I agree, I think music games are a boon for the music industry. I normally have little interest in music, but I play Singstar a lot and have been exposed to bands I might never have heard of otherwise. I've rediscovered some old favorites, but along the way have encountered some new favorites.
Music games only serve to interest people in Music and Playing Musical Instruments.
They can only been seen as a good thing, because no-one thinks they're musical geniuses just by picking up Guitar Hero.
They can only been seen as a good thing, because no-one thinks they're musical geniuses just by picking up Guitar Hero.
I think music games have the potential to educate us about music history in a way that no other medium really can. Hell, even Eternal Sonata educated me more about Chopin than I can imagine any other medium doing, as it has the advantage of being able to offer Chopin's music, his life story told in text form, and interaction to keep the player interested in the material.
I kind of wish that we'd get a rhythm game that had this sort of focus. Sure, we're exposed to old music in Rock Band and Guitar Hero games, but we don't really learn deeply about the music, which I think is the only way to truly appreciate bands, musicians, and songs.
For now, I just hope that we get more games like Eternal Sonata. Despite it not being a great game, it has changed a lot about who I am musically. Chopin is now one of my favorite composers, and I hadn't given him a second thought before the game. That's the power that I think rhythm games should have, though I'm not entirely sure how to achieve that.
I kind of wish that we'd get a rhythm game that had this sort of focus. Sure, we're exposed to old music in Rock Band and Guitar Hero games, but we don't really learn deeply about the music, which I think is the only way to truly appreciate bands, musicians, and songs.
For now, I just hope that we get more games like Eternal Sonata. Despite it not being a great game, it has changed a lot about who I am musically. Chopin is now one of my favorite composers, and I hadn't given him a second thought before the game. That's the power that I think rhythm games should have, though I'm not entirely sure how to achieve that.
I think it's helped, but also ruined the genre as of late.
It's helped by pushing the genre further where Benami games left off (AKA ignored the interested american market.) but in turn of that, it's american publishers chucking these out so as you're seeing, it's constant releases of said Guitar Hero/Rock Band in a short time period. Don't get me wrong, there's a good amount of Benami pushouts but not so closely. GH/RB are like the Madden of Music games.
at this rate though, Harmonix and Activision will kill the scene cause they keep releasing too many damn games and making everyone have to keep buying different guitars due to a company trying to muscle in on some money. America's very money hungry on that crap.
It's helped by pushing the genre further where Benami games left off (AKA ignored the interested american market.) but in turn of that, it's american publishers chucking these out so as you're seeing, it's constant releases of said Guitar Hero/Rock Band in a short time period. Don't get me wrong, there's a good amount of Benami pushouts but not so closely. GH/RB are like the Madden of Music games.
at this rate though, Harmonix and Activision will kill the scene cause they keep releasing too many damn games and making everyone have to keep buying different guitars due to a company trying to muscle in on some money. America's very money hungry on that crap.
Guitar Hero and Rock Band are worse than sports games. Five or six Skus per year per franchise is downright insane if you ask me , the majority of the consumers are completely confused on which to get first and the price tags for some of them are way too high for what they're offering. And I'm not talking about the bundles the additionnal peripherals the kind , the year they we're produced it's a real clusterfuck.
It's a complete mess. BUT I CAN'T WAIT FOR GUITAR HERO XIII SQUEEEEEEEE!!!
It's a complete mess. BUT I CAN'T WAIT FOR GUITAR HERO XIII SQUEEEEEEEE!!!
God knows how many bands i've come to know and love through playing Guitar Hero and Rock Band. When I was about seventeen before I played Guitar Hero for the first time, I didn't really care about music at all, lest it be video game soundtracks. I didn't expose myself to much music at all, but these games completely changed that thought.
They've broadened my horizons quite far. I can't belive there are people out there against those like me learning about music through these games.
They've broadened my horizons quite far. I can't belive there are people out there against those like me learning about music through these games.
I too agree, as Elsa said, playing these games has put me onto new artists that I probably would never have heard if it wasn't for them. Quite a few times I've been playing and had to note down the song and artist afterwards so that I can check them out.
Thanks for your thoughts guys it's very much appreciated :-)
I just thought I'd say that I haven't gone into the business practices of Activision/Harmonix/MTV Games which as some of you have pointed out could lead to the downfall of the genre. I'm just talking about the general concepts and ideas behind these games and the effects they have on people or else this post would go on for pages.
I just thought I'd say that I haven't gone into the business practices of Activision/Harmonix/MTV Games which as some of you have pointed out could lead to the downfall of the genre. I'm just talking about the general concepts and ideas behind these games and the effects they have on people or else this post would go on for pages.
as a source to find new artist/music to listen to? by all means. DDR opened me up more when I was just starting Jpop...or at least getting used to it. I'm too poor to keep buying GH/RB but I can't sit here and say it'll help me fine more rock artist to check out...if I ever find the money to get the right RB/GH and songs to download.
see, i'm already running money up.
see, i'm already running money up.
