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Then why did the only console title with a good story this generation come out of Japan? Deadly Premonition, of course. Sure it's heavily Western inspired, but there's nobody _in_ the West making something that awesome...
Wow, this is utterly stupid. If anything it's the other way around. Sure Skyrim and such has it's merits, or the games in the Fallout series, but they have serious flaws that tend to be overlooked. Most Japanese games nowadays are under a very large microscope and are criticized to hell, even if they dont deserve it.
I dont know what this guys problem is.
I dont know what this guys problem is.
oh shit she's from japan.
guess im racist for not posting western girls now???
here's another pic for you since im racist as fuck :D
guess im racist for not posting western girls now???
here's another pic for you since im racist as fuck :D
Assassin's Creed guy is saying this. THAT is his point of reference... Assassin's Creed. Didn't they steal someone else's book's plot for their game series? Who does this guy think he is?
All I can say is Bayonetta's story was a SPECTACLE that I enjoyed taking in. It was drastically different than pretty much anything else I can think of in recent memory. It was batshit INSANE but I still liked SEEING it all unfold for the presentation style.
Then there's Gears. It was cool. I like Gears. They're fun games and I own all three of them. There was some spectacle, but I'd say that one Bayonetta had as many "Oh my god, what did my eyes just see" moments in it as all three Gears combined.
Those games are great.
All I can say is Bayonetta's story was a SPECTACLE that I enjoyed taking in. It was drastically different than pretty much anything else I can think of in recent memory. It was batshit INSANE but I still liked SEEING it all unfold for the presentation style.
Then there's Gears. It was cool. I like Gears. They're fun games and I own all three of them. There was some spectacle, but I'd say that one Bayonetta had as many "Oh my god, what did my eyes just see" moments in it as all three Gears combined.
Those games are great.
So this bullshit party is spreading? Can developers just shut up and let people enjoy what they want to enjoy instead of somehow insinuating that it's wrong?
There level of trippin' occurring here is almost too much to bear.
Martha Stewart eating a California Club while at a brunch hosted by Pier One Imports to launch her new line of scented candles. She gets up from her table, glass of Chardonay in hand and proceeds to walk over to talk to Adam Lambert who is there promoting his new line of eye liner. Half way there, she trips on a lawn jockey and falls face first into the grass. The earth swallows her up and the ground turns rancid around the hole.
Martha Stewart eating a California Club while at a brunch hosted by Pier One Imports to launch her new line of scented candles. She gets up from her table, glass of Chardonay in hand and proceeds to walk over to talk to Adam Lambert who is there promoting his new line of eye liner. Half way there, she trips on a lawn jockey and falls face first into the grass. The earth swallows her up and the ground turns rancid around the hole.
Did anyone even play Bayonetta for the story? Regardless, I think this dev is displaying his own form of racism, believing that western culture is the only one capable of producing a cohesive story.
In similar news, people that watch bad movies to laugh at them are racist against good movies that aren't funny, and people continue to use words that don't mean what they think they mean.
*peeks in*
After watching my roommate play through the other-wrought cheese fest that was MSG4, I feel like I know where this guy is coming from. Calling it racism is quite dumb, and as at least one commenter has already said, most video game story arcs are largely shit compared to books and movies.
Gears of War is fun anyway!
*runs away*
After watching my roommate play through the other-wrought cheese fest that was MSG4, I feel like I know where this guy is coming from. Calling it racism is quite dumb, and as at least one commenter has already said, most video game story arcs are largely shit compared to books and movies.
Gears of War is fun anyway!
*runs away*
He misuses literally twice. Like he's suggesting that a Japanese story is just guys going "blblsdfew" and having no motivations at all for their arbitrary actions.
My Destructoid friends, I have a confession to make: I am a condescending racist. I've been trying to rid myself of my horrible attitude towards Japan for years, to no avail, so I now humble myself before the community and ask for forgiveness and understanding.
You see, I recently played The Last Story. And I liked. A lot. Now I'm playing Valkyria Chronicles 2, and much to my shame, I can't help but think it's fantastic. The next game on my list is Tactics Ogre: Let Us Cling Together, and I dread the possibility that I may like it.
So I humbly request that Japanese developers forgive me for enjoying their piece of shit stories and crappy games. I just can't help myself, and I doubt I'll ever change.
You see, I recently played The Last Story. And I liked. A lot. Now I'm playing Valkyria Chronicles 2, and much to my shame, I can't help but think it's fantastic. The next game on my list is Tactics Ogre: Let Us Cling Together, and I dread the possibility that I may like it.
