<p><img src="http://www.destructoid.com/elephant//ul/7775-468x-lauren-promoted.jpg" border="0" alt=" " width="468" height="352" /></p><p><em>Editor's Note: Hey all, DMV here. Atheistium's written an interesting rant on the whole girl gamer issue, which has always been a hot topic. So far, it's been a real hit on the community blogs, so give this Destructoid veteran some love and read her story. Enjoy!</em></p><p>I finally want to get my issues with the "girl gamer" culture to rest. This will be my final rant on it all... finally. </p>
<p><strong>For those who know me</strong>, I don't like girl gaming leagues, clans, websites, or anything that really does out line female gamers. <strong>Why?</strong> It's 100% bullshit. Am I the only one who has noticed that the majority of girls in this clans/clubs/sites look like models? It's <a target="_blank" href="http://www.hotgamergirls.com/">shit</a> like <a target="_blank" href="http://www.gamerhelp.com/article_viewer.cfm?article_id=123400">this</a> that gets me thinking. Now this is not an attack on anyone personally (I know the last link contains two members of dtoid who I like), however why do 'girls' let themselves become this? Now I am not a feminist. I laugh at "get in the kitchen" jokes and I do play around with sexual jokes. However sometimes when you see all girls getting certain attention just for being pretty and not for anything to do with their actual skill you start to wonder. </p><p>Now I am not saying I am some uber pro at games. I am not. I don't play one certain game 24-7. I'd rather suck at a lot of games that be some pro at one. However you get these females who come to forums, come to places, demand attention and then when it all boils down to it... don't game. Or play <em>WoW</em>.... Why are you on [insert gaming website here]? Is it because you want to get INTO gaming? Or because being a 'geek' is the new fashion? Apparently it is. </p><p>On the whole <em>WoW</em> issue, I don't consider people gamers if the only thing they play is wow. You play one game. The same goes for people who play one games continuously. If you play <em>Halo 2</em> and only <em>Halo 2</em>, you're a <em>Halo 2</em> player. Playing to compete is a different thing... </p><p>Sometimes you can't really trust if your actually liked or if you've only got popular because you have tits. For example, myself. I managed to get number 1 blog on 1up.com for a few weeks. I was on the front page for a number of weeks also. Now was it because people actually liked my writing, or because I am female? I am not really a great <a href="http://atheistium.1up.com">writer</a>. And some of my 1up messages are all "omg your hot" or "omg girl gamer". I usually introduce myself as a female gamer. I'm 20 years old, I am not a girl any more. </p><p>Which brings me to another point. Girl gaming. I mean it sounds nice and all with the alliteration but the majority of females playing are woman. Over 17. The attitude of girl gamers is usually cutesy with high pitched voices. </p><p>What's happened to this female gamer culture? Where having photo shoots and websites dedicated to your photos, posing around with a Nintendo controllers on your <a target="_blank" href="http://www.destructoid.com/nerdcore-7-video-game-fetish-30827.phtml">nipples</a> or covering your naked body in games. Sure some of its for fun, but not all of it. You can't say "oh yeah I took these last night because I was bored" and have an 100 image photo set of yourself in a number of poses. </p><p>People will probably argue to me "but what about the <a target="_blank" href="http://epilepticgaming.com">EG</a> stunt?". First of all, I will use a quote from my favourite philosopher Ron "Greybush" Workman "<strong>Look, I Drink.</strong>" I was drunk. If you didn't know me and my friend Hollie (pheonix_blood) tend to do crazy shit when we are drunk. DjRome however really was not supposed to put them on screen... and the only way I could play it off was by laughing about it. Summa did not ask for permission to use them on dtoid either. However it got on live, it got passed around and suddenly I had a new form of popularity. Not popularity that I wanted. </p><p>Chobot got popular by licking a PSP, now she works at IGN. For myself who is struggling to get into the industry and to see people get in by being pretty... it's extremely frustrating to see. Not saying Chobot got in solely by that.. but that's the stepping stone. She WORKS for IGN. </p><p>So what does that leave to say? Blame the girls for wanting this strange popularity and friends list count? Or blame the guys for demanding it, reading it, visiting it and encouraging it. I want to blame the girls, for the material would not be out there if it was not for them. However the guys create a demand for it. Gaming is slowly phasing out as a male dominated market. It's not. </p><p>It's really not. </p><p>Can we just stop segregating ourselves into these clans and <a target="_blank" href="http://mega64.com">leagues</a> and just play a fucking game together? Maybe girls would feel less threatened by other females if they got used to other girls being around in the first place. Why I love destructoid. There are actual girls here who GAME. Who are not all idiots and who are a laugh to hang out with. I have always mainly had male friends because of my personality and attitude but its nice to find other females I can relate to. </p><p>Anyway STFUAJPG! /end</p>
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(# 0) on 06/03/2007 08:44
& Athy you pretty much have become the Dtoid poster girl!
