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Veni, vidi, vici.

Name: Francisco *AKA* Y0j1mb0

Age: 38. I'm the residential Old Geezer of Destructoid & You Tube Superstar.



Likes: Poker, Roast Beef Sandwiches, unsolicited sex, video games of all genres.

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Mega Man 9 Whiners Need to Shut Up!!... O'RLY?? A COUNTERPOINT.
Y0j1mb0 | 4:34 PM on 10.01.2008 68 comments




So Mega Man 9 is out and for all intents and purposes it seems that the majority of the community is in a state of retro euphoria. So much so that we have the usual love fest as is evidenced by the mass amounts of Mega Man 9 blogs: Look what woke me up at the wee hours of the morning?, This sums it up about Mega Man... so true, and my favorite that has made this post possible: Mega Man 9 Whiners Need to Shut Up. Now I wasn't going to give my impressions of this game because I tire of being labeled a flamebaiter just for offering my honest opinion but that last blog with the eloquent title just begged and pleaded inside my mind to offer a response.

And thus I begin. Mega Man 9 is not what I expected. I honestly thought it was going to be a ROM hack. What the powers that be instead created is a loving tribute to retro fans everywhere. It's beautiful in it's totality as a slice of 8 bit glory in our era. From the beautiful music to the graphics, all that is carried over to every facet of the game. Remarkable. But all is not well in the land of Mega Man 9. Quite simply this game is for masochists. Gamers who love old school games and invest time in the memorization of the game in order to move five feet within it. If you're a retro fan this is your heaven. Trumpets will announce your coming and gaming angels will kiss your feet while playing it. If you're like me, a regular joe who loves games but doesn't particularly like to work but instead play games, screeching nails on chalkboard will announce your arrival and gaming demons will tempt you to throw your controller on the wall.

I'm not going to sugar coat this like others who wrote this game is hard but can appreciate it raping them, haha. Fuck that. This game is an exercise in frustration. It will break you common gamers, hell hardcore gamers too, but unlike others here I just don't care to be kicked in the nuts and smile about it. This game is all about memorization and CHEAP deaths. That's it. I could stop right there because at its distilled essence that's what it is folks.


Here you go Penny Arcade. Fixed.

Now let me address this gentlemen's points on his Mega Man 9 Whiners blog..

Megaman 9 isn't even that tough. It's really scary that any game that is moderately challenging these days is "controversial". It's just plain absurd. If you are too chicken to play something that doesn't treat you like a little baby and requires a bit of effort and skill, then don't buy it. It's that simple.

Because he thinks it's not tough it must be so... CONFIRMED. Why I'm quite sure with his massive retro cock he didn't even need a controller to play the game. By wiggling his nuts he blazed through it with not a life lost.

Don't ruin it for the rest of us who have been waiting for this day to come for so long. Don't flip out at Capcom until they decide to never release a challenging game again. For the love of all that's gaming, REJOICE that SOMEWHERE, SOMEONE at these companies still cares about true hardcore gamers.

From my observation there really hasn't been any negative views of MM9. The majority positive. As for companies caring about hardcore gamers? Companies care about money. Protip: people who proclaim themselves to be hardcore gamers usually aren't.

I got out of gaming as the difficulty levels descended to something your 120 year old grandma can beat on the first try. Games like Megaman 9 offer that tiny sliver of hope for well-hewn gamers like me... they give us something to care about again, a challenge, something to feel good about conquering.

I love difficult even brutal games. I hate cheap games. I hate having to memorize a stage and its pattern in order to progress further. I'll chalk that up to genres of games you like and leave it at that. If this is your bag, more power to ya.

It's not just the 8-bit-style of Megaman 9. It's about precision control and reflexes. When you die it's your fault. 92% of modern games are sloppy affairs lacking this kind of precision and 1:1 ratio of player interaction. Instead they are 80+ hours of repetitive fetch quests and cutscenes. Forget it. I just want to PLAY games, not act like a wimpy vegetable being force fed lazy filler. Give me tight level design over 20 hours of rendered CG cutscenes any day.

Control and precision huh? Where is that when you're forced into taking leaps of faith into an abyss that at the end of it there are spikes? That's right, those "reflexes" are for you to hit the restart button to play it again after you died and learned the "precision" of the game. Playing an area, an AREA!, over and over and over and over and over again to get to the next area and do the same is beyond bizzaro. This is retarded to me. Always has been about older games.