So I humbly request that Japanese developers forgive me for enjoying their piece of shit stories and crappy games. I just can't help myself, and I doubt I'll ever change.
first time i've seen so much racism in a statement accusing others of racism
maybe he should have thought about that before posting it
maybe he should have thought about that before posting it
My Destructoid friends, I have a confession to make: I am a condescending racist. I've been trying to rid myself of my horrible attitude towards Japan for years, to no avail, so I now humble myself before the community and ask for forgiveness and understanding.
You see, I recently played The Last Story. And I liked. A lot. Now I'm playing Valkyria Chronicles 2, and much to my shame, I can't help but think it's fantastic. The next game on my list is Tactics Ogre: Let Us Cling Together, and I dread the possibility that I may like it.
So I humbly request that Japanese developers forgive me for enjoying their piece of shit stories and crappy games. I just can't help myself, and I doubt I'll ever change.
You see, I recently played The Last Story. And I liked. A lot. Now I'm playing Valkyria Chronicles 2, and much to my shame, I can't help but think it's fantastic. The next game on my list is Tactics Ogre: Let Us Cling Together, and I dread the possibility that I may like it.
So I humbly request that Japanese developers forgive me for enjoying their piece of shit stories and crappy games. I just can't help myself, and I doubt I'll ever change.
Yes; some games journalists give Japanese games a very easy ride when it comes to critiquing their plot.
No; that's not really racist, that's just allowing for obvious cultural differences between the Japanese and the West. Whilst I agree that Western games journo's should critique the plot of these games with a western eye and tell it how it is to a western audience, I also think that people should understand that the Japanese approach to plot and story writing in general is fundamentally different from the Western approach, and that they shouldn't be expected to change.
No; that's not really racist, that's just allowing for obvious cultural differences between the Japanese and the West. Whilst I agree that Western games journo's should critique the plot of these games with a western eye and tell it how it is to a western audience, I also think that people should understand that the Japanese approach to plot and story writing in general is fundamentally different from the Western approach, and that they shouldn't be expected to change.
This is what a company's PR division should be doing, teaching developers how to not make an ass out themselves during an interview. Promote the game, don't distract from it. Now everyone is talking about this guy's weird accusation of racism instead of AC3.
The dev just doesn't get games that have stories in games like Bayonetta. These games aren't "mature" like western stories because they aren't intended to be. Instead they aim for lighter tongue in cheek stories and tbh the game is all the better for it.
Some JRPGS have a problem with their childishly angsty characters so i'm not saying that all Japanese story writing is good.
Some JRPGS have a problem with their childishly angsty characters so i'm not saying that all Japanese story writing is good.
This is one of those guys who is upset that people call him racist when he makes sweeping negative generalizations about an entire culture's storytelling skills. Why can't anyone see that the people who call him racist are the real racists?
If people are inclined to dislike western stories merely because they are western, wouldn't that make them racist against American and European developers? He's throwing in condescension out of nowhere.
"literally gibberish"
i tried to understand his opinion until i read that. it's a pretty big fail when someone accuses others of racism but unintentionally outs himself as an even bigger racist.
actually, perhaps it's unfair to call him racist when he could just be an incredibly ignorant moron.
i tried to understand his opinion until i read that. it's a pretty big fail when someone accuses others of racism but unintentionally outs himself as an even bigger racist.
actually, perhaps it's unfair to call him racist when he could just be an incredibly ignorant moron.
I don't think this race or nationality really has anything to do with what Mr. Hutchinson is saying (even if he thinks it does.) Some people (gamers, journalists, developers, etc.) are going to see something new, unfamiliar, or exotic and be inclined to praise it. I've certainly had the experience of playing a game from Japan that's weird or incoherent and had a non-negative "oh Japan..." reaction.
The thing is, I don't even know that this is bad. Sometimes I like barely-coherent weirdness. It's not the only thing I like, but nobody says I only have to play one game.
I do think that people who rip terrible storytelling in games should be encouraged to savage terrible storytelling in Eastern games as well as Western games, absolutely; terrible storytelling knows no national boundaries. But not every game needs to be analyzed as literature, some games are forgivable despite their many failures and excesses because they are toys, and they are fun, and there's nothing wrong with that.
The thing is, I don't even know that this is bad. Sometimes I like barely-coherent weirdness. It's not the only thing I like, but nobody says I only have to play one game.
I do think that people who rip terrible storytelling in games should be encouraged to savage terrible storytelling in Eastern games as well as Western games, absolutely; terrible storytelling knows no national boundaries. But not every game needs to be analyzed as literature, some games are forgivable despite their many failures and excesses because they are toys, and they are fun, and there's nothing wrong with that.
