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Epic: Cheap app games are 'killing us' photo

One of the great benefits of mobile gaming is the fact that titles are incredibly affordable, with some of the best titles available for under a dollar. Naturally, major game companies aren't best pleased with this.

"We have not been this uncertain about what's coming next in the games industry since Epic's been around for 20 years," said Epic Games' Mike Capps. "We're at such an inflection point. Will there be physical distribution in 10 years or even five? Will anyone care about the next console generation? What's going on in PC? Can you make money on PC if it's not a connected game? What's going on in mobile? Tons of really scary things.

"If there's anything that's killing us [in the traditional games business] it's dollar apps. How do you sell someone a $60 game that's really worth it? They're used to 99 cents. As I said, it's an uncertain time in the industry. But it's an exciting time for whoever picks the right path and wins." 

Cheap apps have been on the market for quite some time now, and $60 games seem to be doing alright. To me, it's like someone asking how they can charge for Blu-ray movies when people can watch television for free. They're two very different entities that provide very different things. I don't personally see how a mobile app is a direct threat to a major title. 

That said ... a uniform $60 price for all games, regardless of their pedigree, is getting pretty stupid. I still say we need a $40 middle-range tier. Maybe the problem is publishers and their refusal to look beyond their noses, rather than cheap apps "killing" traditional development.

Epic: 99-Cent Apps Are 'Killing Us' [Industry Gamers]








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72 comments | showing # 1 to 50
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JohnGrisham's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:01
JohnGrisham
then lower your prices... bitch.
Alasdair Duncan's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:05
Alasdair Duncan
Wonder why they never capitalised on the success of Shadow Complex. Can't Epic do more XBLA/PSN games that would be as financially successful as their main titles. (Obviously given the difference in budgets, "financial success" wouldn't mean both making massive profits:).
WarZombie's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:06
WarZombie
Wait, I thought that used games were killing the market? What other bullshit are they gonna start spewing now?
B4DKARM4's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:06
B4DKARM4
I played the bulletstorm demo and wasnt very impressed with it. Not even tempted with the GOW3 beta. 60 bucks is a lot of money to me and its not something im really going to casually throw away on a game that I MIGHT find entertaining.

A buck or two, well Ill drop a buck or two on a mobile game and never look back, if the game sucks I wont cry about it, whats a buck?

Evolve or die epic.
Cosmictrigger's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:06
Cosmictrigger
thats just it. this goes in all spaces of gaming. Price according to your product. Some games arent worth 60 bucks, and there is no shame in that... just dont pretend that it is. It rarely works out for anyone.

Same in the MMO space... $15 a month... for a giant like WOW... but not $15 a month for Warhammer.

At this point I personally can't afford more than a handful of $60 games a year. Obviously, I'm not going to pass up on what I consider big guns, so it really leaves little wiggle room for 'questionable' titles.
PhilK3nS3bb3n's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:10
PhilK3nS3bb3n
Um here's a thought. Make your $60 title worth it. I've stopped most my day 1 purchases because on day 3-4, I've beaten the game. This isn't just directed @ epic either.
GREENGUY's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:11
GREENGUY
THEY'RE KILLING US MAN
wildcatfan87's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:12
wildcatfan87
I agree with you jim we need more 40 dollars middle tier games.

I do not want all games to be 99 cent apps....I like them but I can't get enough enjoyement, I need some bigger games like portal , elder scrolls andm mass effect.
Astalano's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:12
Astalano
It'll be funny next gen if console publishers and developers say there's no money in console gaming and it's so much more profitable to develop for Iphone and Ipad and Facebook.
DtoidEurope's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:12
DtoidEurope
60$, 65€ is just too much for most games, especially something like Bulletstorm...
Insanity-Oo's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:13
Insanity-Oo
"Cheap apps have been on the market for quite some time now, and $60 games seem to be doing alright. To me, it's like someone asking how they can charge for Blu-ray movies when people can watch television for free. They're two very different entities that provide very different things. I don't personally see how a mobile app is a direct threat to a major title."

