I suppose I can agree that the menu systems are a bit clunky, but after 2347 Tales games I'm pretty used to it. The monster selection is annoying though. Ends up I usually just go after what the game points my sword at instead of bothering to switch.
The plot, to me, was a refreshing change. The 'hero' and his vigilante qualities, the lack of a central villain until late in the game. I always hated when other games explicitly stated "THIS IS THE BIG BAD. GO KILL HIM." and the next 60 hours are devoted to that goal.
Tales games do follow some cliches, but they give their characters depth and allow them to grow, which is more than can be said for most Final Fantasy games and other recent RPGs "What a startling revelation! My behavior shall remain unchanged!". Abyss and Vesperia are some of the best linear stories I've come across in RPGs in a long time. I admit Abyss was a bit more compelling than Vesperia is though, but I think it'll be years before a more interesting story pops up in a JRPG than Abyss.
I'll take Vesperia over FFXII, Eternal Sonata or Lost Odyssey any day. Gotta give Infinite Undiscovery a whirl though.
I've started to ask myself whether all those Japanese RPGs I liked when I was younger were really that great in the first place or whether I'm looking through rose-tinted specs. It just doesn't seem like there's been one worth playing so far the gen unless you're bloody desperate and good at convincing yourself pieces of turd are really bars of gold.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3huQAEIBfac
Check out the above video. As a RPG fan as well as a fighting game fan, I love the ability to do complex combos in this game. It adds a layer of fun to the combat that makes grinding the levels away (usually a chore in most games) absolutely delightful.
I dunno....
@nerpin - I only used offense. Of course, I died my fair share. I just found the blocking nearly useless. And holding down the trigger to run in a circle is just sad when you think about it. :(
I got the same feelings a couple months ago when playing lost odyssey. I was in love with the game but I started to see LO as the exception as opposed to the rule. But then I finally go my earthbound cart to save and it was pure joy. It was one of those rare games that I wish could just go on forever. So it seems this generation is really just as lackluster as it seems.
Turn based FTW.
The game is not meant to launch a million papers or blow you away or make you cry. Its just suppose to be FUN. And it is, overwhelmingly.
It seems as if Brad didn't play very far or deep into the game because he would have seen the evolution of the block button.
Yes it starts off as a simple unmovable block. But as you collect skills from weapons the block changes. You get backstep which allows you to do a backstep while blocking. Then there's a skill that modifies that that lets you backstep in quick succession. Then there's a skill that lets you do an arte from blocking. Then there's a skill that lets you stun the enemy with a forward + block.
And as far as one on one combat, once agian your suppose to make sure your skills progress as you go through the game. your not suppose to stand there in the middle of the stage and get wailed on by multiple enemies. Your suppose to hit and duck and weave, lure enemies away from each other and such. Use knockback moves to seperate the crowd. You get skills that give a sort of auto guard that keeps other mobs from interrupting your attacks.
The skill system is a HUGE part of the game and yet you didn't mention it once in your review Brad. You collect and keep multiple weapons so that you learn as many skills as possible to make sure you have what you need for every situation. There's standard plus damage skills all the way to skills that modify your artes (called Altered artes).
Cooking is NOT tacked on. There specifically meant to help you recover from battle. TP and HP food at the end of a battle will keep you from having to use items. Not to mention the plus attack or defense food that lets you slick into your next battle even faster. In addiction almost every character gets some sort of healing skill, with one of your characters being primarily a healing paladin!
And Brad, sidequest? You totally forgot to even mention those. There's some sort of sidequest to start or continue after EVERY town you go to. It usually requires you to find someone in that town to talk to to trigger the event or run back to a previous town you were at.
There's sidequest that give you items, skills, artes, cooking recipes, rare synthesis mats, costumes and titles. In fact the major sidequest toward the end of the game helps you get your Ultimate weapons (which getting them changes your endboss fight btw) and the lengthy secret dungeon.
Brad I think ultimately you didn't want to give this game a try. From the beginning you made it sound as if you felt jRPG's are stale and old. And while no they haven't change, what genre really has? People like it because its like that. The Japanese make it for them and its us the Westerns that play them and try to get into them.