(# 1) on 06/03/2007 08:49
I hate seeing naked girls with controllers hiding their gines, thats fucking LAME AND GROSS!!!!!! all that did was show me your a fucking SLUT with some video game equiptment around. ghey ghey ghey...you suck nuts! (prob Literally too)
I could careless about the all female clans, that doesnt really bug me too much. PMS is the biggest, but whoop dee do, do u want a freakin cookie? Im in the ACK Ladies, which is a division in the ACK Clan. and we are all family we dont play halo 2 24/7, we are all mostly on GOW or RS3V. So yeah..we rock..All those halo 2 only girl clans are ugly and have no lives. Seriously. "ZOMG HALO 2 FTW!!!!!!" no. But yes lauren, i see where u are coming from. Me, I consider myself a hardcore gamer. I reserve every good game thats about to come out, and I play everyday for 8-12 hours. (except when I have a migraine...that doesnt count) So, yeah im a fucking GAMER, and I don't need to be fake and pose naked pictures with controllers or games all over me!..fuck that shit! But yeah, lately, I've noticed what you are talking about..cause I just joined a site called www.thegamergirls.com and Im on the forums, but I do believe its mostly for PC gamers, I haven't seen anyone Tooo INTO gaming really. But yeah..they are nice, but not hardcore enough for me. and their models i think, dont even game, but yet the posing half naked with the famous controllers. SO yeah. you + me = Rapeness. LOVE YOU! Kelly Kelley
(# 2) on 06/03/2007 09:03
I think another reason this is so annoying is gaming culture itself, not even associated with sexist themes. The idea that gaming should be a way of life and not a hobby simply propels certain ideas- like that of 'girl gamers' and guys who drool over hot girls who play video games. I guarantee those who play video games enough to not get caught up in labeling themselves 'gamers' will have enough wits to realize a pretty girl taking pictures with a console who never actually plays games or even discusses them is not a true person interested in gaming.
But yes, I do agree with most of what you say, especially the irritation at the 'girl gamer' label. It is exceedingly hard for those girls who DO game to not be treated like the attention seeking individuals marketed to males. For many guys who game, they still see me as a girl who games, and not simply a person who enjoys games like they do. I go through these phases where I do not want to even admit that I am female because I do want to know if I am actually liked as a person and not because of my genitalia being different from the majority of people with whom I speak.
I have also found it a challenge to find girls who really do game, or even consider the gaming lifestyle their own. I do feel this is made so difficult because of the aforementioned misleading brand of marketing.
(# 3) on 06/03/2007 09:04
(# 4) on 06/03/2007 09:19
I agree with you completely Lauren, I'm really sick of the whole idea behind model/gamer shit. All it really comes down to is; can you game? If so, awesome, let's play some Gears. If not; go back to modeling for DeezTeez or stockroom. You're making our culture more like a Hooters convention then something that has been a very personal pass time, and I think everyone on Dtoid could agree with that.
(# 5) on 06/03/2007 09:20
(# 6) on 06/03/2007 09:25
I got invited to the site, didn't want to partake. It's stupid.
(# 7) on 06/03/2007 10:05
firstly i have alot of respect for you, your a stong enough person that you dont have to think and be a cetrain way to impress pepole.
i do use the term girl gamer i use it simply becuase its an ailliteration, and thierfore it rolls off the tounge well.
i dont mind women showing what they got. in all firness, if your happy with how you look, then go for it. BUT, thier will come a point where i will get sick of seeing your pushed up DD chest and will ask 'do you actually paly any games'. if they can show me thier skills, prove they have them. go you!
though i draw attention back to them miss video games awards, im sorry, was it jsut me or were none of them girls ordinary looking!? they were all stuidly beautiful! like normaly girls dont play games, or if they did, they couldny possably be any good.
