It doesn't matter what people mean when they start off a sentence like that because you can be fairly certain that the next words are bound to be offensive.
My first day in Psychology class at Belmont Abbey College the professor decided that we were going to play the game "Four Corners". For those who aren't familiar with this game (and this not meant in a condescending manner) it's where signs are put up in each of the corners of a room. You have "Agree", "Strongly Agree", "Disagree" and "Strongly Disagree" no room for neutrality.
The first statement was:
"Video games cause violent behavior"
Big shock, right? It's not like this isn't all over the news all the time and thanks to idiots like Jack Thompson the debate is not likely to end soon...
What was shocking was the fact that I was alone in the "Strongly Disagree" corner. WTF? I looked over and there were two people in the "Disagree" corner and the remaining 24 students were all trying to wedge into the "Strongly Agree" community.
Then we were asked to explain why we chose what we did and the dismaying thing was that most of the people in this particuliar group seemed to be parrotting media fodder or engaging in a bunch of stereotypes about the gaming world and most of those I disagree with.
First of all, I found that most of the people I encountered on this night held the same belief as Jack Thompson; that there was no such thing as "Gamer Culture" merely a bunch of anti-social people who spent all of their times fixated on video games and did not socialize.
Then there were some that admitted that there was a "culture" but that it was closed and unfriendly, that no civilian dare wander in out of genuine curiousity and interest.
To be fair, I was not the best representative for the gaming community merely because I don't possess the vast knowledge of it as other people do. While I do spend a lot of time gaming to some people out there, I am still one of those annoying "noobs". I am not the end all be all source when it comes to the culture nor do I pretend to be. However, I did manage to hold my own.
Today I joined the blog community here after being a reader of the webpage for several months. I was excited about being able to blog and make friends with similiar interests. Perhaps in my excitement I didn't dedicate enough thought to my first post and there was a minor flame war inside.
The troubling question in this post is when the implied statement of some gamers is "Oh You're One of THOSE aren't you?" (meaning noob I guess) where are you supposed to earn your experience points then?
I don't know... that story made me feel all "stabby" all of a sudden.
The way I see it, let the other "non-hardcore" video game players think what they will. In the end, their negative views really have no importance in the universe. [/hippie]
How I did respond was take it to the level of making it about the personal responsibility of an individual playing the game, not the game itself. I should have stated that in the post to make it more clear. Thank you for the input.
In video game terms... you earn xp by lurking. Making your presence known in a fail blog is like going into battle against a gold golem alone, equipped only with a stick... you're going to lose. Instead you should kill slimes (lurk), level up (get a feel for the Dtoid community), and get better equipment (learn bbcode, find something interesting, use a meme) before going off to slay the dragon (Have a battle of the wits with Jim Sterling).
It's a handy exercise. Now you know that 24 people in your psych class are morons who can't think for themselves.
Strangely many Universities fail to instill the concept of critical thinking into their students.
Also, quality quotes, though I've always preferred William S. Burroughs to Kerouac when it comes to the Beats.
This is a situation that DOOM and Counter Strike trained you for! Pull out your guns and settle some business. [/sarcasm]
I remember the odd looks in college, too. It's always a ton of fun, but all you can do is be a good example of our culture. By not killing all of them in some blind rage, you're already making a good case.
Maybe that's just your university in particular? I attend UAH and have been taking Psychology courses for the last five years or so... and the topic of violence as related to media (television, video games, the works) has only been lightly discussed, if at all.
There may have been an attempt by one or two professors to note that content can have a potential impact on impressionable children - and that's a given, really. But other than that? Nah.
Also, if you let it be known that you have boobies, (and I don't mean these kind) a lot of the people on this site are 10000 times more tolerant of fail blogs. Not me though, I hate regardless of color, creed, or class... or gender.
This topic is relevant to my interests.
But it's like trying to enter someone's boundaries I guess, most people need to know that they can trust you, before thy begin to accept you and take you seriously.
Interesting events. I took a psychology class at a local community college where we played the same game and the same question was asked. What I found was a bit more of a mix of opinions. There were more people in the agree section than the disagree section but the points given were mostly the same.
Yes, trust is very important, as easy as it is to post on the intrawebs I keep forgetting that factor. Thank you for reminding me of that.
