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Native of NC and an all out Tarheel Fan.

I work as an Assistant Systems Administrator at a community college. I work hand-in-hand with our unix box that controls all of our student data and personnel information. I also teach part-time online classes each semester to bring in a little extra dough.

I have a Wii, but the 360 rules my TV. You can check the GC for game types, but I am definitely more of a shooter fan.

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Gamertag: MassivePlugger
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Discrimination on Xbox Forums
massiveplugger | 10:32 AM on 06.19.2008 48 comments


I am a 28 year old male gamer that enjoys both Xbox LIVE and the xbox.com community forums. I have been a member of both since December of 2004. I have experienced one of the greatest opportunities. Through Xbox community forums I have found other players from all over the globe with like minds and attitudes as myself. For over two and a half years across numerous games I have shared a great friendship with the same people. We have become true friends and have even had the opportunity to meet face-to-face in a yearly gathering that we now participate in. We met each other through the Xbox community forums, but we are now having a hard time continuing this experience due to extreme moderation on the community forums. We carry on the casual chit chat about life and gaming and we find ourselves being banned or threads deleted and we do not understand why.

A woman told us that their GamerChix forum provides an area for non-gaming discussion called “Girl Talk.” This area allows GamerChixs to talk about other content beyond just gaming conversations. The woman shared with us some of the discussions ranging from threads looking for other lesbian gamers to what men they would keep on the planet. To be a member of GamerChix private area you must have a gamer tag and you must be a woman. All you do is send an email to join and you get access into their closed world and a nice icon beside your name (Called Trixi Icons) showing that you are a GamerChix. Most gamers (including myself) think it is great that this group of minority gamers (GamerChix) is given an area to escape the woes of other gamers hitting on them continuously or being harassed. Also, let me say that I have never seen inside of the GamerChix private area. All I have seen it what was shared.

There is no where else on the general population community forum that this type of chatter is allowed. Everyone must stay completely “On Topic” about gaming content. When gamers asked for an area to enjoy the same community experience as “Girl Talk” we were told no. We were also hammered on for even seeing some of the information in the GamerChix area. The female gamer that shared this information did not share any gamer tags or truly sensitive information. This female was only trying to back the idea we were proposing. After requesting an area like “Girl Talk” many group threads that steered even slightly away from game discussion started disappearing. These threads disappeared with no explanation of why and continued to be deleted even if they did stay “On Topic”.

It is rumored that there once was an area that allowed general non-gaming discussion, but supposedly it got out of hand and was removed. Still, why are GamerChix, a group of 6000 women allowed to have this area? Is it because the Xbox Community Manager (Trixi360 is her gamer tag) is a woman? To most gamers it feels as if we are being discriminated against due to the make up of our chromosomes. Is this fair to not make all groups abide by the same rules of the xbox forums Code of Conduct (CoC) and Terms of Use (ToU)? It is fair to create a separate set of rules for a different gender?

If Xbox’s community is not allowing this to take place due to immaturity why can they not create a special area for GamerParents or GamerAdults based an age seperation? The Entertainment Software Association stats show that the average gamer age is 33 (ESA). . Xbox and Microsoft already back an area called “Xbox Dad.” Why are Xbox Dads not allowed this opportunity? A freer discussion area could even give gamer parents a way to have their kids meet others kids that the parents trust due to a relationship built on the community forums.

Gamers feel this is discrimination to provide an area for non-gaming discussion for GamerChix (females), but not for the general community population. Regardless of the minority of the group it is still discriminatory based on gender. The xbox.com community is over two million strong and grows everyday. But still we are treated with injustice due to a few rotten apples (mostly kids). All moderation is done through volunteering and would not cost xbox.com any additional money to add moderators to a non-gaming general discussion area.

All xbox.com tells us to do is go build our own private forums for our group to communicate. The negative of building a private forum is that it does not allow for us to meet other like minded players. The community forums receive heavy traffic compared to a private forum. Xbox.com forum staff seems to be stuck on the idea that our group wants a special area dedicated to ourselves. What we as gamers want is an area for all gamers to be able to meet each other and have non-gaming general discussion. It is hard to find new friends through the online environment due to the continuous screaming of racism and homophobia (which is another article by itself). Allowing everyone to have a non-gaming general discussion area would allow us to find other Xbox LIVE gamers that might be on the same life tract as we are.