i have actully never met a guy who has an issue with me being a female who playvideo games and i cringe when i read the gaming magazines as women write in to compalin that they are offended by the boobs on page14. im sorry but women in gaming ARE a minority. thats life, i accept it, in fact id like to think im grown up enough to not be offnded by, for example, laura crofts short shorts and can actually enjoy the game for what it is.
i do feel that many all female websites and clans, do carry on creating the stigma that there is a need for women to be different.
im not innocent, yeah, i cosplay, and yeah, i took a photo of myself in my nintendo tshirt. i can be accused of flaunting myself at certain points (EG for example). id jsut like to think that i do these things for the right reason, for FUN. like cam whoring at london expo.
(# 8) on 06/03/2007 10:12
OMFG YOU JUST STOP RIGHT THERE! YOU SPELT LARA WRONG! OMFG IMA KILL YOU!
Hollie, regarding your Cosplay I think its a totally separate thing. Your cosplay is cosplay. You can get so much opportunity and is there even a UK professional cosplay yet? I want you to become that.
I have photos of me in my Mario shirt, but I also have photos of me pissing about on a scooter at work. Looking like a total fag and not worrying about every little thing people think of me. Obviously I don't want hideous photos out there! However if people don't like the way I look whoop-de-fucking do.
Which is a life lesson I want you to learn on a personal level hollie ;-D You know what I am talking about. I just hope you feel comfortable enough to start doing it more!
/sex
(# 9) on 06/03/2007 10:37
Look the only reason gamer girls get any attention at all is because gaming is big fucking magnet to just about any guy. whether the girl is hot or not, the gaming aspect bumps her up 1 on a scale of 1 to 10. I am not going to deny that maybe some girls who are cute are jus taking advantage of gamerdude's fantastical demands, but did you ever think that hot gamer girls are maybe trying to help bring in other girls who normally don't game because gamer girls in most social circles are seen as tobmboys? I tip my hat to these girls because it seems like they're actually trying to break social boundries and set an example for future generations of gamers.
Also What I found interesting was the statement of nongamer girls who post pics and wish for popularity... I think you'd be surprised how many girls out there, cute or not think smart guys/gamers are attractive. (yes these girls are rare
Overall, What I'm trying to say is before you rant think about all the other possibilities before hand and maybe post them as well. Cause as far as I read I just see the perspective of a "Authentic Girl Gamer" who thinks she has a mediocre appearance and got popular online the "hard" way and is not moving anywhere in the gaming industry because she's stunted by her looks.
It's Just how I see things from your writing on what you feel and think. I'm not looking for an arguement, just trying to verify my perceptions.
(# 10) on 06/03/2007 10:44
Fragdolls and all the attention whores you dislike are what I call "Manufactured Gamers" they are as fake as gamers as Avril lavine is a musician. I might not have any ovaries so i won't claim I know how you feel. But I'll take a stab at it you feel that, As a girl gamer you see the opportunities and attention that these filthy whores are garnering, and you want a slice of the pie
but the pie is full of dead kittens and cockroaches. and you want the pie full of Hi-Ethers and Magic Mushrooms. or something to that effect
(# 11) on 06/03/2007 10:57
The saying "if you've got it, flaunt it" comes to mind. What frustrates me is that these communities of "pretty girl gamers" really... boil down to "join my myspace" or "look at me" or "be my friend". But from past experience, you add them as friends you try get a conversation going and you get nothing back.
There is a female on the dtoid forums who's posts are 100% photo thread ONLY. And each post is a new photo of herself. Now unless she is talking to everyone via PM.. what is the point. This user doesn't comment on the blogs, only goes on the forum to post photos and doesn't seen to interact with anyone else unless they have commented on her photo.
I am very welcome for new girls to come into the community. I would never of introduced my friend Hollie to destructoid otherwise. Aktrez is setting up a website called the girl gaming network which she explained to me is nothing more than to market to newer gamers and they are targeting females.
I didn't feel the need to go on about authentic model like gamers because Virtual Girl is a very obvious one. She has a lot of model photos on her myspace but is also an extremely talented artist and passionate gamer.
The reason I brought this blog on was more to relate my feelings to the current situation and burry the hatchet too.
I also didn't want to write the worlds longest rant-worthy essay because in that I would of argued both sides. I mearly wanted to bring up my main worries for the future of females in gaming communities.