But Tales is far more deep than you would let it be. The skill system alone changes how you fight and lets you have a lot of customization over your crew and there's easily another 30 hours of sidequest to do if you seek them. (yes you can easily miss 99% of the sidequest if you don't actively backtrack, talk to people and go places)
If you like RPG's I give it an 9 for Tales fans. 8 for general RPG fans and probably a 7 if you generally don't like rpg's but are feeling froggy.
Play it for yourselves and decide, I think you would be doing yourselves a great injustice by now.
I HATED FFX2 for that reason as even though Riku is pretty hot for a fake female character I've never hated a fictional character in a video game anymore than that. Why couldn't she be hot AND smart...*sigh*
I thought the review was good but obviously Brad is not the biggest fan of JRPG's, so take it with a grain of salt people. I for one am going to pick up ToV anyways, after a few price drops that is. But yeah, ToV is JUST LIKE EVERY OTHER Tales games out there, but is that a bad thing? yes and no.
Random Citizen: My [artifact/item] is missing. Find it.
Yuri: Sure
[travels, finds it, returns]
Random Citizen: Thanks!
It's really that simple. I mean, cooking recipes? It's an invalid concept. Over the course of the game I found it to be the most tacked on thing in the game. Where are the real benefits of the system? The effects last minutes and suck. Why bother traversing the world and killing low level monsters along the way? It's a soulless endeavor. Give me something I care about, you know? I understand your point, I just don't agree with it.
And of course I wanted to give it a try. I wouldn't have played it if I didn't want to. I purposefully removed this review out of the stale concept that I talked about in the introduction. I just wanted to get the word out on the impact that I think the game has made.
i don't understand the point of the cooking game at all, though, every time i try, it says i failed or my party is full. so i just ignore it.
and i think the story is fairly complex as you work your way through it. lots of twists and turns, and multiple lines going on at the same time. i'm very curious to see how it all pans out (other than the obvious happy ending that will be).
From what I've played I would have to give it an 8.
Well thought out review though
The battle system really isn't 'new'. The first incarnation of it was in 1995 in Tales of Phantasia. Each Tales game just adds something new to it.
Story-wise it can't really compare to Symphonia in that regard. There's no big twist and the plot is somewhat linear in the sense that you pretty much know where and what you'll be doing next as the story is revealed. There's a couple of intriguing plot points like vigilante justice vs. lawful justice and the justified killing of corrupt individuals, but once they rear their head they seem to drift off back into obscurity just as quickly without being fleshed out as well as they could be. The experience of the character interactions far exceed the storyline, which isn't too bad since Tales games tend to develop their characters far more than most JRPGs.
Visually, the game is a mixed bag. It can be mundane in some places, but then stunning in the next. Towns like Halure are a pleasure to look at with the tree blossoms constantly falling and the vibrant colors of the characters and buildings, really making use of the cell-shaded visuals. Conversely, when you walk into a cave dungeon you're bored to death with corridors that all look the same with the same texture used over and over again and possibly some dim neon lighting, somewhat disappointing since this aspect is almost identical to previous games of the series. Fortunately the fighting animations and music occasionally make you forget its shortcomings.
My only gripe with the review is the critique of the battle system, which many people believe, myself included, to be the best of all the Tales series and easily the shining aspect of this game. No mention was made of the skill system. Nor do I quite understand your problem with the item system. You press Y to open the battle menu, select items, select which character you want to use the item, pick which item, and then choose the recipient. The only limitation is that unless you have the "Item Thrower" skill set on a character will you be able to use items on characters other than said character.
Also, I think your lack of usage of the skill system skewed your view towards guarding. Skills like "Backstep" and "Critical Guard" makes guarding more strategic than just defensive. Later, things get more complex with skills when you're able to cancel a guard to an arte or prevent staggering while trying to perform a combo. Proper usage of skills keeps the game from becoming a button masher allowing you to plow through dungeons after a little power leveling.
