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Oh, hi there. Didn’t see you enter. Anyways, welcome to my humble little blog. For those of you not familiar with who I am, the name’s Brian. I’m 24 years old and hail from Findlay, Ohio. I work at the local newspaper here as a copy editor, putting my four long years of college to actual use. Kind of. I think.

For those of you who might recognize me from elsewhere, I work as Assistant Gaming Editor over at Blogcritics Gaming and as Features Editor over at Tomopop. It's a lot of work, but it's worth it because I get to do a lot of cool shit with a lot of cool people.

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Thoughts on a future Demoman TF2 update
Brian Szabelski | 10:30 PM on 01.13.2009 12 comments




What makes me at least a halfway-decent Demoman?

Because it's really, really hard to be a good one.

Seriously, most of the time, people just use those damn sticky pipe bombs and that's it. And those people are the ones who really give the Demoman a bad name, since a lot of them would be torn to shreds if they couldn't use that weapon. I've somehow gotten to the point where after nearly 9 hours of Demoman time in TF2, I've mastered the grenade launcher and can pretty much use it like any other weapon in the game, but it's still not easy or very precise. Those 9 hours have also given me plenty of time to look critically at the Demoman and try to figure out how Valve can make him better when they eventually decide to update the black Scottish cyclops. That is, without breaking him and drawing the complaints of a bunch of gamers who can't deal with getting blown to bits by a hidden nest of stickies. Sissies.

So I sat down and came up with a few ideas before refining them down to three things that Valve should include in a future Demoman update:

1.) A short-range weapon. Preferrably, something shotgun-esqe. Make it the secondary weapon in place of sticky bombs to help balance out the Demoman. As it stands right now, a Demoman has no defense against a Pyro, Scout or Spy. His grenade launcher doesn't have the close-range capabilities to take them out, his sticky bombs sometimes work and sometimes don't work quick enough, and the liquor bottle doesn't stand a chance against a knife stab or the red-hot tip of a flamethrower. A short-range weapon would give the Demoman a little bit more on the personal defense side because, let's face it - I'm tired of getting taunted by Scouts after they jump over my short-range grenades and crit bonk me.

2.) An improved grenade launcher, perhaps one with a lowered crit rate, but with better defensive stats. The Demoman is supposed to be a defensive-minded member of the team, but really, I end up playing Demoman on two types of maps most of all: payload maps for the defense, and on capture point and CTF maps, but more for the offensive aspects of the Demoman against Engies and Heavies defending points. The grenade launcher as is remains practically useless for defense, forcing most defensive Demomen to resort to spamming the sticky grenade on points to try and stop enemy advances. And that only works if you're somewhere they can't maul you to death at via Heavy machine gun, Pyro flamethrower or a nice cloaked Spy backstab. Maybe something like Natascha, where getting hit with one of these new grenades knocks you back, might be more helpful to defensive-minded Demomen than a sticky spamfest.

3.) The liquor bottle melee weapon is removed entirely for a third, yet related explosive device - the Molotov cocktail. Only three of these can be held at any time and they do not regenerate when you pick up ammo, to keep people from spamming a capture point or spawn point with these. No crits, but they deal fire damage in a huge radius. This would make a good exchange for the sticky bombs, which are already used primarily for things like protecting capture points or catching people off-guard. And since the Pyro has had his update, he can't very well use them. Plus, they can be used to create chaos, and I love creating chaos.

But hey, that's just me. Any ideas out there from the Dtoid community?