Is probably more racist when some journalists and reviewers dismiss any japanese game with the excuse of it being childish or pedofuel or simply not western enough when they haven't even played it, granted sometimes this is the case, but is very unproifessional to just dismiss every japanese game they come across, and it happens way more often than it should.
@ The Enchanting Wizard Of Rhythm
You are my fucking hero right now.
ACs story has gotten so horrible I dont know how this guy can call anybody else out, yet alone a whole country.
You are my fucking hero right now.
ACs story has gotten so horrible I dont know how this guy can call anybody else out, yet alone a whole country.
I see what he is getting at, but it's not racism. I do it all the time, not just with Japanese games. It can be anything foreign to me. Like if I pick up a German made adventure game on steam; I'm a little understanding when the humour and writing just feels a little "off", because it was written by people of a completely different culture to me and translated to my language, possibly losing some significance along the way as I don't have the same points of reference. Maybe it's a little unfair to be more demanding of something made in my culture to speak to me better, but I can't help it. I think a certain amount of that is human nature.
@Max-
you challenge me to a duel???
A DUEEEEEEEEL!!!!!!!!!!!!
okay you ask for this!!!!!
take this!!!
and this
and finally this!!!!!
you challenge me to a duel???
A DUEEEEEEEEL!!!!!!!!!!!!
okay you ask for this!!!!!
take this!!!
and this
and finally this!!!!!
Gears of War over Bayonetta? Bahahahaha, get a load of this fucking guy, huh?
Definitely buying Assassin's Creed III in the $10 bargain bin like very Assassin's Creed before it.
Definitely buying Assassin's Creed III in the $10 bargain bin like very Assassin's Creed before it.
Umm... One's meant to be funny, the other's trying way too hard to be a serious action film. I GUESS I CAN'T LIKE BOTH. I MUST LIKE EITHER WAYNE'S WORLD OR THE DARK KNIGHT, APPARENTLY.
Isn't UbiSoft getting enough publicity with the release of AssCred 3 coupled with the Uplay PC scam?
I would've taken this dude's claims seriously if only he'd mention other games than Bayonetta and Gears.
Bayonetta is a game that's got one of the most creative mash-up of christian mythology and old-school video games tropes; I love it, but the story is not what strikes me as genius.
Gears's story never annoyed me too much; it did the job setting up the missions and providing a competent narrative frame for the gameplay. It's not deep by any means, but it does the job.
Ass Cred's story is inventive, I'll give them that but the narrative is utter shit.
I would've taken this dude's claims seriously if only he'd mention other games than Bayonetta and Gears.
Bayonetta is a game that's got one of the most creative mash-up of christian mythology and old-school video games tropes; I love it, but the story is not what strikes me as genius.
Gears's story never annoyed me too much; it did the job setting up the missions and providing a competent narrative frame for the gameplay. It's not deep by any means, but it does the job.
Ass Cred's story is inventive, I'll give them that but the narrative is utter shit.
So he wants publishers to start paying you guys to bash other companies, as well as pay you to give them better scores?
It's so weird how racist people always accuse other people of being racist for NOT HATING something that comes from a culture they don't like.
The guy ain't wrong.
You tards buy every story of sexism and racism as long as its approved by the media propaganda, and then you giggle when someone suggests there are other kinds of racism that isnt commonly talked about.
You tards buy every story of sexism and racism as long as its approved by the media propaganda, and then you giggle when someone suggests there are other kinds of racism that isnt commonly talked about.
I'd fire on the guy for being a dimwit, but it won't get him to change. He's still going to throw around Ass Creed III like it's the second coming of gaming and his name will still be in the title. So, instead, I'll say this.
East or West, gaming stories usually suck because of the very nature of games. Too linear, and they call it an interactive movie. Too complex, people get confused or argue about canon. Too minimalist, people wonder why there wasn't more story involvement. Too in your face, people call it trying too hard.
And that's not even going after quality of writing (of which Assassin's Creed, in this case, is also crappy for because it also plays into tired Western tropes, including the universal 'Religion is Corrupt' angle.)
But never mind all this, keep on posting girls.
East or West, gaming stories usually suck because of the very nature of games. Too linear, and they call it an interactive movie. Too complex, people get confused or argue about canon. Too minimalist, people wonder why there wasn't more story involvement. Too in your face, people call it trying too hard.
And that's not even going after quality of writing (of which Assassin's Creed, in this case, is also crappy for because it also plays into tired Western tropes, including the universal 'Religion is Corrupt' angle.)
But never mind all this, keep on posting girls.
If only this guy realized that video games aren't movies, then he might actually understand why bayonetta's story shouldn't be taken seriously.
