more relevant stuff... I like online FPS games, I like to play online with other Dtoid members. I'm primarily a PS3 gamer but you can occasionally find me on Xbox (though I don't currently have gold, but expect to get it again around Christmas).
PSN: Elsa XBL: Elssa62 Playstation Gamer Advisory Panel Member (GAP)
Currently Playing: PS3:
Two Worlds 2
Uncharted 2 and 3
MAG (mostly Raven, though I have a SVER alt)
... and occasionally Warhawk, UT3, Resistance 2 co-op or Killzone 2!
Xbox:
Halo Reach.
Left 4 Dead 2
Divinity 2: Dragon Knight Saga
Recent Favorites:
WARHAWK!!
UT3
Portal 1&2
Sacred 2
Bioshock series
Oblivion
Fallout series
Dragon Age: Origins
Resistance series
Killzone 2
Left 4 Dead 2
Where are the "VIDYA GAME WOMENGS"? Well... they're not appearing in PS3 ads unless they are the "Insignificant other". I love the new Kevin Butler PS3 advertising campaign, but I'm disappointed with the most recent two ads. In the God of War advertisement, Sony has regressed to the old days of those "picking up chicks" dustballs or the Romeo and Juliet finger puppets, where Romeo is too busy playin' PSP games and he tells Juliet to go call someone else's name cause he's too busy gaming for that love stuff. All of those older Sony ads were pretty clear that "only boys play video games". With the newest Playstation Move ad I had hoped that Sony might indeed move into the "future", but again they showed a guy playing a boxing game and another guy playing a shooter game. Where are the vidya game womengs????
Sony doesn't seem to "get it". There are all kinds of studies and data that show that women are gaming in increasing numbers and that this is a HUGE untapped market. According to Nintendo there are about 11.7 MILLION female gamers in the Americas alone (almost one-third of the 33.3 million male players, and almost one-quarter of all gamers) and Nintendo is claiming to have 80% of these female gamers. (reference) , an NDP report shows an even higher percentage and claims that approximately 44 percent of current gen console users are female (Wii, 360, PS3). (reference) Another recent report showed that if you own a PSP and are male, you may well be a minority now... 52% of PSP owners are female. If you game on the PC and play casual games you're definitely a minority and if you play World of Warcraft, then there's only approximately a 61% chance that you're male (reference) ... and your percentage is dropping each year.
With the Playstation Move, Sony had the opportunity to attract a percentage of those women that own a PSP, own a Wii or play casual PC games... but no, instead they once again are advertising to a demographic they already have - 18-35 year old men. Geez, don't they get it? What most attracts 18-35 year old men.... are 18-35 year old women! They don't need to have advertising aimed specifically at women, but I would think that they could be smart enough not to create "exclusionary" advertising that implies that we don't game... that we are the pissed off "insignificant other" whose husband/boyfriend games, or at best we are the babysitting mom playing games with the kids and getting our face licked by a puppy. Why couldn't the boxer in the newest advertisement have been a female... in workout gear. That's an attractive image for both men and women.
Where are the videa game womengs?? We're there. We're growing in numbers. Even the Quantcast profile for Destructoid shows that 27% of the American visitors to this site are female, that's more than 1 in 4! (though I rather wonder about the accuracy and how those stats are arrived at).
I don't think that we women want everything in pink or to be catered to with advertising aimed specifically at our gender... I think we just want to feel that it's normal for us to game and to feel welcomed into the hobby of gaming. It is possible to create websites, advertising and games that appeal to both men and women. Oh, and as a total aside, I see that the Destructoid viewing options are now labeled as "chubby" or "quickie". To a woman (well, to me anyway) both of these seem to imply "short" (and dissatisfying). This seems yet another small but interesting look at how men's wordage might differ from women's, and that sometimes using less of a boy's club mentality might seem less exclusionary, and confusing, for women.
... and this entire rambling blog was brought to you by an ad that made me laugh. This ad makes fun of women but in a friendly, nice way. It satirizes what women are "supposed" to want, but laughs with us, not at us. After seeing this ad, I then saw the most recent PS3 "Insignificant other" ad, and the contrast got me thinking. Both ads are primarily aimed at men and make fun of women... but one ad was appealing, while the Sony ad just made me pissed off. Here's the ad that I thought did humor right:
What are your thoughts on advertising in the gaming industry? Do men find that Old Spice ad funny too? Is it possible for ads to attract women to gaming, while not alienating men?