One last thing: If you can't beat Megaman 9, take up a hobby more your pace, like stamp collecting, or perhaps bird watching.

Because I can't beat Mega Man 9 I'm not a gamer? Really?? I better start collecting stamp because your litmus step of being a gamer I just flunked.

To reiterate, I think that Mega Man 9 to the retro rabid and those select few that have that special wiring of loving trial and error games will salivate and drool about this game. The rest of us will think it's a great look back at what certain games of yesteryear were: frustrating, cheap and just not fun.



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64 comments | showing # 1 to 50
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shipero's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 16:45
shipero
This game really takes me back to my childhood. I didn't like Mega Man when I was a kid either.
Dan CiTi's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 16:51
Dan CiTi
Mega Man 9 is a ROM hack. It doesn't mean a ROM hack can't be good. I still bought it. I can still agree with this though. I wished Mega Man 9 was more like Bionic Commando: Rearmed, to be honest.
A New Challenger's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 16:52
A New Challenger
The only real leap of faith cheap death I remember is in Splash Woman's stage.

This game will kick your ass in the very beginning, every step of the way. After you've beaten it once, though, it suddenly becomes a lot easier as you've undoubtedly memorized the levels.

It also helps tremendously if you've played through the other Mega Man games, naturally.
Senisan's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 16:55
Senisan
you know, mifune's character was a bit of a flamebaiter too in Yojimbo...great movie btw.
Naim Master's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:00
Naim Master
Yojimbo, first you lose to ya kid in Samurai Showdown II , then you left warhawk out of PS3 friday nights, NOW YA F* CALLING MEGAMANs CHEAP !!!
I ..i....i....
If ya didnt had a beard i would hate your soul right now ...
The Incredible Edible Egg's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:04
The Incredible Edible Egg
I think its hard, but I wouldn't have Mega Man any other way.
MaxVest's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:08
MaxVest
Yeah, I never liked Mega Man either. Virtually every other major franchise that got its start on the NES got so much better faster. Mega Man 2 was cool, but it wasn't fun. And neither was Ninja Gaiden.

I dunno, I'm going to spend maybe an hour or two, tops, with a game, and I don't want to spend it doing the same thing over and over. I might as well be working / getting paid.
Tubatic's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:09
Tubatic
I agree more with Ashley Davis than you sir.
Qraze's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:09
Qraze
it's the first of the month, haven;t played it yet, been finally playing bionic commando and can't find the yellow card. i think i beat about 7 or 8 levels and am stumped.
i also been playing a shitton of old or "retro" games, i may like this game but i never really liked megaman games to begin with. i was a mario, zelda, excite bike with a splash of californa games kid growing up, i call myself hardcore but its my love of games that's hardcore, not difficulty levels and cheap deaths buts thats how i see all those old games as but i still enjoy them. i tell you what, i just beat the first(trpg) and second(side scrolling) front mission and went straight back into assasins creed and i was blown away by how much has changed but is still almost the same. this blog has been #1_in_the_hood_G!!
Y0j1mb0's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:10
Y0j1mb0
Naim Master:

There's no need to bring back the painful memory of my son beating me SSII.
Krow's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:12
Krow
"it suddenly becomes a lot easier as you've undoubtedly memorized the levels."

I think the point is, we shouldn't have to memorize whole levels to enjoy a game. Not that I didn't purchase, play, and enjoy Mega Man 9 that is.
Tubatic's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:17
Tubatic
"I think the point is, we shouldn't have to memorize whole levels to enjoy a game. "

For me, that depends on the game. If I can barrel through a God of War or Force Unleashed, I'll say I've had a real good time, because these dudes are supposed to be bad ass.. If I don't have to repeat levels in Mirror's Edge, a platforming, cool move, precision sort of game, I think I'll be a little disappointed.
nicojay's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:18
nicojay
So first you lump yourself in with the whiners who need to shut up and then you procced to....
MaxVest's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:19
MaxVest
@Y0j1mb0: You sidebar reflects the age of a younger man... time for the annual elder update.
Kryptinite's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:22
Kryptinite
I'm actually working on a similar post :)
king3vbo's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:22
king3vbo
I suck at Megaman games, and I'm loving it. How does that work?

