John Riccitiello's exact words were "confounding", but that didn't look as good in the header image. Either way, it's clear that the EA figurehead doesn't fully understand why some of his games aren't selling on the Wii. According to the publisher- "Dead Space Extraction was one of the best pieces of software built on the platform and it did not perform well. It's a strong IP but for some reason it did not resonate in a way that brought consumers to the store to buy it. And Madden hasn't performed to my expectations so far this year, even though it's a fabulous piece of software."
OK, John, I've got the answers you've been looking for. About Dead Space Extraction; it's not that strong of an IP, it's not one of the best pieces of software built on the platform, and it's an on-rails shooter. If Dead Space had the same kind of fan-base as Resident Evil, and if Dead Space Extraction couldn't be completely finished in under 8 hours, and if on-rails shooters were a popular genre, and if the Wii wasn't already flooded with those kinds of games, then yeah, maybe you'd have a point. It's also worth noting that Wii games that try to copy Hollywood action/horror movies usually have a tougher time than those that are more "game-y". If you want to make a "core" game on the console, you might be better off going the No More Heroes route as opposed to Disaster: Day of Crisis.
As for Madden, I've never understood why those games sell so well year after year anyway, but I do know that a lot of modern dudes will only watch their football on a HD TV. I assume they feel the same way about their football videogames. I guess the grass looks a lot greener in 1080i? Honestly, I really don't know.
So there are your answers, John! I hope they help you to understand that what Wii owners really want from your company is an upgraded sequel to Mail Order Monsters, not downgraded on-rails prequels to games that they've never played in the first place.
Jonathan Holmes is the most lovable Associate Editor on Destructoid. Catch him on videos, original editorials, and on back episodes of the Destructoid Show and MTV's Road Rules. Jonathan is a retro gamer's gamer.
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Despite the article trying desperately to frame this another way, the real problem is of course the target market. People like me who enjoy games like Dead Space do not want to play them on the Wii, for numerous reasons.
If we ignore the precedent Umbrella Chronicles set - that a known IP in one of the only genres the Wii can do well will sell respectably - then yes, it was totally unreasonable for EA to expect Extraction to be successful.
I've actually heard good things about DS:E. Well, aside from an apparent game freezing glitch that one guy ran into multiple times. But most of the second paragraph and "on-rails prequels to games that they've never played in the first place" are right on the money.
Madden and other sports games had trouble on the Gamecube as well. No one really talks about a non-Mario regular sports game on a Nintendo system that isn't Tecmo Super Bowl. Your reason is part of it but maybe there's something else.
couldn't agree with you more, Jonathan. as a wii gamer, i could care less about rail shooters. the genre is dead to me. even if i was going to buy one, i'd get one of the RE titles before Dead Space. I'm still waiting for a third party title that has the same amount of polish as the big hitters on the hd twins. nintendo gamers like polish, deep gameplay, and involving gameplay. if you create a wii game using the same amount of effort as you do with your hd games, we will buy them. the reason you can't sell your substandard software, is because we know that it's substandard.
+1 for a Mail Order Monsters sequel. I'd enjoy a little Beast-Fu reckoning using a Wii-mote. (Then again, I doubt anyone can pull of a proper sequel anyway... that game was truly unique).
Muramsama was a freaken awesome game! That's why it sold better then dead space Extraction!!!!! GAAHH!!!!
All side comments aside. They where both good games, but an interesting point to state is the fact that Dead Space banked on nothing, and was basically advertised up the SHi hole. Dead Space Extraction was riding off the success of the first game. Which barely reached 1 million.
... That was also on completely different systems......
"Although 1 million unit sales is pretty great. Heck, some companies would be happy with just one hundred thousand units."
Madden sells well because lots of people love football. It doesn't sell well on Wii, because there is no reason whatsoever to buy it on that system, as opposed to the others. EA is still getting their money, regardless of which system a person buys Madden for. Turn those frowns upside down!