The review nailed alot of good points and I'd have to agree with most of it after having put in over 60 hours into the game. The only area I feel you really failed to do justice describing is the depth and customization of the battle system.
Oh, and I'm going to have to deduct a point for failing to mention that one of your characters is a pipe smoking dog that attacks with a knife.
Tut tut. He doesn't actually SMOKE the pipe. Don't give people any wild expectations! They could buy the game expecting a pipe smoking dog then go "WTF. He just keeps it in his mouth." *wags finger* Then they'll come for you and your family.
As far as I'm concerned, a dog that goes around looking like he's smoking a pipe is just as badass as a dog that does smoke a pipe. It's the best he can do without opposable thumbs.
And the reward from the sidequest are items, weapons, skills and such. Not just "useless" cooking recipes.
If you used cooking you'd realize how useful it was. It requires NO grinding whatsoever to do cooking. Most of the things you need are dropped from mobs you'll already be fighting or bought for dirt cheap at a town.
Like I said it keeps you buffed between battles, and the food isn't for minutes, its for the next fight. How is food that replenishes 30% health or TP useless? Food that gives 30% extra magic defense or physical attack.
Food is there to keep your party topped off while cutting through mobs. That way you don't have to use items unless its an especially hard fight or its a boss fight.
I can understand why you did the review. But some of the points you make don't make sense at all, its almost like you didn't play it.
Thanks for saving me $80 Brad ;)
Vesperia is a fantastic game and probably the best JRPG on the 360 at the moment. On top of that it's quite possibly the best Tales title yet, a series which you so obviously have never touched in your life, making me wonder why you even bothered to write this review.
I mean, this wasn't even a good review, it was just plain -wrong-. I don't know what game you're playing where blocking has no effect, or how you're forced to "take your lumps" when the free run system lets you circle around enemies to avoid most any hit. You're not even forced to stand still when blocking, if you would just equip some skills you'd have realized that. As for the targeting and item selection, they are the same as they've been in every single Tales game for the past thirteen years!
As for artes, plenty of useful spells affect large areas. Go read up on how to utilize Rita and how broken she is, then come back and write this review. And you even rip on the cooking! The cooking is a staple of Tales, and is an extremely useful way to provide healing of your entire party at once at the cost of a single use item.
Even further, while, yes, the plot is certainly only slightly above average, the characters are very well done and again, some of the best Tales has offered in its entire history.
It is really a shame such a poorly written review is keeping so many people from experiencing such a fantastic RPG. It's certainly not the quality of the writing that is an issue, but the content. You clearly have no experience with Tales at all and seem from the outset to not even be a fan of RPGs to begin with.
This was an absolutely horrible review written by someone that clearly had no clue what they were talking about. Really, really disappointing.
Give me Star Ocean, I actually finish them games.
How about you read what I--and others--said about the quality of this review before mouthing off?
However people who read Brad's review need to know something,
especially you Collete.
If you like Tales of the Abyss gameplay you'll Tales of Vesperia. It is a great game.
I can understand people not liking the cheesy storyline, but same could be said about Tales of the Abyss.
Essentially Collete, if you liked Tales of the Abyss you'll Like Tales of Vesperia even more.
If you didn't like Tales of the Abyss, then you won't like Tales of Vesperia.
It's simple as that.
That said, I really do like this game. Some of the characters and their development can suck you in.[/b]
And Cooking is tacked on? Have you played a Tales game before??
I'm a proud owner of the best RPG on the 360 right now and if you're on the fence, I hope you consider giving it a shot despite the review here since it's obviously in the minority (this game is sitting at 80% on gamerankings)
Always good to point out that you can still enjoy a game even if it doesn't score high. Different people have different tastes.
I'm enjoying Infinite Undiscovery at the moment, even though it's recieving poor reviews. And even a jrpg fanatic like myself can see it has some.. less than ideal design choices. And I suspect Colette is going to be mean to the game because of it.
But I'm still enjoying it though. And I have the feeling Tales of Vesperia is much better.
So I'm still excited about ToV. \o/

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