Also, DO WANT
Naim Master's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:25
Naim Master
Y0j1mb0 :

so i will only say ONE more and i'll be done, mybe along with your reflexes and half a split second timing that you lost with aging ya lost the level memorization abilities too? O.o * mystery tune plays out *
Naim Master's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:27
Naim Master
Oh and YAY yojimbo just answered one comment of mine , i think i just turned into a full fledged man now ...
Holyetheline's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:28
Holyetheline
You're getting too old for games. Your memory is not serving you properly anymore. Did you ever play Contra or Contra 3? Lots of memorization but very rewarding.
Y0j1mb0's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:36
Y0j1mb0
Lol @ Maxvest.

I thought I could get away with that.
TheDreadHawk's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:40
TheDreadHawk
Naim Master... I totally hate you.

Anyway, I do agree with what you're saying j1mb0. I loved the Mega Man games and they were fun when I had all the time in the world to play them, now not so much. I haven't picked MM9 up yet, though.
Conrad Zimmerman's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:45
Conrad Zimmerman
Am I the only person who doesn't think this game is as hard as everyone is making it out to be? It's challenging, sure, but I've certainly played much more difficult games. I'd even venture to say that it's easier than the "Difficult" setting for Mega Man 2.

As for the memorization aspect, that's just the style of play. If you don't like Mega Man, that's one thing (I think you're crazy, but you're welcome to the opinion) and you aren't going to like any of them less or more than this. But to say that it's been engineered to defeat the player indicates a lack of patience and skill at it. That doesn't make the game bad, it just makes you bad at the game.
Naim Master's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:47
Naim Master
TheDreadHawk :

So do I ya communist ( your c-blog banner proves it) ... XD
Naim Master's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:50
Naim Master
TheDreadHawk :

But ya do like HL2 , and i like it too, BUT my hate for comunists is bigger than my love for HL ...

Conrad :

So do i, people seen to forget how it was to play Old games ...
Tubatic's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:50
Tubatic
I also like the song that Conrad sings.
Technophile's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:54
Technophile
I really think this is a matter of taste. Von Richter makes a good point that games have gotten easier, but if it's a good game it's a good game. I don't care if it easy, hard or rapes my grandma.

Y0J1mb0 also makes the very valid point that games are supposed to be fun and not frustrating and for alot of people Mega Man games (all of them) can be brutally hard.
It's not fun for some people and that's perfectly fine.

Some people like the sense of accomplishment of doing something over and over until they get it right, like getting through mega man and that's perfectly fine too.

It's a matter of taste and doesn't have anything to do with being a "real" gamer and Y0J1MB0 is right to take offense to that.
Brando's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:57
Brando
I think the problem is that a lot of newcomers never played through all the other MM games and think that level memorization is a must. Just to reiterate, this is the NINTH game in the series and is not designed for newcomers. If you played through the older games then you'll have a much better idea of how to deal with obstacles and enemies and experience much much less "cheap deaths". This game is a fan service, if you never liked/played MM before, your opinion doesn't really matter because the game was not made for people like you. For hardcore MM peeps, don't complain about the whiners because it's obvious that they don't "get it" and move on.
mix's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 17:59
mix
I thought the greatest leap of faith was on Tornado Mans stage, that block in the could FUCKED with me for like 5 minutes and I swear my heart rate was red lining.

"k that jump looks to far, maybe if I edge all the way out...no still looks to far. I wonder if there is a block right below me, it would make this jump so easy...they probably put that damn cloud there to mess with me hoping I'll hop down and fall to my death. mwa hwa hwa"

8 minutes later

"Wait dammit that jump still looks to far...I guess I'm going to jump down into the cloud.....HELL YES!!!!

It took me (no lie) an HOUR and a HALF before I beat a single boss (Jewel man) then I beat 2 right after him in about 1 hour again..then all the others right after.

I really liked the fact that I nearly shit my pants when I killed Jewel man, no other game has brought me that much satisfaction.
Y0j1mb0's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 18:07
Y0j1mb0
Conrad:

As I stated in the post, memorization in games isn't my thing. I don't knock the game for those that like that, I just think that to the everyday gamer this game is ridiculously difficult.