"We need people in our lives with whom we can be as open as possible. To have real conversation with people may seem like such a simple, obvious suggestion, but it involves courage and risk." --Thomas Moore
It was actually scary when I realized that I was alone, but by this point I am so fed up with gamer ignorance that it drives me to stand up and dare to be different.
@daedHead8
I think if I lived in the Northeast the results would have been a bit more evenly placed. But regardless of location it seems that some people are too easily frightened and more eager to believe what they see on TV these days sadly. It was a disturbing glimpse into my "peers".
yea, i would def be in the strongly disagree category but the problem would be that i would try to use arguments that i didn't necessarily have a back up for. i hate when that happens.
but you held your own. for this, props are in order.
I actually wanted to see what you said to the nay sayers.
but me personally everyone starts off fresh somewhere. It's how people decide to take it being the "new guy/girl/noob" of the group or whatever it is. Either you learn, refuse to learn, or act like a complete ass/idiot. It's not hard. But then again many people aren't used to so many different personalities clashing which can cause for bad blood at times. Especially as something as epic as the internetz.
so I mean...yea. Don't EVER feel bad about being a lone soldier. Especially if you know you're right.
Well this is much better. And it's a shame that those people in your class are misinformed. I think you missed a really good opportunity to enlighten some people on violence and videogames.
Or at the very least prove them right and whack them with your purse.
Or, take them out completely so as to stop the idiocy from spreading.
Well, I’m glad to see that you were able to weather the storm. The community here can be pretty hateful to first-timers, and they’re often driven away, never to return. As liquidninja said, don’t let anyone here make you feel inferior. We welcome all types of gamers here...or at least I’d like to think so.
@Gasekura: Yeah, in addition to her Psych class, she's taking Potions 101 and Double Jump 192. Plus, you should see her wield the Vampire Killer Whip. Truly a thing of beauty. heh.
I play on the Killrogg server with my fiance' Drewcifer75 my user name is Taliarose and I am a draenei warrior...you are most welcome to quest with us if you'd like =)
@Reaprar
I saw that and need to comment that you DID help me! I truly appreciate it. =)
@Aziel13
I feel warm fuzzies and I squee in your general direction! Thanks =)
Thankfully I was able to hold my own without getting in over my head. I cited the fact that I *allow* my 11 year old son to play Tom Clancey games because he knows the difference between video game violence and RL violence. It all comes down to personal responsibility and actually parenting your children. Of course I fully expect Jack Thompson to call Social Services on me now.
I also rarely get into debates about things that I am not fully informed on it helps to cut down on the time that my foot stays in my mouth as it were.
@Shin_Oni
Hindisight indicates that I should have included that in the post...basically what I did say was that in saying that the actual video games caused violence was like saying that the blender that makes milkshakes is to blame for you getting fat. You have to accept some level of personal responsibility for your actions and if you are a parent then you have to also take responsibility for your children's actions. It seems that some people are way too eager to pass the buck on things and choose to find scapegoats instead of effectively dealing with problems.
@TrailerParkJesus
It IS a tragedy that so many people are ignorant of the art of video gaming. I get excited about how far technology has improved since the days of Pong and Intellivision you know?
Gah! Middle aged? Well yeah I guess..but I thought that didn't start til 40. PHOOEY! I'm not a wife yet and the prospect of having Jim Sterling unleashed on me? Could be interesting I guess but does he bite?
@Gasekura
Well there are alot of monks there, but fear not I am just a freshman..a noob there too. Besides some of my best friends are Vampires so this may cause a conflict of interest. =)
@Samit_Sarkar
I couldn't leave I enjoy the page too much! I'm WAAAAY too fangirl I even own a beanie. Aside from that I have learned that you can't take flames personally. I had the discussion with my fiance' last night before blogging that I was disappointed with the whole flamer tendency though.
The one thing that drew me into the culture back when I was 10 was the whole accepting mentality that was so unlike the social groups like the Jocks that thought Geeks and nerds were free game. Nowadays it seems that some gamers behave like the jocks back then.
But yes Dtoid is an awesome community and I don't plan on leaving anytime soon.
Thanks =)
@Drewcifer75
I saw you posted your article from Wicked Toast..WTG Baby! You are made of awesome and Cheezits! Another of the acres of reasons that I love you so much! <3
Well perhaps it was more than a mini-flame war as you quite the persitant and somewhat daunting opponent.