Now I never ever said that my looks were stopping me from getting into the industry. I was stating that looks have gotten other females, for example Chobot, into the industry as a stepping stone. If she was not pretty, her liking a psp would of meant fuck all to a lot of people. My inability to get into the industry is my lack of experience and also living in a country where industry jobs are sparse and sought after.
I do feel I have mediocre appearance but that also has nothing to do with this post. If I was drop dead gorgeously I wouldn't go for a photo shoot and post it on the internet unless I was trying to be a model, which if a lifestyle I don't believe I could handle.
Also on the "hard" way note. I am sorry but you've talked bull right there. I never said it was hard to me to get into the community. Actually the majority of communities I join I manage to get known pretty quickly. Why? Because I become part of the community! By taking part. Not by flashing myself all over. I am outspoken which is usually an easy way to get noticed.
It's nice to see a male perspective objecting to what I have written. I want to see the issue from all angles and people's feelings. Why I wrote this blog.
(# 12) on 06/03/2007 11:02
I don't want a slice of any popularity pie (maybe normal pie) tbh. I go into ventrilo talk to my dtoid friends and that's all I need.
(# 13) on 06/03/2007 11:17
You just posted your last response before i was done typeing this, and thank for not throwing me under the bus, i was worried that i was the epitome of what you are talking about...lol
I have a ton of serious conversations with my husband about how to approach the gaming industry...and i never know what to do. I have been getting a lot of attention because I do model, but games are my life, I know that i will work in the industry (graphic design or writing) someday, and i want to make sure that i get the chance because i am an extreamly hard worker, and because of my talents, not because of how i look...
So what do I do? Stop modeling? take down my photos? I already pulled a few off since the girl gamer article on gamerhelp.com, but for the most part i am stuck on what to do and how to be taken seriously...
Its anoying that female gamers have to work so hard to be taken seriously, and i really dont know some times if i am helping or hurting that cause...I know i am guilty of doing "gaming related" shoots, which i agree with you, usually are just done for attention or to market yourself a specific way...to me i was just combining my hobbies...
Modeling for me was a proffession, now a hobby, and is most likely soon going to go away all together, gaming is my life and it is not going anywhere...its sad, but i dont want to get in to a proffession because of how i look, but becuase of my skills...
If you have any suggestions, please throw them to me, you seem to be very well respected in the community!!!
(# 14) on 06/03/2007 11:29
Well I have to admit you are alot more professional than I thought with your response to my response. (I was expecting huge "stfus" or "post deleted" lol) Anyway after reading your response I have to say I better understand where you're coming from now. Once again if I pegged you inapropiately I apologize (it's because I like to make lots of assumptions and see how close to home I get/ Also I think the intensity of your writing kinda fooled me.)
Anyway good luck with you're career (especially at our age; the dreaded "20") and I got a feeling I'll be seeing you in a published book or something. (This assumption isn's so wild)
(# 15) on 06/03/2007 11:30
I know where you are coming from, and i know how easy (unfortunatly) it would be for me to get where i want to go because of my looks and my gender, but i feel like i should be exposing my work, not my body to get there...
I did piss off a large part of the female community with an article i did recently, where the site picked the photos off of my myspace modeling profile and surprise surprise they picked the few lingere shoots i have ever done to feature...i guess i should have seen that comming...
I got some really horrible responses to it, some just mean, and others from a ton of girls who said i was setting a bad example for other girls...and that really got to me...I am a gamer, the last think i want to do is alienate other people like me...
(# 16) on 06/03/2007 11:38
Even though I like some of your modelling photos, I will honestly point out I don't like the gamer set on. With you on that stage with all the like nintendo signs etc. But that's personal opinion. Other than that I like you, I think your awesome.
The gamer girl article, I can't say I enjoyed. Not mearly because it was gamer girls but because of the pictures used as well. You and Britini are on there, sure you got to get your name out. There was photo's of one girl like sat on her bed without skirt/pants on and it seemed a bit "wow..wtf?".
Getting your name out is one thing but stripping down to do it?
I do respect girls who come into the community. Sometimes that is a challenge itself. But try be more insightful than just posting photo's of yourselves. Please!?