I think the biggest problem is just the general gap between male and female interests. Of course, not all guys and girls follow the same path, but where Mr. might like guns, blood and explosions; Ms. might prefer the less violent sort. So it's kind of hard to market a game to both audiences, since that gap is the reason we have various game genres. I wouldn't expect a typical female to be genuinely interested in the newer Ninja Gaiden games, what with the excess of boobs and blood. Likewise, I don't expect a typical male to be interested in Hello Kitty games, ignoring the fact that I do own a Hello Kitty game.
Wait...what? Ahem...well...
I really think the advertising world is extremely caught up in the idea of target audiences. They find a group that sells, and they just shovel their marketing dollars directly into catering that particular group. It works on an immediate level, but like you say, it pretty much alienates the rest of the world.
Bros are more likely to be watching Spike with their other bros when that commercial appears. They also have a 97 percent chance to bro fist or bro hug when said commercial appears because they can totally relate to the fact that their wemmnyz be bothering them during God of War II time.
HA! I included that Old Spice commercial in a blog a while back. Excellent choice!
As for a video game commercial engaging women, I think the problem is that advertisers have been using the old stand-bys for so long now that they don't really know how to engage women. They still view video game marketing as explosions + tits = getting the guys to pay attention but I see that starting to change. Perhaps for the moment the old ways are working and advertisers can stick to their guns and sell to the dudez out there but soon, very soon they will have to address that female gaming population.
I do cringe every fucking time I see some bikini clad girl in a video game that is the heroine even though from the shred of clothing she's wearing it looks like she's a strong breeze away from being a centerfold or that awful, ridiculous gaming team(I forget their name) that was just a bunch of women with implants and blank stares hocking some product or another. Shit like that sets women involved with video games back a few years and it angers me to think that someone jackass out there believes I will be interested in that just because I have a penis.
As an emerging (but significant) portion of gamers today, women need to acknowledged well beyond a female skin in a multiplayer mode or a stereotyped piece of eyecandy for guys to fawn over. All the strong women I have ever known were strong because of who they were, not because of what they did (or didn't) wear. That strength needs to show up in video games as well and I look forward to the day that it does.
As for creating a commercial, I wonder what percentage of these advertising firms that create this stuff are women? Better yet, how many are women who actually play games?
Haven't you seen the front page? The chicks are too busy making videos and being all girly on girlgamer.com to go to the women in gaming convention. So that's where they are.
I have to agree with what Panda says, as I so often do (he keeps beating me to the punch), about target audience, at least in the God of War commercial. They tend to focus on the group that they believe will be most interested in this game. Although I'm sure there were gamers of both genders that were equally excited for GoWIII, it is most definitely targeted at red blooded males who want to kill things and see tits, and in this case they were focusing on their target with laser precision.
I am the most feminist straight guy I know, and want the industry to be a bit more homogeneous about gender. I know that the girls are out there but its hard to make people know that easily. Is like in boxing or martial arts, we barely know about women on them but there are a LOT of them.
Où sont les femmes ? (Your title reminded me of a famous French song entitled like this)
I think the big problem with most of the ads surrounding women playing video games and what most entertainment companies are missing is to portrait them like men are portrayed. They need to make an ad about girls and boys (Blur..again music) are playing games with the same amount of interest and dedication and not be labeled by any "sexist" standard. Why not make a Final Fantasy XIII ad with both gender and have fun with a game that everybody can enjoy.
At the risk of repeating myself , I have met a lot of women who are way more hardcore than me , yeah I'm a collector I have a lot of games and consoles and I usually have a global knowledge of the past and present of the industry. But these gals ... They know their Final Fantasy or Silent Hill or Persona to a level I would never be able to attain.
@speednut... no, the guy is hunky... but it's the satire that women want a guy on a yacht, diamonds, tickets to that thing we love... or a knight on a white horse! All those stereotypes are so wonderfully addressed, yet they made me laugh rather than cringe. The ad makes fun of women... but is still funny. The Sony ad makes fun of the stereotype of "the gamer guy's pissed off girlfriend" but it just seems so yesterday and out of pace. I'm not really sure why one ad is funny to me and the other isn't, but Sony needs to figure that out!
@Blehman... yeah, speaking of stereotypes... I just don't like self segregation of "we are women... we are special". Ironic given that I also dislike Sony's opposite stance of "women don't game". I think I just want a reflection of the reality that women DO game, and it's not a big deal.
@Occanms... yeah this blog was an excuse to post that commercial! LOL! You're right that advertisers seem to be using "old stand bys", but maybe Sony needs to wake up and realize that the simple reality is that all kinds of women game. They don't need to advertise "to" us, but at least don't insult and alienate us. Same goes for ingame models, etc. :(
@MrSadistic... LOL! I do think that's exactly how Sony thinks!