Also, when pieces of a serious story are shown with some restraint in between all the fun cutscenes like bayonetta did it, then it is much, much, much more authentic (authentic as in real/believable/being yourself.) Look at games that do this right, FF7, FF6, Nier, Gravity Rush, Prince of persia 2008, Metal gear solid 1-3
Now look at games that don't: Inversion, FF13, Soul Calibur 5, metal gear solid 2-4, AssCreed.
When games try to be serious and emotional from the first minute, you cringe at first, just like if you talk to a girl, and you try to jump right in with very heavy conversational topics, she'll probably won't like it very much.
This Generation I was the most impressed story-wise with Enslaved, and Alice madness returns, both of which feature horribly boring gameplay, but have such believable voice acting and social dynamics that you start to care about the characters.
Making things to deep or heavy, especially from the start is a bad bad baaad idea. Most japanese devs seem to understand this, as it's something that is the same in Anime. You don't start off being all serious. You slowly ease the deeper level of the story into the game, reaching it's peak at about 3 quarters in, or at the ending.
Don't think anyone will read this, too much blah blah, or understand what i'm talking about, but the gist of it. If you'll let me make your games you'd play a lot better stuff than assassin's creed.
Also, when pieces of a serious story are shown with some restraint in between all the fun cutscenes like bayonetta did it, then it is much, much, much more authentic (authentic as in real/believable/being yourself.) Look at games that do this right, FF7, FF6, Nier, Gravity Rush, Prince of persia 2008, Metal gear solid 1-3
Now look at games that don't: Inversion, FF13, Soul Calibur 5, metal gear solid 2-4, AssCreed.
When games try to be serious and emotional from the first minute, you cringe at first, just like if you talk to a girl, and you try to jump right in with very heavy conversational topics, she'll probably won't like it very much.
This Generation I was the most impressed story-wise with Enslaved, and Alice madness returns, both of which feature horribly boring gameplay, but have such believable voice acting and social dynamics that you start to care about the characters.
Making things to deep or heavy, especially from the start is a bad bad baaad idea. Most japanese devs seem to understand this, as it's something that is the same in Anime. You don't start off being all serious. You slowly ease the deeper level of the story into the game, reaching it's peak at about 3 quarters in, or at the ending.
Don't think anyone will read this, too much blah blah, or understand what i'm talking about, but the gist of it. If you'll let me make your games you'd play a lot better stuff than assassin's creed.
While I agree that Japanese stories need a little more toughness, maybe reviewers think that they just didn't get the story and would seem stupid if they didn't, it's not like I can follow Western stories either. L.A. Noire was something about a murder, then some lady, then another murder, then some guys, then corruption, then more people get explained, and I seriously gave up about a quarter of the way through. And I have absolutely no idea what was going on in ACII, Templars, Assassin's, killing some kid, nothing made sense.
He's got a point, but it's not racism. It's cultural differences, and I would bet that Japanese gamers would have a hard time understanding some of the stories from the west.
He's got a point, but it's not racism. It's cultural differences, and I would bet that Japanese gamers would have a hard time understanding some of the stories from the west.
So, Japanese people make shit games and people are racists for liking them? You literally can't make this shit up. It's GOLD Jerry, GOLD!
Clearly racists don't understand what "racism" means. That's the only possible explanation for why they fly into a tizzy when they get called on their racist bullshit.
Clearly racists don't understand what "racism" means. That's the only possible explanation for why they fly into a tizzy when they get called on their racist bullshit.
Racists? No. Pink colored glasses biased? Yes, probably. But that is often the case of most western gamers, not just journalists.
The problem with Japanese storytelling is that most of the games from Japan that has gibberish story comes from a time when story and narrative were the last priority. Games like Pacman, Mario, Contra or Spelunker don't have a narrative; they have a premise, mostly to justify the gameplay. Those games get a free card now because they aim at nostalgia service and are true to their heritage.
However, nowadays story is a major point. That is one of the reasons why new Japanese IPs often don't do well in the west; because new IPs don't get that free card anymore and their narrative tools don't resonate with the western market that well (and when they try to, its even more awkward)
The problem with Japanese storytelling is that most of the games from Japan that has gibberish story comes from a time when story and narrative were the last priority. Games like Pacman, Mario, Contra or Spelunker don't have a narrative; they have a premise, mostly to justify the gameplay. Those games get a free card now because they aim at nostalgia service and are true to their heritage.
However, nowadays story is a major point. That is one of the reasons why new Japanese IPs often don't do well in the west; because new IPs don't get that free card anymore and their narrative tools don't resonate with the western market that well (and when they try to, its even more awkward)
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