EA needs to get with the program and realize that the majority of Dead Space fans did not want an on-rails Dead Space prequel. They basically pulled a Capcom by offering a spin-off title. EA, Wii owners want the real deal, not more spin-off titles. Quite frankly, it seems like most Wii gamers have also gotten sick of the on-rails FPS genre with 3 of them being released in this year alone Overkill, DS: Extraction, RE: Dark Side Chronicles).
Lesson # 1 Give us what we want and we'll probably buy it.
I bought the game and while it is certainly fun and of high quality, it just feels more like a rental especially given its lack of replay value. Still, the game is worthwhile. Although, I found Dark Side Chronicles has better replay value even though its gameplay and story isn't as refreshing or as compelling as Extraction's.
The main reason why these games don't sell, all comes down to marketing. I don't get why 3rd Party's think they don't need to put out TV ads for their Wii games, like they do for their 360/PS3 games. Am I missing something? Shouldn't it be the opposite? Shouldn't they be advertising to the casual/mainstream consumer more on the Wii? The hardcore gamers already know about the game and whether, or not they're going to buy it, so if the casual/mainstream consumer doesn't know the game exists, than how do these company's expect them to buy the game?
They marketed EA Sports Active, hell they even made it its own retail stores and it sold well over 2 million units. So if they just put half that effort into games like Dead Space, than it would of sold better as well. It's like they sent Dead Space to die. They put it out right at the end of the month, a week after Halo 3: ODST and didn't market the game at all, so of course its going to sell like crap. They couldn't of screw up its launch anymore is they tried!
Why would anyone expect Dead Space Extraction to sell well on any console? They act like it would have been one of the best selling games of the year had it been on 360 or PS3. It would have probably done even worse on those consoles.
As Holmes pointed out, rail shooters aren't a popular genre. A lot of people see them as watered down FPSs. Not only that, but there are bigger name rail shooters on Wii, like the 90 Resident Evil rail shooters and the House of the Dead games. I doubt that there are many people who buy every rail shooter that comes out. Most people probably own one or two, if even that many. And if you're going to own a couple of rail shooters on Wii, neither of them are going to be Dead Space Extraction.
The Wii isn't flooded with on-rails shooters. It has about 10 that actually have effort put into them and another 10 that are mostly just compilations of older shooters.
So, uh, yeah, it's not flooded and it's really pretty dumb to think otherwise.
You have to be a complete fucking moron to think the wii is going to die prematurely or that developers SHOULD let it die. They should invest the most in wii on userbase alone.
"I don't know why they even bother, if it's not from nintendo, it probably won't sell that much. Just let the console die."
Wow don't let the facts get in the way of your BS story. The Wii has like 65 million seller thus far and only 22 of them are from Nintendo themselves, so there are 43 million sellers from 3rd Party's. Games do sell well on the Wii. It might not be the games that you want to be selling, but there still selling just the same!
I agree with what a few posters already said, EA does not market most Wii games, at all, and act surprised when they don't sell. Dead Space was a VERY slow burn when it came out on the 360 and PS3, and didn't sell even half a million copies in it's first few months.
So, EA doesn't advertise this game....a new entry in a series that never hit in the Wii in the first place...
@ AdamantiumHip- Like I said in in the Dead Space Extraction review, it's a good game. It's a very good game, one that I'm glad to own, and lend out to friends on a regular basis.
But one of the best on the Wii? Not in this writer's opinion. That said, I'm glad you appreciate the game more than I do.
@ Mondi- Yeah, Boom Blox was a million seller, wasn't it? Weird that EA has succeeded on the Wii to that level and still hasn't figured out how to develop for the thing yet.
@ EggmaniMN- Twenty games in niche' genre over the course of three years doesn't constitute a flood? OK then, we'll just have to agree to disagree on that one.
@ ZSeba- 3rd parties will let the Wii "die" as soon as they stop making money off of the console.
Dead Space is clearly a franchise aimed at the hardcore gamer. And hardcore gamers most likely have a XBox 360 or PS3. And those gamers have had their hands full this fall with Borderlands, Uncharted 2, Demon's Souls, Halo ODST, MW2, Brutal Legend, AC2...
