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Devs talk about how to make games art photo

Every year for the past three years a handful of game developers gather in Texas for Project Horseshoe, an invite only conference where the devs sit around discussing the biggest problems facing the industry and how to topple them like Boom Blox. This year the group took on the cause of how to make games art and came out with a Designer's Manifesto.

The manifesto isn't arguing that games aren't art yet, but that they aren't perceived as art yet and that lead designers aren't given the credit they deserve as artists. After noting the general issue the manifesto turns to the subject of how things become art, noting that painting wasn't considered a fine art until after about a century of PR relations which Michelangelo (the painter, not the Ninja Turtle) spearheaded. Thus the idea is that over time games could become seen as a fine art. However, we live in the "now," so the devs want to accelerate this whole thing.

They identify three major problems that have to be solved in order for game designers and games to get credit where credit is due and then give their own solutions to the problemS. It's far to long to reiterate all of it here, but, to summarize, the three major issues are the general public's perception of gaming, the leadership in gaming not being able to design creatively within the soul sucking confines of the modern gaming industry and, of course, the most ultimate evil of all, money. Their solutions for these problems range from insightful (broaden the middle circle of game criticism and writing) to obvious (mo' money, less problems).Their final big solution is for a new, major conference that is open to the public and shows off games as art, not as an industry like E3 does.

It's a solid read, if a bit long by internet standards. It's the weekend though, what else are you going to do? Play videogames?








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Matthew Razak is Destructoid's Associate editor and co-founder of film site Flixist. He began as community member "cowzilla" and was since sequestered to write brainy features material. He lives in Los Angeles with his beautiful wife. Likes Games! Movies! Hats! Meet the rest of the team



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16 comments | showing # 1 to 16
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Poopface Morty's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/04/2009 19:05
Poopface Morty
Looks like an interesting read, although I'm sure a lot of the local contingent will balk at some of the suggestions. Balk away folks.
Swizzler121's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/04/2009 20:45
Swizzler121
The only thing I have against games as art is that not all of them are. There's no such thing as a 'Mona Lisa 2: Return of the Smile.' But using that argument, I guess movies aren't art either. Your move, Hollywood.
BlackFreefall's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/04/2009 20:58
BlackFreefall
Well it really depends on one's definition of art. You can make doodle on a piece of paper and still call it a work of art. Games are art.
Prince Ghidorah's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/04/2009 21:14
Prince Ghidorah
The constant prattling over whether games are "art" or not is second only to the quibbling over who and what constitutes a "hardcore" gamer or games in terms of trends that disgust me. The problem with the games as art debate is that there is, of course, no way to resolve it. To the degree that it has any meaning, it usually boils down to whether or not games can be emotionally moving. This is, of course, completely subjective. It is not a criterion that lends itself to the resolution of the larger question. What else might we mean by art? I find Rez and Bit.Trip.Beat (to take two examples off the top of my head) to be aesthetically pleasing. Does this make them art?
I suppose to me it does, but I certainly don't care to convince the wider world that such is the case.
The core of the problem is this; gamers aren't concerned about whether or not games are art to THEMSELVES. They already are. We find games to be, at their best, capable of granting emotional and aesthetic uplift to the same degree as film, literature, whatever accepted traditional medium you might choose as an example. Problems arise when gamers are desperate to have those not yet "among us" appreciate games as art, when we become upset because, say, Roger Ebert declares that they are not. I say, "who cares?" If folks want to open themselves up to the possibilty of a potentially enriching experience, great. If not, well, why should I make proselytizing my business?
Chronic Logic's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/04/2009 21:40
Chronic Logic
Video game is just a medium. Also art is almost impossible to define solidly. Just take photoshop and add some objectives like "drawing this in this amount of time." Add some progressively harder objectives each level, and then you have an art game.

Who doesn't perceive video game as a legitimate medium for art? I doubt anybody will tell you a video game is NOT a medium for art. Perhaps it's the word "game" in the phrase "video game" that makes people question the suitability or seriousness of making art in video games.

Also what's the problem with video game designers making money? Who here wants to be a "starving artist?"