You LOVE retro games like Mega Man, hence why you don't think it's difficult. But whatever your opinion, my opinion and how I feel when playing it is that the game is aggravating and headache inducing.

As for the lack of patience to build my skill level is concerned, no thanks. Too much work. I want to have a pleasurable experience, not a frustrating one. After the 20th Game Over screen, that's when my patience punched the clock for the day.

I'll take a retro game like Super Mario World any day over Maga Man. With SMB you pass levels with platforming skills, not inflated death counts due to a lack of memorization.
Ashley Davis's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 18:16
Ashley Davis
I disagree with you, but that guy's post reeked of elitism and I want to shake your hand for calling him out on that.
Corak's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 18:17
Corak
I was never that big of a Mega Man fan back in the day. I played it at a friends house when I was younger but never had any fond memories of it from what I remember. I thought about getting it but then I looked in my fridge and there was no beer, so a 12 pack later I decided to pass.
-PL-'s Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 18:17
-PL-
Every Mega Man game has been like this... I'm glad they kept it hard.
Naim Master's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 18:21
Naim Master
Y0j1mb0 :

Buuuut aren't ya a 2D fighting games fan? i mean aren't they all about special moves memorization? * insert painfull memorie joke here (you know what memorie ;) ) ...
But it's ok if ya dont like it , just dont call it shit cause there are lots of old school MM fans out there ...
OHHH and ya want a HARD ' HARDCORE MM experience witouth the level memorization? Play MM ZX and MM ZX advent , it's hard as hell , but with no level memorization , just extremely overpowered bosses .....
Conrad Zimmerman's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 18:30
Conrad Zimmerman
I don't think you have to memorize the levels in order to get through them. You merely have to exhibit a certain amount of caution.

Take the pits in Concrete Man's stage, for example, where a robot pops up when you get close enough, probably hitting you and knocking you to your doom. The first time that happens, you should immediately be aware that any pit in this game could have a dude lying in wait to kill you. It isn't as though they wait until you're above them to strike. So, you approach them to see if something comes up, shoot it when it does, and move on.

There's no situation in this game that can't be approached from a logical, planning perspective and be successful for the player. If you feel as though you're suffering "cheap" deaths, maybe you need to slow down and evaluate things.
konchu's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 18:36
konchu
People are going to have different opinions so people trying to force the game on anyone is pointless.

Really Mega Man comes from a day when we didn't have online and to me it seemed most people played games longer. And those games were generally harder for various reasons. But there was a personal reward for overcoming the hard parts and mastering a game like this. I personally got to the point on Sonic the Hedgehog I would reset the game if I died once and to me it became a game of skill and the drive was to master it moving as quickly,flawlessly and how far I could. So as a game of nostalgia I think Mega does a great job.

Seems though that game focus has changed and not necessarily for the worse. More games are about the story and presentation and controls have been honed to a point that much of the frustrating elements are removed from them. We get our longevity now out of Multiplayer modes etc now. There are still the hard games like Ninja Gaiden 2 that are being made so I think there is room for everyone to enjoy themselves. Personally sometimes I just want to relax and enjoy the game and see whats next but I still want to be challenged. So balancing this is really a challange for todays gamer.
mix's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 18:41
mix
*cloud

I fail at type.
ShadokatRegn's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 18:43
ShadokatRegn
I prefer Mega-Man in the form of Dead Rising's main character dressed up. It's pretty much hilarious.

Or, Megaman Soccer ROM - which is the shit!
Dan CiTi's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 19:09
Dan CiTi
Game sucks, let's move onto good capcom games like Megaman Zero, Okami, Dead Rising, Viewtiful Joe and Puzzle Fighter.


Also Galaxy Man is the coolest guy in the world.
Gen Eric Gui's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 19:47
Gen Eric Gui
Conrad is my hero.
KamikazeTutor's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 20:19
KamikazeTutor
Y0j1mb0 is somewhat right, old games were mostly about memorization.

I remember that perfectly, as I owned few games and playing them over and over again would burn every single movement into my brain.

Megaman is no exception, it's actually the worst of the bunch, as it forces you to restart the level too many times for a single minuscule error.
Reeper's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 20:21
Reeper
Fuck Mega Man 9.