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10 comments | showing # 1 to 10
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TrickyNicky's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/13/2009 23:56
TrickyNicky
I think Demo's are fine and should be the last to get updated. Of course, I play in 32 player servers, so I'm kind of used to having at least 3 demos per side.
EnoSachran's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/14/2009 00:49
EnoSachran
You know, I like the idea of taking away the melee weapon and adding molotov cocktails. But you know what I REALLY want to see VALVe do with the Demoman? If you look in a slew of the trailers, you can see him lobbing a load of dynamite into an area, which does one large explosion, then a few of the sticks that splintered off and caused smaller explosions. I would love to see THAT implemented instead.
ajaxender's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/14/2009 01:02
ajaxender
I think your ideas have merit and could be considered, but your intro... dude, 9 hours is not enough time to tell how hard it is to be a really good demo. Im at 34 hours, and I consider myself pretty noob at it (although im still effective enough with it, which is one of my gripes with the class. And if youre wondering, 34 hours is not a lot for me; my sniper is at 215)

Tbh, the demo doesnt need anything to make him 'better', as such, which is why i like your idea for replacing the stickies, rather than just changing them. A shotgun wouldnt really fit, but something close range and more suited to attacking scouts and the like would be interesting. Similar for your pipe bomb idea, something more defensive would suit the role the demo 'apparently' is supposed to have; but considering what a powerhouse he is currently, im really not sure what role Valve intend him to play. And the 'competitive' TF2 mod (created to cut some of the bs out) already tones the pipe bomb damage down, so I think thisll happen soon anyway.

The molotovs are interesting, but I very much think that a melee weapon is necessary (as a last resort) and replacing it wouldnt be an option for most players. Perhaps moly's as a replacement for pipes or stickies? Could be worth checking out.
Shoop's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/14/2009 01:55
Shoop
I think Demo should get a proximity mine replacement for stickies (and only be able to place half as many).
Alasdair Duncan's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/14/2009 02:04
Alasdair Duncan
These are good ideas. I'd like to see something that would more effective over aa wide range or against somethings like sentry guns, which are always a pain in the arse.
CWal37's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/14/2009 02:10
CWal37
A lot of people actually get annoyed at how well demos control points. Demomen have been nerfed at least twice that I can think of off the top of my head, but I still play with them the most these days because I generally have the highest points per death that way. In fact, out of the top 5 players on my favorite servers, 4 use demoman far more than anything, so it's not just me.

Pyros don't give me trouble because I can normally get them with pipes or stickies before they get me. Because of the way spies are played they're not really an issue, and scouts can be annoying, but not too large of a threat. What demos really have difficulty dealing with are things like snipers. It's not as big of a deal on a map like 2fort where you're so close, but on other, like Badwater Basin (my favorite map) it can get quite aggravating.

I've played 92.9 hours of demoman so far, so I like to think I have an idea about them. For about half the time I've had TF2 I haven't been able to play due to computer and internet issues, otherwise that number would be much higher.
Eschatos's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/14/2009 05:35
Eschatos
Screw Demo. Update engi already.
Velt's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/14/2009 08:22
Velt
I sort of agree with everything you guys are saying, the Demo is probably my mostly played character by somethimes I feel I cant do the job of ofense: taking care of sentry with a pyro coming or a spy.
Mastering the weapon is hard, but never underestimate the power of undirect damage.
Darren Nakamura's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/14/2009 13:19
Darren Nakamura
My idea is to just never play as the Demoman, because I suck as him.
Wedge's Avatar - Comment posted on 01/14/2009 17:56
Wedge
Demo is generally the most overpowered class in the game, it just takes a fairly high level of skill to get there. They need to work on nerfing the obscene offensive capabilities of their stickies, especially mid-air detonations, and maybe a lower clip size.

Though I do think you're somewhat right, in that it could be made easier for beginning players to use, and that is what they did with the (useless by my view) Heavy update. However the class in no way needs to be made stronger, as it's already the highest overall powered class in the game (12 shots of high powered explosives with no reload is nuts). You need to accept that classes are _supposed_ to have weaknesses, that's the point of a class based game. The Demo's weakness is intended to be close range combat, because they dominate at mid-range.

Also Pyro's are easy sauce, just run backwards and drop stickies at your feet and that will handle 90% of the retards.
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