Yes… These are private forums that are owned by Microsoft, but shouldn’t there be some separate but equal mentality on their site? Xbox and Microsoft completely back GamerChix. They even allow for them to have dedicated nights banding them all together playing the same game (Xbox Calendar). They also have a family night. Why is there not a separate area for “Family” gamers to get together and share lives struggles that are seen by adult family gamers? If my group were female and shared our story on xbox.com we would be put in the “Gamer Spotlight” or even marketed like Fragdolls. But, instead we are banned and pushed to the darkest corner for our conversations to take place and be heavily scrutinized for any “Off Topic” discussion.

Of course our group and many others gamers can venture a little to far away from the CoC in our conversations but we steer ourselves back. Regardless of what we try we are still male gamers with little to no hope of gaining the opportunities that the GamerChix have already. I still have to question if this is the case because the community is managed by a female gamer. The Community Manager is going to come back and say that this area is mostly younger gamer girls that do not need other gamers pressuring them or being bad role models. She is also going to say that we acquired this information by exploiting the area, but we cannot help that a female gamer was kind enough to supply us some information in hopes of helping our cause. We do not want their area disband. We only want the same opportunity to have casual chit chat to meet more people that may be great to game with. Make an adult gamers area and an area for younger gamers too. Why do we all not deserve to have the same opportunity on Xbox’s community forum?



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42 comments | showing # 1 to 42
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Butmac's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 10:35
Butmac
This post will reach 50+ comments within the hour
massiveplugger's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 10:41
massiveplugger
I would like to see that happen. I am not looking for an arguement against the GamerChix, I am looking for a way to build more communities to allow Gamer Parents and kids to meet each other easier on xbox.com.
SilverDragon1979's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 10:43
SilverDragon1979
MY GOD MAN!!! Put some pictures up in the post or something. That was a wall of text just screaming to be knocked down.

Also ... get a damn avatar!

On topic though, screw the XBOX forums. Just come to destructoid. We do not descriminate here. All we ask is that you don't suck.
massiveplugger's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 10:54
massiveplugger
I agree. I read yours the other day and it is very true.
BlindsideDork's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 10:55
BlindsideDork
You want Gamer Parents and kids to meet each other?
massiveplugger's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 10:56
massiveplugger
Try to read it seriously. No.... I said in the article that it would be nice to have an area for parents to go off topic like the Chix have in their private forums.

Allowing parents to get to know each other on a different level could even allow them to get their kids playing together online creating an even more trustable gaming experience.

To be fair maybe kids could get their own area to meet each other was what I was meaning.
BlindsideDork's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 10:58
BlindsideDork
You have to admit...the wording was kind of funny.
BluDesign's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 10:58
BluDesign
You're better off here. No one will delete your posts that are critical of Dtoid/Xbox/Playstation here.

I only ever go onto the Xbox forums for achievement tips and technical support. If I want to meet people to play, I've met them here.
massiveplugger's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 11:00
massiveplugger
Not smart enough. Ticked every GC on xbox.com for sharing a piece of their private area to the world. I just wish that they would understand that I am lobbying for a better community for all genders, age, and whatever else.
blehman's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 11:01
blehman
No offense and completely off topic, but I found this statement hilarious for some reason:

"Also, let me say that I have never seen inside of the GamerChix private area."
BlindsideDork's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 11:01
BlindsideDork
Who is this plugger with an avatar...hmmmm.
massiveplugger's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 11:02
massiveplugger
I admit it was funny and left me open for a bunch of punch lines.


I understand about meeting on other sites, but do I and other gamers not deserve the opportunity to relax and meet each other there like the GCs do? Do you not think that you would spend more time there if you had this opportunity?

I think most would.
Silverback 55's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 11:03
Silverback 55
Maybe you should start your own forums with blackjack and hookers. You know what, forget the forums.

/Bender'd
wardrox's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 11:03
wardrox
OK, from reading it your main problem is that an LGBT group, GamerChix, get their own area for off-topic chat, but there isn't one for the general plebs?

LGBT groups often get their own area due to continual harassment and abuse by the vast majority of other people.

This is usually fine and accepted. You are suggesting that either all, or maybe a few selected, gamers get this treatment too.

You say there used to be a general off-topic forum which was closed down, so that's the reson you dont have one. If you want one for a specific minority, if enough members of the group got together and asked, I'm sure their own area could also be set up. Or simply set one up off-site.

The girl's forum is not a right that should be demanded, it's something MS have done for them which is nice.