Anyway VG, love ya xox
(# 17) on 06/03/2007 11:41
Anyway, I do come off very bias sometimes. Take me with a pinch of salts :D
(# 18) on 06/03/2007 11:45
w00t! I am loved! lol...
Thats what i am trying to do...I reorganized my myspace photos to seperate my modeling pics from everything else, and i am trying to comment on more diverse threads and push my design work more than anything...hopefully it works!
Dont worry about not likeing that set...most of the time i dont like my photos either... I get that WTF was i thinking look...lol
(# 19) on 06/03/2007 11:50
To be fair, this also happens in other arenas as well (once again, look at MySpace), so I think it's unfair to just focus on the game industry.
Who's to blame for this? Marketers, or the dumb people that fall for this crap? I blame the idiot's, like the people on MySpace who will gladly friend anyone with a hot avatar who sends then a friend invite - without realizing that the "hot girl" they just accepted is really a 400 pound man, who's only intention is to infect that dumb guy's computer with adware.
I do take issue with the fact that people who only play one game are not true "gamers". That's like saying that people who only watch Basketball or Soccer are not sports fans.
(# 20) on 06/03/2007 11:51
And call me crazy, but your hotness is not gaming related. Lol It just is.
(# 21) on 06/03/2007 11:51
(# 22) on 06/03/2007 11:58
(# 23) on 06/03/2007 12:00
Of all those women in those pics you posted, how many of them are actually above average in their profession of choice?
(# 24) on 06/03/2007 12:03
I am getting confused now! lol, you said it is okay to use your looks to get to where you want to be, but you dont think Anna should be respected? If there is no respect for what you do i dont think its worth doing! I am not being sarcastic btw, i am just confused by your argument!
(# 25) on 06/03/2007 12:10
(# 26) on 06/03/2007 12:10
Anna (sadly) has many titles and one a buttload of times in tennis.
Ashley force. Wow. she was just in first for the points in Drag racing. when her dad finally didn't qualify for a race, she went on to race and I placed 2nd. Don't even imply that those woman are below average, cause they aren't.
(# 27) on 06/03/2007 12:11
(# 28) on 06/03/2007 12:14
(# 29) on 06/03/2007 12:20
(# 30) on 06/03/2007 12:29
(# 31) on 06/03/2007 13:04
oh no hun, I wasn't trying to imply that you wanted the populatiry. you're attractive and intelligent enough to get that without having to resort to taking your shirt off.
I guess what i was trying to say was. you'd like to get your feet in the industry without having to become a complete sellout in the process. and i wouldn't blame you. you seem to have a good head on your shoulders, i'm sure you'll find your way
@puppet
Nbuisnesow shush the big people are talking serious business
(# 32) on 06/03/2007 13:16
OHHH! KK ;D
btw that pie looks delicious!
(# 33) on 06/03/2007 13:22
i guess lots of us are going to take a differnet stand on this whole issue, but its nice to see that people are actually taking in what others are saying.
i guess what ever happens thier are always gonna be people who use their looks and sexuality to make things work for them. as long as thier are people like that thier are gonna be people, who to some degree, belvie its acceptable or unacceptable from thier stand point.
its interesting to on a personal level, that yeah i used to post loads of pics of myself, like on my myspace, and yeah i will freely admit, i liked getting comments. but making new friends over the course of this year (yeah she knows who she is) has really started to change my way of thinking. i know on my part it was self confidence. thanks to a certain someone, im starting to learn that i shouldnt have to seek such reassurance from random people, or give two shits what they think.actually now i think about it, im guilty of pretty much everything athe lsited at some point, i like to think im maturing a little though, hahaha.
im sorry i spelt lara wrong, dad was yelling at me at the time, he wanted to put a golf club for sale on ebay, i want to reply to your post, conflict arose!
(# 34) on 06/03/2007 13:29
Ima sex you in the butt till you pass the fuck out.
@Boba
Ima sex you in the butt till you pass the fuck out.
(# 35) on 06/03/2007 13:39
There are no gaming girls. simple. clean cut. And likewise, there are no gaming guys. There is just gamers. Thats how I've always seen and thats how I will continue to see it. There are gamers and non-gamers and a lot of these 'popular' women and men as well are none gamers, they sold themselves for a pretty penny and do the gaming for a pr flick. Now I know not all of them are like that, but there are those out there who ARE like that, where gaming became a marketing stunt for them and no longer something that they enjoyed. I could be wrong I suppose, I just cant stand to see gaming turned into everything else out there, where the popular becomes the weekly pr stunt to promote something. Sex and Money talks I suppose, even in the gaming industry.
