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Solid argument, I'm trying to go back and forth in my head as to where I would pick the argument apart. The only thing I can strongly think of is that she advertises for the game in question, so in part she is doing a service for the company.
However, if she never ever buys new, even if she could then she is stomping on her cause. I believe she is a true fan, she just doesn't apply her fandom appropriately.
However, if she never ever buys new, even if she could then she is stomping on her cause. I believe she is a true fan, she just doesn't apply her fandom appropriately.
I think you're more along the lines of a supporter than a fan by making sure the developers get their funding. By your logic the Executive Producers of just about any game are the biggest 'fans' of it. I'm not saying that what you're doing is wrong, far from it, but being a fan isn't always a good thing.
Obsessives of any kind tend to wear people thin when their interests aren't aligned or to the same degree. Trust me. You don't want to be a fan. You want to be someone supporting the arts.
Obsessives of any kind tend to wear people thin when their interests aren't aligned or to the same degree. Trust me. You don't want to be a fan. You want to be someone supporting the arts.
I'll just add that it's common sense that if you don't support something you are a fan of, what you are a fan of will no longer exist. However, purchasing a game, even a used game, is supporting whatever you are purchasing. It may not be a show of support as strong as buying new on the day of release, but it's still support. She obviously shows love for the series in other ways.
Used games support the legitimate sales of games. So the only thing she's guilty of there is being overly thrify (Reall?, $5 off of retail price is enough for her to not have the joy of shrinkwrap?). You'd have a case here if she was pirating it.
Cosplaying in public brings up the awareness of whatever it is she is Cosplaying, so it's as if she is doing a little bit of promotional work as well, which supports also supports the title.
So yes, I'd say she is a bigger fan then you. While you appear to enjoy the game series for what it is, she is giving and getting lot more out of it then you.
Used games support the legitimate sales of games. So the only thing she's guilty of there is being overly thrify (Reall?, $5 off of retail price is enough for her to not have the joy of shrinkwrap?). You'd have a case here if she was pirating it.
Cosplaying in public brings up the awareness of whatever it is she is Cosplaying, so it's as if she is doing a little bit of promotional work as well, which supports also supports the title.
So yes, I'd say she is a bigger fan then you. While you appear to enjoy the game series for what it is, she is giving and getting lot more out of it then you.
I can see what you're saying but then you quickly fall into the trap of whoever spends the most money is the biggest 'fan' and that really doesn't go anywhere and not everyone can afford as much as others. As long as you both appreciate and enjoy the series and the developers of the series are receiving a return from you both, you're both fans and who cares who's the bigger one.
@falsenipple
I would argue that that might be true. God knows that a lot of them have to put in a lot of hours and money for the project, and at that level, they really do have to be fans of it to do their job well. However, I get what you mean.
@DigitalMase, jjjenigma
Here's my point, and it's really, really simple: If the world had nothing but fans like her, her favourite series would be gone. It's not just being thrifty to buy used versus new and not buying DLC, it's being unforgivably cheap. Especially when you're spending money on costumes.
You love the game so damned much you're going to spend hours upon hours to make a costume and then go to a convention dressed up, but spending an extra half an hour of your pay when a new game comes out so that the publisher and developer pocket a portion of the profit instead of it all going to Gamestop is where you draw the line?
I would argue that that might be true. God knows that a lot of them have to put in a lot of hours and money for the project, and at that level, they really do have to be fans of it to do their job well. However, I get what you mean.
@DigitalMase, jjjenigma
Here's my point, and it's really, really simple: If the world had nothing but fans like her, her favourite series would be gone. It's not just being thrifty to buy used versus new and not buying DLC, it's being unforgivably cheap. Especially when you're spending money on costumes.
You love the game so damned much you're going to spend hours upon hours to make a costume and then go to a convention dressed up, but spending an extra half an hour of your pay when a new game comes out so that the publisher and developer pocket a portion of the profit instead of it all going to Gamestop is where you draw the line?
Fan and fandom is generally defined by enthusiasm and not money. So while you are a better supporter of the franchise by purchasing official games and merch, you are not a better fan.
On a personal thought, cosplayers (and other forms of rabid fans) provide free marketing which is invaluable for games that don't have huge supporters monetarily.
It's funny - I don't think I ever agree with anything you say. But I still like ya ;]
On a personal thought, cosplayers (and other forms of rabid fans) provide free marketing which is invaluable for games that don't have huge supporters monetarily.