[size=.1]I haven't played it. I really wouldn't know.[/size]
Reeper's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 20:21
Reeper
OH FUCK BBCODE.
Lurfadur's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 20:24
Lurfadur
I completely agree.
I can remember when I was younger and playing these frustrating games on the NES and even certain ones on the Sega Genesis. After renting a game that was too hard for my fragile little mind, I would complain to my mother about the difficulty and unfair points of the game to which she would reply:

"They make you die a lot so you have to keep putting in quarters to play"

Gee, thanks mom! That does me a whole lot of good when I'm at home playing it on a console. She hasn't played a game since Centipede with a trackball at the arcade and I think that the arcades are where these games truly shine and belong at.
SilverDragon1979's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 20:31
SilverDragon1979
@Yojimbo: I go away on vacation for a week and come back and here you are getting the locals all riled up.
BluDesign's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 20:37
BluDesign
I'm with Conrad on this one. It's rote memorization. That's it. What's the problem? You either do or don't. If you don't, don't play this game. Go play Gears or Burnout. No one forced you into buying it.

Maybe I'm a masochist, but this game to me, isn't any less easy than playing through the original. I beat the original, 2, and 3. STFU whiners. If you don't like it, don't buy it. It's a hard game.
Jonathan Holmes's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 20:48
Jonathan Holmes
I don't Yojimbo, I didn't think MM9 took any more memorization than any other game that has boss battles.

A good videogame boss will kill you the first time, and every time you fight it, until you learn it's pattern and devise a strategy around it. That's what Mega Man 9 is like, except not just during the boss battles. It's like that from beginning to end.

In that way, I guess MM9 is more like Shadow of the Colossus than anything else. And I looove SotC.

But I hear your point. It's stupid to imply that if you don't like MM9, then you're not a fan of videogames.
pendelton21's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 20:49
pendelton21
IMO, I, like you, died a shitload of times. I also saw that GAME OVER screen a few too many times for comfort. But, with that said, I think this is one of the most fun games I've played in a while. Sure, it's tough as balls (at points, not consistently), but I love it when I overcome a challenge and get one of the little crowns or an Achievement pops up on screen. It's not nearly as frustrating as you make it out to be, but, the frustration is part of my fun, at least. Overcoming that which you've been frustrated with makes me cackle with delight as if I've just taken that jump or enemy that's pissed me off and dick-slapped him a few times.
ZeroTolo's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 21:32
ZeroTolo
Is it really that hard to remember something like "Oh there's a guy coming up here" or "I just have to use that ladder and shoot the elephant from there"? Seriously. I think people are blowing the difficulty of memorization way out of proportion. Let's use an example based in something that Yoj1mbo loves: fighters.

The very first time people picked up a controller, or dropped a quarter in the slot of Street Fighter II, did they all automatically know how to pull off Zangeif's Spinning Piledriver? or (for those not familiar with the series) Ken and Ryu's Hurricane Kick? No. Unless they'd been familiar with the first game in the series, most people probably had no idea that the special moves even existed.

I'll admit that the points 'j1mbo focused on are a little self-aggrandizing, and while I'm not a fan of people claiming to be better than others, I do think that there's a lot of complaints going around that probably should have been more well thought out. So before we go around claiming that people should be able to know everything about a game after ten minutes of playing, let's take into account that there's a learning curve for everything, and that some just don't pick up on it as quickly as others.

And for the people complaining that the game is just too hard period, I direct you to the reason why they release trial versions (regardless of length) of games. No one is forcing anyone to buy a game that they don't like. It's not anyone else's fault.
Bob Muir's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 21:36
Bob Muir
Has Old Man Yojimbo gotten soft in his old age? :P
Y0j1mb0's Avatar - Comment posted on 10/01/2008 21:53
Y0j1mb0
ZeroTolo:

I hear what you're saying but the Street Fighter analogy to work right here would have to go like this:

I don't know any special fighting moves, as I start the round, out of nowhere Akuma appears before me and throws a fireball. GAME OVER.

Dramatic and an exaggeration? Perhaps... but that's what it's like. As for buying the game, I love games and trying them out. Although to set the record straight I didn't buy it, it was shared by a certain Moose Dtoider through PSN so I didn't pay for it.

And again, I didn't say the game is bad, I just said it's not for everyone.
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