The idea that music games are somehow 'ruining' music strikes me as complete nonsense. If anything, I've gained more respect for guitarists after trying to play theses games. After all, if I can barely get through "Through the Fire and the Flames" on Medium, how awesome do you have to be to be able to play it for real?
The major assumption in most of these arguments is that people have no way to differentiate reality and fiction- that, if they're pressing buttons and music is playing, then surely they're a rock god. That's hardly, if ever, the case- ask someone who's playing Rock Band if they think they know how to play a real guitar. That being said, the games can teach basic concepts- after all, they're abstractions of the real instruments.
When I first played Guitar Hero, I had no idea how the thing even worked, but after a few play sessions, I could use phrases like 'frets' and 'chords' and actually know what i was talking about. Slowly, I got used to using more than three fingers at a time, and eventually stretching my fingers to reach that blasted orange button. When I finally sat down to fiddle around with the real deal, I already had a jump start, because I had learned the basics from a videogame. Not only that, but I had a clear goal: I want to play guitar like I can play it in Rock Band. Every time I got frustrated with myself, I went back to play a tune on the game, to remind myself: This is what you're aiming for. You can do this. I've been playing real guitar for over a year now, and I fully intend on furthering my skills.
Oh, and one more thing the fake band games gave me: Before I played Guitar Hero, I had never heard War Pigs. I had no idea who Jimi Hendrix was, I had never listened to Message in a Bottle, or Black Magic Woman, or Monkey Wrench, or even half of the setlist from any of those bloody games. These games introduced me to more music than any other single source, and I am eternally grateful for it.
The major assumption in most of these arguments is that people have no way to differentiate reality and fiction- that, if they're pressing buttons and music is playing, then surely they're a rock god. That's hardly, if ever, the case- ask someone who's playing Rock Band if they think they know how to play a real guitar. That being said, the games can teach basic concepts- after all, they're abstractions of the real instruments.
When I first played Guitar Hero, I had no idea how the thing even worked, but after a few play sessions, I could use phrases like 'frets' and 'chords' and actually know what i was talking about. Slowly, I got used to using more than three fingers at a time, and eventually stretching my fingers to reach that blasted orange button. When I finally sat down to fiddle around with the real deal, I already had a jump start, because I had learned the basics from a videogame. Not only that, but I had a clear goal: I want to play guitar like I can play it in Rock Band. Every time I got frustrated with myself, I went back to play a tune on the game, to remind myself: This is what you're aiming for. You can do this. I've been playing real guitar for over a year now, and I fully intend on furthering my skills.
Oh, and one more thing the fake band games gave me: Before I played Guitar Hero, I had never heard War Pigs. I had no idea who Jimi Hendrix was, I had never listened to Message in a Bottle, or Black Magic Woman, or Monkey Wrench, or even half of the setlist from any of those bloody games. These games introduced me to more music than any other single source, and I am eternally grateful for it.
@Anus ... that's not right;
It's a wonderfull concept and it's probably one of the best way to introduce music to the kids and stuff , all the posters have proved it. My only problem with it which I've already talked about it the way it's marketed. I mean the Beatles are massive in music but all of a sudden everybody it talking about them like they never surfaced in the industry. I know there is a difference between praise and recognition but you have to see the other part. Most people will play Beatles Rock Band or any other specific group games and after a while they're going to get bored. I've heard a lot of criticism from my customers talking about the lack of diversity in Beatles Rock Band. I mean fuck it's the most popular group in the world what more can you hope for....That's why I think there is a danger that some groups could turn into a gimmick just to sell more. Singstar Michael Jackson will sell like millions only because of the name, I would've loved to see Rock Revolution take the indie part and Jap rock like they were in the arcades, Scratch might be the only title worthy of my interest only because the big cannons of the industry are no where to be seen for the most part.
Anyway, long reply is long.
It's a wonderfull concept and it's probably one of the best way to introduce music to the kids and stuff , all the posters have proved it. My only problem with it which I've already talked about it the way it's marketed. I mean the Beatles are massive in music but all of a sudden everybody it talking about them like they never surfaced in the industry. I know there is a difference between praise and recognition but you have to see the other part. Most people will play Beatles Rock Band or any other specific group games and after a while they're going to get bored. I've heard a lot of criticism from my customers talking about the lack of diversity in Beatles Rock Band. I mean fuck it's the most popular group in the world what more can you hope for....That's why I think there is a danger that some groups could turn into a gimmick just to sell more. Singstar Michael Jackson will sell like millions only because of the name, I would've loved to see Rock Revolution take the indie part and Jap rock like they were in the arcades, Scratch might be the only title worthy of my interest only because the big cannons of the industry are no where to be seen for the most part.