I realize that my intial post lacked content and regret that I came off as fluff to the regulars. But while I understand that such posts can be viewed as waste of time and bandwidth I never understand what is accomplished by degrading a 'noob'.
I appreciate the fact that you also commented on this post and extended a welcome. Thank you.
Dynamic Sheep's comments need to be required reading for every fail blogger that comes to dtoid. And I agree with MrSadistic. It made me feel all stabby too.
Dynamic Sheep is my new guru, I will heed the advice given. It is a stabby situation because it's plain ignorance at work in society, not shocking but aggravating as all hell.
What frustrates me about the "Games cause violence" argument, especially from people over a certain age, is that there are so many other factors to consider. It just seems to amazingly short sighted to actually, truly believe that a video game by itself has this ability to lead a child by the hand to where he will pick up a weapon and kill... That's just so....amazing to me because of how you would think history would have taught people that media alone simply cannot be blamed. We saw it with TV, and the birth of rock and roll, and just about every fad or emerging entertainment trend. That's kind of frustrating. Grrr..
Destructoid is an open discussion community. You don't need to "audition" to post a comment - just speak your mind. We respect differing opinions on the site, so have at it. Be smart, funny, insightful, clueless, or cute -- but back it up with substance. Keep your cool, keep it fun. We only ask that you act respectfully and above all: don't be a troll and ruin it for everyone else. Don't bring down gamers or we'll, you know, gently shoot you in the face and stuff you into a flaming mailbox. Each comment is your opportuntity to make this community awesomer. Is that even a word?
Avoiding the banhammer only requires common sense: spamming, trolling, racism, NSFW stuff, and other forms of sucking will not be tolerated. If anyone is griefing please report abuse. Be good. Don't suck!
about me
Who am I?
Well obviously you're reading this drivel, which means that you do want to know about me. My name is Lesa (which is what my friends call me). I am frequently referred to as "Mom" but only by my children and I prefer to keep it that way and my fiancé dubbed me "d00b" a long time ago and it stuck...so yeah as long as it's civil I tend to respond to anything. =)
I'm not famous, haven't climbed Everest, I'm 39 years old, I go to college full-time in pursuit of an English Degree and I also work part-time when not gaming. I reside in NASCAR Central aka Charlotte, NC. I'm a GEEK. I wear this title proudly as it should be. I thoroughly enjoy video games, comic books, and technology.
I game on the following systems:
NES
GameCube
DS
PS2
Xbox
PC
Games Currently Addicted to:
World Of Warcraft (PC)
Arcana Heart (PS2)
The Longest Journey (PC)
God of War (PS2)
But instead of me filling random blather about who I am here, why don't you just ask, I only bite if you submit the proper forms (in triplicate).
The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes "Awww!”
-Jack Kerouac
It was the Law of the Sea, they said. Civilization ends at the waterline. Beyond that, we all enter the food chain, and not always right at the top.
- Hunter S. Thompson
In those days spirits were brave, the stakes were high, men were real men, women were real women and small furry creatures from Alpha Centauri were real small furry creatures from Alpha Centauri.
- Douglas Adams
The fact that man knows right from wrong proves his intellectual superiority to other creatures; but the fact that he can do wrong proves his moral inferiority to any creature that cannot.
- Mark Twain (Samuel Clemens)
It's a strange world. Let's keep it that way.
-Warren Ellis
Destructoid is an independently-run publication forged by our love of video games and the gaming community's need of accountable enthusiast press living the dream since March 16, 2006
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Nice to meet you d00b, you can call me q00p.
I don't know... that story made me feel all "stabby" all of a sudden.
The way I see it, let the other "non-hardcore" video game players think what they will. In the end, their negative views really have no importance in the universe. [/hippie]
True and a very good point.
How I did respond was take it to the level of making it about the personal responsibility of an individual playing the game, not the game itself. I should have stated that in the post to make it more clear. Thank you for the input.
In video game terms... you earn xp by lurking. Making your presence known in a fail blog is like going into battle against a gold golem alone, equipped only with a stick... you're going to lose. Instead you should kill slimes (lurk), level up (get a feel for the Dtoid community), and get better equipment (learn bbcode, find something interesting, use a meme) before going off to slay the dragon (Have a battle of the wits with Jim Sterling).