Also, those gamers are not necessarily interested in paying $50 for a low-res light gun game.
Jonathon Holmes - "Twenty games in niche' genre over the course of three years doesn't constitute a flood? OK then, we'll just have to agree to disagree on that one."
It definitely isn't a flood. It's not even 7 games per year on the system with by far the most games being put out for it (well, the DS might have it beat). And it's literally the only system where the genre even makes sense. It being a smaller genre is meaningless. A flood is what's happened to FPS games.
So yeah, continue trying to make it sound like there's some horrible flood of games of that "dreaded genre" but it's not even close. There is no glut of them.
holmes i dont agree with you, i know you didnt give it an impressive score, but according to metacritic DSE was one of the highest rankin games released for the wii on 2009
not only that, your argument about on rails shooters having no fan base on the wii is absurd
wii owners hyped deadspace extraction, hyped house of the dead overkill before it and hyped resident evil darkside chronicles AFTER it
in fact DSE was the better of all 3 according to the metascore
in my opinion the wii simply has a different demographic
I agree with Deadline, hardcore gamers (like myself) upon finding out that the Wii wasn't going to deliver, we moved on to PS3 and 360. Dead Space Extraction, even though it was a good game, missed the boat.
Maybe EA can kick the graphics up a notch and release it on the PS3 when its remote control comes out.
@ pl0x- Sure, the Wii has a different demographic, but it's not a demographic that is notoriously opposed to buying on-rails shooters. RE:Umbrella Chronicles sold about 1.3 million units. I think that EA thought that DSE would do the same numbers.
It hasn't so far, and for my money, it's wont. It has less content and is based in a much less popular IP than RE:UC. That's a lot of why it didn't sell.
And I never said that on-rails shooters don't have an audience on the Wii. I implied that the on-rails audience on the console was already satiated with on-rails shooters for the year. I don't know how many comments I read about DSE that were along the lines of "I'll rent DSE because it's short, and buy RE:Darkside Chronicles because it's long" or "I'll get DSE after the price drop. I paid full price for House of the Dead: Overkill, only to see it drop to $30 two months later".
That's where people were coming from with DSE. It was the wrong game from the wrong IP at the wrong time.
And I don't care what the critics say, DSE is shorter, and has way fewer environments, enemies, and boss fights that RE:UC or RE:DC. That's not something a game like DSE can get away with. It had to truly blow the competition out of the water, lest it end up like Ninja Blade or Bionic Commando on the 360.
I guess EA just wasn't punk rock enough for Johnathon Holmes... too bad. Because without supporting the true efforts on the console without being a snob, you're stuff with what works. Tiger Woods 43, EA Active 12, Boom Blox 7, and nothing but your own bitching to blame for it.
DS:E was good. But the rail shooter is a bit of a niche market these days. On top of that, other rail shooters released on the wii did a good job of packing a bit more content into the game, which is quite necessary if you re going to charge full price. DS:E had some interesting ideas in it as far as rail shooters go, but you can nearly beat it in one sitting. It's hard to get people to see the value in that. Even I waited for a price drop.
Its a good game, prolly my second favourite Wii game of the year after Muramassa, but it has the wrong controls and the wrong marketing.
EA should have stolen Resi 4 Wii's control scheme. No shame in that, nothing that Dead Space didn't do to the Gamecube Resi 4. Its not like making it a different game would drastically add to the development costs either, just use the same assets as were created for the rail shooter, playtest the level layouts a bit more thoroughly. I didn't see any marketing for the game. Only pre-release mentions I saw was by scouring game trailers. So fans of Dead Space and the general public did not know it existed I guess. They shoulda got the geniuses doing Dante's Inferno and Dead Space 2 to do some marketing to raise awareness.