This statement is why I look at people who say "iOS games are going to replace the NGP/3DS games" funny.
Praefectia's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:14
Praefectia
Completely agree on the "a uniform $60 price for all games, regardless of their pedigree, is getting pretty stupid."
Octomom's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:15
Octomom
I generally like Epic but that's one dumb comment - also, when has the future ever been certain?
TripleShot's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:17
TripleShot
Before iPhone existed I had a hard time justifying 60 bucks for an Xbox game. For the most part I've been dodging this entire gen of consoles or buying used copies. Sorry, but it just wasn't meant to sustain. Just cause manufactures force a 60 price tag on us doesn't mean we have to buy it. No game is really worth it.
JetSetRadioForever's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:17
JetSetRadioForever
There's lots of games worth 99 cents and few that are worth 60 bucks.
Jon B's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:29
Jon B
How do you make a game sell for $60?
You don't make it 4 fucking hours long, that's how.
BoomingEchoes's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:30
BoomingEchoes
I really do think the industry is over thinking this and panicking. Theres going to be a place for big, "expensive", games well into the future. Some dinky $1 game isn't going to change much and it'll take a lot to make those games have depth.

Now what they need to worry about more, maybe, is games on XBL and PSN, stuff like Limbo and Shadow Complex that can come out at $15 and steal away months worth of praise. Games that can give depth for almost the same amount of time as most $60 games. Thats something to worry about.
Elsa's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:31
Elsa
nicely said. The blu-ray/TV comparison is spot on, as is the idea of different pricing for different games.
stevesan's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:33
stevesan
Betta' lowa' yo' pricez!
Sexualchocolate's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:35
Sexualchocolate
I think "The $60 / £40 standard game price is killing the industry" would be more correct.

There are a fucktonne of games out there that millions of people will, have and DO buy at $40 / £30 pre-owned. Why the fuck do publishers keep shooting for the top price and pretty much forcing those consumers to buy pre-owned.

It's like they don't want the fucking money!

Get this, sell your game cheaper, sell more copies, look better in sales figures, make the same, if not more profit, let those who aren't willing to pay full price get your game on day one at the price it's worth AND convert used sales into new sales in one. fell. swoop.

Seriously, sometimes i think the bigwigs at games publishers are fucking stupid.
D Chap's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:35
D Chap
This then brings up the issue of- if the next say, I dunno, Red Faction game comes out and its $40 instead of $60- will gamers regard that as a good deal, or will they get the impression that the new Red Faction is of lower quality because of the price drop?

It's a very difficult issue for publishers to deal with since no one really knows exactly how the consumer will respond.
Ace829's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:38
Ace829
Ladies and gentleman, mattrodroid , The Internet Psychologist!
shadow2398's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:39
shadow2398
Well considering Epic's constant old school attitude of "we can't develop certain things because we just can't and don't feel like trying." bullshit, I feel no remorse for them feeling pressure because they don't want to invest in such things as arcade titles or actually trying to put out a 3ds game. If they did a HD update to unreal tournament 99 and launched on xbla and psn, it would likely be very successful.

Oh and that 40 tier does exist, you just have to have enough patience to wait for a sale or a price drop. Unless you're activison. However a 40 dollar price point at launch would be awesome.
whormongr's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:40
whormongr
if you drop the entry level of games to $39 instead of $59 you will sell a whole lot more, personally I just wait on nearly every title because in a few months it drops to $29-$39. If you budget for a $39 release or possibly sell smaller games episodically for lower prices, people will buy it more readily. The truth is that it gets really hard to justify the price point for the games. also... lower prices kills some but not all piracy complaints as well.
Jawmuncher's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 10:43
Jawmuncher
A mid tier is definitely needed. to many games pony on the 60 price whenwe all know they shouldn't even be trying
Cosmictrigger's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 11:00
Cosmictrigger
@DChap--- I think thats a good question. To me the answer largely lies in critic reviews. If i saw a game getting a 7 (hypothetically) and it was $40... personally, I might give it a shot. If i saw it getting a 7 and was $60... almost no chance. If a game got a 7, and was $20, yeah I'd get it if the genre was interesting to me. Sad but true, a borderline-score game gets a better shot from me if its cheaper.

