earlier post, even included a few words of my own at the end to make it personal. I realize this issue as a whole is not just about Epic, but this article is.
Exactly, a company's open statement does not hold much water for me or many others these days. We have adopted a "wait and see" approach due to all the statements and promises constantly made that are constantly broken. I don't consider myself a conspiracy theorist at all in this matter. I can see how this appears to make me paranoid, I look at it more like real-world skepticism. It doesn't matter what they SAY to us. PROVE it.
I'm not sure what makes you think I was trying to focus the attention on Epic and not the real problem as you said, SOPA. This article is about Epic's statement, so that is what I focused on. Perhaps you should start to consider that maybe Epic's statement does not dissolve them of any sort of responsibility in this matter
I absolutely emailed Jim's letters from the earlier post, even included a few words of my own at the end to make it personal. I realize this issue as a whole is not just about Epic, but this article is.
@Mrdraven
Epic's statement may not "dissolve them of any sort of responsibility in this matter," but what people don't seem to understand is that companies like Epic have all the right in the world to make sure their games aren't stolen. I think we all agree that SOPA, as it currently, is, certainly isn't the answer, but that doesn't mean piracy isn't an issue and should be ignored. I'd be wary about leaving the ESA, too, if I were in Epic's position. At least they actually came out and said that they disagree with how it currently looks.
Epic's statement may not "dissolve them of any sort of responsibility in this matter," but what people don't seem to understand is that companies like Epic have all the right in the world to make sure their games aren't stolen. I think we all agree that SOPA, as it currently, is, certainly isn't the answer, but that doesn't mean piracy isn't an issue and should be ignored. I'd be wary about leaving the ESA, too, if I were in Epic's position. At least they actually came out and said that they disagree with how it currently looks.
I have never stated that Epic or anybody else doesn't have a right to protect their own material, and I never will. If that is what you have gathered from my statements you are simply incorrect.
Piracy should absolutely NOT be ignored, but if you can honestly tell me you believe that SOPA can effectively and completely squash piracy WITHOUT allowing any abuses of power...we'll just have to agree to disagree.
What I or others don't understand is how in the world Epic can look themselves in the mirror and basically say "we're not the bad guys, we just side with them".
I hear the KKK has excellent health benefits, I think I'll join. But you absolutely cannot link me to their hate crimes, because I'm telling you now I don't agree with it. But I will join the KKK so don't you or anyone else hold anything against me, ok?
Dramatic? Yeah. Thank god it's friday, lol.
Piracy should absolutely NOT be ignored, but if you can honestly tell me you believe that SOPA can effectively and completely squash piracy WITHOUT allowing any abuses of power...we'll just have to agree to disagree.
What I or others don't understand is how in the world Epic can look themselves in the mirror and basically say "we're not the bad guys, we just side with them".
I hear the KKK has excellent health benefits, I think I'll join. But you absolutely cannot link me to their hate crimes, because I'm telling you now I don't agree with it. But I will join the KKK so don't you or anyone else hold anything against me, ok?
Dramatic? Yeah. Thank god it's friday, lol.
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