@Renegade... I think that the general interest gap is less than people think. Just as there are guys that like Wii games and Hello Kitty games, there are lots of women that like MAG, COD and violent games like GoW and GTA4 (which actually had online female avatars!). I just think that advertising can be humourous without being exclusive. Why alienate anybody with an advertisement (as COD did with their F.A.G.S. viral ad). Advertisers are paid big money... can't they do humour without insult?
I think the first ad to dedicate in that should display a woman playing too but as if it always was liek that. No need of WHOAH WOMYNZ PLAYING VIDJEWO GAYMZZZ DAWG
@Kraid and Monodi... I like Kraid's idea of just showing women playing the games in the occasional ad. As I said, why couldn't it have been a woman playing the boxing game or the shooter game in the more recent ad for the PS Move? No big deal made of it... just a woman instead of a man.
Simple... yet it would have been oh so effective!
But there's the big problem ; Whatever ways ad companies will try to make an ad displaying both genders equally you'll always going to have "OMFG ISS A WEEMIN PLAYUN MAH GAWD AUFF WARS!!!" response from a lot of immature gamers.
and I'm not talking about 14 years old boys respectively too.
...but they released a Hannah Montanah Pink PSP...
We men never get a MEN-ONLY convention, or our own MEN THEMED gaming site... When "girls gamers" stop capitalizing on their vaginas, so will the suits, you can quote me on that.
Seems to me like advertisers need to redefine the idea of sexy for video games. Sexy doesn't have to be some girl in a bikini. Sexy can be a girl getting headshots and knife kills in Battlefield? (I know nothing of these games) while being confident and having fun or kicking ass at Street Fighter IV and Rock Band. That's sexy as well to a lot of guys out there and doesn't require tits and stereotypes.
Also, big 'ol pet peeve of mine: Show women with curves....how women actually look. I'd buy a goddamn house painting sim on principle if it depicted women as they actually look.
Anorexic tit-monsters are not attractive to anyone with half a personality and mind. They are, however, going to be featured as a new villain type in Doom 4.
Oh, and about the Insignificant Other ad, why are you so quick to protect the whole estrogen team? They made a joke specifically about needy complaining girlfriends with no bigger purpose in life than having a boyfriend/worshiper, I trust that you're not one of those, so there's no need to be offended...
Yeah, I hated that God of War 3 ad. It felt like Sony had just gone back in time to the 90s - do you remember that Ocarina of Time advert? "Willst thou get the girl, or play like one?"
I genuinely think better advertising could maybe persuade more women to take up gaming.
I just found out that a girl that I have a bunch of courses with has a PS3 and is really into Modern Warfare 2, Little Big Planet and is on a hunt for Dante's Inferno, which is sold out everywhere in our area apparently. It's not even like she's the type of person who I would expect to own a console...more like the type that used to be a cheer leader in high school. She said she saw the "It only does everything...$299 ads" and ran out and bought one.
THANK YOU, I actually find the DOA Volleyball girls to be a strange gimmick. Now if you give me a girl getting all Kill Bill and Trinity on a bunch of people I get boners.
"What most attracts 18-35 year old men.... are 18-35 year old women!" That is a very good point. And while I didn't particularly like the ad, it's certainly true that God of War III is probably not the best game to try marketing to women. As for Move...yeah, not sure what they were thinking there.
Nowadays, it's just faceless 'Here's Our Exclusive!' stuff (probably because their original 'post-modern' PS3 adverts completely flopped). Microsoft and Nintendo both cater to female customers, the latter especially when they put out adverts like this:
To be honest, I don't think Sony have given much thought to advertising this generation. They've relied too heavily on branding and I think it's done more harm than good.
Considering Elsa's usually exorbitantly high standard of posting, I can see her point but don't find it especially original or pertinent: gaming advertising is embracing women more and more, even if that one ad was somewhat retrograde (even if the writer/director was only seeing gaming from the male perspective, how did they ever think describing someone as an 'insignificant other' would not be insulting?). There's rarely a Nintendo ad anymore with a lass at the console (often exclusively - see the Animal Crossing campaign), while third party ads tend to use gameplay (real or CGI) rather than weak, fleshy humans. The post would have been more appropriate were we still in the days of 'Wilt thou get the girl... or play like one?'
But while I disagree with this post, the Old Spice ad is hysterical and fappworthy.