Also, be very careful in your wording, you don't want to come off sounding like you hate LGBT people, or girls. You also don't want to sound demanding using the "You gave them something nice, I want that too!" argument.

Also, your suggestion that this is some corruption because the community manager is a girl is dumb and I highly suggest you don't go down that line. It will inevitably make you look like a fool.

That's just my opinion anyway.
massiveplugger's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 11:05
massiveplugger
Finally got an avatar up... Should have done that first.

Man... About that comment. I got crucified for even seeing information away from their domain. You do not piss off the gamerchix or you are in for a world of hurt. Off course the entire community is ran by the Queen GC herself.
massiveplugger's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 11:09
massiveplugger
I have asked and numerous others to try and get an area like we are discussing. We have been denied and even banned (for short periods of time) to make a point.

I am only stabbing at the idea of the community being ran by a woman is one reason. It is not my main focus of the article.

My main focus is that we all deserve the same opportunity. It is very difficult to meet people through in game voice. Restricting people from meeting on their forums by forcing only game talk makes it hard to meet people there.

I do not want general chit-chat limited to anyone. Just would like to see it become available.
Aurvant's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 11:10
Aurvant
@Massiveplugger - I'm going to try and see if I can answer the question your asking here. Being the administrator of my own batch of forums (not here, duh) I have run in to this problem before. When you begin to single out groups of people to give them something everyone else around that group begins to emulate or copy what was given to the original group.

When a forum begins to single out groups to give them certain accessibility or privileges your beginning to alienate other groups who would desire the same type of treatment. So, what begins to happen is that the admin must then create new areas and new groups one by one. After a while instead of having a geenralized community that interacts with each other by general threads you begin to, inadvertently, create niche areas that end up dividing the community.

Then, without realizing it, the admin has created the "high-school" scenario and you have numerous clicks that form and then demand equal treatment between the groups and thus a divide in the community even further.

The best thing that Microsoft and Xbox could have done was to deny the existence of "GamerChix" in the first place and just tell them to abide by normal forum rules instead of granting special privileges.
massiveplugger's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 11:13
massiveplugger
I do not want to blame the GCs for anything. They have a great thing going, but unfortunately I feel that it has made them very powerful on those forums.

If you spend sometime there (like I have 2.5 years) you will find what I am talking about.

Lets not bash them... Lets just lobby for more opportunities.

Saying Fuck them and this will only create a major cluster fuck of flame wars on here. Not needed for sure since that will take away from the content.

Please... Do keep helping to defend the cause since we can already see it is going to be tough.
Eschatos's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 11:18
Eschatos
If they're policing you to talk about what they want you to talk about then fuck 'em. Find some new forums where you can say what you want.
Char Aznable's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 11:23
Char Aznable
Honestly, dude, you're making this a bigger deal than it really is. 1,000+ words over the merits of an off-topic internet forum? Come on, man; let's keep this in perspective. Just tell your buddies to pack up and head to Destructoid, where the rules are far more forgiving.

@Silverback55 lol Great reference, man.
massiveplugger's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 11:23
massiveplugger
I understand the vote to find another website, but we are looking for Xbox LIVE gamers. Plus... I am not going to give in for something that is wrong.

It is wrong that they have such a double standard built.
Dr FloppyBollocks's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 11:25
Dr FloppyBollocks
I have met plenty of great girl gamers, and all of them hate gamerchix and pms etc etc because to get in you have to be either a man hating diesel dyke, or constantly on the rag.

gamerchix isnt about a safe place for women gamers, its a cave where fat ugly goblins are kept in a dark place for the sake of the other part of the community that make microsoft their profits (males)

/endrant
Kryptinite's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 11:29
Kryptinite
what butmac said
massiveplugger's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 11:32
massiveplugger
Aur.... I agree with you. There is a ton of truth in what you said. But... I do feel that the GCs idea is a good thing to help remove some of the male gamer pressures.

Char... Those 1000+ words all lead to the same place and gives a great overview of the tast at hand. I tried to trim what I could.

Maybe I will get my guys/gals to shift to destructoid. I just hoped that more of the people here might feel the sameway. That is the only reason I even created the blog.

Thanks for the input from anyone'e point of view.
massiveplugger's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 11:35
massiveplugger
Heading to lunch... I will catch up with all the comments in a moment.