Also trying to expresss yourself to make art is kind of hard in video games, because well, video games by definition and technology are limited by the rules and hardware.

One thing that REALLY confuses me is that why do these people make it seem like it's difficult doing art in video games. What's stopping them from programming their art games, in pure tranquil happiness? Did a publisher refuse to publish their games? What?
CapnCrunk's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/04/2009 21:54
CapnCrunk
I still don't understand what art is.

I will point out incorrect use of the word 'to.'
"It's far to long..."
munkee's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/05/2009 03:53
munkee
For something to be considered 'art' it must exist only to serve the purpose of being 'art'.

If it has any purpose other than just being 'art', unfortunately it is not 'art'.
comradetrotskii's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/05/2009 11:36
comradetrotskii
[i]For something to be considered 'art' it must exist only to serve the purpose of being 'art'.

If it has any purpose other than just being 'art', unfortunately it is not 'art'.[/i]

Fuck off.
comradetrotskii's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/05/2009 11:37
comradetrotskii
For something to be considered 'art' it must exist only to serve the purpose of being 'art'.

If it has any purpose other than just being 'art', unfortunately it is not 'art'.

Fuck off.
Roel's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/05/2009 12:03
Roel
munkee: go take a course in art history, read an encyclopedia, or talk to someone wiser than yourself. I don't care which one, but please do something about your blatant ignorance.
Fury-Genesis's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/05/2009 14:45
Fury-Genesis
Oh I don't know if lead designers should be given all that much credit as being artists.

A significant amount of designers I've worked with so far have been self important pretentious douchebags. It is already a situation where the designer position is much like that of the singer in a rock band, a position that attracts all the assholes, we really shouldn't create an environment that feeds into that even more.

We have character artists, environment artists, concept artists, even animation is an art in itself. Designer on the other hand, which usually boils down to some ass who sits there and says "it's like Gears of War mixed with Devil May Cry!!!" and proceeds to slowly kill the team with pointless feature creep, is not a fucking artist. >_>
munkee's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/05/2009 15:44
munkee
haha, the aggressiveness of internet forums never seizes to amaze me. I was just passing on a quote that was mentioned to me the other day. You could have just offered a better suggestion and then we could have discussed it like reasonable people.. thus making a friendly videogame debate in a friendly forum.

But, instead you tell me to 'fuck off' and that i am blatantly ignorant. If you guys are just as aggressive when you reply to people in real life, you seriously need to work on your social skills.

art
noun
the expression or application of human creative skill and imagination, typically in a visual form such as painting or sculpture, producing works to be appreciated primarily for their beauty or emotional power.

Maybe this can promote some constructive discussion
Roel's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/06/2009 00:59
Roel
Well, you could have made it more apparent that you were quoting someone. Of course now the question is which is the bigger fool: the fool, or the fool quoting the fool.

...or the fool replying to said quote on the internets.
munkee's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/06/2009 04:21
munkee
Okay, congratulations for steering the topic straight back onto a game of one up.

How about..

"producing works to be appreciated primarily for their beauty or emotional power."
^The last line of a Dictionary quote.

This would suggest to me that most games are not art. Because, they are not created "primarily for their beauty or emotional power."

*cough* [only to serve the purpose of being art]

Games are created for us to play, race, fight, shoot etc..
They are also created to make money.. Most games, not all, most games are not very well made either and how many famous artistic pieces do you see that are just generic clones [Andy Warhol?]

There are some artistic games out there.. Flower, SotC [maybe] But, if anything I would consider demoscene to be more artistic than games themselves.

I also agree a great deal with Fury-Genesis.
"We have character artists, environment artists, concept artists, even animation is an art in itself."
I am a motion graphics designer/producer and have worked with coders on various occasions. None of the coders I have worked with have been artists. They are very good mathematicians, but, not artists.

Your very welcome to make your own opinion, as i have made mine. But, lets try and keep to the point.
Super Mega Hyper's Avatar - Comment posted on 04/07/2009 06:12
Super Mega Hyper
I like the first one best,
I've just had a quick look at the article, it's pretty long but I'm determined to get through it before nightfall.
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