(# 36) on 06/03/2007 13:40
Exactly. I am a gamer. Not a girl gamer. I am a female gamer but a gamer non the less.
(# 37) on 06/03/2007 13:44
good call
(# 38) on 06/03/2007 14:13
(# 39) on 06/03/2007 14:18
From what I've spoke to Aktrez about GGN its the girl gaming is mearly a marketing campaign to get new gamers in and its targeted at females. It's not a clan/league. It's to get NEW females into gaming.
(# 40) on 06/03/2007 14:43
(# 41) on 06/03/2007 14:52
(# 42) on 06/03/2007 15:00
I do understand where you are coming from, but as a part of GGN i have to disagree with your interpretation of the site. Growing up, i only ever really had guy friends, because none of the girls i hung out with had the same hobbies as myself.
While i love guys, every once in a while it would be awsome to hang out with another girl online or in person. It would kick ass if my girlfriends and I would go out to lunch and talk about all the new stuff going on in the industry like i do with my guy friends. I would love to get more girls in to gaming, lots of people like to share their passions with other people, and this is no different. Aktrez, myself, and all the other people working on GGN want to share our passion and help more people enjoy it.
For some reason, most of the non-gaming females i know are intimidated my the gaming crowd. I have a regualar game night and its hard to get them to pick up anything besides mario party. And finally, yes, guys and girls can be dicks, and while i manage to blow it off the majority of the time, it is anoying when i get kicked out of a round of gears because someone finds out i am married, or constantly being ragged on for sucking at a new game (and having it be blamed on being a girl) and it gets old being told that there is no way that I can possible be a girl when i do well...I have a thick skin, so it does not bother me more than a moment, but it exists out there, there is no denying it...
So, if i can get more girls in to gaming, and provide a less intimidating entry point in to the culture through the GGN, i dont think there is anything wrong with it. And GGN will not be exclusive to girls, guys can join as well...
Thats my two cents, i guess i just wanted to let you know that we are not trying to seperate ourselves, like i said, for the most part, my friends are guys, and i would never give that up!
(# 43) on 06/03/2007 15:07
I have a friend that was a closet gamer when i met her a couple of years ago when we were still in high school. In her case she would hide that she played games because the people she hanged out with considered it a geek, and thus a lame, thing.
Now she's not bad looking, but she's the type that looked up to britney spears and cristina aguilera, the type of girl who would like to be "fergulicious" in appearance. She's not all casual either (she likes RTSs), so even tough i agree that there shouldn't be so much emphasis on the girl part of "girl gamers", i can see things like that bringing girls like my friend into gaming, or at least give it an opportunity.
Also, this reminded me of Futurama, the episode where Leela plays blernsball and at the end she becomes an inspiration making all other female players try to be better to prove that not all girls suck at the sport.
(# 44) on 06/03/2007 15:28
@ electro
You could have used your same example about how ridiculous 'male gamer clans' would be with 'black gamer clans'. Everyone at dtoid who knows you also knows you're black, and sure there's some jokes thrown around (at least half by you), but I don't anyone would think of or call you a 'black gamer'. that would be absolutely fucking ridiculous.
I think the same thing applies here.
(# 45) on 06/03/2007 16:12
(# 46) on 06/03/2007 18:52
:D
Nice post, nice discussion. (Read most of it, but not all :P)
And all those guy friends you have? Yea, they wanna bang you.
But I definitely have respect for the gals that stay, you have to put up with a lot of shit(like mine) and yet you stick it out. It shows you really are a real gamer. Real gamer girls are able to deal with the reality of the male libido.
That said, WTF is wrong with girls that get nekkid and rub themselves down with snes controllers? If that's wrong, I don't wanna be right.
On the flip, if you want pics of me jackin it with an Xbox, just ask.
(# 47) on 06/03/2007 19:07
Yes I do can you email them to me ASAP thank you xoxo
(# 48) on 06/03/2007 19:13
I'm not lying either, though it might take me a few days(I need to reclaim my camera from family).
I don't wanna see no cops on my door!