Thanks for any feedback... 4Real!!
wardrox's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 11:45
wardrox
tbh, instead of stirring up what could be described as a giant vat of eDrama, just go to another forum.
DeusPayne's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 11:51
DeusPayne
XBL is not a democracy based on equality. It is a product, and the 'community' behind it is run by the same people that sell the product. To expect 'fair' treatment in a place like that is naive. Microsoft felt that they wanted to reach out to a new demographic in hopes that brining in more 'girlgamers' will bring in other gamers as well. To do this, they gave girls incentives to join, one of which is a private area. If the belief that all gamers are nerds who can barely talk to women didn't exist, I doubt they'd even be trying to get more girl gamers.

If you're still pissed off about it, just pretend it's like an all girls slumber party. They may not be topless, practicing kissing, and having pillow fights, but it sure is more fun to think it is.
Dr FloppyBollocks's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 12:00
Dr FloppyBollocks
its more like, shaving their top lips, burning their bras and sewing up their icey vah jay jays
weedgan's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 12:20
weedgan
Trixie? HA!

Is it just me or does it look like she doesn't know JACK SHIT about gaming. Just another mother fucker getting paid to be a host on a show.

Oh look at me I can use the interwebs and make post on forums, I'm sooo savvy with technology.

Fuck off and die.
weedgan's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 12:22
weedgan
And all this shit with gaming is going out of hand.

Do you see musicans with there own clubs,

GUITAR DADS

DRUMMER CHICKS

BASS DYKES

I mean fuckin' A, we're all people just leave it at that I don't care what gender you are or how many kids you have, pay your damn taxes and shuddup!
weedgan's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 12:24
weedgan
I guess all I'm trying to say is, GamerChix or anything like fragdolls and all that shit is just fucking stupid.
massiveplugger's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 12:46
massiveplugger
Well... I do see that brought this to the wrong area.

This is twice that I have struck out. I will leave it along for sure.

Thanks again....

MP
Rucksack's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 13:54
Rucksack
@MassivePLugger

Dude, stay on here. We're not all jerks!
SLiFE's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 14:38
SLiFE
"FUCK GAMER CHIX AND FUCK TRIXIE THAT FAT FUCKING TROLL YARD BEAST OF A GAMER."

Oh GAWD, hearing her makes me want to stab myself in the ear hole.

Also, fuck the Frag Dolls. A gamer is a gamer is a gamer, regardless of your junk.
Dr FloppyBollocks's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 14:45
Dr FloppyBollocks
i remember watching a vid of two winners of a halo tourney (male) being made to play two GC. the girls got destroyed but Gimli was stood their saying "those girls gave you a hard game eh? they gave you two quiet the challenge didnt they?"

the two guys just stood there looking embarressed and agreed, blatently with threat of ban if they pointed out that they just destroyed the two rosie o donnel lookalikes sat opposite them...
Rifter01's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 15:13
Rifter01
I agree with Reaprar, except that I did read the wall of text..

..Wait a minute.. I agree with Reaprar?!?!
MechaMonkey's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/19/2008 15:42
MechaMonkey
You pose an interesting conundrum, and one that has been brought up on numerous occasions right here on Destructoid. Do female gamers deserve special treatment or recognition? The consensus around here is generally no, they do not, but that doesn't change the fact that they continue to receive it.

As for the problem you face on those forums, it doesn't look like a fight you can win. There are other Xbox-related communities out there that will allow you to speak freely. Or, you could just stay here at Destructoid. :)

Finally, don't mind our resident members of the He-Man Woman Haters' Club. The girls made fun of them in school and it made them bitter.
massiveplugger's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/20/2008 07:00
massiveplugger
You guys are all a trip.... I do not plan on leaving Destructoid for sure. First experience is this and it has been great.

I was just apologizing for bringing up in an area where most people did not really want it. Still.... I enjoyed sharing my opinion regardless. : P
Aaron Mxy Yost's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/20/2008 10:56
Aaron Mxy Yost
@ rifter01: I know, I'm in the same boat. My head asploded. But yup, equality is not what they care about.

All Gamer Chix has accomplished is making the women involved look like they care more about being in a stupid club and getting rewarded for being born with certain plumbing than playing games. I feel embarrassed for them myself.
DaiBoOK's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/20/2008 19:24
DaiBoOK
got love ppl who want to put their 2 cents in and can't read well enough to get though a few paragraphs
KBs FuRy's Avatar - Comment posted on 06/23/2008 16:03
KBs FuRy
Excellent story Massive. GamerChix suck (probably not literally) and I think you will start seeing more and more gamer girls not wanting to become part of the club. Gamer girls rock..... but GamerChix suck
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