Wii is not the system for horror games. Cursed Mountain sold even less than DS:E (70K to DS:E's 110K according to vgchartz (and that was in spite of having a casual-oriented tv campaign running at haloween), Project Zero 4 didn't make it out of Japan, I am told Juon sucks, Silent Hill Shattered Memories is coming out on PS2 and PSP as well (guessing Konami realises SH fanss may not have a Wii, but will have a PS2 from the older games). Resi, imo, has not been a horror series in nearly a decade, it is action all the way, although I respect people who don't play stuff like Siren and Silet Hill may find it a bit scary.
Unrelated, but EA doesn't "get" horror elements of games in general... Dragon Age: Origins is supposed to be a Diabalo-esque "Dark Fantasy"? It is the pinnacle of generic high fantasy, with a blood splattering effect on your characters after every battle.
hey john easy, first of all is kind of dumb to say you dont care what critics say when YOU are a critic
the common consensus is that the game is good and sure the on rails genre is a bit overcrowded on the wii, however its not more overcrowded than the FPS genre on either the ps3 or the xbox360, that doesnt stops good games like resistance 2 and borderlands from pullin out decent numbers, despite not being well known IPs
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Contest:
1:00 PM on 12.04.2009
| 
Sad too, I love them so.
Madden and other sports games had trouble on the Gamecube as well. No one really talks about a non-Mario regular sports game on a Nintendo system that isn't Tecmo Super Bowl. Your reason is part of it but maybe there's something else.
All side comments aside. They where both good games, but an interesting point to state is the fact that Dead Space banked on nothing, and was basically advertised up the SHi hole. Dead Space Extraction was riding off the success of the first game. Which barely reached 1 million.
... That was also on completely different systems......
"Although 1 million unit sales is pretty great. Heck, some companies would be happy with just one hundred thousand units."
Lesson # 1 Give us what we want and we'll probably buy it.
I bought the game and while it is certainly fun and of high quality, it just feels more like a rental especially given its lack of replay value. Still, the game is worthwhile. Although, I found Dark Side Chronicles has better replay value even though its gameplay and story isn't as refreshing or as compelling as Extraction's.
They marketed EA Sports Active, hell they even made it its own retail stores and it sold well over 2 million units. So if they just put half that effort into games like Dead Space, than it would of sold better as well. It's like they sent Dead Space to die. They put it out right at the end of the month, a week after Halo 3: ODST and didn't market the game at all, so of course its going to sell like crap. They couldn't of screw up its launch anymore is they tried!
As Holmes pointed out, rail shooters aren't a popular genre. A lot of people see them as watered down FPSs. Not only that, but there are bigger name rail shooters on Wii, like the 90 Resident Evil rail shooters and the House of the Dead games. I doubt that there are many people who buy every rail shooter that comes out. Most people probably own one or two, if even that many. And if you're going to own a couple of rail shooters on Wii, neither of them are going to be Dead Space Extraction.
- Make games we want.
- Look at the genres that work well for Wii & its controls.
- Put in some actual effort to promote your games.
To EA & all other publishers, you're making it harder than it has to be.
So, uh, yeah, it's not flooded and it's really pretty dumb to think otherwise.
Just let the console die.
@ZSeba
That's a terrible philosophy and why many 3rd party games are not given a chance, many think the same without even trying them.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wrjQ7joYHi0
I HATE THIS FFFF----
@Monodi
Word up.
You have to be a complete fucking moron to think the wii is going to die prematurely or that developers SHOULD let it die. They should invest the most in wii on userbase alone.
Wow don't let the facts get in the way of your BS story. The Wii has like 65 million seller thus far and only 22 of them are from Nintendo themselves, so there are 43 million sellers from 3rd Party's. Games do sell well on the Wii. It might not be the games that you want to be selling, but there still selling just the same!
So, EA doesn't advertise this game....a new entry in a series that never hit in the Wii in the first place...
"WHY'S NO ONE BUYING???? GARGGRGGR?"
But one of the best on the Wii? Not in this writer's opinion. That said, I'm glad you appreciate the game more than I do.