Anyway, long reply is long.
I think it's a useful tool to get people checking out music they wouldn't usually be exposed to (much like the Grand Theft Auto soundtracks), but usually these games are just party pieces in the same vein as a karaoke rather than stepping stones.
To me, real bands/musicians and music games don't really have any bearing on each other in the real world. How many people actually use all that studio stuff anyway? Nobody has made a real song on Rock Band that's appeared on anybody's radio.
You know, 'real' musicians were threatened by dance music in 90's anyway. Guitar bands gave way to music programs and bedroom musicians, but that kind of music always has a resurgence. So even as 'real' musician myself (barely ha!), I don't really feel threatened by this kind of thing, even though I can see why people get a bit snobbish because something might dilute the purity. Well, karaoke has been going for years and it hasn't destroyed anything.
I'm not really a fan of the games, not because I hate the idea (I'm the opposite) but because I just can't wrap my head around playing chords with buttons. If I gave up what I've learnt, then maybe I wouldn't be so indifferent.
...
Also, you have made my country's flag even more awesome. RIGHT AWWWN!
To me, real bands/musicians and music games don't really have any bearing on each other in the real world. How many people actually use all that studio stuff anyway? Nobody has made a real song on Rock Band that's appeared on anybody's radio.
You know, 'real' musicians were threatened by dance music in 90's anyway. Guitar bands gave way to music programs and bedroom musicians, but that kind of music always has a resurgence. So even as 'real' musician myself (barely ha!), I don't really feel threatened by this kind of thing, even though I can see why people get a bit snobbish because something might dilute the purity. Well, karaoke has been going for years and it hasn't destroyed anything.
I'm not really a fan of the games, not because I hate the idea (I'm the opposite) but because I just can't wrap my head around playing chords with buttons. If I gave up what I've learnt, then maybe I wouldn't be so indifferent.
...
Also, you have made my country's flag even more awesome. RIGHT AWWWN!
@Kraid:
I'm sorry I probably phrased my response wrong. What I meant is that this piece was written to be a kind of "video games are art, look how they provide you a different experience to everything else out there" piece and "look how games can broaden your horizons" and using the Rock Band/Guitar Hero games as an example to illustrate the new experience music games can give you while highlighting the other benefits the games give, such as exposure to new music. I hope this made a little more sense.
I agree with you though that these games are over saturated and while it exposes you to new bands it can also dilute their importance.
I'm sorry I probably phrased my response wrong. What I meant is that this piece was written to be a kind of "video games are art, look how they provide you a different experience to everything else out there" piece and "look how games can broaden your horizons" and using the Rock Band/Guitar Hero games as an example to illustrate the new experience music games can give you while highlighting the other benefits the games give, such as exposure to new music. I hope this made a little more sense.
I agree with you though that these games are over saturated and while it exposes you to new bands it can also dilute their importance.
@Anus :
When I think about it I've actually discovered more Hip Hop groups with the Grand Theft Auto serie than in any other form of media. I think you have an interesting point which I have completely miss before now.
When I think about it I've actually discovered more Hip Hop groups with the Grand Theft Auto serie than in any other form of media. I think you have an interesting point which I have completely miss before now.
Speaking as a gamer that burst his Guitar Hero World Tour and Rock Band cherry at the weekend, I'd have to say no its not spoiling music.
Music people are very weird about anything new, if its not on their somewhat archaic terms. Like all muses that have an elitist attitude, they fail to bend with the wnd and fear their demise.
I honestly believe that while Actiblizzard have whored the hell out of Guitar Hero, it and Rock band will turn a lot of gamers onto music they would have ignored. Its very similar to how when most games play jrpgs, they develop a high appreciaion for orchestral music, and game music in general. Video Games Live is a testament to gamers higher appreciation or good music in games, so I don't see why these rock games can't do the same for other music.
All music game IMO have this effect on the player. I first experienced this with Ouendan on DS (those crazy japanese tunes stuck in my hea, then later Elite Beat Agents. EBA gave me a love for Deep Purple's Highway Star, so much so, that when I saw it on Rock Band's track list, it was the first song I had confidence in singing. As me and my band of scum rocked out, it was the best party gaming experience yet.
I have no doubt, I will seek out some old rock tracks for my iPod. I'm 31 so I don't fear some variety in my musical tastes.
So yeah, such high brow artists should hold their tongues, and welcome anything that might make them a new fan. If Bill and Ted, Wayne's World and School of Rock can do so well for films, now its the turn of video games. Bring on Rocktober and some Brutal Legend.