(# 49) on 06/03/2007 19:30
srsly, I think people make a huge deal out of nothing, I mean does it really matter whether you got a shlong
(# 50) on 06/03/2007 20:35
I've got to say thanks for actually thinking these things through and seeing what the point of many of those gaming girl groups are.(They say: we are girls in gaming, lets get accepting by forming together and bringing strength in numbers! They do: all the girls go into the groups that have no males and are further segregated.) Quite frankly, its hard to find people that actually think to this depth when they are contemplating an action(in this example, to join or not to join those girl gamer leagues). And, (sexist comment on the way) as hard as it is to find males that think this way, its 2 or 3 times as hard to find females that do.
In conclusion, the main point of my often meandering reply(with its overuse of parenthetical statements) is thank you for using your brain.
And btw, you always blame people for what they do, despite what demand or need society puts on them. It may be viewed as me just putting the blame on the women since I'm a guy, but I just feel people are always accountable for their actions, despite outside influence.
(# 51) on 06/03/2007 20:51
I think that I may have a different paradigm then you all do for giving credit. Basically, if you play games and kick ass, you get respect. Gender doesn't really matter (although it does seem to me that a lot of the "girl gamers" that I've run into in the past really didn't play that well; possibly girlfriends paying back boyfriends who went Salsa dancing?). That's what is great about people like Athy over here; being CH1X0RZ doesn't mean anything, other than having a different scale for measuring shoe sizes. Gaming ability is not governed by gender, only time and effort put into the games. I'm pretty good at Halo, R6:V, GoW, and a myriad of other games, both console and computer. I know a lot of women -as in over 18- who play games competitively over a broad spectrum of games. I think that the Female Gamer stereotype is something that we as a community need to stomp out, both the ladies and the gents.
And as for the Token Hot Female Gamer thing; we live in a society that rewards such behaviour. Solution? Start a colony in the middle of nowhere, and lay down some strick fuckin' rules. AMIRITE? You'll always see people who get to the top by other means, and it's something that everyone will have to live with. The fact of the matter is the gamer culture is still predominately Male-Driven, with Games like Dead or Alive that sport some interestingly dis-proportionate ...errr...qualities. Basically, it's just something we'll have to life with.
But see, to fix the problem, we need a major effort on the part of all gamers. Unfortuneatly, many of which are the kinds of people who buy the newest version of Madden to stay cool, and are highly resistant to all forms or common sense.
So to sum it up, if you want into the industry, kick the hell out of the pretty chick who plays CS in some GoW. Seriously, whats with people's fascination with playing games almost 10 years old competitively?
Also,.......cocks?
(# 52) on 06/03/2007 21:20
My views have changed a LOT throughout my time in gaming.
What it boils down to is this: If you got it, flaunt it. If you don't, find something you are good at and own it. If it's not hurting you, don't worry about it. If you are offended, look the other way. Above all... sex sells.
It's assinine to think that we, as a gaming culture, are in some sort of bubble ESPECIALLY due to the fact that this is still a male dominated market. Is it right? That's your choice to decide but it is what it is.
Now, I will say that cow towing IN game to girls who claim they are gamers is bull shit. Giving women more money or prizing because they have boobs is stupid. IF you are in a game... earn your titles.
If you are in the media... then work it! I mean, come on! It's the entertainment industry folks... sex/power speaks wonders. Call a spade a spade and respect others for what it is they are doing. Models are models. Gamers are gamers. Models can be gamers just as gamers can be models. Everyone is just trying to do their thing.
(# 53) on 06/03/2007 22:09
(# 54) on 06/03/2007 22:28
What is the difference? You're coming across like a jackass. Even more than I am, and that says something. You need a PHD nowadays to make a commentary about games? WTF does anyones background affect the statement they make?
Nice job jackass. Jackass.
(# 55) on 06/03/2007 22:35
(# 56) on 06/03/2007 22:38
welcome to the exclusive club for people with community blogs that got on the front page.
(# 57) on 06/03/2007 22:38
Again?
(# 58) on 06/03/2007 22:44
(# 59) on 06/03/2007 22:58
This might be why all the ladies dont think your single!!!! lol
(# 60) on 06/03/2007 23:20
Pretty girls who like to throw pictures of themselves around on the internet are hardly the problem. Hey, I'm totally with you on the whole 'showing your body off on the internet for attention is dumb' thing, but this is hardly some phenomenon unique to gaming; look at half the MySpace and Facebook pages out there. There is always going to be some overlap of women who like the attention with nearly ANY hobby.