@ Mondi- Yeah, Boom Blox was a million seller, wasn't it? Weird that EA has succeeded on the Wii to that level and still hasn't figured out how to develop for the thing yet.
@ EggmaniMN- Twenty games in niche' genre over the course of three years doesn't constitute a flood? OK then, we'll just have to agree to disagree on that one.
@ ZSeba- 3rd parties will let the Wii "die" as soon as they stop making money off of the console.
That hasn't happened yet.
Also, those gamers are not necessarily interested in paying $50 for a low-res light gun game.
sorry... but a hardcore gamer most likely has all consoles and is starving for a great 3rd party effort on the wii.
Boom Blox was just...incredible. AND a new IP!
It definitely isn't a flood. It's not even 7 games per year on the system with by far the most games being put out for it (well, the DS might have it beat). And it's literally the only system where the genre even makes sense. It being a smaller genre is meaningless. A flood is what's happened to FPS games.
So yeah, continue trying to make it sound like there's some horrible flood of games of that "dreaded genre" but it's not even close. There is no glut of them.
not only that, your argument about on rails shooters having no fan base on the wii is absurd
wii owners hyped deadspace extraction, hyped house of the dead overkill before it and hyped resident evil darkside chronicles AFTER it
in fact DSE was the better of all 3 according to the metascore
in my opinion the wii simply has a different demographic
Maybe EA can kick the graphics up a notch and release it on the PS3 when its remote control comes out.
It hasn't so far, and for my money, it's wont. It has less content and is based in a much less popular IP than RE:UC. That's a lot of why it didn't sell.
And I never said that on-rails shooters don't have an audience on the Wii. I implied that the on-rails audience on the console was already satiated with on-rails shooters for the year. I don't know how many comments I read about DSE that were along the lines of "I'll rent DSE because it's short, and buy RE:Darkside Chronicles because it's long" or "I'll get DSE after the price drop. I paid full price for House of the Dead: Overkill, only to see it drop to $30 two months later".
That's where people were coming from with DSE. It was the wrong game from the wrong IP at the wrong time.
And I don't care what the critics say, DSE is shorter, and has way fewer environments, enemies, and boss fights that RE:UC or RE:DC. That's not something a game like DSE can get away with. It had to truly blow the competition out of the water, lest it end up like Ninja Blade or Bionic Commando on the 360.
EA should have stolen Resi 4 Wii's control scheme. No shame in that, nothing that Dead Space didn't do to the Gamecube Resi 4. Its not like making it a different game would drastically add to the development costs either, just use the same assets as were created for the rail shooter, playtest the level layouts a bit more thoroughly. I didn't see any marketing for the game. Only pre-release mentions I saw was by scouring game trailers. So fans of Dead Space and the general public did not know it existed I guess. They shoulda got the geniuses doing Dante's Inferno and Dead Space 2 to do some marketing to raise awareness.
Wii is not the system for horror games. Cursed Mountain sold even less than DS:E (70K to DS:E's 110K according to vgchartz (and that was in spite of having a casual-oriented tv campaign running at haloween), Project Zero 4 didn't make it out of Japan, I am told Juon sucks, Silent Hill Shattered Memories is coming out on PS2 and PSP as well (guessing Konami realises SH fanss may not have a Wii, but will have a PS2 from the older games). Resi, imo, has not been a horror series in nearly a decade, it is action all the way, although I respect people who don't play stuff like Siren and Silet Hill may find it a bit scary.
Unrelated, but EA doesn't "get" horror elements of games in general... Dragon Age: Origins is supposed to be a Diabalo-esque "Dark Fantasy"? It is the pinnacle of generic high fantasy, with a blood splattering effect on your characters after every battle.
the common consensus is that the game is good and sure the on rails genre is a bit overcrowded on the wii, however its not more overcrowded than the FPS genre on either the ps3 or the xbox360, that doesnt stops good games like resistance 2 and borderlands from pullin out decent numbers, despite not being well known IPs
All I want to add to it is that obviously Madden isn't recession proof.