I thought the GoW3 commercial was pretty funny but they really could have worked it in other ways. They could have used the "abandoned friend", "ignored grandmother", "confused neighbour" or even just switched the gender roles. I guess they just went with the "easy" option. That Old Spice ad is hilarious as well.
My girlfriend has been playing Dragon Age: Origins for at least seven hours of this day. She's still in the living room playing now, ignoring me... as I sit here, lonely in front of a computer, with no motivation to work, waiting for her to realize that I still exist... *sigh*
@Enkido: Yeah, I drank, like, waaaaay too much of that melted blue ice that comes in those blue ice freeze packs your mom used to use to keep your drinks cold during Summer camp. I'm impressed that my third nipple only now started crying.
I read this in the Journal on the Old Spice campaign.
The short of it is P&G (the makers) of Old Spice figured out men generally will use whatever soap/body wash is in the shower. Since women generally buy the soap the adds are there to get women to buy the manly soap for their men.
I'm a woman who games and personally, I really don't give a damn about if ads contain more men than women or "make fun" of women. You know why? Because I'm not paying attention to the content of the commercial itself; I'm paying attention to the actual substance of it - the game's gameplay.
I honestly laughed at both those ads because I found them to be amusing. As a woman, I never once felt offended by such ads like this. I did what I always do. I went to the store, I bought my game, and went home to enjoy it. I don't need an ad to tell me this game is for me. I knew before the ad was even aired that it was. So why should I let media bother me in such a way?
Sorry, too busy being a stereotypical girl and playing Dragon Age: Origins to care. ;P Poor Discarded Couch Sandwich! I wonder whether he, like my main man, is jealous of Alistair? sigh!
Actually, here in HK girls are constantly playing video games, and we seem to have them marketed at us just as much as guys do. I no longer have a television subscription, so the only commercials I see are on the bus or train or in public areas, but it seems that the ads here are made to appeal to both sexes and not overtly targeting one or the other.
I wasn't much into games other than the Princess Maker and Harvest Moon series in the U.S. and therefore never paid much attention to the market; it wasn't until I came to Asia (with a gamer boyfriend in tow) that I had much interest in them. My preference remains with adventure games, but I also loved GTA4, but GTA3:SA was vastly superior; GTA4's saving grace (aside from the excellent voice acting and hilarity that is Brucie) is the Ballad of Gay Tony, which was once again properly fun.
@ Occams
Those were my favorite part of lunch at summer camp. I always got a brain freeze followed by severe hallucination and symptoms matching the description of Chrone's disease. Good times.
I thought at least one of the Sony ads was amusing. Something about scented candles or some such nonsense. I mean sure it might be fun to have the woman playing the game and the guy acting clueless for a change, but they are playing on the stereotype for humors sake and while whether it was funny or not is pretty subjective I find it to be harmless in the overall "women in gaming" movement.
They use the stereotypes that the majority of people will recognize and relate to, and while you and I are both examples of the fact that women do indeed play games the perception is still that it's an immature guys territory so that's what we'll continue to see reflected in the majority of ads.
In the meanwhile I'm still pretty pissed off about my avatar in Runes of Magic having to wear high heel shoes while killing boars in the wild. This is the sexism that really grinds my gears, have we not advanced enough as a civilization that I can get some decent footwear and pants that don't end at my crotch?
Honestly I found those advertisements amusing because they're so fucking true. The ones with "insignificant others" reflects the reality where most men will ditch their women as soon as they find a more fulfilling distraction than entertaining a woman until she puts out.
Sad, but true... but funny.
Keep pushing for equality and maybe one of these days we'll see a female equivalent commercial where women ignore their men once they find a distraction more fulfilling than... than... fuck, why do women even bother spending time around the average male anyway? Men fucking suck.
Gaming will make every man in the world single and lonely soon.
@Stevil, those ads freaked the fuck out me. But that Old Spice advert is pretty funny.
But yes, more ladies would be nice. Problem is, as soon as some stereotypical "gamer chikz" arrive, us guys start lambasting them for being a stereotype. When will we make up our minds!?!
Speaking as somebody who works in advertising/marketing, any ad you run is potentially a double edged sword. If you focus hard on a specific demographic, you run the risk of alienating anyone outside of that demographic that sees the ad. That said, targeting produces the best results.
Nintendo's family friendly marketing has done a good job of alienating hardcore gamers, but by targeting that market they're making bank. So you're right in suggesting the GoW ad isn't girl gamer friendly, but not necessarily right in the assumption that Sony doesn't "get it." Following the GoW 3 example, Sony are basically aiming for the demo that they think will yield the greatest results. Potentially offending girl gamers is collateral I assume they've taken into account.