It's funny - I don't think I ever agree with anything you say. But I still like ya ;]
@Caiters
*sniffs condescendingly*
Of course you do. At some level, you know that even if you don't agree with me, I'm right. (kidding, kidding! Though you did agree, at least, that Sequence was awesomesauce on fantastitoast.)
I don't know, but the whole reason I feel this way is because I read a lot of obscure manga and manwha, and people seem to be surprised when stuff that "they're huge fans of" goes under when they don't actually support it. It's frustrating to talk to someone about a cancelled series like, say, Veritas, and hear them go on and on about how much they loved the series, then get blank looks when I ask them if they actually bought any of the collected volumes in favour of dressing up like the characters. I don't even speak the language, but I imported the volumes after reading the online translations because I wanted to see the story finished, something that will now never happen.
I can understand it in a few cases where the support, one way or another, doesn't really matter. Naruto and Final Fantasy, for example, are not going to go away. They've got too much inertia to do anything but succeed, now. However smaller stuff (like the "Tales Of X" series, which already is seeing releases skipped for budgeting concerns) which sees a similar is frustrating.
Because these "fans" won't bat an eye when the studio, or artist, or writer, or whatever they claim to love finally has to call it quits for lack of support. They'll shuffle their feet awkwardly, then move on to their next obsession without batting an eye.
They might talk a bit here and there how it's a shame that this thing they loved is gone, but at the same time they contributed to it. They bought the pirated, badly subbed versions in Chinatown because it was cheaper than the real thing at HMV or their local anime store. They've bought the used copies to save themselves a few bucks. They read the online translations instead of buying the official translations, sometimes even justifying it by saying that the official translation isn't "faithful" enough. They loved it enough to invest themselves in it, but not their money.
How much of a fan can a person be, bad costumes and slash fanfiction included, if they allow the series to wither and die without providing any support?
*sniffs condescendingly*
Of course you do. At some level, you know that even if you don't agree with me, I'm right. (kidding, kidding! Though you did agree, at least, that Sequence was awesomesauce on fantastitoast.)
I don't know, but the whole reason I feel this way is because I read a lot of obscure manga and manwha, and people seem to be surprised when stuff that "they're huge fans of" goes under when they don't actually support it. It's frustrating to talk to someone about a cancelled series like, say, Veritas, and hear them go on and on about how much they loved the series, then get blank looks when I ask them if they actually bought any of the collected volumes in favour of dressing up like the characters. I don't even speak the language, but I imported the volumes after reading the online translations because I wanted to see the story finished, something that will now never happen.
I can understand it in a few cases where the support, one way or another, doesn't really matter. Naruto and Final Fantasy, for example, are not going to go away. They've got too much inertia to do anything but succeed, now. However smaller stuff (like the "Tales Of X" series, which already is seeing releases skipped for budgeting concerns) which sees a similar is frustrating.
Because these "fans" won't bat an eye when the studio, or artist, or writer, or whatever they claim to love finally has to call it quits for lack of support. They'll shuffle their feet awkwardly, then move on to their next obsession without batting an eye.
They might talk a bit here and there how it's a shame that this thing they loved is gone, but at the same time they contributed to it. They bought the pirated, badly subbed versions in Chinatown because it was cheaper than the real thing at HMV or their local anime store. They've bought the used copies to save themselves a few bucks. They read the online translations instead of buying the official translations, sometimes even justifying it by saying that the official translation isn't "faithful" enough. They loved it enough to invest themselves in it, but not their money.
How much of a fan can a person be, bad costumes and slash fanfiction included, if they allow the series to wither and die without providing any support?
I agree with Meteor. For example, a 'fan' of an anime series who only download torrents, even when the series is available on dvd/blu-ray in their country with subs and such, are not supporting their show. Sure, they advertise it, but if nobody is buying, just downloading, how the company who did it gains money for making more?
Take Okami. How many people says the game is great but have bought it used/downloaded and illegal copy? Them when Okami sells thousands and Bratz games sells millions, they complain how unfair this situation is.
Take Okami. How many people says the game is great but have bought it used/downloaded and illegal copy? Them when Okami sells thousands and Bratz games sells millions, they complain how unfair this situation is.