For the sake of arguement, we are assuming that a $40 retail game would get the same development resources (money.time and people) as a $60 game. But, in practice that may not be the case. This all plays into perception too, since perhaps there is less money for advertising and paying off game reviews (not this site).

The general public that doesnt read reviews... thats another ball of wax, but my guess they are going to buy whats advertised and what has a name brand.

thats my crystal ball prediction though
EvilEnvi's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 11:03
EvilEnvi
Oh this is complete garbage. Not only do Console games still soak up most of themarket but they do more this year than last year. The only real competition between these cheap games are on the portables which the iphone/ipad/etc is currently starting to take. If they are complaining about their games not selling well they should blame themselves for selling 60 dollars game they just look nice but have no substances to them. Games are way to short nowadays and much too reliant on either JUST multiplayer or a mediocre combination of both. Theres far too many games in the multiplayer FPS online space to keep churning out very similar experiences and expect people to play it much beyond the first week or two before you and other get bored and then when you attempt to play later the community is dead and you lose your only reason for playing it in the first place. I just don't see people playing 4 games at a time regularly when they are very similar. Most people will focus one and either rarely play other or never play at all. Killzone 3 is awesome but if I have black ops on the same console I'm more than likely going to focus on one only. A good chunk of my friends have modded 360s because they don't feel like spending money on games that last them a day or two
Enzi's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 11:16
Enzi
Hm, it's quite simple because time will show that 1$ apps are not something you can sustain for very long as a developer.

I mean, even if you bring out a really cool game that sells around 100k, which is very very good for an indie developer, what do you get out of it? Can you pay the guy who made the sprites for you? What about the one who made the music. Not everyone is a one-man wonder who can do all by himself.

1$ apps are devalueing games at a very fast pace and this things doesn't end good. Iphone games are still going strong but Android is practically dead. (Name 5 good Android games that costs 1$)

You can't put a seal on every game which says: indie - 1$, triple fucking A - 60$.

Publishers should really start to sell their products for what they are worth. (Activision, yeah, I'm talking to you) Some are learning. Maijin sold for 30$ which is a pretty good deal for a new franchise and a good game.
dtomek's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 11:16
dtomek
I wonder if some of the trouble with releasing games at $40 isn't a gamer perception thing? I.E. Gamer looks at brand new game released at $40 and thinks to himself "Meh, it's already discounted and it just came out. Has to be shit."
PalinRMA's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 11:17
PalinRMA
Prices are way to high for most games. I just wait for Steam sales or for the console game prices to drop.
Excel-2011's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 11:19
Excel-2011
Nintendo totally called it.
PhilK3nS3bb3n's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 11:28
PhilK3nS3bb3n
@mattrodroid: not everyone is from this new generation of add kids. I know how to milk my games, cause I grew up poor. While nowadays i do have a nice disposable income, and will drop $60 in heartbeat, it has to be worth it. Example: Fallout NV/Battlefield/Mass Effect 2/Forza 3/Crysis 2, all worth $60 (IMO). However, Bulletstorm/Homefront/Portal 2/Enslaved, all felt more like $40 titles to me. That's just my opinion. Smell my shit, I'm the busdriver.
styleznma's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 11:32
styleznma
I wouldn't mine if they went back to a 49.99 price tag (ps3 360)... i sure hope they don't jump to 69.99 for the next round of consoles.
comradesnarky's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 11:40
comradesnarky
This is just stupid. Why do developers say crap like this? Are we supposed to feel bad and get in line to pony up for Gears 3? Personally, I don't think the Gears games have ever been worth $60. Few games truly are worth $60 as has been said many times here.