The girl gamer demographic is an interesting one, because you could argue that girls that are into the more hardcore games weren't introduced to gaming through advertising and don't really need targeting. That's why you have the pink DS and some super "girly" ads. They're targeting the girl demo that would probably ignore games altogether otherwise. Whether they're successful or not is another story. It's worth considering that the idea that a girl gamer that's initiated in the culture enough to post on Dtoid probably doesn't need to be sold on gaming. That's why they can safely exclude that demographic.
What I'm saying basically, is that any good marketing team should know the numbers you quoted above. If they're excluding your demo in a particular campaign, they're doing it knowingly and with reason.
Also, yes the Old Spice ad is excellent. The reason it deliberately tries include women in the joke, is because women have the ability to veto a man's use of the product, since aftershave is worn primarily for their benefit. If women are turned off by an aftershave ad, they can tell their boyfriend or husband they don't like Old Spice and just like that Old Spice have lost a sale. Looking back at the GoW example; If a woman has a negative opinion of the ad or game, there's a good chance it won't stop their boyfriend or whatever buying it.
I could talk about this all day but I'll stop here and spare you. Love the thought and research you put into the post, it really stands out in the sea of rage and speculation that is the internet.
My wife loves God of War 3, but there is no way they could have marketed to her without alienating me. It's a manly game about a manly man doing manly things. There's just not a real middle ground here.
But we could definitely do with being a bit nice to the girls I guess. Only problem is, 1 out of 4 is not exactly a large amount. You don't want to shut out that 25%, but you'd rather not risk losing a lot of that 75% that are men either. I don't envy the people who run gaming websites.
@Ali: Tell me about it. I was like 14 or 15 when that Chris Cunningham advert was released and I honestly thought her head really was like that!
The thing about men being cynical is that it doesn't help when companies like Ubisoft try and market things like Frag Dolls. I don't think they represent female gamers at all. To me, they're an advertising tool marketed towards men. So it's really hard to not scrutinise female gamers who are being honest, when we get Frag Dolls and their 'down with the guys' attitude every so few years.
@Schway... wonderful comment! Thank you so much for clarifying a lot of this.
What struck me most about the two ads (cause I really love that Old Spice ad) was that they both mock females yet my reaction was quite different. I think the thing that bothered me about the GoW ad was that I've rather liked the new Sony ads up to this point, but the GoW ad was a throw back to old ads - bad ads. I was also rather hoping that the new Move ads might in some way target women... even subtly.
Again, I don't want to be marketed "to"... I just don't wanted to be marketed "against" in gaming adverts.
(... and Stevil, don't get me started on the Frag Dolls! LOL! I have nothing against those gals, but Ubi did more damage to the average female gamer with that B.S. than just about anything else. They did NOT encourage more women to game, it was straight up to encourage guys to buy Ubi products - nothing more).
... and Eternal, for PS3 owners, the figures are likely closer to the 20% mark.... but the thing is that there is a huge "potential" customer pool of females that are already gamers... and own a Wii, a PSP or a DS. Attracting them to the PS3 with PS Move ads might increase female PS3 gamers by quite a large number - in the millions in the U.S. alone. That's why I don't get it... why pedal backwards when they could at least stay somewhat neutral in their ads.
Meh...I'm sure we'll see more Move ads... it will be interesting!
I am a male, and I find that Old Spice commercial hilarious. So does my wife.
The Sony ad? Didn't really think too much about it until it showed up on TV while my wife and I were watching...something. Not important what we were watching, no relevance to the - oh, wait. It was American Picker. We're friggin' addicts of that show.
*Ahem*
Sorry. Tangent.
Anywho, commercial aired, I laughed. I turned to the missus and saw she wasn't. She wasn't pissed; she just turned and said "so, women are annoying twits who don't get it?"
Ah...yeah. I could see how she'd get that impression from the commercial. Don't think the "insignificant other" label helped any.
Wonder how guys would feel if they showed a girl playing GoW 3 in the ad. Would they assume the game had romantic, "girly" crap in it, and then decide not to buy it? It's like a discussion we had in my English class, after reading an essay about how companies don't show handicapped people in ads. "Normal" people might see a person in a wheelchair using some sort of laundry detergent or body soap and think, consciously or unconsciously, that the product is for handicapped people.
Point? Uh...I think I lost it. Oh, wait - found it. Until the majority of males see females as gaming equals, expect more ads like this...wife/girlfriend doesn't approve of husband/boyfriend's hobby, is oblivious of draw games have on males, is slighted by the fact that they are ignored.