Don't let anyone here make you feel inferior. Almost everyone who attempts to do so is a jerk. (surprised?)
It's a handy exercise. Now you know that 24 people in your psych class are morons who can't think for themselves.
Strangely many Universities fail to instill the concept of critical thinking into their students.
Also, quality quotes, though I've always preferred William S. Burroughs to Kerouac when it comes to the Beats.
This is a situation that DOOM and Counter Strike trained you for! Pull out your guns and settle some business. [/sarcasm]
I remember the odd looks in college, too. It's always a ton of fun, but all you can do is be a good example of our culture. By not killing all of them in some blind rage, you're already making a good case.
@zerO_Hour
My favorite Burroughs quote is
“After one look at this planet any visitor from outer space would say 'I want to see the manager'.”
Maybe that's just your university in particular? I attend UAH and have been taking Psychology courses for the last five years or so... and the topic of violence as related to media (television, video games, the works) has only been lightly discussed, if at all.
There may have been an attempt by one or two professors to note that content can have a potential impact on impressionable children - and that's a given, really. But other than that? Nah.
Also, if you let it be known that you have boobies, (and I don't mean these kind) a lot of the people on this site are 10000 times more tolerant of fail blogs. Not me though, I hate regardless of color, creed, or class... or gender.
@MrSadistic
Plz to not be going ginsu on me
@DynamicSheep
Noted! direction finally.
@q00p
nice to meet you! =)
@liquidninja
I have a total lack of surprise actually, but thank you.
@CaptainApocalypse
Thanks =)
This topic is relevant to my interests.
But it's like trying to enter someone's boundaries I guess, most people need to know that they can trust you, before thy begin to accept you and take you seriously.
I applaud you for standing in the strongly disagree corner by yourself. It takes guts to not always go with the media controlled mob.
Interesting events. I took a psychology class at a local community college where we played the same game and the same question was asked. What I found was a bit more of a mix of opinions. There were more people in the agree section than the disagree section but the points given were mostly the same.
@commish
Yes, trust is very important, as easy as it is to post on the intrawebs I keep forgetting that factor. Thank you for reminding me of that.
"We need people in our lives with whom we can be as open as possible. To have real conversation with people may seem like such a simple, obvious suggestion, but it involves courage and risk." --Thomas Moore
@ceark
It was actually scary when I realized that I was alone, but by this point I am so fed up with gamer ignorance that it drives me to stand up and dare to be different.
@daedHead8
I think if I lived in the Northeast the results would have been a bit more evenly placed. But regardless of location it seems that some people are too easily frightened and more eager to believe what they see on TV these days sadly. It was a disturbing glimpse into my "peers".
Way to stand alone! Well done!
Welcome to the community!
What server do you play on in WoW?
you + gas + set class + chained doors= Pure win
cool story hansel.
yea, i would def be in the strongly disagree category but the problem would be that i would try to use arguments that i didn't necessarily have a back up for. i hate when that happens.
but you held your own. for this, props are in order.
I actually wanted to see what you said to the nay sayers.
but me personally everyone starts off fresh somewhere. It's how people decide to take it being the "new guy/girl/noob" of the group or whatever it is. Either you learn, refuse to learn, or act like a complete ass/idiot. It's not hard. But then again many people aren't used to so many different personalities clashing which can cause for bad blood at times. Especially as something as epic as the internetz.
so I mean...yea. Don't EVER feel bad about being a lone soldier. Especially if you know you're right.
Well this is much better. And it's a shame that those people in your class are misinformed. I think you missed a really good opportunity to enlighten some people on violence and videogames.
Or at the very least prove them right and whack them with your purse.
Or, take them out completely so as to stop the idiocy from spreading.
A middle aged gamer wife, eh? Hmmm, somebody should call Jimmles in here...
Wait wait, Belmont Abbey College? Are you taught the ancient arts of vampire slaying, passed down by the descendants of the Belmont family?!
Well, I’m glad to see that you were able to weather the storm. The community here can be pretty hateful to first-timers, and they’re often driven away, never to return. As liquidninja said, don’t let anyone here make you feel inferior. We welcome all types of gamers here...or at least I’d like to think so.
Well said, d00b. Well said indeed.