Music people are very weird about anything new, if its not on their somewhat archaic terms. Like all muses that have an elitist attitude, they fail to bend with the wnd and fear their demise.
I honestly believe that while Actiblizzard have whored the hell out of Guitar Hero, it and Rock band will turn a lot of gamers onto music they would have ignored. Its very similar to how when most games play jrpgs, they develop a high appreciaion for orchestral music, and game music in general. Video Games Live is a testament to gamers higher appreciation or good music in games, so I don't see why these rock games can't do the same for other music.
All music game IMO have this effect on the player. I first experienced this with Ouendan on DS (those crazy japanese tunes stuck in my hea, then later Elite Beat Agents. EBA gave me a love for Deep Purple's Highway Star, so much so, that when I saw it on Rock Band's track list, it was the first song I had confidence in singing. As me and my band of scum rocked out, it was the best party gaming experience yet.
I have no doubt, I will seek out some old rock tracks for my iPod. I'm 31 so I don't fear some variety in my musical tastes.
So yeah, such high brow artists should hold their tongues, and welcome anything that might make them a new fan. If Bill and Ted, Wayne's World and School of Rock can do so well for films, now its the turn of video games. Bring on Rocktober and some Brutal Legend.
Cowboy Ttop has got a great point:
"Music people are very weird about anything new, if its not on their somewhat archaic terms. Like all muses that have an elitist attitude, they fail to bend with the wnd and fear their demise."
Totally agree. Jack White said it's sad that people who discover music through Guitar Hero? Why? A few years ago, did people say the same about downloads? Or digital radio? Did people back in the 80's dismiss MTV as a fad that would cheapen music and lead it to be less important? Probably.
Music is an ever-changing thing and the desire to create it has never gone away from the dawning of mankind. To think that people playing a videogame (and always remember, GH and RB are videogames) will somehow cheapen, ruin or even destroy music is absurd.
"Music people are very weird about anything new, if its not on their somewhat archaic terms. Like all muses that have an elitist attitude, they fail to bend with the wnd and fear their demise."
Totally agree. Jack White said it's sad that people who discover music through Guitar Hero? Why? A few years ago, did people say the same about downloads? Or digital radio? Did people back in the 80's dismiss MTV as a fad that would cheapen music and lead it to be less important? Probably.
Music is an ever-changing thing and the desire to create it has never gone away from the dawning of mankind. To think that people playing a videogame (and always remember, GH and RB are videogames) will somehow cheapen, ruin or even destroy music is absurd.
I've always been a particular type of music listener - I'll really get inside the tracks. Sometimes I'll play a song and only hear the drums, the bass or one of the guitar parts, picking up on their every nuance and subtelty before figuring out how it contributes to the whole. It's this sort of listening which is why I became a composer.
Not everyone is that sort of listener though. That's fine, it's just that they listen to overall songs, or only really pay attention to the tune. That's probably most people, and there's nothing wrong with that. What's great about these music games is that it provides a way that everyone can really get into the song and see what it's made of - especially in the case of Beatles Rock Band and its vocal harmonies.
This is extremely valuable - as I said, I would never have become a composer if I hadn't had this deconstructive way of listening to music, and I think this new, interactive way of listening will inspire more people to get a much better intuitive understanding of the music they like, what makes it tick.
Not everyone is that sort of listener though. That's fine, it's just that they listen to overall songs, or only really pay attention to the tune. That's probably most people, and there's nothing wrong with that. What's great about these music games is that it provides a way that everyone can really get into the song and see what it's made of - especially in the case of Beatles Rock Band and its vocal harmonies.
This is extremely valuable - as I said, I would never have become a composer if I hadn't had this deconstructive way of listening to music, and I think this new, interactive way of listening will inspire more people to get a much better intuitive understanding of the music they like, what makes it tick.
Also, people complain about the lack of diversity in Beatles Rock Band? I love Rock band, but in my opinion there's more diversity in those 45 songs by ONE BAND than there was in the 80-odd RB2 songs by many more bands. That's half of what makes it so exciting.
Guitar Hero and RockBand are not going ruin music. Music is a form of expression and art that is adored and loved by billions of people. No game/s is going to change that, ever. The same could be said of videogames, to a slightly lesser of a degree.
@SurplusGamer: I like The Beatles, I listen to their songs, and I've enjoyed playing RockBand: The Beatles. But to say that there is more diversity in that game than RB2 is just plain stupid. Please point to me the jazz, alternative, punk and heavy metal in that game, that RB2 had.
@SurplusGamer: I like The Beatles, I listen to their songs, and I've enjoyed playing RockBand: The Beatles. But to say that there is more diversity in that game than RB2 is just plain stupid. Please point to me the jazz, alternative, punk and heavy metal in that game, that RB2 had.

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