But hey, maybe a company can step up and do something where the husband is playing something like GoW 3, wife walks in, starts telling him what to do, takes controller when he keeps dying, shows him the proper way to play...something like that would be funny. And might not alienate the guys. You've got them amused because of the "typical" wife telling him what to do, and the women are shown as being better than their husbands, who are usually portrayed as not knowing much past football and beer.
Like what EDS said it's a manly game so you have to ahvertise manly things. Not saying women don't like manly things but most women that like manly things have mustaches and mullets......my GF does not like GOW but she does enjoy borderlands. She likes violence but different kinds.
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Wait...what? Ahem...well...
I really think the advertising world is extremely caught up in the idea of target audiences. They find a group that sells, and they just shovel their marketing dollars directly into catering that particular group. It works on an immediate level, but like you say, it pretty much alienates the rest of the world.
As for a video game commercial engaging women, I think the problem is that advertisers have been using the old stand-bys for so long now that they don't really know how to engage women. They still view video game marketing as explosions + tits = getting the guys to pay attention but I see that starting to change. Perhaps for the moment the old ways are working and advertisers can stick to their guns and sell to the dudez out there but soon, very soon they will have to address that female gaming population.
I do cringe every fucking time I see some bikini clad girl in a video game that is the heroine even though from the shred of clothing she's wearing it looks like she's a strong breeze away from being a centerfold or that awful, ridiculous gaming team(I forget their name) that was just a bunch of women with implants and blank stares hocking some product or another. Shit like that sets women involved with video games back a few years and it angers me to think that someone jackass out there believes I will be interested in that just because I have a penis.
As an emerging (but significant) portion of gamers today, women need to acknowledged well beyond a female skin in a multiplayer mode or a stereotyped piece of eyecandy for guys to fawn over. All the strong women I have ever known were strong because of who they were, not because of what they did (or didn't) wear. That strength needs to show up in video games as well and I look forward to the day that it does.
As for creating a commercial, I wonder what percentage of these advertising firms that create this stuff are women? Better yet, how many are women who actually play games?
Another good blog. Sony does seem to get pretty shallow / repetitive with their ads instead of evolving over time.
Also, "I'm on a horse."
I think the big problem with most of the ads surrounding women playing video games and what most entertainment companies are missing is to portrait them like men are portrayed. They need to make an ad about girls and boys (Blur..again music) are playing games with the same amount of interest and dedication and not be labeled by any "sexist" standard. Why not make a Final Fantasy XIII ad with both gender and have fun with a game that everybody can enjoy.
At the risk of repeating myself , I have met a lot of women who are way more hardcore than me , yeah I'm a collector I have a lot of games and consoles and I usually have a global knowledge of the past and present of the industry. But these gals ... They know their Final Fantasy or Silent Hill or Persona to a level I would never be able to attain.
So yeah , Where dem gurls at?!
@Blehman... yeah, speaking of stereotypes... I just don't like self segregation of "we are women... we are special". Ironic given that I also dislike Sony's opposite stance of "women don't game". I think I just want a reflection of the reality that women DO game, and it's not a big deal.
@Occanms... yeah this blog was an excuse to post that commercial! LOL! You're right that advertisers seem to be using "old stand bys", but maybe Sony needs to wake up and realize that the simple reality is that all kinds of women game. They don't need to advertise "to" us, but at least don't insult and alienate us. Same goes for ingame models, etc. :(
@MrSadistic... LOL! I do think that's exactly how Sony thinks!
@Renegade... I think that the general interest gap is less than people think. Just as there are guys that like Wii games and Hello Kitty games, there are lots of women that like MAG, COD and violent games like GoW and GTA4 (which actually had online female avatars!). I just think that advertising can be humourous without being exclusive. Why alienate anybody with an advertisement (as COD did with their F.A.G.S. viral ad). Advertisers are paid big money... can't they do humour without insult?
I think the first ad to dedicate in that should display a woman playing too but as if it always was liek that. No need of WHOAH WOMYNZ PLAYING VIDJEWO GAYMZZZ DAWG
Simple... yet it would have been oh so effective!
and I'm not talking about 14 years old boys respectively too.
Team
Fortress
2.
Ladies love to play the Spy, I like burning Spy's. Everyone's happy. Everybody wins.
Well, I win, but yeah.
We men never get a MEN-ONLY convention, or our own MEN THEMED gaming site... When "girls gamers" stop capitalizing on their vaginas, so will the suits, you can quote me on that.