You're asking for respect when there is none to be found. What these girls are doing is little different then the women who appear on Maxim, or go on "The Bachelor." There's a MUCH deeper issue with what they are doing (and I'm not saying that issue is good or bad) that trumps video games here.
Perfect example, take your Anna Kournikova's in tennis. There is some attention granted to them because they are attractive women willing to pose in magazines. Are women in tennis being held back because of women like her? No. Not really. Good looks don't make you a good athlete.
There was some point in the history of tennis where guys stopped saying 'aww, look at those women! I bet they don't know it's called a racket!" and started taking them seriously.
I fully agree that right now, women AREN'T taken seriously when it comes to video games. The thing is that the women who I guess, casually game, and flaunt some T&A for attention aren't holding your average woman gamer back. It will probably take some combination of a cultural shift plus more recognition from developers, but my point is that ten, twenty, umpteen years from now, women will be taken seriously in video games, and the barely legal women who wish to have a small male cult following will still exist.
- Eddie
(# 61) on 06/03/2007 23:24
I try not to pass judgement on other people not out of some religious theory, but because I care about their image about as much as I care what they think of me: Very little (notice, I didn't say I don't, we all do)
Chobot licks a PSP, Summa overhypes some non-news, Workman has an "in" (and has a catch line). Everyone has to do something attention grabbing sooner or later, if they want to get attention. Once you get it are you able to deal with the negatives.
(# 62) on 06/03/2007 23:24
(# 63) on 06/03/2007 23:30
sorry, I just woke up from a coma, let me go back to it...
btw, wake me up when a girl actually wins first place on a game...
(# 64) on 06/03/2007 23:39
(# 65) on 06/03/2007 23:51
I admit I haven't read this yet cause I am tired and i don't know the subject but still. And no I am not a girl gamer hater.
That is just my thought on girl gamers...
(# 66) on 06/03/2007 23:59
(# 67) on 06/04/2007 00:01
No, but seriously, I agree 100%. Good post. I have nothing productive to add.
(# 68) on 06/04/2007 00:19
(# 69) on 06/04/2007 00:27
Yeah, being a girl gamer is hard. Being a girl in general is harder than being male. Life did deal you a set of shittier cards than males. I get it.
Life's tough. It will be tough when you wake up tomorrow as well. Playing games and realizing some whore is trying to sell herself by saying "I WUV GAMEZ" won't really change matters. The good looking people will still try to sell every aspect of themselves that they can sell (after all, it's a well sought commodity). The only problem here is that now gaming is becoming popular, that aspect of life is starting to seep in here as well.
The sun rises again. World's still a piece of shit in many ways. Today it is with the added pleasure of having yourself misrepresented by a bunch of attention whores. Tomorrow it'll be something else.
Buy a bullshit filter, is my recommendation. The rest you have to live with. I'm not all that crazy about being misrepresented by the guy yelling "OMG GURL GAJMER!" but since we're both males, I'm as strong as my weakest link, which is him. All I can do, is when the time comes, is not say: "OMIGOSH BOOBZ!".
A feat that won't be hard to accomplish, luckily. Till then all I'll be doing is playing games with my mouth shut, not taking naked pictures of myself with a controller stuck up my ass.
(# 70) on 06/04/2007 00:28
Also, awesome read. Agreed.
(# 71) on 06/04/2007 00:57
It's the same with any marketing system for any product or service since man stepped down from the tree and went "OMG BOOBZ". We will always have these Hot Chick Clans because they guarantee more money to the companies. The most you can do is ignore them and not buy their products.
(# 72) on 06/04/2007 01:04
Being [enter you race, religion, color, creed, nationality, sexual orientation, etc.] is harder than being a white protestant male, unless you are a white protestant male in the middle east, a catholic area, a communist country, asia, africa, professional sports, the music industry, a free medical clinic, etc... or if you are a white protestant male who is disabled or fat.
Generally, life is hard for everybody, one way or another. If the biggest complaint we can have is about sexual exploitation in the videogame industry than we have pretty good lives.
BTW, there is a inequality in the work place. However, looks (i.e. physical appearance) affects promotions and pay raises at much for men as it does women. Go figure.
(# 73) on 06/04/2007 01:06
(# 74) on 06/04/2007 01:17