The problem is that developers are completely able to release a game at a lower price, they just don't/won't do it because all of them are deluded to the point that they think they're making the most incredible game ever.
OTLeon's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 11:44
OTLeon
well, if Apple someday become more serious about games, then these dollar games really could be a threat to the traditional gaming industry.
jackal27's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 11:46
jackal27
Maybe studios need to downsize. The millions of dollars that they are throwing at some of these games is just ridiculous. Especially when you consider that many people are able to make really fun, really creative games with little or no budget at all. When I play a game on my 360 and realize that it cost millions upon millions of dollars to make, I think to myself "Really?" Because most of these games aren't worth putting that much money into or paying $60 for!
mellotron's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 11:56
mellotron
Epic: Dont worry - i dont even consider those 1$ app games as video games. it's all garbage and i wont be diverting your dollars to shit like that. However, i also will not be paying 59.99 for all but the best of games. I will get them later from eBay, GameStop, or if there's a really good Amazon sale.
yenner's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 11:59
yenner
Shit, I don't know. How do fancy steak houses compete with fast food value menu?

Tier price range with matching quality. It really isn't that hard to figure out, Epic. Or do you just want to complain cuz you don't want to adapt?
bungalowbill79's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 12:01
bungalowbill79
While I don't agree with the idea of cheap apps being the death of the traditional games industry your suggestion that it is comparable to blu-rays and TV is just wrong. In the case of a movie made available on blu-ray there are almost always nearly identical versions, albeit usually at lower resolutions (standard DVD, netflix, cable TV etc.) of the same movie available as well for a lower (or free) price as well. If companies like Epic sold the same games they release in cheaper formats, with lower FPS for example, then that comparison might work.
EvilEnvi's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 12:01
EvilEnvi
Oh this is complete garbage. Not only do Console games still soak up most of themarket but they do more this year than last year. The only real competition between these cheap games are on the portables which the iphone/ipad/etc is currently starting to take. If they are complaining about their games not selling well they should blame themselves for selling 60 dollars game they just look nice but have no substances to them. Games are way to short nowadays and much too reliant on either JUST multiplayer or a mediocre combination of both. Theres far too many games in the multiplayer FPS online space to keep churning out very similar experiences and expect people to play it much beyond the first week or two before you and other get bored and then when you attempt to play later the community is dead and you lose your only reason for playing it in the first place. I just don't see people playing 4 games at a time regularly when they are very similar. Most people will focus one and either rarely play other or never play at all. Killzone 3 is awesome but if I have black ops on the same console I'm more than likely going to focus on one only. A good chunk of my friends have modded 360s because they don't feel like spending money on games that last them a day or two
Leathersoup's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 12:07
Leathersoup
So games that focus on things other than "EXXXTREME" graphics and non stop gun fights are selling better? It's about time.
ElektroDragon's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 12:18
ElektroDragon
If this guy thinks some 99 cent piece of garbage 1MB game is taking market share from $60 AAA titles on console, they need to fire him for idiocy.
CBunn's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 12:25
CBunn
I wish games had prices like books. Smaller ones cost less, big budgets more. We are getting there with digital distribution. Movies should go that direction as well
Maniac's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 12:35
Maniac
Put up or shut up.
kid23455's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 12:46
kid23455
Shut up, epic, the reason nobody likes to spend 60 bucks on a game is because times aren't exactly like you can spend money as you please. If you have a hard time competing against $1 apps, which I will go and say that are sometimes better than 60 dollar games, it would be in order to lower your prices. Nothing makes me angrier and more close to quitting games is to get a 60 dollar game that sucks ass.
Shinta's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 13:10
Shinta
Epic are such drama queens.
BizBob's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 13:20
BizBob
"Maybe the problem is publishers"

In this industry, there are devs and there are devils. Publishers are not devs.
Killrig's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 13:21
Killrig
These are two different markets.

And this statement is silly. I disagreed when CliffyB said that the middle tier games are going away and I disagree with this statement as well.

Also, Bulletstorm was disappointing.
Vajoiner's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/20/2011 13:29
Vajoiner
aww... poor mr. epic. loosing a slice of his l33t pie to darwinism. "we dont know how to make money anymore!" remember when it was about the fun, mr. epic?
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