Also, big 'ol pet peeve of mine: Show women with curves....how women actually look. I'd buy a goddamn house painting sim on principle if it depicted women as they actually look.
Anorexic tit-monsters are not attractive to anyone with half a personality and mind. They are, however, going to be featured as a new villain type in Doom 4.
Thanks a lot.
Jerk.
I think it's pretty much in my bro-genes to like "tit-monsters", sorry, but you're alone on this one, bro.
@Occams: My bro-genes were eliminated when I had the boating accident so like the cheese, I can stand alone on this one
I genuinely think better advertising could maybe persuade more women to take up gaming.
THANK YOU, I actually find the DOA Volleyball girls to be a strange gimmick. Now if you give me a girl getting all Kill Bill and Trinity on a bunch of people I get boners.
I wish women would like me, but yeah, I like women.
And as a guy, I fucking love that Old Spice ad.
"@Occams: My bro-genes were eliminated when I had the boating accident so like the cheese, I can stand alone on this one"
You talking to yourself again, you know how dangerous that guy is.
Double Life
Mental Wealth
Nowadays, it's just faceless 'Here's Our Exclusive!' stuff (probably because their original 'post-modern' PS3 adverts completely flopped). Microsoft and Nintendo both cater to female customers, the latter especially when they put out adverts like this:
Animal Crossing
To be honest, I don't think Sony have given much thought to advertising this generation. They've relied too heavily on branding and I think it's done more harm than good.
But while I disagree with this post, the Old Spice ad is hysterical and fappworthy.
Just thought ya should know!
I read this in the Journal on the Old Spice campaign.
The short of it is P&G (the makers) of Old Spice figured out men generally will use whatever soap/body wash is in the shower. Since women generally buy the soap the adds are there to get women to buy the manly soap for their men.
I personally like Irish Spring BTW.
I honestly laughed at both those ads because I found them to be amusing. As a woman, I never once felt offended by such ads like this. I did what I always do. I went to the store, I bought my game, and went home to enjoy it. I don't need an ad to tell me this game is for me. I knew before the ad was even aired that it was. So why should I let media bother me in such a way?
Actually, here in HK girls are constantly playing video games, and we seem to have them marketed at us just as much as guys do. I no longer have a television subscription, so the only commercials I see are on the bus or train or in public areas, but it seems that the ads here are made to appeal to both sexes and not overtly targeting one or the other.
I wasn't much into games other than the Princess Maker and Harvest Moon series in the U.S. and therefore never paid much attention to the market; it wasn't until I came to Asia (with a gamer boyfriend in tow) that I had much interest in them. My preference remains with adventure games, but I also loved GTA4, but GTA3:SA was vastly superior; GTA4's saving grace (aside from the excellent voice acting and hilarity that is Brucie) is the Ballad of Gay Tony, which was once again properly fun.
Nintendo misogyny for the win. :)
Those were my favorite part of lunch at summer camp. I always got a brain freeze followed by severe hallucination and symptoms matching the description of Chrone's disease. Good times.
They use the stereotypes that the majority of people will recognize and relate to, and while you and I are both examples of the fact that women do indeed play games the perception is still that it's an immature guys territory so that's what we'll continue to see reflected in the majority of ads.
In the meanwhile I'm still pretty pissed off about my avatar in Runes of Magic having to wear high heel shoes while killing boars in the wild. This is the sexism that really grinds my gears, have we not advanced enough as a civilization that I can get some decent footwear and pants that don't end at my crotch?
Sad, but true... but funny.
Keep pushing for equality and maybe one of these days we'll see a female equivalent commercial where women ignore their men once they find a distraction more fulfilling than... than... fuck, why do women even bother spending time around the average male anyway? Men fucking suck.
Gaming will make every man in the world single and lonely soon.
But yes, more ladies would be nice. Problem is, as soon as some stereotypical "gamer chikz" arrive, us guys start lambasting them for being a stereotype. When will we make up our minds!?!
Of course, as a jerk I'm offended by all advertising!
Nintendo's family friendly marketing has done a good job of alienating hardcore gamers, but by targeting that market they're making bank. So you're right in suggesting the GoW ad isn't girl gamer friendly, but not necessarily right in the assumption that Sony doesn't "get it." Following the GoW 3 example, Sony are basically aiming for the demo that they think will yield the greatest results. Potentially offending girl gamers is collateral I assume they've taken into account.