@Gasekura: Yeah, in addition to her Psych class, she's taking Potions 101 and Double Jump 192. Plus, you should see her wield the Vampire Killer Whip. Truly a thing of beauty. heh.
@Tubatic
I thank you and my spleen thanks you...
I play on the Killrogg server with my fiance' Drewcifer75 my user name is Taliarose and I am a draenei warrior...you are most welcome to quest with us if you'd like =)
@Reaprar
I saw that and need to comment that you DID help me! I truly appreciate it. =)
@Aziel13
I feel warm fuzzies and I squee in your general direction! Thanks =)
@Fleet3000
Thankfully I was able to hold my own without getting in over my head. I cited the fact that I *allow* my 11 year old son to play Tom Clancey games because he knows the difference between video game violence and RL violence. It all comes down to personal responsibility and actually parenting your children. Of course I fully expect Jack Thompson to call Social Services on me now.
I also rarely get into debates about things that I am not fully informed on it helps to cut down on the time that my foot stays in my mouth as it were.
@Shin_Oni
Hindisight indicates that I should have included that in the post...basically what I did say was that in saying that the actual video games caused violence was like saying that the blender that makes milkshakes is to blame for you getting fat. You have to accept some level of personal responsibility for your actions and if you are a parent then you have to also take responsibility for your children's actions. It seems that some people are way too eager to pass the buck on things and choose to find scapegoats instead of effectively dealing with problems.
@TrailerParkJesus
It IS a tragedy that so many people are ignorant of the art of video gaming. I get excited about how far technology has improved since the days of Pong and Intellivision you know?
@Wedge
Gah! Middle aged? Well yeah I guess..but I thought that didn't start til 40. PHOOEY! I'm not a wife yet and the prospect of having Jim Sterling unleashed on me? Could be interesting I guess but does he bite?
@Gasekura
Well there are alot of monks there, but fear not I am just a freshman..a noob there too. Besides some of my best friends are Vampires so this may cause a conflict of interest. =)
@Samit_Sarkar
I couldn't leave I enjoy the page too much! I'm WAAAAY too fangirl I even own a beanie. Aside from that I have learned that you can't take flames personally. I had the discussion with my fiance' last night before blogging that I was disappointed with the whole flamer tendency though.
The one thing that drew me into the culture back when I was 10 was the whole accepting mentality that was so unlike the social groups like the Jocks that thought Geeks and nerds were free game. Nowadays it seems that some gamers behave like the jocks back then.
But yes Dtoid is an awesome community and I don't plan on leaving anytime soon.
Thanks =)
@Drewcifer75
I saw you posted your article from Wicked Toast..WTG Baby! You are made of awesome and Cheezits! Another of the acres of reasons that I love you so much! <3
@d00b
Awesome AND Cheezits AND LOVE?! WOOOT!! TRIPLE WIN!!
Thanks, m'darlin'. Love you too. =)
flame flame flame flame flame flame :) :) i'd like to think it was more than a mini-flame war. ;p
glad to see you updated your side-bar, and are now going about blogs in a thoughtful and filling way.
without further ado, welcome to destructoid xD
@BlackSheep
Well perhaps it was more than a mini-flame war as you quite the persitant and somewhat daunting opponent.
I realize that my intial post lacked content and regret that I came off as fluff to the regulars. But while I understand that such posts can be viewed as waste of time and bandwidth I never understand what is accomplished by degrading a 'noob'.
I appreciate the fact that you also commented on this post and extended a welcome. Thank you.
Dynamic Sheep's comments need to be required reading for every fail blogger that comes to dtoid. And I agree with MrSadistic. It made me feel all stabby too.
@blehman
Dynamic Sheep is my new guru, I will heed the advice given. It is a stabby situation because it's plain ignorance at work in society, not shocking but aggravating as all hell.
What frustrates me about the "Games cause violence" argument, especially from people over a certain age, is that there are so many other factors to consider. It just seems to amazingly short sighted to actually, truly believe that a video game by itself has this ability to lead a child by the hand to where he will pick up a weapon and kill... That's just so....amazing to me because of how you would think history would have taught people that media alone simply cannot be blamed. We saw it with TV, and the birth of rock and roll, and just about every fad or emerging entertainment trend. That's kind of frustrating. Grrr..