I would actually disagree somewhat. I buy most games new, and yes I'll go out of my way to even buy DLC that I don't really want just to support the developers (I buy pretty much everything Insomniac puts out). Still... I don't know the Resistance world as well as many people do, I haven't read the books/comics or whatever "stuff" is put out there (be it official or fan fiction). I don't have a Chimera outfit tucked away in my closet and while I'll pre-order their next game, I won't spend hours examining screen shots to find out that there is a new chimera breed then speculate as to it's origins within the canon of the world.
I think a true fan does tend to just know "more" about the world and the game. They go beyond merely buying the game new or monetarily supporting the game. I don't tend to do that much myself.
... though you know the other day I came across a black bicycle helmet in a closet and I put it on then suggested to my husband that I had a cosplay costume for PAX... I could go as a Raven character from MAG! (and if we had a hockey mask, my hubby could go as SVER). :)
I think a true fan does tend to just know "more" about the world and the game. They go beyond merely buying the game new or monetarily supporting the game. I don't tend to do that much myself.
... though you know the other day I came across a black bicycle helmet in a closet and I put it on then suggested to my husband that I had a cosplay costume for PAX... I could go as a Raven character from MAG! (and if we had a hockey mask, my hubby could go as SVER). :)
Hmm. Your logic makes sense. I can see where you're coming from and I agree with you -- to a certain extent.
Games are becoming more and more expensive. The pre-owned market allows people who may not necessarily be able to afford new releases to keep reasonably up to date by providing recent releases at affordable prices. I think that it's a bit of a slap in the face to claim that those who purchase pre-owned games cannot *truly* call themselves fans of that game.
Games are becoming more and more expensive. The pre-owned market allows people who may not necessarily be able to afford new releases to keep reasonably up to date by providing recent releases at affordable prices. I think that it's a bit of a slap in the face to claim that those who purchase pre-owned games cannot *truly* call themselves fans of that game.
I can see that, to a certain extent... However, on the other hand, if someone is a big enough fan of a series, I'd think they'd want to get their hands on it. Keep in mind my big thing here is monetary support being a key ingredient in the whole "I'm a fan" thing, and I'm specifically calling out people who say that they can be fans without spending a dime on the studio/company/artist/writer/etc.
Bought the game used? Fine, but did you buy a bit of DLC or something to show your support? Have you bought an official shirt, action figure, or some other piece of merchandise? Done anything at all to make sure that the creator of the work you're claiming to love can pay their bills and create more things for you to love aside from go on about how much you love it?
I mean, gaming is not a cheap hobby to begin with. If spending a couple of bucks extra on a DLC costume or ordering a poster from the company's website is beyond your means, why did you buy a console in the first place?
Bought the game used? Fine, but did you buy a bit of DLC or something to show your support? Have you bought an official shirt, action figure, or some other piece of merchandise? Done anything at all to make sure that the creator of the work you're claiming to love can pay their bills and create more things for you to love aside from go on about how much you love it?
I mean, gaming is not a cheap hobby to begin with. If spending a couple of bucks extra on a DLC costume or ordering a poster from the company's website is beyond your means, why did you buy a console in the first place?
Oh yeah I totally agree with you there (see, it can happen!). I used to have tons of friends in high school and college that would save all of their money for Otakon badges and hand made plushies but not pay a single penny for actual manga or anime (or buy it only when they could not borrow or pirate it). But it doesn't make them any less of a fan - it just makes them horrible human beings ;]
Please forgive me I don't have anything intelligent to add to this conversation, so please enjoy this terrible picture I made in MS Paint that was inspired by the title of this blog.
I agree with you. I NEVER buy used games as I do not see the point of paying 5$ less for a game, which is possibly in a bad condition. I wish to support developers of games I like and hence will always buy new.
However I do disagree with you on the price drop stance. If I do not think a game is worth the price when it releases (and here in Australia new release games are 80 - 110$ which is quite a chunk of cash) I will just wait for it to go down in price, which is a perfectly valid thing to do - I mean would the devs rather I buy used or do that. Either way I get my game, and the developers get some money.
However I do disagree with you on the price drop stance. If I do not think a game is worth the price when it releases (and here in Australia new release games are 80 - 110$ which is quite a chunk of cash) I will just wait for it to go down in price, which is a perfectly valid thing to do - I mean would the devs rather I buy used or do that. Either way I get my game, and the developers get some money.