The girl gamer demographic is an interesting one, because you could argue that girls that are into the more hardcore games weren't introduced to gaming through advertising and don't really need targeting. That's why you have the pink DS and some super "girly" ads. They're targeting the girl demo that would probably ignore games altogether otherwise. Whether they're successful or not is another story. It's worth considering that the idea that a girl gamer that's initiated in the culture enough to post on Dtoid probably doesn't need to be sold on gaming. That's why they can safely exclude that demographic.
What I'm saying basically, is that any good marketing team should know the numbers you quoted above. If they're excluding your demo in a particular campaign, they're doing it knowingly and with reason.
Also, yes the Old Spice ad is excellent. The reason it deliberately tries include women in the joke, is because women have the ability to veto a man's use of the product, since aftershave is worn primarily for their benefit. If women are turned off by an aftershave ad, they can tell their boyfriend or husband they don't like Old Spice and just like that Old Spice have lost a sale. Looking back at the GoW example; If a woman has a negative opinion of the ad or game, there's a good chance it won't stop their boyfriend or whatever buying it.
I could talk about this all day but I'll stop here and spare you. Love the thought and research you put into the post, it really stands out in the sea of rage and speculation that is the internet.
But we could definitely do with being a bit nice to the girls I guess. Only problem is, 1 out of 4 is not exactly a large amount. You don't want to shut out that 25%, but you'd rather not risk losing a lot of that 75% that are men either. I don't envy the people who run gaming websites.
The thing about men being cynical is that it doesn't help when companies like Ubisoft try and market things like Frag Dolls. I don't think they represent female gamers at all. To me, they're an advertising tool marketed towards men. So it's really hard to not scrutinise female gamers who are being honest, when we get Frag Dolls and their 'down with the guys' attitude every so few years.
What struck me most about the two ads (cause I really love that Old Spice ad) was that they both mock females yet my reaction was quite different. I think the thing that bothered me about the GoW ad was that I've rather liked the new Sony ads up to this point, but the GoW ad was a throw back to old ads - bad ads. I was also rather hoping that the new Move ads might in some way target women... even subtly.
Again, I don't want to be marketed "to"... I just don't wanted to be marketed "against" in gaming adverts.
(... and Stevil, don't get me started on the Frag Dolls! LOL! I have nothing against those gals, but Ubi did more damage to the average female gamer with that B.S. than just about anything else. They did NOT encourage more women to game, it was straight up to encourage guys to buy Ubi products - nothing more).
... and Eternal, for PS3 owners, the figures are likely closer to the 20% mark.... but the thing is that there is a huge "potential" customer pool of females that are already gamers... and own a Wii, a PSP or a DS. Attracting them to the PS3 with PS Move ads might increase female PS3 gamers by quite a large number - in the millions in the U.S. alone. That's why I don't get it... why pedal backwards when they could at least stay somewhat neutral in their ads.
Meh...I'm sure we'll see more Move ads... it will be interesting!
The Sony ad? Didn't really think too much about it until it showed up on TV while my wife and I were watching...something. Not important what we were watching, no relevance to the - oh, wait. It was American Picker. We're friggin' addicts of that show.
*Ahem*
Sorry. Tangent.
Anywho, commercial aired, I laughed. I turned to the missus and saw she wasn't. She wasn't pissed; she just turned and said "so, women are annoying twits who don't get it?"
Ah...yeah. I could see how she'd get that impression from the commercial. Don't think the "insignificant other" label helped any.
Wonder how guys would feel if they showed a girl playing GoW 3 in the ad. Would they assume the game had romantic, "girly" crap in it, and then decide not to buy it? It's like a discussion we had in my English class, after reading an essay about how companies don't show handicapped people in ads. "Normal" people might see a person in a wheelchair using some sort of laundry detergent or body soap and think, consciously or unconsciously, that the product is for handicapped people.
Point? Uh...I think I lost it. Oh, wait - found it. Until the majority of males see females as gaming equals, expect more ads like this...wife/girlfriend doesn't approve of husband/boyfriend's hobby, is oblivious of draw games have on males, is slighted by the fact that they are ignored.
But hey, maybe a company can step up and do something where the husband is playing something like GoW 3, wife walks in, starts telling him what to do, takes controller when he keeps dying, shows him the proper way to play...something like that would be funny. And might not alienate the guys. You've got them amused because of the "typical" wife telling him what to do, and the women are shown as being better than their husbands, who are usually portrayed as not knowing much past football and beer.
I'd laugh, and I'm sure my wife would.
Like what EDS said it's a manly game so you have to ahvertise manly things. Not saying women don't like manly things but most women that like manly things have mustaches and mullets......my GF does not like GOW but she does enjoy borderlands. She likes violence but different kinds.